AVATAR Concept Art released

[danlb_2000]

I doubt that Disney would be using that title as it is already copyrighted by someone else. Disney is pretty about stuff like that.

You can't copyright a name, and a quick search of the US Trademark database doesn't show anyone having a trademark on that name.

 

[ShookieJones]

Sure the concepts for Pandora look great, but I can't help but be dissapointed if the only attractions there are going to be a Soarin and boat style ride. I was expecting a state of the art ride system for one of Pandora's rides. Same thing with the Star Wars expansion if the main attraction is a motorbike roller coaster with some theming. I was also a bit dissapointed that Radiator Springs Racers is pretty much the same ride system as Test Track.

At least HP Forbidden Journey has a unique ride system that had never been done before. And it sounds as if Gringotts will have a unique ride system again too with the combination of dark ride/ roller coaster with special elements in it. Maybe it's too early to complain about it since we don't know the exact details of Pandora's and Star Wars rides, but it definitely feels to me that Universal is pushing the envelope on new ride systems instead of Disney.

Hmm..I think Disney has done pretty damn good with their Orlando theme parks as far as any cloning is concerned. I can't think of any direct duplications in the four parks.

Nothing against Universal (or either of these fun rides), but to counter your point:
Spiderman and Transformers both a stone's throw away from each other -- are nearly identical rides.

 

[SirLink]

Hmm..I think Disney has done pretty damn good with their Orlando theme parks as far as any cloning is concerned. I can't think of any direct duplications in the four parks.

Nothing against Universal (or either of these fun rides), but to counter your point:
Spiderman and Transformers both a stone's throw away from each other -- are nearly identical rides.

Eh? I don't even ... so basically your saying you wouldn't want an Indy EMV ride because it would be identical to Dinosaur with different theming ?

 

[lazyboy97o]

The great thing about Avatar is you won't be getting a Navi'd up Mickey action figure. Cameron wouldn't allow that. I'm expecting merchandise that will only be available in that part of the park - not necessarily what people will be craving but still it might shock Disney into realising they have been doing it wrong, for such a long time.

More of my "damned if they do, damned if they don't" thinking: what if Disney fills this place with unique merchandise that doesn't sell? Does that reinforce the "demand" for the same stuff already everywhere else?

 

[erider]

Hmm..I think Disney has done pretty damn good with their Orlando theme parks as far as any cloning is concerned. I can't think of any direct duplications in the four parks.

Nothing against Universal (or either of these fun rides), but to counter your point:
Spiderman and Transformers both a stone's throw away from each other -- are nearly identical rides.

I was not talking directly about cloning, but more by looking at the ride systems of the rumored upcoming WDW rides. Pandora simulator sounds very similiar to Soarin, Star Wars motorbike coaster sounds very similiar to Pony Express coaster at Knott's Berry farm. Nothing really ground breaking in my opinion, but I hope Disney will surprise us with some unique elements to these upcoming rides.

I agree with your Spiderman and Transformers comment. These are indeed very similiar.

 

[SirLink]

More of my "damned if they do, damned if they don't" thinking: what if Disney fills this place with unique merchandise that doesn't sell? Does that reinforce the "demand" for the same stuff already everywhere else?

Not really. If the unique merchandise doesn't sell better marketing is what is needed. Plus TWDC refers to the parks as one huge conglomeration when they should use view each park singularly.

 

[doctornick]

Except the concept art matches pretty much exactly with the leaked blue prints. Sorain' 2.0? with a Boat Ride. I really am hoping this is incorrect and they are building a true next-generation E-Ticket.

The concept art also matches up very well with a Pandora's Box ride system. So?

The concept art shows essentially nothing about what the main E-ticket ride will be like, beyond that it will simulate riding on a banshee on Pandora. In terms of ride system, we only know what the insiders have indicated and the concensus recently has been that (1) the leaked blueprints are no longer the current plans and (2) the ride is supposed to move from place to place, not just be in front of one screen. That doesn't meant that things cannot change, but it seems to be where we are now.

Someone (I think Martin, but I could be wrong) also mentioned that to appease Cameron for taking out the third ride (that they want to use for Star Wars instead), that Disney has committed to really plussing the remaining planned attractions and land. If true, then hopefully that would mean a true ground breaking experience for the E-ticket.

 

[DVCOwner]

I just have a feeling that if Universal was building Avatar and just released the artwork, the same group saying how bad this is would be saying how great this is. They would be using it as another example to prove Universal is the best. They would go on to list all the great things about the Avatar plans and wonder way Disney can not do the same. It comes down to Universal good - Disney bad.

I for one think that Walt Disney World needs something new and sooner than 2017; but it does not take away from my looking forward to seeing what Disney can do with Avatar.

 

[SirLink]

I just have a feeling that if Universal was building Avatar and just released the artwork, the same group saying how bad this is would be saying how great this is. They would be using it as another example to prove Universal is the best. They would go on to list all the great things about the Avatar plans and wonder way Disney can not do the same. It comes down to Universal good - Disney bad.

I for one think that Walt Disney World needs something new and sooner than 2017; but it does not take away from my looking forward to seeing what Disney can do with Avatar.

Well for one it would have already been built by now.

 

[orky8]

Correct. Potter's real boon has been guest spending. The land paid for itself in a matter of a few months and has been raking in the cash ever since. I don't know DAK or DHS's guest spending numbers, but I have to assume IoA's numbers are higher.

Also, keeping in mind that most people visiting DHS are doing so on a multi-day ticket where the marignal cost for that day of attendance is only a few dollars. Attendence is only part of the story, and without guest spend, DHS easily could be losing money for Disney even with higher attendance levels than the Uni parks.

 

[ShookieJones]

Eh? I don't even ... so basically your saying you wouldn't want an Indy EMV ride because it would be identical to Dinosaur with different theming ?

Hmm...let me reread what I posted.....

Nope -- I didn't say anything close to that! If you'll note I wasn't even ranking on Spiderman and Transformers being almost identical. I enjoyed both those rides and my fun wasn't hampered by the cloning.

I wouldn't complain one bit if RSR or Indy made the trip to our coast!
I was merely commenting on the post and saying that so far Disney has done a good job of NOT doing what the poster was stating that Disney was doing and that Universal was not.

I hope this makes sense. As of late I tend to stay out of the Uni vs. WDW arguments but after my most recent visit to both parks I've found that some of the comments made in both directions often border on unfounded viewpoints, and just wanted to make note that cloning as of yet is NOT an issue at WDW.

 

[ShookieJones]

I was not talking directly about cloning, but more by looking at the ride systems of the rumored upcoming WDW rides. Pandora simulator sounds very similiar to Soarin, Star Wars motorbike coaster sounds very similiar to Pony Express coaster at Knott's Berry farm. Nothing really ground breaking in my opinion, but I hope Disney will surprise us with some unique elements to these upcoming rides.

I agree with your Spiderman and Transformers comment. These are indeed very similiar.

Agree on above comments if rides come to fruition as stated. I also agree on your original comments that Universal as done some pretty amazingly ground breaking rides recently!! Not to mention the amazing job they've done on theming in WWoHP either.

 

[lebeau]

I would've agreed until last Thanksgiving when a surprise addition to the Studios wowed me beyond belief. As I participated in a simple game of Simon Says, done Dora the Explorer style and helped Captain Jack defeat various bad guys, I realized that Disney had far exceeded the expectations harbored by the most cynical. Bravo. Bravo.

Say Map! Say MAP! SAY MAP!!

There have been times when Dora the Explorer almost pushed me over the edge.

 

[Atomicmickey]

That said, I have heard that the motorbike coaster wasn't cut for budget reasons, but simply Disney pulled it to plug it into the Star Wars Project. And that Cameron was NOT happy. To appease him, Disney promised to go totally over the top on the elements in the boat ride and the macro-themeing of the whole land.

This seems to be the 'rumor story' that makes the most sense, and is getting the most
traction. Haven't heard direct confirmation from any insiders, though. Would be good to hear.

I am, again, just fine with them NOT putting the coaster in Pandora, and instead having us
zipping through Endor. It's not like we're not getting a coaster . . . . we're going to get
two new themed lands! All good.

 

[lebeau]

I just have a feeling that if Universal was building Avatar and just released the artwork, it would open before 2017 and cost half as much.

Fixed that for you.

 

[space42]

The concept art also matches up very well with a Pandora's Box ride system. So?

The concept art shows essentially nothing about what the main E-ticket ride will be like, beyond that it will simulate riding on a banshee on Pandora. In terms of ride system, we only know what the insiders have indicated and the concensus recently has been that (1) the leaked blueprints are no longer the current plans and (2) the ride is supposed to move from place to place, not just be in front of one screen. That doesn't meant that things cannot change, but it seems to be where we are now.

Someone (I think Martin, but I could be wrong) also mentioned that to appease Cameron for taking out the third ride (that they want to use for Star Wars instead), that Disney has committed to really plussing the remaining planned attractions and land. If true, then hopefully that would mean a true ground breaking experience for the E-ticket.

The only person saying that it will not be Soran' 2.0 is @Tim_4. I don't think that is a consensus. I hope he is right. I want to be wowed! Soran' 2.0 in 3D would be a huge missed opportunity.
The leaked blueprints show Soran' 2.0 (or some type simulator in front of a screen) and a boat ride that travels through the show building. The concept art and video seem to support this.

Disney already surpassed Soran' 1.0 back in 1983 with Horizons by suspending your ride vehicle through 2 separate Omni-Max domes as just a small part of a 15 minute long mega E-Ticket. I just want to see Disney out-do (or at least come close to) classic Disney.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Not really. If the unique merchandise doesn't sell better marketing is what is needed. Plus TWDC refers to the parks as one huge conglomeration when they should use view each park singularly.

It seems contradictory at first, but the problem is actually the opposite of what you state. The Resort is not looked at as a whole, but at each individual component, beyond the park level down to individual shops and restaurants and their square footage. What this means is that every little thing must justify its existence. This individualism created the generic landscape because everything stopped working together, but in competition. The shops had to increase profitability so they just copied the best selling merchandise from the stores with the biggest numbers. A similar story occurred with food service and many were shuttered for being unable to meet new expectations based on their being seen as an isolated restaurant.

Disney also has a pervasive and troubling culture of fiercely defending preconceived notions. This is why I see so much of this project as "damned if you do, damned if you don't." Disney likes franchises and mass merchandising and those are the positions they will defend. If unique merchandise sells it is not because it is unique, but because of the franchise. If it doesn't sell it is not because of lack of franchise appeal or poor marketing it poor quality, but because unique merchandising doesn't work.

 

[doctornick]

The only person saying that it will not be Soran' 2.0 is @Tim_4. I don't think that is a consensus. I hope he is right.

Phenenix agreed with Tim_4 on it. I thought there was someone else like articos or Martin as well.

 

[Kman101]

I think anything with a screen will be labled Soarin' 2.0. Period. And some use it as a way to dimiss the attraction. I think even WDW1974 was a little less dismissive of it, which says something.

I for one will hold my opinion on that until I hear more, and see more.

Maybe they realized it was the best way to do what they wanted do with the attraction? I wish people would just stop making assumptions

And it's true (I really don't want to play the Uni vs. WDW game either, it's getting old). If Uni were putting this in, it would get praise up the you know what, and no one can tell me otherwise. But it's Disney and a screen and it's just awful before it even debuts.

I understand that the Soarin' ride itself may not be everyone's cup of tea but the negativity around it just astounds me. We have no idea what the completed experience will be. Of course my gut says TDO will be lazy and cheap but I'm really trying to give them the benefit of the doubt here. If it's a hangglider and a screen, then yes, it is Soarin 2.0 and I won't be that thrilled.

But it's also like saying Small World and POTC shouldn't exist because both are boat rides. It's about what's done with the finished product and the scenery and the experience. IMO. I just wanted to add that. (And that same argument can be used for Indy, Dinosaur, any coaster....)

 

[awoogala]

Correct. Potter's real boon has been guest spending. The land paid for itself in a matter of a few months and has been raking in the cash ever since. I don't know DAK or DHS's guest spending numbers, but I have to assume IoA's numbers are higher.

Haven't been there yet ( we are going in November), but I have been thinking, ALL of our spending money is going to Potter this time..lol
I haven't been buying much in Disney the last 2 years, the stuff is getting boring.