Avengers Campus - Reactions / Reviews

shambolicdefending

Well-Known Member
If you say the scale of cuts are smaller, then I don't know how you can say its similar to the 90s. The late 90s was bad for the park, so again I don't know you can say its similar.

But ok, if you say so. :)
Because that's what the word "similar" means:

sim·i·lar
/ˈsim(ə)lər/

adjective
adjective: similar
  1. resembling without being identical.
 

shambolicdefending

Well-Known Member
Now who is being disingenuous.

So tell me how what you posted isn't similar to that?
Well, unless my junior high school English teachers lied to me...

"APs aren't as financially valuable..." (implied comparison)

and

"APs are not financially valuable."

...are two sentences that do not mean the same thing. And, using the same standard you used to decide if cost reductions in the 90s and today were "similar", they're not even close.
 

Disney Irish

Premium Member
Well, unless my junior high school English teachers lied to me...

"APs aren't as financially valuable..." (implied comparison)

and

"APs are not financially valuable."

...are two sentences that do not mean the same thing. And, using the same standard you used to decide if cost reductions in the 90s and today were "similar", they're not even close.
And my point was that I'm sorry but you are incorrect in your assessment of APs value to the company, no matter how you word it.
 

DanielBB8

Well-Known Member
I don't know how you can say that when the year isn't over yet.

For the last decade, except for 2012 and 2016, the attendance at DL has steadily increased:


If anything 2019 will likely be flat to slightly lower just like in 2016. Which still over the average of the last decade is still a yearly increase.
But then, I don't know you can make a claim that every year is higher when this year it has been lower 3%. Your prediction should be year to year, yet you already conceded that this year will be flat. You can't make an argument based on the average of the last decade. It is unlikely this year will see a increase in attendance unless attendance in the current quarter exceeds 3% significantly, which from what we've seen, APs aren't back in force.
 

Disney Irish

Premium Member
But then, I don't know you can make a claim that every year is higher when this year it has been lower 3%. Your prediction should be year to year, yet you already conceded that this year will be flat. You can't make an argument based on the average of the last decade. It is unlikely this year will see a increase in attendance unless attendance in the current quarter exceeds 3% significantly, which from what we've seen, APs aren't back in force.
First, that is down 3% across the entire domestic parks including WDW. Second, that is only for the most recent quarter not the entire year, this year isn't over yet. So you can't claim the entire year will be down when the year isn't over.
 

DanielBB8

Well-Known Member
First, that is down 3% across the entire domestic parks including WDW. Second, that is only for the most recent quarter not the entire year, this year isn't over yet. So you can't claim the entire year will be down when the year isn't over.
I haven't claimed anything, but you claimed a lot like this year will increase like every other year it has increased.

That 3% decline if included WDW could mean Disneyland's decline is even worse than thought because WDW didn't get the advice to avoid the parks.
 

Disney Irish

Premium Member
There is actually plenty of data that makes it very difficult to conclude otherwise.
Please provide this data, and I'll be happy to look it over. But with Iger's recent statements that specifically state that DLR attendance was only down due to APs being blocked. That indicates that APs are even more valuable to the company than anyone thought.
 

shambolicdefending

Well-Known Member
Please provide this data, and I'll be happy to look it over. But with Iger's recent statements that specifically state that DLR attendance was only down due to APs being blocked. That indicates that APs are even more valuable to the company than anyone thought.
I think you missed the point with Iger's statement (which you also misquoted - he did not say that was the "only" reason attendance was down).

But, more to the point, you have to answer this question: Why did the parks choose to impliment the heaviest AP blockouts we have ever seen this summer, to coincide with SWGE's opening?

If you want data, it's easy to come by. The two obvious data points are admission prices and the function of the blockout calendars. There's no way to substantively analyze those two things and conclude that Disney views APs (as a whole) as holding greater or equal financial value than paying guests.
 

Disney Irish

Premium Member
I think you missed the point with Iger's statement (which you also misquoted - he did not say that was the "only" reason attendance was down).

But, more to the point, you have to answer this question: Why did the parks choose to impliment the heaviest AP blockouts we have ever seen this summer, to coincide with SWGE's opening?

If you want data, it's easy to come by. The two obvious data points are admission prices and the function of the blockout calendars. There's no way to substantively analyze those two things and conclude that Disney views APs (as a whole) as holding greater or equal financial value than paying guests.
I'm sorry but I don't extrapolate that same data as you do based on blockout and price increases (which by the way were across the board not just on APs). So again agree to disagree.

However I will say this one final thought. If Disney didn't see the same value from APs as daily ticket purchasers, why don't they just eliminate the monthly payments or eliminate the program all together? This idea that APs are not the same financial value as daily ticket purchasers has been thrown around boards like this since the program started. And its stems from the idea that because APs can go more often they must spend less, which is not true. There is no actual real concreate data that proves one way or the other that APs are seen as less valuable than any other guest. If they were Disney would have gotten rid of the program a long time ago.
 

shambolicdefending

Well-Known Member
I'm sorry but I don't extrapolate that same data as you do based on blockout and price increases (which by the way were across the board not just on APs).
I didn't say anything about price increases. You seem to have a habit of saying I (and Bob Iger) said things that we actually never did.
However I will say this one final thought. If Disney didn't see the same value from APs as daily ticket purchasers, why don't they just eliminate the monthly payments or eliminate the program all together?
The answer to this is obvious. Because the AP program makes them money. This has nothing to do with whether or not they are worth more than paying guests.
This idea that APs are not the same financial value as daily ticket purchasers has been thrown around boards like this since the program started. And its stems from the idea that because APs can go more often they must spend less, which is not true.
That is not at all where the idea stems from. I have never heard anyone make this argument. I've certainly never made it.
There is no actual real concreate data that proves one way or the other that APs are seen as less valuable than any other guest. If they were Disney would have gotten rid of the program a long time ago.
This makes no sense at all. Why would they get rid of a program that makes them money, just because it makes them less than other tickets?

The evidence that APs are worth less is obvious. During the days, weeks, and months of the year when paid guests come in their greatest numbers, Disneyland blocks out APs to make room for them. Why would Disney do that if APs were worth the same or more?
 

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