Alligators captured at Disney doubles

[LAKid53]

I think it's reasonable to say that *most* of us don't blame Disney or the parents for what happened and are commenting on prevailing societal attitudes and the general dumbing down of society as a whole.

I don't blame either. It was a tragic accident. It would be unreasonable for folks from the Midwest to understand the danger of wading around bodies of water in Florida at night. Should Disney have had clearer signs that stated why no swimming? Probably, in hindsight.

But residents of Florida, who should know better, lose dogs to gators when they allow them to walk around the edges of Florida lakes and ponds. We had a gator in the water hazard behind our home in Miami. We never let the dog walk unleashed down the edge of the golf course. For a very good reason.

 

[Pixieish]

Your statements simply contradict each other.

You acknowledge greater "encroachment" on their territory as time goes on, but refuse to acknowledge the well-known scientific fact that any species with their temperament will become more aggressive over time as their habituation to being near humans continues.

WDW wasn't there in 1946. What has happened is that because of people feeding them, and the general "country club" environment that Disney created with the SSL for them, if WDW were not stepping up as they are to reduce the numbers of gators on their property, the attacks would get progressively worse. This was a warning sign that the issue was getting progressively worse, not a freak chance occurrence.

When WDW was young, there weren't NEARLY as many gators on property as there are now. Conservation efforts have allowed the gator population to surge, virtually unchecked, so the native populations that were far from humans have outgrown their space and they are now finding their way into areas populated by humans and establishing themselves there. This is an issue of out-of-balance conservation and population control, no doubt about it. I don't think hunting should become a free-for-all, but realistically, more hunting needs to be allowed and alligator populations carefully monitored and controlled.

 

[peter11435]

That's a bit different from the quote I was replying to, who was directly replying to a quote about WDW.

Yes, because this entire discussion is about WDW. Society in general has lost the concept of personal responsibility and this includes at WDW.

If someone is visiting WDW they most certainly should be preparing for a trip to Florida because that's where WDW is located. It is their responsibility to educate themselves about the place their visiting. It is WDW's responsibility to warn against and prevent hazards. That's why they have long worked to remove gators from property and why they have signs posted saying the beaches are closed and not to enter. If people ignore these warnings and enter anyway that's on them.

 

[LAKid53]

When WDW was young, there weren't NEARLY as many gators on property as there are now. Conservation efforts have allowed the gator population to surge, virtually unchecked, so the native populations that were far from humans have outgrown their space and they are now finding their way into areas populated by humans and establishing themselves there. This is an issue of out-of-balance conservation and population control, no doubt about it. I don't think hunting should become a free-for-all, but realistically, more hunting needs to be allowed and alligator populations carefully monitored and controlled.

I don't have a problem with proper species maintenance. - keeps the species healthy in addition to minimizing conflicts between humans and other species that never goes well for them. I just don't like the "kill all the gators! [other than the Gainesville ones, figuratively speaking]" factions that pop up after a tragedy like this. And we've been encroaching on their space for years now. Due to both agriculture and development, the Everglades is about one third of its original size.

 

[John park hopper]

Since the topic of of encroachment has been brought up. Not long ago I read the population for the US is going from 300+ million currently to a projected 450+ million by 2050. At that rate large species other than man will not have a chance. So enjoy the gators while you can. World pop is expectd to go from 6+ billion to 9+ billion by 2050

 

[Pixieish]

Since the topic of of encroachment has been brought up. Not long ago I read the population for the US is going from 300+ million currently to a projected 450+ million by 2050. At that rate large species other than man will not have a chance. So enjoy the gators while you can. World pop is expectd to go from 6+ billion to 9+ billion by 2050

This is a big part of the problem, too. We've passed so many laws protecting us from ourselves that our own population has exploded and will continue to do so. It's super harsh, but it's a fact. That's why natural selection is a thing in nature - it keeps things in balance, and we've done away with that in regards to our own species. Not necessarily a good thing for the planet or for our own continuation.

 

[LAKid53]

Since the topic of of encroachment has been brought up. Not long ago I read the population for the US is going from 300+ million currently to a projected 450+ million by 2050. At that rate large species other than man will not have a chance. So enjoy the gators while you can. World pop is expectd to go from 6+ billion to 9+ billion by 2050

Oh, it's not going to be just gators and other large animals that will have problems. We humans will too. Mainly due to lack of potable water. Not sure the planet can support another 2 billion without a serious resource problem (drinkable water and sufficient land for food production). And before someone says there are wide open spaces...of course there are. Mainly because they are uninhabitable. Humans aren't going to populate areas that don't have sustainable sources of potable water or land that can grow food.

 

[LAKid53]

This is a big part of the problem, too. We've passed so many laws protecting us from ourselves that our own population has exploded and will continue to do so. It's super harsh, but it's a fact. That's why natural selection is a thing in nature - it keeps things in balance, and we've done away with that in regards to our own species. Not necessarily a good thing for the planet or for our own continuation.

Not sure how we're going to fix that, other than natural disasters and plagues. Any attempts to control human population, other than the Darwinian way, have been dismal failures. See the China one child policy.

 

[matt9112]

I would then counter and say you should save your 6k and learn proper English.

Hey...I kid I kid!

it's over blown some of the smartest people to ever walk the earth were horrible with it

 

[John park hopper]

Not to get off topic but it truely annoys me when I hear the "save the planet types" when they refuse to address the root cause of all the problems ---which is over human population. Until that happens I don't see how the quality of life will not continue to decline. There was a cartoon from the 70's Pogo which I remember "we have met the enemy and he is us" Oh so true.

 

[Pixieish]

it's over blown some of the smartest people to ever walk the earth were horrible with it

English major here - it's by far one of the most complicated languages as far as "rules" go...especially since so much of it is derived from other languages to begin with.

 

[LAKid53]

Not to get off topic but it truely annoys me when I hear the "save the planet types" when they refuse to address the root cause of all the problems which is over human population. Until that happens I don't see how the quality of life will not continue to decline. There was a a cartoon from the 70's Pogo which I remember "we have met the enemy and he is us" Oh so true.

The ones who truly understand the problem, phrase it in "save our species", which most understand. But saving the planet, i.e., potable water, sufficient quality land to grow food and clean air, is part of the equation.

 

[matt9112]

English major here - it's by far one of the most complicated languages as far as "rules" go...especially since so much of it is derived from other languages to begin with.

was never good at it. he'll I can speak (a little) in a few different languages but awful with English and my handwriting is downright dangerous. the computer saved me.

 

[LAKid53]

English major here - it's by far one of the most complicated languages as far as "rules" go...especially since so much of it is derived from other languages to begin with.

Imagine learning English as a 2nd language and understanding the difference between where and wear. Pronounced the same, but spelled differently and different meanings. Or red and read. Or read and read. Or their, there and they're.

 

[John park hopper]

The ones who truly understand the problem, phrase it in "save our species", which most understand. But saving the planet, i.e., potable water, sufficient quality land to grow food and clean air, is part of the equation.

I would feel better if it were "save all species" not just humans

 

[LAKid53]

I would feel better if it were "save all species" not just humans

So would I. But many humans are incapable of understanding that saving species lower on the food chain benefits us humans also. They are called indicator species for a reason....

 

[Pixieish]

Imagine learning English as a 2nd language and understanding the difference between where and wear. Pronounced the same, but spelled differently and different meanings. Or red and read. Or read and read. Or their, there and they're.

There's tons of instances exactly like that (Google I Love Lucy Desi learning to speak English - HILARIOUS). But seriously - English is more Latin and French than people realize.

 

[LAKid53]

There's tons of instances exactly like that (Google I Love Lucy Desi learning to speak English - HILARIOUS). But seriously - English is more Latin and French than people realize.

Hence the reason I took a few semesters of Latin in college. Plus, the ability to swear at people in several languages (French was so elegant) was worth it.

 

[DisAl]

How did this thread go from a discussion of Reptilia Crocodillia Alligatoridea Alligator Mississippiensis to a discussion about Latin and English?
Oh....

 

[Pixieish]

How did this thread go from a discussion of Reptilia Crocodillia Alligatoridea Alligator mississippiensis to a discussion about Latin and English?
Oh....