News Cars-Themed Attractions at Magic Kingdom

[UNCgolf]

Those are park visits per year. I didn’t say they were unique visits, but they are # of days attended by guests in a year

You can’t compare a 2 day trip to Disneyland by one person vs. a week long trip to Disney World (and perhaps Universal / Sea World) for a week by one person. That would be statistical malpractice

Again, the unit here are theme park visits, not # of unique guests. And Orlando pulls in way, way more than SoCal

I'm sorry, but no.

The fact that they aren't unique visitors is incredibly important to the point you were attempting to make. I don't care about the underlying argument about WDW vs. Disneyland, but what you said was simply wrong from a statistical analysis standpoint. You can't just add up the total park visits when one resort has four parks and one has two if you want any kind of remotely useful information (at least in this context).

A stronger argument would be that the Disneyland numbers likely have a significantly higher percentage of repeat local visitors, which means their actual unique visitor total probably is lower than the raw numbers suggest.

 

[flynnibus]

This is such an awful example. By the same token peoolecould ask for a dark ride and be handed Superstar Limo. Does that mean the people who want more dark rides have sucky ideas too?

And you called my example bad? I can’t even understand your leap.

Case in point… what made disney parks great was they insight to know what would create greatness…. Before the audience even knew it was possible. Building the solution the mob says you should build will only ever get you a hot mess

 

[flynnibus]

What? What do you mean vastly missing the point and being vague on purpose doesn't articulate the point that someone was making. We should not ask for anything because the magical monkey paw is purposefully making it as bad as possible on purpose. People want a zootopia themed land? Sure we get a themed land but it's all bathrooms! See people don't know what they want!

Yes… because the general population is short sighted, selfish, and generally stupid. So if you want to let them dictate what your creative direction by building their solutions instead of listening to their needs. You deserve the hot mess you’d get.

 

[CoasterCowboy67]

I'm sorry, but no.

The fact that they aren't unique visitors is incredibly important to the point you were attempting to make. I don't care about the underlying argument about WDW vs. Disneyland, but what you said was simply wrong from a statistical analysis standpoint. You can't just add up the total park visits when one resort has four parks and one has two if you want any kind of remotely useful information (at least in this context).

A stronger argument would be that the Disneyland numbers likely have a significantly higher percentage of repeat local visitors, which means their actual unique visitor total probably is lower than the raw numbers suggest.

No.

I never claimed unique visits or unique visitors is what you get from combining multiple parks’ attendances. I don’t know why you keep saying that?

You get total visits to the combined parks, and it’s an absolutely valid metric to look at because it’s measuring total consumption of the product, which yes, includes both unique consumptions and repeat consumptions.

Let’s say $100 is the average cost per day at a US Disney theme park

DLR had a combined 27.25 total visits in 2023. At $100 per day DLR would have made $272.5 million — whether that’s 1 person visiting 27.25 million times or 27.25 different people visiting 1 time it does not matter.

WDW had a combined 48.77 total visits in 2023, which would amount to $487.7 million paid on theme park visits, almost twice.

Add in Sea World, Universal Studios and Islands of Adventure to FL and Universal Studios Hollywood to CA and you get an even wider margin. Without question, Orlando is a much larger and more competitive theme park market than Anaheim / LA. Epic Universe will only increase that. That was the original point

The fact one market has 2x the number of parks than the other is part of the actual point that it’s a more competitive market

 

[DisneyHead123]

This is such an awful example. By the same token peoolecould ask for a dark ride and be handed Superstar Limo. Does that mean the people who want more dark rides have sucky ideas too?

I think the issue at the moment is that there’s not a group who is really trusted in terms of being “guest experience first.” Both in intent and ability.

On the one hand you have park visitors, who are not experience designers, right? There’s no expectation that they should know what goes into making a great theme park, except for a small percentage who work in that type of field or are amateur enthusiasts, maybe. But 90% of them do other (very valuable) things. They teach, they’re dentists, they’re engineers, they’re musicians, etc… not designers.

On the other you have execs, who understandably have their own set of responsibilities, worries, and concerns. I’m actually sympathetic to that in a big picture way and I think they probably have a very heavy weight on their shoulders. Still, that doesn’t mean that guest experience is always going to be their top priority. And even when it is, short term gains may be emphasized so much that negative incentives are built into the system. I’m sure they’d like to see super quality parks, but have to balance that with the threat of being out if profits in their division aren’t up next quarter.

The free market is a great feedback loop, and an amazing driver of implicit learning. But it works best in a “long arc” kinda way. Slapping Cars down over a historical landmark may well be a huge misstep. And if it is, I am confident that Disney will see that in the long run. But it doesn’t help to preserve a beloved landmark and a portion of park ambiance in the short term. Market correction is great, but it’s not a wise parent or guide telling you what you should do. It’s a harsh “F around and find out” mechanism that teaches largely from viewing mistakes in the rear view mirror.

 

[CoasterCowboy67]

If 1850-1900 themed Haunted Mansion can reside in 1770’s Liberty Square, then I guess not on the inside.

“The ghosts are from 1770 so the times match up” lol

In all seriousness, the lands today indeed all have widely diverse time periods covered

 

[sndral]

Can someone show me where all of this water in/around the Cars ATV ride will be? I’ve studied the D23 art - I’ve circled in black the only area that looks like it might be water. I’ve made a red line for all of the track areas - I’m unclear on the white cascade down the mountain - maybe a waterfall or maybe the track for the ATVs to go down? The blue line is where there are little people, thus walkways. There’s not much ‘berm’ between Frontierland & the track & there’s none over by the mine train.

 

[Gusey]

I’d be interested in the Tom Sawyer island numbers vs. Rafikis Planet Watch

Remember, they did close Rafiki's Planet Watch in 2018 "permanently" before re-opened it with the Animation Academy in 2019, now with a Fastpass opportunity in that area of the park.

 

[John park hopper]

Some how I don't see waterfalls= it costs a lot of money to run pumps to create waterfalls

 

[ChrisFL]

If I had a lot of free time I'd almost want to mock up this in Planet Coaster...alas I do not have that much free time

 

[Incomudro]

And you called my example bad? I can’t even understand your leap.

Case in point… what made disney parks great was they insight to know what would create greatness…. Before the audience even knew it was possible. Building the solution the mob says you should build will only ever get you a hot mess

100%.

 

[Incomudro]

Yes… because the general population is short sighted, selfish, and generally stupid. So if you want to let them dictate what your creative direction by building their solutions instead of listening to their needs. You deserve the hot mess you’d get.

Exactly.
You don't dumb down to please the masses.

 

[Johnny D]

If 1850-1900 themed Haunted Mansion can reside in 1770’s Liberty Square, then I guess not on the inside.

Well I mean.....Electrical lighting is also residing in 1770's Liberty Square .

 

[UNCgolf]

No.

I never claimed unique visits or unique visitors is what you get from combining multiple parks’ attendances. I don’t know why you keep saying that?

You get total visits to the combined parks, and it’s an absolutely valid metric to look at because it’s measuring total consumption of the product, which yes, includes both unique consumptions and repeat consumptions.

Let’s say $100 is the average cost per day at a US Disney theme park

DLR had a combined 27.25 total visits in 2023. At $100 per day DLR would have made $272.5 million — whether that’s 1 person visiting 27.25 million times or 27.25 different people visiting 1 time it does not matter.

WDW had a combined 48.77 total visits in 2023, which would amount to $487.7 million paid on theme park visits, almost twice.

Add in Sea World, Universal Studios and Islands of Adventure to FL and Universal Studios Hollywood to CA and you get an even wider margin. Without question, Orlando is a much larger and more competitive theme park market than Anaheim / LA. Epic Universe will only increase that. That was the original point

The fact one market has 2x the number of parks than the other is part of the actual point that it’s a more competitive market

You'd be better off just admitting you made a mistake instead of digging in, because now it seems like you either don't understand what you're talking about or you completely misunderstood the original point of discussion.

Again, I don't care about Disneyland vs. Disney World at all. But it bothers me when people misuse numbers/statistics, because it's so widespread.

 

[J4546]

Well I mean.....Electrical lighting is also residing in 1770's Liberty Square .

ALso everywhere you go is flooded with people wearing their modern clothing and disney hats and bubble wands lol. No matter how well themed a land is, its always full of regular modern day people wearing disney clothing

 

[CoasterCowboy67]

You'd be better off just admitting you made a mistake instead of digging in, because now it seems like you either don't understand what you're talking about or you completely misunderstood the original point of discussion.

Again, I don't care about Disneyland vs. Disney World at all. But it bothers me when people misuse numbers/statistics, because it's so widespread.

No, you don’t understand statistics despite repeatedly misusing the word. I didn’t make any statistical claim. I have tried to explain the difference between the argument you want to have and the reality of what I said and the point I was making

The fact is, one person spending 4 days going to 4 theme parks has more weight, and is representative of much more investment, than counting that as 1 unique visitor because it was the same person that went to all 4 parks

I am measuring total consumption of the parks, not unique visitors. I never claimed the latter. Please read the posts again before making inane generalizations about someone else’s understanding of statistics. You’re only making yourself an example of the problem you’re so concerned about.

The one valid note on my math are park hopper days when a person visits multiple parks on one day. I don’t know for sure, but I would guess that inflates DLR more given the parks are right across each other and the average person would find it easier to park hop there than at WDW

 

[Florida Man]

Out of all the projects announced, I hope this one is ultimately canceled and that the imagineers find a creative way to navigate around RoA to allow access to the land behind big thunder for expansion.

Some sort of transportation to the land—skyway, moving sidewalk, tunnel, bridge. This is Disney and they can figure it out. They lifted a giant golf ball into the air for crying out loud.

 

[Mr. Sullivan]

Out of all the projects announced, I hope this one is ultimately canceled and that the imagineers find a creative way to navigate around RoA to allow access to the land behind big thunder for expansion.

Some sort of transportation to the land—skyway, moving sidewalk, tunnel, bridge. This is Disney and they can figure it out. They lifted a giant golf ball into the air for crying out loud.

It won’t be. They’ve already started.

Furthermore, they shouldn’t. The purists will never admit to it, but even they deep down know that Magic Kingdom is in dire need of something exactly like this.

 

[Florida Man]

It won’t be. They’ve already started.

Furthermore, they shouldn’t. The purists will never admit to it, but even they deep down know that Magic Kingdom is in dire need of something exactly like this.

Can you elaborate on what you mean by they’ve already started?

 

[Mr. Sullivan]

If you don't believer there are rules to theme park design then you clearly know nothing about how Imagineering and how Disney parks go to where they are at today.

They got there by breaking the rules. By not allowing there to ever be a status quo, never allowing something to be infinite. The Disney parks got where they are precisely because they didn’t stick to rules, not by creating rules.

These parks are designed to change. Nothing is supposed to last forever. A long time, sure, but real creatives don’t design something that’s going to sit there forever and ever to the point it’s lost its luster and its relevance. They will get the desire to come in and create something new to take it’s place because time always moves forward and the needs of the time you land in will be different than the one you left.

Letting something just sit simply because it’s been there for a long time is no way to run a theme park. That’s the quickest way to kill a park.