Analysts project 10 pct attendance decline at Disney's U.S. parks

[alecshawn]

Well, 10% less folks is good for us! Less folks to navigate around.

 

[yankspy]

As usual, people take liberties with facts in order to make their point. First, Obama NEVER said people shoudn't travel or take vacations. He was castigating Wells Fargo for offering employees a lavish Vegas trip after it had received $25 Billion in taxpayer funds after absorbing Wachovia (it is specualted that the only reason Wells Fargo purchased Wachovia was so it could receive the bailout money). Obama said nothing about people taking vacations on their own dime.

Secondly, the parks are crowded, yes. But Disney isn't making any money off them. I mentioned it in another thread, but some people think too highly of gate admission. Most parks could probably operate without charging gate admission...they make the real money from in park spending by guests...how do you think seasonal parks could continue to operate year after year when they have no income for half the year! And none of them charge Disney's rates. It's also why after a four day pass that add-on days are really cheap at Disney. The resorts are packed...but most people are only paying 57% of what Disney actually charges. Not to mention the resorts aren't using all the rooms they have. With so few rides at DHS and DAK, naturally the rides are going to have long waits when it has never been so cheap to visit Disney. As the old saying goes: "appearances can be deceiving." Go to any Broadway show on opening night. I assure you, the performance that night is not making any money. When people aren't paying, there's no money to be had!

It is true that not everyone is affected by the economy. But that was true of the Depression. The hardest-hit industries were manufacturing. There aren't anywhere near as many manufacturing jobs in the U.S. anymore. Banks collapsed. I think at it's height unemployment was at around 15%. So you had 85% of the country still working. Since we actually learned something from history, bank depsoits were insured, so we won't see that level of disaster again (unless Japan calls it loans to the US...which would destroy the economy). We are a much more white-collar country now, so the effects of a afailing eonomy take longer to become obvious. But to pretend as if people are overstating the state of the economic crisis is absolutely ignorant.

Some estimates go as high as 25%. Another lesson learned was getting rid of the 90% margin rule.

 

[bjlc57]

if a down turn is coming...

instead of giving discounts that may or may not apply to you..

why can't WDW lower the BASE PRICE?

$75 a day is a little much don't you think? even a $10 drop would be appreciated. that allows for every one to receive the bounty of "discounts".

there is price and then there is over price.. Tell me what new rides or whatever justify $75 per day as a base price? its unrealistic.

 

[RSoxNo1]

instead of giving discounts that may or may not apply to you..

why can't WDW lower the BASE PRICE?

$75 a day is a little much don't you think? even a $10 drop would be appreciated. that allows for every one to receive the bounty of "discounts".

there is price and then there is over price.. Tell me what new rides or whatever justify $75 per day as a base price? its unrealistic.

What would be more logical is a Florida Resident single day discount. Get more locals to visit the parks.

 

[dave2822]

I am not going to debate whether or not these numbers are accurate nor I am going to start down some political path :lookaroun

My only question is why hasn't anyone brought up all of the other tourist spots that are deeply suffering? I mean whether or not Disney has a drop off, history will suggest they will be just fine ...

What about all of the other tourist destinations in Florida and around the country? Is Universal/Sea World in real danger of being shut down if this continues? Aren't they still on the chopping block looking to be sold as it is?

Of course Disney is a concern, and what's bad for them is bad for the entire travel industry ... but it's not like they are losing and everyone else is winning ... EVERYONE is losing ... tourist destinations, banks, retail, local stores ... it's not what Disney isn't doing it's just what's happening in the country (and world) ...

But I would be more worried about other tourist desitinations that may suffer deeply ...

 

[RiversideBunny]

A 10% drop, or even 15%, would only be from the very high attendance levels that were experienced last year and in the last few years.

It would not mean that no one is going to the parks, just that attendance may be getting back to 'normal'.

 

[hokielutz]

A 10% drop, or even 15%, would only be from the very high attendance levels that were experienced last year and in the last few years.

It would not mean that no one is going to the parks, just that attendance may be getting back to 'normal'.

You could call it a market correction.... attendance comes down, but will go up again in the future.

Lets also be happy that Disney is keeping to their refurb schedule.

 

[alecshawn]

instead of giving discounts that may or may not apply to you..

why can't WDW lower the BASE PRICE?

$75 a day is a little much don't you think? even a $10 drop would be appreciated. that allows for every one to receive the bounty of "discounts".

there is price and then there is over price.. Tell me what new rides or whatever justify $75 per day as a base price? its unrealistic.

Actually, thats not that much. AND, with theWYW ticket system, if you stay more than a day...the price gets cheaper.
I think a 7 day ticket is what 33.00 per day? (ish)

 

[fosse76]

Actually, thats not that much. AND, with theWYW ticket system, if you stay more than a day...the price gets cheaper.
I think a 7 day ticket is what 33.00 per day? (ish)

The problem is that not everyone stays at Disney that long. Disney can leave the prices as is...if the include park-hopping in the admission. Then they can decrease the base amount for people who don't want to spend a week there.

 

[hokielutz]

Actually, thats not that much. AND, with theWYW ticket system, if you stay more than a day...the price gets cheaper.
I think a 7 day ticket is what 33.00 per day? (ish)

But you have to get to a 4-day ticket to start making the visit pay-off. This is a little bit of a negative to those who will only be in town for 1-2 days or that is all the plan to spend at the Disney parks, because Disney is part of a broader vacation plan.

 

[Pumbas Nakasak]

analists analyse

 

[flynnibus]

But you have to get to a 4-day ticket to start making the visit pay-off. This is a little bit of a negative to those who will only be in town for 1-2 days or that is all the plan to spend at the Disney parks, because Disney is part of a broader vacation plan.

And there in is the exact intention of the pricing plan. To entice you to stay longer verse just dropping by for a day or two. This isn't by chance... this is by design.

 

[DisneyDellsDude]

Sounds as if it could be plausible.
You can't expect that attendance will go up every single year.
But you also can't expect that you will get loads of people to visit when you offer no good quality attractions or refurbs.

Disney's 21st Century Financial Strategy
Attendance is down, so we can't refurb/build because we won't be making enough money.
Attendance is up, so we can't refurb/build because people will complain or not visit - and we'll lose money.

 

[CBOMB]

I still do not see anything wrong with them advertising it like they have been. No one is being forced to to jump at the discounted offer. I lumo this in the same category that allows the same car dealerhship to advertise the worlds largest one week car sale every week for 16 years...




This is what got us into this mess in the first place. if you cant afford a vacation you shouldn't take it... period. That being said this is a free country and people have the choice of what to do with their money. The fact is that Disney needs to offer incentives right now in order to fill the parks and that is what they are doing. Again, if they choose to extend the offer it is their choice and they can do it.

I still am not seeing how this affects the situation you describe above. If they bought the discounted trip and they get it at the rate as advertised how does it adeversley effect them if the deal is extended. They have already gotten their trip for a deal they liked. How does that basic principal change when the deal is extended?



I cant make that comparission. Disney is offering a specific vacation package for a greatly reduced rate that must be paid for - in full - prior to services being rendered. Now, if someone chooses to get a loan or use a credit card to pay for it that is up to them. Either way Disney is paid up front.

The ARM's were being pushed by many banks and loan companies because they knew rates were at or near lows and would of course go up. However, in the end the prospective homeowner is the one that makes the final decision to sign on the dotted line.

The world would be much better off if everyone was actually held accountable for their own decisions. But when you can blame Disney for "making" you take a trip due to a coupon, or banks can loan money to someone whom they know cannot pay it off but can rely on the government to bail them out - problems await.

Legal advertising does not always make it ethical advertising. There just seems to be to many shades of gray when it comes to advertising here. Individual responsibility seems to be a concept becoming extinct in America.

Down 10%, huh? So does that mean Obama can fire Iger? :king:

Just ask Mr. Wagoner. Personally I think the government needs to start sponsoring rides.
I can see it now Dumbo sponsored by the House of Representatives of the United States of America.

I don't believe this for a second. What about all those guests pouring through the gates everyday?? The company and parks are absolutely fine. I think the executives should get bonuses this quarter.

:animwink:

Where are all of the "the parks are fine" people?

Heck, fire more CM's, and give the executives even bigger bonuses!!!!

So all employees should be retained with dropping revenues and no money to pay them?

I'm not sure what the solution is, but other than every employee agreeing to pay cuts, I don't see how some of these companies have options. This isn't just Disney, it's everyone.

Less spending = less revenue = less money to pay employees = bankruptcy.

Then ALL the employees will be out of jobs.

Sorry, just don't see the logic.

Here's a raical concept. Keep your CM's, and cut the inflated salaries
of the executives, while elimanating bonuses. Develope a long term growth rate for the parks taking advantage of lower construction cost at the present. Continue to offer discounts to the general public, and even better discounts to locals, AP holders, and DVC members. Ride out the storm for now with loses, improving your base for when the economy recovers. Think long term.

As usual, people take liberties with facts in order to make their point. First, Obama NEVER said people shoudn't travel or take vacations. He was castigating Wells Fargo for offering employees a lavish Vegas trip after it had received $25 Billion in taxpayer funds after absorbing Wachovia (it is specualted that the only reason Wells Fargo purchased Wachovia was so it could receive the bailout money). Obama said nothing about people taking vacations on their own dime.

Secondly, the parks are crowded, yes. But Disney isn't making any money off them. I mentioned it in another thread, but some people think too highly of gate admission. Most parks could probably operate without charging gate admission...they make the real money from in park spending by guests...how do you think seasonal parks could continue to operate year after year when they have no income for half the year! And none of them charge Disney's rates. It's also why after a four day pass that add-on days are really cheap at Disney. The resorts are packed...but most people are only paying 57% of what Disney actually charges. Not to mention the resorts aren't using all the rooms they have. With so few rides at DHS and DAK, naturally the rides are going to have long waits when it has never been so cheap to visit Disney. As the old saying goes: "appearances can be deceiving." Go to any Broadway show on opening night. I assure you, the performance that night is not making any money. When people aren't paying, there's no money to be had!

It is true that not everyone is affected by the economy. But that was true of the Depression. The hardest-hit industries were manufacturing. There aren't anywhere near as many manufacturing jobs in the U.S. anymore. Banks collapsed. I think at it's height unemployment was at around 15%. So you had 85% of the country still working. Since we actually learned something from history, bank depsoits were insured, so we won't see that level of disaster again (unless Japan calls it loans to the US...which would destroy the economy). We are a much more white-collar country now, so the effects of a afailing eonomy take longer to become obvious. But to pretend as if people are overstating the state of the economic crisis is absolutely ignorant.

Neither Japan or the real biggie China will call in their loans. It would devastate their econmy far worse than it has already been devastated.

Some estimates go as high as 25%. Another lesson learned was getting rid of the 90% margin rule.

The FDR Presidential Library list it at 24.9%, and they should know.

 

[WDWRLD]

Could have fooled me, I called sunday before last to make our ADRs for June which is the 90th day before our trip. You would have thought I was calling for tomorrow night....there was hardly anything left.

 

[SirGoofy]

Here's a raical concept. Keep your CM's, and cut the inflated salaries
of the executives, while elimanating bonuses. Develope a long term growth rate for the parks taking advantage of lower construction cost at the present. Continue to offer discounts to the general public, and even better discounts to locals, AP holders, and DVC members. Ride out the storm for now with loses, improving your base for when the economy recovers. Think long term.

Because this makes too much sense. The parks are fine! Look at all the magic and pixie dust!!!


There is absolutely no vision in the leadership of WDW. They only care what their numbers look like now.

 

[DoctorPrius]

Disney's 21st Century Financial Strategy
Attendance is down, so we can't refurb/build because we won't be making enough money.
Attendance is up, so we can't refurb/build because people will complain or not visit - and we'll lose money.

That is actually the belief of the Walt Disney Company.

 

[jmvd20]

Legal advertising does not always make it ethical advertising. There just seems to be to many shades of gray when it comes to advertising here. Individual responsibility seems to be a concept becoming extinct in America.

True about the legal/ethical issue. However, in this particular case I really do not see anything at all wrong with the way Disney is advertising their promotion. In my opinion Disney has made plenty of bad/questionable decisions or judgement calls, however I do not think this advertsing issue is one of them at all.

With how things seem to be going I am not sure that too many people even know what individual responsibility means anymore!

 

[unkadug]

Could have fooled me, I called sunday before last to make our ADRs for June which is the 90th day before our trip. You would have thought I was calling for tomorrow night....there was hardly anything left.

Maybe they have let most of the servers go, so therefore there are no tables available to sit at, and no one to sit you.

 

[alecshawn]

The problem is that not everyone stays at Disney that long. Disney can leave the prices as is...if the include park-hopping in the admission. Then they can decrease the base amount for people who don't want to spend a week there.

We all have to pay to play,
I dont think 75.00 is too much though, even for one day tickets.
Heck, Six flags or Kings Island etc..will run you close to 40ish at the gate or more.
Disney is a bargain.
BUT!, remember this...Not everyone can or should be able to afford disney.
I consider it a priviledge to go there.
Some never will, thats ok.
But all in all, a WDW or DLR vacation is incredibly inexpensive compared to other family destinations.
Room rates will go down, and more perks may come. But for the "day trippers" open your wallet. You gotta pay to play.