Big changes coming to FASTPASS in March

[Rowdy]

And I think is really unfair. It's smart of them to want to charge extra for fastpass, and it makes sense for them to implement a system that does just that and make it "easy" to pick your return time from home. But this is something that should have been introduced from the jump, and not years after it being a "free" service as it was marketed as.

Disneyland is looking sweeter and sweeter as the day goes on.

I think Fastpass always will be free. X-pass and the NextGen stuff will be the premium.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

I wonder if it would be unlimited, or if they'd "run out" or give time frames like the current Fastpass system? I'm ignorant to how Six Flags or Universal do it, but I'd imagine there would have to be some type of structure for it to work properly.

I did it at Six Flags Magic Mountain in LA. The more you paid, the shorter the window you had to wait between rides. I paid the top level, and basically literally could walk from ride to ride. It wasn't cheap... I think I paid $220 for 3 of us, plus regular park admission... But my longest wait was probably 10 minues, and that was for X2. We got through the whole park in like 5 hours.

But even then, then looks we were getting from people as we passed them by were like icepicks in my back. It definitely created a tiered class system... Which is something Disney is probably going to do, and it's going to create a HUGE problem.

 

[the-reason14]

I think Fastpass always will be free. X-pass and the NextGen stuff will be the premium.

I think so too, but I think the day will come when in order to fully reap the benefits of it, you'll have to pay extra. Basically I can still vacation the way I like and come back when it's convenient, but now I have to plan extra hard to make sure I'm back at mgm from MK for my 9pm tsm pass so it's not as free and spontaneous. And on top of that, I have to pay extra? It was fun while it last, but me thinks it's time for a break.

 

[Buried20KLeague]

Disneyland is looking sweeter and sweeter as the day goes on.

We took that view a few years ago and are passholders out there now. A far superior product to FLA, in my opinion.

But you better get your visits in now. If this gets rolled out at WDW and isn't a complete disaster, it's coming for the left coast, too.

 

[Horizons_03]

I love fast pass and I think that it is great what Disney has done, but now with all of these fast pass and QBOTS outside of Disney that people have to pay to more to enjoy there days, is rediculous. I understand the companies reasoning for it and it is more money, which I cannot fault them for wanting.
I personally feel Parks need to go back to getting rid of this all of these systems and let everyone wait his or her turn in line, that way people have a choice what to do with there time and are not on a schedule. A Disney vacation can be stressful enough as it is now. This way nobody has a right to complain about he wait times, it what it is and the line keeps moving not slowing down for someone who paid more.
Obviously this will never happen. I just hope for other people who paid more the person who already almost $80 per day just to get in the park, Disney does not go down the road of the pay per fast pass.

 

[the-reason14]

We took that view a few years ago and are passholders out there now. A far superior product to FLA, in my opinion.

But you better get your visits in now. If this gets rolled out at WDW and isn't a complete disaster, it's coming for the left coast, too.

I've been out there once, and had a blast. I can never see myself calling it home, but still, it was a breath of fresh air. Not so much because of WDW "falling apart" but it's because I've been to WDW so much and for a long time that it was good to want to slow down and take in the small details again at a "new" Disney park

But will this really make it's way over to DL with the whole planning your fastpass type crap? I honestly wouldn't mind being at DL and them enforcing the time window. It's no problem to get from Space to splash to Soarin to ToT since it's all walking. So there's no problem there. And if you're staying on site, then it's still walking so no issue. But this whole xpass thing just sounds ridiculous to me. I did a thread in general discussions a few weeks ago about 'the last straw' and this is close to being it for me.

 

[the-reason14]

When you put your needs above everyone else at the cost of others and justify it as correct because it serves you better.. that's exactly what selfish and self-righteous means.

Ok well call me that then, don't think I could care any less. I think you and some others are taking things out of context, but I don't have to justify my wants regarding fastpass and how I've become accustomed to vacationing to anyone else. You vacation the way you like, and I vacation the way I like. Now it seems I have to alter that and I'm not happy.

 

[draybook]

It's clear the policy was one of customer service and providing people an unquestioned grace period on allowing FPs after the return window. That does not mean the return window doesn't exist, or that it had no purpose. It just means it was policy not to enforce it.

Just because the police do not pull you over for going 58mph in a 55mph zone does not make the law on speeding mean 'speed limits are really just do your best' - it's just simply policy that they are not going to pursue prosecuting people within some range of the limit normally.

People continually refuse to acknowledge the difference between enforcing a rule vs not having the rule at all.



Don't see any of that at all. What I see is people hunting for any sort of exception case that is possible, regardless of probability, and trying to use that to say why limits shouldn't be enforced. Yet in most cases, Disney already has a comp system to deal with, or there are ways to deal with it, or in some cases that simply means you didn't get to use your FP. Not a huge loss.

What I see is more of people trying to make FP into some thing that heaven forbid if they don't use someone robbed them or something.



Manipulating to your advantage is 'gaming'. It doesn't matter if its someone tries to actively block it or not, or if it impacts others. Taking advantage of a system to be used in ways it for which were not the intended purpose is gaming the system.




You are correct. And the reason people complain are the same type of logic that would complain they are only going 2mph too fast if they got pulled over for doing 67mph in a 55mph zone.. because policy was not to stop people going less then 10mph over the speed limit. But they are still going 12mph over the limit.. not two. Because some people take 'lattitude' and instead of treating like a buffer, they treat it like entitlement.

Well, you're preaching to the choir, so to speak. I don't have an issue with the change nor will I have a problem adhering to it. The problem is that once again you people keep pointing the finger at those of us that use the "glitch". Try taking your soapboxes to the TDO offices and preach to them. They created the monster and they let the monster walk right in with late FP's. And comparing the FP situation to legal/illegal activites is just doing the apples/oranges thing all over. Like someone said, the cops won't tell you that they don't have an issue with you speeding, but Disney WILL tell you it's ok to show up late.



Pesonally, I wouldn't mind just getting rid of Fast Pass altogether, along with ADR's.

 

[the-reason14]

Ok, that is a much fairer statement than what you said previously. In the future I will only judge you on the third of fourth post you make, in which you clarify your point.

Just to be clear though, just as you don't like it and will visit less frequently (so you say) I DO like it, and I will visit more frequently to counter your less visits. By that logic, how does Disney lose?

In the end, we're not really debating something that is debatable, it's all about preferences and policies set by people we don't control. That's gotta be frustrating. Cause if I were against this and I came on the boards, hoping to drum up an angry mob like Gaston or something, and I was met by a bunch of folks who either didn't care or who liked the Beast, i'd be pretty PO'd.

Well, I don't have to clarify anything to anyone really. I could write out paragraph after paragraph to help illustrate how I feel, but there's no need. When it all falls down to it, you do you and vacation the way you want, and I'll do me and vacation the way I want. I never said Disney will "lose" if they do lose me as a customer. It's pretty much common knowledge that for every 100 people they could potentially lose because of this change, they'll gain 10,000 or so more. I do think a lot of people blow hot air when they complain about this and that not working and still plan trips. But that's them and their money, so I don't care. But I know for sure about me, and it has no effect on you either way.

 

[CP_alum08]

FastPass windows + strict enforcement of end-of-window times = discouragement to park-hop.

So don't park hop. It's pretty simple.

I'm looking at a FP right now (from 2/17/11) on the back it clearly says "Please enter at the designated entry point between the times noted on the other side" I guess I don't understand what is so hard to comprehend about that.

I also don't understand the amount of crap excuses people are coming up with to not make it back during the window; stopping for bathroom breaks, being caught in parade crowds, stuck shopping in stores. Seriously? I can understand the ADR issue to an extent, but if you look up and the fastpass window is 6:00-7:00 and you know you have an ADR at 6:00, either call the restaurant and let them know you will probably be a few minutes late (which we have done countless times and every time they have been accommodating) OR come back 10 minutes later and get a fastpass for the next batch of times. You can't possibly tell me that walking around for 10 minutes in the happiest place on earth is going to "ruin your vacation." And if it's taking longer than around 10 minutes for the times to change, the stand-by line probably isn't that long to begin with!!!!

I am all for this. Yes, it might mean that those FPs we shoved in our pockets and forgot about won't get used, but if it means Disney enforcing more of it's own rules, then great. Maybe we will finally get them to enforce the no flash photography rule too.

The excuses I see people making on here are the reason why I think this new Xpass thing is a HORRIBLE idea. if you can't plan around a 1-hour time window how are you possibly going to be able to plan your entire trip 6 months before you get there? Little Johnny is going to need an 'unscheduled' bathroom break and it's going to throw off the entire days plan and mom and dad are going to think the vacation is a bust. Bring back spontaneity, get rid of FP and ADR all together!

 

[flynnibus]

Well, you cut out all the meat of my post where I described why deluxe resort guests are more likely to miss their time window: break at the pool, 2-hour signature meal, park hopping, etc. I never said everyone, but the indirect effect is that the people who followed a more relaxing, spontaneous, expensive approach (more commonly deluxe resort guests) will be affected.

I cut it out because it was something that only applied to the subset, not the larger set you implied. Addressing it was redundant because it only applied to the subset, not the larger set like you stated.

Why? Because enforcing the FP return time isn't changing when the return time is. If someone did have time to go get in the pool before their return time.. they still will. Or conversely, those that did not, still will not.

So, the impacted audience are those that would treat the return time as non-binding, not all deluxe guests like you stated.

 

[David S.]

Disneyland is looking sweeter and sweeter as the day goes on.

I feel the same way, for a number of reasons. This latest rumour is but one "little thing", that when taken with various other recent disappointments, adds up to a big thing.

I've enjoyed and agreed with your posts in this thread, BTW

We took that view a few years ago and are passholders out there now. A far superior product to FLA, in my opinion.

But you better get your visits in now. If this gets rolled out at WDW and isn't a complete disaster, it's coming for the left coast, too.

Great advice (and I've enjoyed and agreed with your posts in this thread as well). I'm planning a trip to DL in 2013 or 2014 because I'm taking a break from WDW after the Snow White darkride closes anyway, and this will coincide nicely with the launch of Carsland and relaunch of DCA. I just hope that there aren't any major rehabs going on during my trip window, like this year's Matterhorn rehab, which rules 2012 out (my main travel window is before summer).

And a few years ago I considered going but the entire Rivers Of America area was drained, which would have meant missing all of their Frontierland boat rides, (including Columbia and Canoes, both not found at MK), Tom Sawyer Island, and Fantasmic! Considering I know WDW inside out but have only been to DL twice (and the first I was around 5 and barely remember it), I just want to get the "complete experience" since trips out there are so rare for me since I drive everywhere (hate flying) and it's MUCH further for me than WDW.

Good point that "next gen"/not allowing FP window until closing could be heading to DL next. Since we've heard so many times that WDW has only a small percentage of locals but DL is majority-local, I'm hoping that opposition from local Disneylander APers who enjoy using FP the way it is currently set up will provide enough opposition to make it harder for management to get this implemented on the left coast.

If these changes do come to DL, hopefully they will be after April 2013, which is my tentative earliest trip date.

 

[the-reason14]

When I read about people assuming it's a change to make more money, I agree and shake my head at the same time. My biggest issue is that it's been free and the policy has been this way for years. They should have done this sooner honestly then it wouldn't be such a big blow.

Anyways, remember the noodle station? Once upon a time it was free to sit down and watch wishes in it, now you have to pay for a dessert party or something. Well I used to enjoy watching wishes and remember watching several shows from the noodle station. I never really tripped too much about the change because I've seen wishes more then enough times, and it's been the same fireworks show for years.

Ending point, if they were to make new rides, new lands, new things to experience, then and only then could I see myself coming back and embracing this fastpass change. Keeping things the same, but wanting to charge extra for it is not gonna cut it.

 

[flynnibus]

You do know you didn't use have to have ADR's, right? Before the DDP and ADR's, you could walk up to virtually every restaurant on property, put your name down, wait a few minutes, and get a table

BS - they've always had reservations. The problem was before you couldn't do it except day of, which meant scrambling in the morning to get your reservations for the day to eat where you wanted. It was one of the primary purposes of the interactive kiosks put in EPCOT. You always had to plan ahead if you actually wanted to get what you wanted. Just when/how has changed.

Maybe you're the small case where you could fit between the cracks and spare capacity. But dining reservations and working that has virtually always been part of WDW. The main difference now is when you must make those reservations and the demand increase due to DDP.

Same with FP's. If I don't work the system as well as everyone around me, it means I stand in more lines. That's not conjecture... That's fact

Yes, but you aren't excluded from participating in the attractions either. It is also fact that someone who plans WHEN they goto certain attractions will wait in less lines then someone who wanders and happens to hit the attractions at bad times. That isn't to say we FORCE everyone to minimize their waits by following a specific touring plan, but for someone who chooses not too.. they must accept they are not going to get the maximum potential someone else might.

People can't cry when someone who works harder gets more.

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

I cut it out because it was something that only applied to the subset, not the larger set you implied. Addressing it was redundant because it only applied to the subset, not the larger set like you stated.

Why? Because enforcing the FP return time isn't changing when the return time is. If someone did have time to go get in the pool before their return time.. they still will. Or conversely, those that did not, still will not.

So, the impacted audience are those that would treat the return time as non-binding, not all deluxe guests like you stated.

For the millionth time, I never said all deluxe guests are impacted, but that deluxe guests are more likely to be impacted. Learn to read, please. Or if you can read, stop putting words in my mouth and address my actual point.

It's just simple logic. If I get a fastpass for 1pm but I feel like going back to my nice resort at 12pm and then swim for 2 hours, I'll miss my return window. If my fastpass is for 5:30 but I have a reservation for Citricos at 5:45, I'll miss my return window. Deluxe resort guests are more likely to do things that make it harder to make your exact return window.

 

[the-reason14]

I feel the same way, for a number of reasons. This latest rumour is but one "little thing", that when taken with various other recent disappointments, adds up to a big thing.

I've enjoyed and generally agreed with your posts in this thread, BTW




Great advice (and I've enjoyed and agreed with your posts in this thread as well). I'm planning a trip to DL in 2013 or 2014 because I'm taking a break from WDW after the Snow White darkride closes anyway, and this will coincide nicely with the launch of Carsland and relaunch of DCA. I just hope that there aren't any major rehabs going on during my trip window, like this year's Matterhorn rehab, which rules 2012 out (my main travel window is before summer).

And a few years ago I considered going but the entire Rivers Of America area was drained, which would have meant missing all of their boat rides, TSI, and Fantasmic! Considering I know WDW inside out but have only been to DL twice (and the first I was around 5 and barely remember it), I just want to get the "complete experience" since trips out there are so rare for me since I drive everywhere (hate flying) and it's MUCH further for me than WDW.

Good point that "next gen"/not allowing FP window until closing could be heading to DL next. Since we've heard so many times that WDW has only a small percentage of locals but DL is majority-local, I'm hoping that opposition from local Disneylander APers who enjoy using FP the way it is currently set up will provide enough opposition to make it harder for management to get this implemented on the left coast.

If these changes do come to DL, hopefully they will be after April 2013, which is my tentative trip date.

Thank you, I'm glad you've enjoyed my posts and rants over this change lol.

And I see where you're coming from and a lot of other people when they talk about WDW being stale etc. The bigger picture is slowly but surely fitting nicely in it's frame and I'm seeing what a lot of people have been talking about. I haven't "ignored" things like messed up AAs or light bulbs not flickering right etc, but I've never chalked them up to being a huge deal, at least not big enough to make me want to stop going. However I have been extremely blessed to have gone to WDW so many times over the years, that I can honestly see myself cutting back from 4 or 5 trips a year to none in saving up for Disneyland. Disneyland is still new and exciting as I've only ever been once. It's not like WDW is building anything interesting to me personally over the next few years. So slowing things down and observing may be in the cards for me. It's funny how your perspective can change over one little thing haha.

 

[CarlFredricksen]

What exactly do we know about 'Xpass' and the 'nextgen' systems?

 

[flynnibus]

In my case, it's because I specifically asked managers "Is it considered 'against the rules' to use a FP after the one hour window", and I was told emphatically, on multiple occasions, "No, our policy is only that you can't use it early. They are good from the first time printed on the ticket until park closing".

On the other hand, the police won't likely ever tell you, "Although the speed limit is 70, we don't consider it speeding unless you are over 75"

That is simply a difference in what information they share and how forthcoming they are. It doesn't change what the actual rules are.

The policy gives them the flexibility to control when they chose to enforce it or not. No one is denying Disney employees have confirmed you can use them later. That's their enforcement policy. But the FP return window HAS been enforced in the past. No one looked at it as 'disney is changing the rules!!' - no it's simply Disney being more strict about enforcement. Disney has done this frequently for short periods. Either due to testing or due to simple acute situations like busy periods.

A Disney CM may also tell you that they aren't going to charge you if you break something in the store - it doesn't change the underlying rule that Disney may still hold you responsible for damage caused by a guest.

Policy and enforcement may be more flexible then the actual rules. Same as speeding.

Others, including myself, who were always told by the actual CMs in the park that it WASN'T breaking the rules to use them "Late", therefore see this not as "cracking down" on "finally enforcing" an existing rule, but actually CHANGING the rule to one that will give us less flexibility, as Allgar so eloquently stated.

Your perspective.. but by your view then Disney has been flip flopping on this for years.

 

[the-reason14]

Why not? It's how a LOT of people work. Get them hooked on your product at a discount (or free!) and then pull it back and start charging.

I ain't sayin' I agree with it... But it's what happens.

Sad but true. And Disney doesn't give a rats ______ about me or anyone feeling this way. But it just is what it is I guess.

 

[Captain Chaos]

I have a theory about this. This change will be most disruptive...to higher paying guests.

Think about it. Higher paying guests are the ones most likely to leave the park and take a break at their nice volcano pool, mini water park, etc. Higher paying guests are more likely to have a fancy 2-hour signature dinner at a resort during their 6pm fastpass window. Higher paying guests are more likely to pay $50+ per person per day to park hop, which makes it harder to make your exact window.

This is all commonly observed stuff. Value resort guests are more likely to book their hotel simply for a place to sleep. Then they tour commando-style and spend all day in the parks, eating fast meals at mediocre buffets and quick service. Deluxe resort guests want to enjoy the resort, relax, have some downtime doing nice things...which is exactly what makes this change frustrating for us.

So why would Disney do this? Well, I think it's to force higher paying guests to buy NextGen and X-Pass. Since it sounds like this is going to be quite costly, making the fastpass return windows more definite means it'll be harder to get on your favorite rides without booking the right day/time in advance. Ugh, I'm not thrilled about this.

If you have a dining ADR for Ohana at 5:45, and you go to Splash and see FP return for 5:30 to 6:30, a reasonable person would know they are going to miss their FP return window.. then you don't get the FP... if the ride is that important for you, either get there first thing in the morning or just wait online...