A Spirited Summer Special (AKA Phil Holmes Takes Anaheim!)

[TeriofTerror]

This is part of a strategy direct from Chappie as Chapek favors the Anaheim way of doing things and according to someone with direct knowledge ''thinks the WDW operation has gotten sloppy and lazy and their execs need to spend more time in California to learn how the DLR is managed and operated. It's a message that is hard to swallow for many WDW folks, but Chapek is unrelenting and has made it clear he thinks Anaheim is doing it better. Phil Holmes is only the first in a series of WDW execs who will be making a pilgrimage to Anaheim soon.''

So Rose and Crown is following Le Cellier, Chefs de France and Crystal Palace (and whomever else I'm leaving out) with an all-day, screw the Guests, menu. That is how you increase revenue despite filling fewer tables and serving fewer people. Disney still doesn't fundamentally get this strategy can only last so long.

1. Hallelujah.
2. I used to be a sit-down dining devotee. I figured since I'm always the one to cook everyone for everything, I deserved sit-down meals on vacation. Now I'd rather grab food from Tangierine Cafe and a Grand Marnier slushy and call it a day. Or go off-site entirely.

Dining too is soon going to be too overbuilt. Right now you have two majors closed in Fulton's and PH and STK just opened. But I just don't see all of those lasting. Splitsville is struggling quite a bit I'm told.

3. Does that mean pricing could become competitive? (He-he. I crack myself up.)

Mixed bag, but he still has no business in the position. I'm actually starting to think his being placed had more to do with Bob placating Ike for handing Kevin more power at Marvel. Chappie can move Marvel crap like no one from what I'm being told.

4. In my completely uninformed and unimportant opinion , Kevin Feige deserves it. I'm a fan.
P.S. Thanks again and as always for all of the excellent info!

 

[danlb_2000]

A few more thoughts while I have the time on a somewhat gloomy day ...

For those who think WDW (and UNI and all of O-Town) have most of the summer left, so "let's wait and see" (whenever I read this now I think Germany and WWII ...have no idea why!), I've been told in the last few years by FL tourism (state) officials that the summer season peaks between July 20-25th every year. The difference can have to do with calendars, July 4th etc ...

That means that taking the last date in the range of July 25th, every successive week will see lower and lower and lower numbers of visitors until things bottom out traditionally in the two middle weeks of September before gradually building again.

It is why Disney has been desperate to make September a Halloween month, even though it is not. It is why Disney is starting the Fall Food and Wine Festival on 9/14 this year (with booths opening to Lifestylers and bloggers etc a day or two earlier). August may well be summer to most people in this hemisphere, but over the last 20 years (the horrible hurricane seasons of 2004-05 completed it) May has actually become a busier and more important month than August.

If parks are not busy around the Fourth of July and the following week, then it is a proverbial canary in the coal mine.

Since I see a few posts above, again, let me clarify that right now the SWE is hoping to debut at DL in 12/18. WDW's earliest date I have ever heard is spring 2020. If you asked me right now, I'd say simply sometime that year.

Have heard some wonderful things about the new Mickey and the Magician show at DLP. Have heard some mediocre things about MK's new gator-less stage show.

I put this in one of my last post's before taking off for summer, but it does bear repeating: DCL's long range plan calls for another FOUR ships (in addition to the two on order now) and a second island in the Bahamas. I've since heard there is a strong likelihood that one of the older ships will be moved over to China as soon as ship 5 comes into the fleet.

Is the difference in the opening dates for SWL simply a question of how long it will take to build at DHS, or was there a conscious decision to have DL open first?

 

[JediMasterMatt]

However, I have a hard time believing that DHS is 18-24 months behind already

Behind what? From the very get go, the plan was always for WDW's SWL to open well after DL. Never forget that SW CANNOT come online in the swamps until TSL is open. The park simply couldn't handle it. As time is going by, I'm less and less optimistic that TSL is open on time. Of course, it should be easy to hit dates with it as there is very little meat on the TSL bone.

Since I see a few posts above, again, let me clarify that right now the SWE is hoping to debut at DL in 12/18. WDW's earliest date I have ever heard is spring 2020. If you asked me right now, I'd say simply sometime that year.

Nothing's changed from what I've heard. Anaheim is on target and Orlando is going to Orlando for as long as they can... that is until Spirit brings us perhaps the greatest news of all...

For all the braggadocio of how the One Disney Initiative concept was going to take the best from both coasts and synergize the paradigms using all the latest corporate buzz words and doublespeak (or newspeak), it is the same concept that has allowed the current operational continental divide of differences between the parks. Ding, dong, the wicked witch of One Disney is dead (or so we hope).

It doesn't take a lifestyler to notice that things in Orlando haven't felt very Disney in quite a long while.

I've been doing my best to stay away from WDW and been visiting Anaheim as much as possible.

Now, before we all jump for joy and exclaim that everything is well in Disney Parks, keep in mind that while the left coast has been fighting the good fight and trying to keep up the tradition of quality - it's still not perfect. But, it is far, far closer to what we should expect out of the World's Best Theme Park franchise. If Disney can truly make both resorts follow the same tenets of operation then both can benefit from the examples of the other. Almost like an initiative to make both Disney Resorts one.

I encourage anyone to take the Pepsi challenge of operational comparison between the resorts.

Did anyone else notice that one resort put up walls, drained the Rivers of America, put dams in place, refilled the remaining river, took down the walls and then put up scrims and when they didn't block enough of construction, brought in trees in planters to hide the view... the other resort puts up a few walls and lets them sit for years. One is what you'd expect for an industry leader. The other is what you'd expect at Six Flags.

This is potentially the best news of the last decade for Disney Parks.

The first step on the road to recovery is admitting you've got a problem.

I'm more excited by this than all of the DHS 2.0/Pandora/IPCot news put together.

Now Spirit buddy... take some time off. You deserve it after bringing good news for a change.

 

[SorcererMC]

1. Make our own outlet mall.
2. Make the prices higher than other outlet malls in the same area.
3. ???
4. Profit.

Perhaps 3 = Intl Tourists who shop 'til they drop.

The problem w/ that is, what happens when they stop coming in droves? (rhetorical; we know what happens).

 

[ChrisFL]

Disney spends the past 15-20 years attracting small kids and their families who are typically on tighter budgets, then opens lots of premium stores at Disney Springs...for who exactly?

I was there last week, lots of window shoppers...not many people buying things (anecdotal of course). I'm just not ready to pay $100 for a hawaiian shirt or $50 for a pair of flip flops at Tommy Bahama.....or pay $100 for the stereotypical "middle-manager who likes fishing" stuff at Columbia sportswear.

BTW I also tried the international soda stuff at the new Coke store...$8 for 16 samples...5 were drinkable

 

[TeriofTerror]

Perhaps 3 = Intl Tourists who shop 'til they drop.

The problem w/ that is, what happens when they stop coming in droves? (rhetorical; we know what happens).

My #3 was going to be "Exploit the Disney name." I'm sure both factor in.

 

[danlb_2000]

Behind what? From the very get go, the plan was always for WDW's SWL to open well after DL. Never forget that SW CANNOT come online in the swamps until TSL is open. The park simply couldn't handle it. As time is going by, I'm less and less optimistic that TSL is open on time. Of course, it should be easy to hit dates with it as there is very little meat on the TSL bone.

If TSL and SWL were both moving full speed ahead right now, TSL would still open first. So I don't see TSL's opening being any limiting factor on the pace of SWL construction.

 

[Cmdr_Crimson]

Dining too is soon going to be too overbuilt. Right now you have two majors closed in Fulton's and PH and STK just opened. But I just don't see all of those lasting. Splitsville is struggling quite a bit I'm told.

And rediculously overpriced...It's coming to a point where your seeing this....

 

[lebeau]

It's coming to a point where your seeing this....

If the picture were of a cupcake, that would be WDW dining.

 

[Cmdr_Crimson]

If the picture were of a cupcake, that would be WDW dining.

Very true....

 

[WDW1974]

A two-year old story from the Sentinel that I recall reading that explains a bit about the fact that O-Town can't support high-end retail ... which really makes me wonder about that next housing bubble that's going to explode.

http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...-mall-20140721_1_florida-mall-millenia-outlet

 

[WDW1974]

In another thread someone commented "When did Downtown Disney become an outlet mall?" I thought that was funny and mentioned it to my wife, and she responded, "But it's not an outlet mall, because the prices are so high". So true. You have the look of a high-end outlet mall but with theme park prices. I honestly don't see how it could possibly work.

It does look lovely now, even though the theming makes no sense and walking through with any design expert will reveal so many flaws. But the question really is who is going to spend to shop and/or dine here? Some places are going to be huge ... Boathouse and Morimoto, both faves of mine, appear to be safe. And any place that sells cupcakes. But how many flip-flop/sandal/shoe/hat outlets that don't sell Disney-branded crap do you need? All when the economy is tanking again, regardless of what people on Wall Street or in DC want you to believe.

 

[deeevo]

It's actually quite pathetic how clueless these execs are. If you want to know why WDW is what it has become these days, it's because Burbank has, for a good decade or more, encouraged a culture of cutbacks, financial engineering, screwing guests, screwing cast, resting on laurels, and stagnating in nearly every way, with the only goal of increasing profitability each quarter, with little regard for the long term outlook.

It's really that simple. WDW is run this way because it has been actively encouraged to be run this way by company leadership. Iger's, Rasulo's, and Stagg's minions did exactly as they were told. As you sow so shall you reap.

Unfortunately this is how most Fortune 100 companies are ran. I work for a Fortune 100 company and you pretty much summed up how I have been treated the past 3 years. Seems they are constantly preparing for the worst just in case the market tanks and we head for another recession. Then the execs can look like rock stars in front of the board.

 

[WDW1974]

Is the difference in the opening dates for SWL simply a question of how long it will take to build at DHS, or was there a conscious decision to have DL open first?

I've always been under the impression it was planned that way. That is certainly how it was explained to me. Part of that likely has to do with Disney having to invest billions in Anaheim to get the 30-year tax break on tickets. But I do not really have the full tale here.

 

[WDW1974]

Disney spends the past 15-20 years attracting small kids and their families who are typically on tighter budgets, then opens lots of premium stores at Disney Springs...for who exactly?

I was there last week, lots of window shoppers...not many people buying things (anecdotal of course). I'm just not ready to pay $100 for a hawaiian shirt or $50 for a pair of flip flops at Tommy Bahama.....or pay $100 for the stereotypical "middle-manager who likes fishing" stuff at Columbia sportswear.

BTW I also tried the international soda stuff at the new Coke store...$8 for 16 samples...5 were drinkable

Love the post, Chris.

I couldn't help but notice all the Tommy Bahama shirts and shorts on sale at Cast Connection for half price when I was there in May. And it wasn't exactly jumping off the racks. I love their stuff because I want to appear 15 years older than I am, divorced twice with three daughters (one with a drug problem, the other two who barely speak to me), a three-year-old 'pre-owned' BMW that I like to pass off as new, and a six-figure (low) salary as a Marketing VP for some insurance company that is likely to downsize my position out of existence in the next 12-36 months.

That's largely who buys Tommy Bahama stuff or the Columbia stuff etc ... they are at WDW often as part of conventions, but I'd love to know how mans TB shirts are sold at the YC or Contemporary gift stores over a 12-month period at full price.

 

[asianway]

Love the post, Chris.

I couldn't help but notice all the Tommy Bahama shirts and shorts on sale at Cast Connection for half price when I was there in May. And it wasn't exactly jumping off the racks. I love their stuff because I want to appear 15 years older than I am, divorced twice with three daughters (one with a drug problem, the other two who barely speak to me), a three-year-old 'pre-owned' BMW that I like to pass off as new, and a six-figure (low) salary as a Marketing VP for some insurance company that is likely to downsize my position out of existence in the next 12-36 months.

That's largely who buys Tommy Bahama stuff or the Columbia stuff etc ... they are at WDW often as part of conventions, but I'd love to know how mans TB shirts are sold at the YC or Contemporary gift stores over a 12-month period at full price.

The mens store at GF is mainly where I ever saw it

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

@WDW1974 - how many losing Los Angeles sports bids does Bob Iger want to be a part of?

http://variety.com/2016/biz/news/bob-ager-walt-disney-co-olympics-1201812677/

 

[PhilharMagician]

Sooner or later, the disastrous business model employed by WDW Co. will come home to roost and all the new timeshares they can build won't make a bit of a difference. I wonder what Disney Springs will look like when half of those new tenants are gone within 18 months of opening.

I am surprised that they were able to get this many companies to lease space. Must have been one hell of a sales pitch Disney put on.I can only imagine what they charge monthly for store space.

 

[MerlinTheGoat]

On the one hand, it is of course great to hear that someone higher up might at least entertain the notion of WDW's quality having hit the bottom of the barrel. Especially if they're actually trying to get it back up to snuff with how Disneyland handles things.

On the other hand, BURBANK ARE THE ONES WHO ORDERED WDW TO BE RUN INTO THE GROUND IN THE FIRST PLACE!!! While i'm sure Orlando management shoulders some responsibility, it sounds like Burbank ordered the lionshare of cuts at WDW for the past several years-
http://forums.wdwmagic.com/threads/...-resorts-thanks-to-shanghai-and-paris.909756/

Correct me if i'm wrong @WDW1974 or anyone else who has the scoop, but it sounds like Orlando are just following orders. While i'm on board with better training (perhaps it could help a little), if Burbank keeps the purse firmly closed and constantly barks orders to cut cut cut then how much could this really help? It seems very contradictory and ignorant from someone like Chappie. "Stop cleaning the parks and fixing rides, you're wasting money! Hey, why are your parks and rides in such horrid shape? Do you need lessons on how to clean and repair stuff?!" I almost suspect political shenanigans going on upstairs, setting lower level fall guys up so highers can avoid responsibility... Otherwise they either have some sort of bipolar problem going on upstairs, or Dory's severe short term memory loss...

It's like an architect ordering his subordinates to use extremely poor materials and hire unqualified workers. Then being surprised and angry at your subordinates when it starts to have major issues and falls apart. Yelling at THEM for being too stupid and incompetent for using bad materials and workers...Hey isn't that exactly what happened with Shanghai Disneyland? Seeing a pattern of childish stupidity and blame shifting here...

So forgive me if I don't believe this will work with execs withholding budgets and continuing to order cuts. If someone has a better perspective of how much responsibility Orlando management really shares for the state of WDW (as opposed to Burbank), then please let me know. But from what i've heard from recent years, they really don't seem to have much of a say in matters anymore and are just following orders.

 

[RobidaFlats]

Disney spends the past 15-20 years attracting small kids and their families who are typically on tighter budgets, then opens lots of premium stores at Disney Springs...for who exactly?

I was there last week, lots of window shoppers...not many people buying things (anecdotal of course). I'm just not ready to pay $100 for a hawaiian shirt or $50 for a pair of flip flops at Tommy Bahama.....or pay $100 for the stereotypical "middle-manager who likes fishing" stuff at Columbia sportswear.

I am also confused as to what the draw would be for that kind of shopping while on vacation in the first place. High-end retail is not exactly hard to come by these days. Aside from guests coming from more rural areas, why would a vacationer do high-end shopping not specifically related to the vacation since they could do it at home?

I could see buying a Hawaiian shirt while in Maui, or even a WDW shirt while in Orlando, mementos can be nice. However, a pricey pair of sandals just doesn't show up on my radar as something worth getting while on vacation (unless I forgot to pack some or some similar situation).

Obviously everyone shops differently, but who is the intended demographic here?