News Bob Iger is back! Chapek is out!!

[Casper Gutman]

Chapek was "CEO" for just short of three years. I have a hard time believing that he could enact some wide spread change of audience habits in that short of time even if he were trying.

This isn't a matter of trying to retrain audiences to go back to theaters. This is simply an issue of finding out how to monetize what the audience is already doing: staying home.

I’m the weirdo willing to give Chapek a ton of slack and blame Iger for everything, but putting the Pixar films on streaming seems to be one of the few decisions attributable mostly to Second Bob. If I’m wrong, hey, more things to blame on Iger.

The thing about meeting audiences where they were that Chapek and all of Hollywood seemed to forget is that the pandemic was going to end someday, and decisions needed to account for that future and not just the house-bound present.

 

[fgmnt]

It’s probably relevant to add that as much as movies are finding big audiences at the theaters there ARE two categories of film that are struggling. The first is Oscar-y prestige pics like Tar and She Said. The second, more relevant category is Disney animated films.

Chapek trained audiences not to bother with taking kids to cinemas by sticking prestigious, critically acclaimed content like Turning Red, Soul, and Luna on streaming. Disney is also probably hurt by strong brand identification here, because everyone knows where to find Disney and Pixar animated films on streaming. For something like Minions, the streaming outlet is less clear and the audience’s mental connection between the film and “watch it on streaming” less immeadiate.

I don’t know how Disney breaks this cycle - as sad as it is to say, they probably need some big showy sequels to market as events. If they’ve got a Toy Story 5 or Incredibles 3 in any stage of development, now is the time to step on the gas. This may also be a moment to gamble big on a hand drawn revival or to put the first full-length narrative film (in any animated style) starring Mickey and friends into development. ANYTHING to break the established pattern.

I'm hopeful for Wish critically but there definitely needs to be a commercial strategy if that is going to be the pivot point. I do not think Iger has any interest in restarting a complete hand drawn production house. I would be surprised if we did not see a direct sequel to a successful WDAS movie announced as the next movie for the studio.

Not entirely related, but I have been waiting for the company to make a live action Hunchback as a theater-first production, and have it be one that really swings for the fences in scale of spectacle. It's unquestionably the renaissance movie most worthy of it.

 

[Touchdown]

I have to say that recent Disney Animation has looked more off to me, with the exception of Encanto, it seems like Disney and Pixar the last few years have been sliding away from the moving painting style from Tangled for Disney, and standard Pixar look towards what I call the Wallace and Gromitt aesthetic where things look more cartoony/rubbery and less realistic. Almost like it’s a stop motion puppet. It hasn’t helped draw me to the movies but that’s a personal opinion.

 

[Casper Gutman]

I'm hopeful for Wish critically but there definitely needs to be a commercial strategy if that is going to be the pivot point. I do not think Iger has any interest in restarting a complete hand drawn production house. I would be surprised if we did not see a direct sequel to a successful WDAS movie announced as the next movie for the studio.

Not entirely related, but I have been waiting for the company to make a live action Hunchback as a theater-first production, and have it be one that really swings for the fences in scale of spectacle. It's unquestionably the renaissance movie most worthy of it.

If I’m CEO, I look at the Mario trailer and say, “I want that with Mickey and friends and done at the best Disney level, which dwarfs Illumination.” Or build off Ralph and do a Princess team-up film. Now is the moment for some really high-quality pandering.

I completely agree about Hunchback as the high point of the renaissance, by the way.

 

[Heppenheimer]

This actually has been a claim -- not in those exact terms, but there have been discussions that the advent of HD, large screens, etc. at home (along with the skyrocketing costs to actually attend an event) has made it much harder for sports teams to sell tickets than even 20 years ago.

It's obviously not going to end live sporting events, because there are still plenty of people who want to go. It's just decreased the potential audience for ticket sales as the at-home experience has improved, because there are people who may have bought tickets 25 years ago who now prefer to just watch at home.

The NFL is actually a counter-example, since broadcast has provided their biggest source of income for decades.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

I’m the weirdo willing to give Chapek a ton of slack and blame Iger for everything, but putting the Pixar films on streaming seems to be one of the few decisions attributable mostly to Second Bob. If I’m wrong, hey, more things to blame on Iger.

COVID. It was COVID. 100%, no other reason than COVID. Whether it was Bob I, Bob II, or some non-Bob in the big chair, they were not going to send AAA animated feature films to theaters for extended box office runs in the middle of a pandemic. It would have been suicide.

The thing about meeting audiences where they were that Chapek and all of Hollywood seemed to forget is that the pandemic was going to end someday, and decisions needed to account for that future and not just the house-bound present.

The problem is, they haven't had a quality film to bribe people back into the theaters yet. If they had said "Lightyear and Strange World won't be on Disney+ until 8 months after their theatrical release," audiences would have shrugged and said "okay we'll wait 8 months."

 

[SirLink]

That would be the opinion of a fool that thinks the world is gonna “reset” to 1962…where we all smoke luckys next to the water cooler at the toy factory in Ohio

Haha ... not really just. Disney could be making more money by cutting scenes, prefably for all regions, and get their films released to more territories. Treat this time as a bad experiment by Chapek and refocus by making sure the company isn't going to champion social justice over money.

Iger should sell the company to the Public Investment Fund

 

[CaptainAmerica]

That would be the opinion of a fool that thinks the world is gonna “reset” to 1962…where we all smoke luckys next to the water cooler at the toy factory in Ohio

Just @ me next time.

But I'm a New England supremacist so it's a water cooler at the toy factory in Massachusetts.

 

[FigmentFan82]

Answering “false” on a multiple-choice question usually doesn’t work

It's why they have short theatrical windows for their oscar contenders

 

[lazyboy97o]

I have to say that recent Disney Animation has looked more off to me, with the exception of Encanto, it seems like Disney and Pixar the last few years have been sliding away from the moving painting style from Tangled for Disney, and standard Pixar look towards what I call the Wallace and Gromitt aesthetic where things look more cartoony/rubbery and less realistic. Almost like it’s a stop motion puppet. It hasn’t helped draw me to the movies but that’s a personal opinion.

And a big part of the problem is they're paying significantly more for what looks rather similar to cheaper work. Why have we not seen a feature length film using something like the Paperman technique? Why not look at what Glen Keane had developed for Rapunzel?

COVID. It was COVID. 100%, no other reason than COVID. Whether it was Bob I, Bob II, or some non-Bob in the big chair, they were not going to send AAA animated feature films to theaters for extended box office runs in the middle of a pandemic. It would have been suicide.

There were options besides a doomed theatrical run or straight to streaming. They could have done the Premier Access route or they even could have delayed the movies. Minions: Rise of Gru was originally scheduled for a 2020 release.

 

[FigmentFan82]

If I’m CEO, I look at the Mario trailer and say, “I want that with Mickey and friends and done at the best Disney level, which dwarfs Illumination.” Or build off Ralph and do a Princess team-up film. Now is the moment for some really high-quality pandering.

I completely agree about Hunchback as the high point of the renaissance, by the way.

Could have sworn I heard news from at least the past year of live action Hunchback happening. It's not my favorite Dis property but makes sense to adapt.

Would love if Disney felt bold enough to have a full "shared universe" type Mickey movie like what looks like Super Mario is, but I doubt they would. They seem so skittish to try big things with Mick. I mean it took forever for the mouse to get an attraction.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

There were options besides a doomed theatrical run or straight to streaming. They could have done the Premier Access route or they even could have delayed the movies. Minions: Rise of Gru was originally scheduled for a 2020 release.

Hindsight is 20/20. They could have delayed, but delayed until when? When we were in the midst of the pandemic, we didn't know when the pandemic would end.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Just @ me next time.

But I'm a New England supremacist so it's a water cooler at the toy factory in Massachusetts.

Thanks, Callahan…

It ain’t happening…because of like…math…and science…and demographics.

Couple of schools on the Charles good at that sorta thing

 

[Casper Gutman]

Hindsight is 20/20. They could have delayed, but delayed until when? When we were in the midst of the pandemic, we didn't know when the pandemic would end.

We knew it would end at some point. Minions and Top Gun prove pretty definitively the correct move was to hold your cards.

Maybe, MAYBE you role out one Pixar film (probably Luca) on streaming with a huge PR push. What you absolutely don’t do is make the streaming release of critically acclaimed Pixar films routine and banal.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

I would consider putting on streaming as being free. Yes they are getting subscriptions from it but the movie itself isn't making money. It's why they need to go back to charging people to watch it on streaming for the first year.

I think if it was gonna work…they would already have dumped the theaters.

Remember: studios get half the take - if that - from theater runs.

No accountant in history likes that margin.

Something ain’t working

 

[Heppenheimer]

Could have sworn I heard news from at least the past year of live action Hunchback happening. It's not my favorite Dis property but makes sense to adapt.

Would love if Disney felt bold enough to have a full "shared universe" type Mickey movie like what looks like Super Mario is, but I doubt they would. They seem so skittish to try big things with Mick. I mean it took forever for the mouse to get an attraction.

Please, no MMU (Mickey Mouse Universe). Keep him completely non-canonical, so that one minute he can play with his friends in a Clubhouse, the next he can be a Wild West cheese rustler. I do like that the latest cartoons reference the parks, but doing a shared universe would just throw up too many narrative constraints. Mickey's varied adventures these days are one of the few things that keep my kids distracted long enough for wifey and I to get some peace.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Minions and Top Gun prove pretty definitively the correct move was to hold your cards.

Maybe, MAYBE you role out one Pixar film (probably Luca) on streaming with a huge PR push. What you absolutely don’t do is make the streaming release of critically acclaimed Pixar films routine and banal.

Oh dear god…that was the smartest move that was ever made…on so many levels.

Maybe better than Irvin kershner and Gary Kurtz fighting George Lucas to pay to shoot empire the right way…
Resulting in the greatest fantasy film in history…and billions ever since

 

[Tha Realest]

Now is the moment for some really high-quality pandering.

As opposed to the transparent pandering they've done as of late

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Just FYI, I don't think it was Napster/Apple that obliterated the old music industry, it was the rise of highend software for low costs. When I was younger, we would go to a studio with close to a million dollars dumped into software/hardware just to get a professional sound. To do this, you needed a label that owned/contracted a studio like that and would front the costs, and take 90% of your sales. I can now create nearly identical quality in my room with a $250 audio interface, $60 software, a decent mic, and a handful of plugins for around $200. Now that I can afford to make it myself, I don't need to sign on with a record company that will fund my release but take 90% of the profits from what I made. All I need is a way to get my music to the radio/top of the streaming lists. Yes, they make less now due to streaming, but I honestly think the improvement in gear and the industry not finding a pivot really hit it the hardest.

I worked in music retail and owned my own store during that period of time…I have firsthand knowledge of what happened to the music industry…

It was mainly a combination of two factors….
1) the 5 major labels: WEA (Warner Bros), Sony, Capitol, MCA & PMD (Polygram) were (at the time), run by old time record executives and believed they were the “Kings of the industry”, a legal cartel if you will, that were CONVINCED that downloading was a fad, something that would NEVER effect their business…they were too big to fail…(SOUND FAMILIAR, DISNEY?). As events unfolded, they learned QUICKLY, they failed to prepare for the future.

The second catastrophe for the music business was Napster. My store was a full service store, but specialized in dance music. I sold 12” singles, domestic and import and supplied every club and DJ at the Jersey shore and had DJ’s from as far away as DE, PA,& NY.
My good DJ customers would meet the UPS driver and as fast as I unpacked the vinyl, they would buy it. Within 3 months, my business slowed to a crawl. WHY? DJ’s we’re downloading the music from Napster. They went from carrying milk crates out of my store to spinning music from a laptop. On top of that, 9/11 happened and we were in the midst of a recession. 1 hurdle I could’ve weathered…3 hurdles, impossible. After 7 years, I had no other alternative but to close my store and try to sell my inventory.
The major labels learned that computers were the new way to deliver music. We, as an industry couldn’t compete with free and the majors had to scramble to make money off downloading. They never thought twice about the major chains that were their outlets, Record Town, Record World, Sam Goody, Tower, the Wiz and more plus the independents. In 2001, there was no Apple Music.
This is the example I always use when people talk about UNI creeping up on Disney. They too think they’re the kings of the hill…when you’re on top, there’s only one way to go…and it ain’t up.

This is so great…thank you.

This thread has had fantastic discussion…it’s why boards are interesting

 

[Casper Gutman]

As opposed to the transparent pandering they've done as of late

Transparent pandering is great if you’re good at it and don’t do it all the time. It’s a big key to the success of MCU (and a major reason those films are so much fun in a crowded theater) and a significant key as to why Universal feels more fun and welcoming then Disney at the moment. WDW just forgot how to pander well!