Big changes coming to FASTPASS in March

[allgar]

Ok, where to begin.

First off, don't make assumptions about me, I've toured it both ways. Every DDR planned, sometimes multiples a day, sometimes none at all. There ARE advantages to both. I find that I eat better with the ADRs and i enjoy the parks/rides better without them cause I'm not focused on the clock as much.

The whole notion about having to plan in advance to get what you want, well, duh. I mean, it's basic supply and demand. Le Cellier can only seat so many people, so they fill up quickly with ADR's. When would you propose they take ADR's the same day? A day in advance? There is no system that alleviates the headaches only shifts when they occur.

I don't think you can say OF COURSE my day is negatively impacted. Some of my favorite days in the parks have been waking up without a plan, heading over to epcot, walking about, rinding ones or two things, heading to blizzard beach, ending the day at MK, all just winging it. Just because YOU can't fathom something doesn't mean it can't exist.

BTW, I have totally lost sense what you points you were trying to argue. Are you for or against ADR's (since you seem to hate them but love to use them) Are you for or against the new fast pass rule?

Stop your trolling. Simply put if you can't see, let alone understand, why this policy change would disappoint those of us who have come to enjoy it's flexibility you are doing so purposely and solely to get a rise out of people.

No it's not the end of the world, but yes it does diminish the experience for many of us. Is it the right thing for Disney to do? Maybe... but it's another policy change that reduces the value of their service offering.

I for one can't wait until they start charging for Fastpasses or whatever it will be... Then at least i can't be called selfish for not wanting to wait in long lines or be on someone else's schedule.

 

[wdwmagic]

A reminder to keep things civil. Thanks.

 

[flynnibus]

It's not hard to follow the rules. The problem with this statement is that the fine print itself states no early entries, but nothing about late entries. Yes, it's a technicality, but it's still there. Also, as I stated above and in numerous posting, CM's allow it and have been trained to let late FP's through. This is not "gaming" the system, it's using the system that Disney has set up.

It's clear the policy was one of customer service and providing people an unquestioned grace period on allowing FPs after the return window. That does not mean the return window doesn't exist, or that it had no purpose. It just means it was policy not to enforce it.

Just because the police do not pull you over for going 58mph in a 55mph zone does not make the law on speeding mean 'speed limits are really just do your best' - it's just simply policy that they are not going to pursue prosecuting people within some range of the limit normally.

People continually refuse to acknowledge the difference between enforcing a rule vs not having the rule at all.

And I'm not seeing a whole lot of folks upset about the change, as a matter of fact it looks like more of the "do right" crowd are getting up in arms, ready to crucify anyone that might dare show up with a late FP.

Don't see any of that at all. What I see is people hunting for any sort of exception case that is possible, regardless of probability, and trying to use that to say why limits shouldn't be enforced. Yet in most cases, Disney already has a comp system to deal with, or there are ways to deal with it, or in some cases that simply means you didn't get to use your FP. Not a huge loss.

What I see is more of people trying to make FP into some thing that heaven forbid if they don't use someone robbed them or something.

Same as above, it's not gaming

Manipulating to your advantage is 'gaming'. It doesn't matter if its someone tries to actively block it or not, or if it impacts others. Taking advantage of a system to be used in ways it for which were not the intended purpose is gaming the system.

Correct me please if I'm wrong but each fast pass gives you one hour window.Add the 5minute early entry plus the 15 minutes on the back end and you have one hour and twenty minutes to make the attraction.Is this correct?If so,how can anyone complain about that amount of time to get there?On the other side of the park?Still no problem.Dinner ressies?They will hold your reservation for 15-30 minutes,at least that's been my case going every year for the last 15 years.So there's another half hour added to the equation.

You are correct. And the reason people complain are the same type of logic that would complain they are only going 2mph too fast if they got pulled over for doing 67mph in a 55mph zone.. because policy was not to stop people going less then 10mph over the speed limit. But they are still going 12mph over the limit.. not two. Because some people take 'lattitude' and instead of treating like a buffer, they treat it like entitlement.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I've been watching for a while, just haven't decided to comment much. Seeing this thread made me want to jump in and comment.

Way to not hold anything back.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

I have a theory about this. This change will be most disruptive...to higher paying guests.

Think about it. Higher paying guests are the ones most likely to leave the park and take a break at their nice volcano pool, mini water park, etc. Higher paying guests are more likely to have a fancy 2-hour signature dinner at a resort during their 6pm fastpass window. Higher paying guests are more likely to pay $50+ per person per day to park hop, which makes it harder to make your exact window.

This is all commonly observed stuff. Value resort guests are more likely to book their hotel simply for a place to sleep. Then they tour commando-style and spend all day in the parks, eating fast meals at mediocre buffets and quick service. Deluxe resort guests want to enjoy the resort, relax, have some downtime doing nice things...which is exactly what makes this change frustrating for us.

So why would Disney do this? Well, I think it's to force higher paying guests to buy NextGen and X-Pass. Since it sounds like this is going to be quite costly, making the fastpass return windows more definite means it'll be harder to get on your favorite rides without booking the right day/time in advance. Ugh, I'm not thrilled about this.

 

[38053WDW]

As much as it cost to go to WDW, and as someone who frequented the parks a lot, we/I should be able to vacation how I want. Sorry, but this change totally ruins my way of vacationing and I'm scheduled to go next month for spring break and this may be my last time there for awhile.

I hear ya .. those security guards at the main entrance making me get a FP is terrible !! :wave:

 

[flynnibus]

I have a theory about this. This change will be most disruptive...to higher paying guests.

No.. not higher paying guests, but higher paying guests who have ignored the FP return time.

This is a subset of the deluxe users - not all of them.

This is another example of the extreme boundary case.. yes possible.. but is it really that significant a population?

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

No.. not higher paying guests, but higher paying guests who have ignored the FP return time.

This is a subset of the deluxe users - not all of them.

This is another example of the extreme boundary case.. yes possible.. but is it really that significant a population?

Well, you cut out all the meat of my post where I described why deluxe resort guests are more likely to miss their time window: break at the pool, 2-hour signature meal, park hopping, etc. I never said everyone, but the indirect effect is that the people who followed a more relaxing, spontaneous, expensive approach (more commonly deluxe resort guests) will be affected.

 

[BrittanyRose428]

To be clear, since I'm the one that brought up this point...

I'm not saying I'd complain if I had a fastpass in hand and a kid had a melt down and I had to leave without using it. If you read my post, I was saying that if you're in one corner of the park and want a fastpass for something in the opposite corner of the park not knowing what window the FP's are currently distributing for is a problem. Without that, it could be a 10 minute trek over to the other side, just to see.

I'm not saying don't make this change... I'm saying plan for it properly and boost infrastructure AHEAD OF TIME (imagine that!!) so as to minimize potential negative guest impact. That's all.

Okay that makes sense lol I didn't mean to point out just you in particular though, WDW fans all over the internet are all saying that same thing. I can see how that would be aggravating, I wonder if they'd some up with some way for everyone to know what the return time is at any given moment, apps work for now but not everyone has access to them.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Ok, where to begin.

First off, don't make assumptions about me, I've toured it both ways. Every DDR planned, sometimes multiples a day, sometimes none at all. There ARE advantages to both. I find that I eat better with the ADRs and i enjoy the parks/rides better without them cause I'm not focused on the clock as much.

The whole notion about having to plan in advance to get what you want, well, duh. I mean, it's basic supply and demand. Le Cellier can only seat so many people, so they fill up quickly with ADR's. When would you propose they take ADR's the same day? A day in advance? There is no system that alleviates the headaches only shifts when they occur.

I don't think you can say OF COURSE my day is negatively impacted. Some of my favorite days in the parks have been waking up without a plan, heading over to epcot, walking about, rinding ones or two things, heading to blizzard beach, ending the day at MK, all just winging it. Just because YOU can't fathom something doesn't mean it can't exist.

BTW, I have totally lost sense what you points you were trying to argue. Are you for or against ADR's (since you seem to hate them but love to use them) Are you for or against the new fast pass rule?

So first you say I don't have to plan ahead, but then you say "well duh, you've got to use ADR's". Which is it?

You do know you didn't use have to have ADR's, right? Before the DDP and ADR's, you could walk up to virtually every restaurant on property, put your name down, wait a few minutes, and get a table. Now, if you want to eat a steak in Canada, you have to decide so months in advance. I don't use ADR's because I WANT to... I do it because I HAVE to. I'm "keeping up with the herd" as it were. Maybe you didn't frequent WDW back then, and don't have the same frame of reference as others... Maybe you don't have anything to compare it to. ADR's have killed the idea of locals popping in for dinner. I'm not a local, but can identify with their plight.

Same with FP's. If I don't work the system as well as everyone around me, it means I stand in more lines. That's not conjecture... That's fact. Your point is sound... If I were to go to the parks to simply walk around, taking it all in, maybe watch fireworks... It might not impact me. But the vast majority of people going to the parks are going for attractions. So again, I have to "work the system", or it means more lines.

To be clear:

I don't like having to decide months in advance where I want to eat on a trip and when. I DO it, because I have to. I never said I like it (but nice try). It's a necessary evil.

I wouldn't mind the FP change if it was planned for properly, with boosted infrastructure to minimize the negative guest impact of the change. If you read my hypothetical situation I posted, my concern is with having the knowledge AHEAD of making a trek to get a FP... Not about if I have one in hand and can't use it. That would be on me. I just want to be able to know ahead of time if it's worth trekking across the MK for a FP because the window is good for me. I don't see that as greedy or anything... I see that as wanting to have the best information to make the best decision on where I go and what I do before I do it, so I don't burn lots of time walking places just to see.

 

[Lee]

Know what's funny?
It never occurred to me to use a FP after it's window. Never. ( Not that it's a bad thing...)

That's why this policy change will only help me. Like if I go to Epcot and there are FPs available at Soarin between, say 12-2 because lots of guests with lunchtime ADRs opted not to take them.

It honestly has no downside for me at all. Probably a benefit of my "fast and loose" way of visiting parks. No ADRs, no young 'uns, etc.
:shrug:

 

[David S.]

It's all been said and debated and of course my two cents isn't going to change anyone's mind on this subject but this is a great disappointment to me. Fastpass is a wonderful tool and it's one that helps us all enjoy our park experiences more by reducing the amount of time we spend in lines. For those of us who were aware that the return time was a "suggestion" and not a rule, we have used it to our advantage to further enjoy the park experience by allowing us to maintain a pace which we ourselves set.

Put me firmly in the camp of people who like to control my own time in the parks, and stand in line as little as possible. I'm 40 now and being a park "commando" holds little interest to me, i don't want to be running from one side to the next and back again 10 times in a day, frankly it's just too exhausting... and standing in line for 40-50+ minutes to experience a ride is just not in my wheel house.

I'm deeply saddened by this change. It's just one more thing that Disney is doing that will lessen the pleasure of my park experience. I'll refrain from getting up on my tired old soap box of continued price increases versus continued service cuts, but suffice to say, this one is a deep cut in my eyes, one that will completely affect the way I enjoy their parks by putting me on a schedule OR forcing me to stand in lines. I'm certain that many have been living that reality for a long time and don't/won't/can't understand my sadness and perhaps think that I've been selfish all along, but rest assured this was a Disney rule and one that I loved and appreciated. It made me feel as though Disney cared about how I enjoyed their park, that they encouraged people taking their time to appreciate the magical experience they put in front of them. Now... well it's just another service cut in my eyes. Something I once had that I will never again get to enjoy.

:sohappy::sohappy::sohappy:

My favorite post in the thread so far (and there have been some great ones).

Well said, sir, and thank you

It's clear the policy was one of customer service and providing people an unquestioned grace period on allowing FPs after the return window. That does not mean the return window doesn't exist, or that it had no purpose. It just means it was policy not to enforce it.

Just because the police do not pull you over for going 58mph in a 55mph zone does not make the law on speeding mean 'speed limits are really just do your best' - it's just simply policy that they are not going to pursue prosecuting people within some range of the limit normally.

People continually refuse to acknowledge the difference between enforcing a rule vs not having the rule at all.

In my case, it's because I specifically asked managers "Is it considered 'against the rules' to use a FP after the one hour window", and I was told emphatically, on multiple occasions, "No, our policy is only that you can't use it early. They are good from the first time printed on the ticket until park closing".

On the other hand, the police won't likely ever tell you, "Although the speed limit is 70, we don't consider it speeding unless you are over 75"

Therefore, from day one of my using the system, I never felt like I was "breaking the rules" or "scamming the system", because everyone I asked from the front line CMs to coordinators to managers to Guest Relations CMs to Disney tour guides all told me, very clearly, that the official policy is "They are good from the first time printed on the ticket until park closing".

The stormtroopers in this official Disney-sanctioned preshow say the same thing (beginning at 1:55): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-C1KJS3aOtQ

I think the biggest difference of interpretation in these forum debates that I see here is some see this as cracking down on those evil 'late' "rule breakers who broke the rules".

Others, including myself, who were always told by the actual CMs in the park that it WASN'T breaking the rules to use them "Late", therefore see this not as "cracking down" on "finally enforcing" an existing rule, but actually CHANGING the rule to one that will give us less flexibility, as Allgar so eloquently stated.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

So why would Disney do this? Well, I think it's to force higher paying guests to buy NextGen and X-Pass. Since it sounds like this is going to be quite costly, making the fastpass return windows more definite means it'll be harder to get on your favorite rides without booking the right day/time in advance. Ugh, I'm not thrilled about this.

Ahhhhh.... Someone seeing the forest, not just the trees.

I completely agree. This is all being done to make Disney more money somehow, some way.

Opinions of many on the board will change once everything is out in the light, I can assure you.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

Ahhhhh.... Someone seeing the forest, not just the trees.

I completely agree. This is all being done to make Disney more money somehow, some way.

Opinions of many on the board will change once everything is out in the light, I can assure you.

Honestly, I think Disney's plan is going to work.

Fastpass was originally supposed to get people shopping and dining more (every FP commercial I saw in 1999 showed people with ice cream cones, shopping bags, etc). I think that was the hope, but instead people have largely used it to do more attractions in a day, go back to their resort and nap/swim (aka not spend money, etc). I still can't believe fastpass has remained free for so long, but finally, Disney's going to have a way to cash in on this technology at a premium.

 

[Lee]

This is all being done to make Disney more money somehow, some way.

This.
It applies to EVERY decision and policy change.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Honestly, I think Disney's plan is going to work.

Fastpass was originally supposed to get people shopping and dining more (every FP commercial I saw in 1999 showed people with ice cream cones, shopping bags, etc). I think that was the hope, but instead people have largely used it to do more attractions in a day, go back to their resort and nap/swim (aka not spend money, etc). I still can't believe fastpass has remained free for so long, but finally, Disney's going to have a way to cash in on this technology at a premium.

I don't disagree. And I'll probably be one of those paying the premium to get the better experience. I won't like it... But I'd be more ticked off watching everyone pass me by getting to do more stuff than me!

Then again... This is coming from a guy that spent WAYYYYY too much money one day on a personal guide for us because it was just too crowded and I didn't want to wait in any of the lines.

I'm just saying that if folks on the board think there's an uprising NOW... just wait! :lol:

 

[Rowdy]

Well, you cut out all the meat of my post where I described why deluxe resort guests are more likely to miss their time window: break at the pool, 2-hour signature meal, park hopping, etc. I never said everyone, but the indirect effect is that the people who followed a more relaxing, spontaneous, expensive approach (more commonly deluxe resort guests) will be affected.

In the grand view of things you could be right. I wouldn't consider myself a "higher paying" guest. But we do usually get and use the perks, (park hoppers, deluxe accommodation). Where I differ is, I haven't ever really used FP that much, and certainly haven't relied on it. Because generally I'm in 2 to 3 parks every day, or back at the hotel. The planning for me is pretty much impossible, because I don't know where I'll be next.

 

[the-reason14]

I have a theory about this. This change will be most disruptive...to higher paying guests.

Think about it. Higher paying guests are the ones most likely to leave the park and take a break at their nice volcano pool, mini water park, etc. Higher paying guests are more likely to have a fancy 2-hour signature dinner at a resort during their 6pm fastpass window. Higher paying guests are more likely to pay $50+ per person per day to park hop, which makes it harder to make your exact window.

This is all commonly observed stuff. Value resort guests are more likely to book their hotel simply for a place to sleep. Then they tour commando-style and spend all day in the parks, eating fast meals at mediocre buffets and quick service. Deluxe resort guests want to enjoy the resort, relax, have some downtime doing nice things...which is exactly what makes this change frustrating for us.

So why would Disney do this? Well, I think it's to force higher paying guests to buy NextGen and X-Pass. Since it sounds like this is going to be quite costly, making the fastpass return windows more definite means it'll be harder to get on your favorite rides without booking the right day/time in advance. Ugh, I'm not thrilled about this.

And I think is really unfair. It's smart of them to want to charge extra for fastpass, and it makes sense for them to implement a system that does just that and make it "easy" to pick your return time from home. But this is something that should have been introduced from the jump, and not years after it being a "free" service as it was marketed as.

Disneyland is looking sweeter and sweeter as the day goes on.

 

[Rowdy]

I don't disagree. And I'll probably be one of those paying the premium to get the better experience. I won't like it... But I'd be more ticked off watching everyone pass me by getting to do more stuff than me!

Then again... This is coming from a guy that spent WAYYYYY too much money one day on a personal guide for us because it was just too crowded and I didn't want to wait in any of the lines.

I'm just saying that if folks on the board think there's an uprising NOW... just wait! :lol:

I wonder if it would be unlimited, or if they'd "run out" or give time frames like the current Fastpass system? I'm ignorant to how Six Flags or Universal do it, but I'd imagine there would have to be some type of structure for it to work properly.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

And I think is really unfair. It's smart of them to want to charge extra for fastpass, and it makes sense for them to implement a system that does just that and make it "easy" to pick your return time from home. But this is something that should have been introduced from the jump, and not years after it being a "free" service as it was marketed as.

Disneyland is looking sweeter and sweeter as the day goes on.

Why not? It's how a LOT of people work. Get them hooked on your product at a discount (or free!) and then pull it back and start charging.

I ain't sayin' I agree with it... But it's what happens.