A Spirited Perfect Ten

[baymenxpac]

A story as big as alleged would be far more clicks.

would it? even on this specific thread, where we all come eagerly looking for higher level discourse, the china stuff has been met with a lot of, "MEH! WHO CARES?!" i know we're talking about the wall street journal here, and the business focus of the outlet would seem to imply the story would have more legs in the traffic department than a blow-by-blow breakdown of a frozen overlay, but try to explain each story to a layperson and see which they find more interesting. after all, we are talking about america here, land of the willfully ignorant.

I often wonder what most of these Disney defenders do for a living. I bucket it like this:

1.) stay at home spouse who loves to spend their SO money like a drunken sailor. Never did a day of real work on their life.
2.) on govt assistance of some type
3.) works for Disney
4.) has some type of low level hourly job and doesn't understand how the real world works

Am I missing any?

i dunno, man. i don't really know what the demos are in that category, but i guess the pixie dust holds a pretty powerful hold over someone.

i should mention that i don't like to chime in a lot here just to say meaningless words. usually, i try to reserve my posts for when i have something insightful to say. i'm an amateur when it comes to attraction load capacity and financial figures and all that. but what i do know is how to be a really good PR person (and i'm talking about the kind that is some 23 year old that, "like, totally wants to introduce you to our CEO, who's, like, super interesting.") i know how it works.

the president of my firm and i had a 20 minute talk this morning about how disney turned the narrative like this, and we were lauding it as a brilliant case of corporate comms. as a fan of disney that wants the current execs to be held accountable for the sham job they're doing with the brand, it pains me. but as a professional, it's a case study. and sorry, no, it's not a conspiracy theory.

 

[Cody5294]

Hollywood Reporter is reporting that Disney is going to have a $120-140 million write off for Tomorrowland. Of course that's not a big deal for Disney this year as they will probably hit 5 billion globally with Inside Out, Ant-Man, and Star Wars still to come. I don't see this write off effecting their stock price

 

[PhotoDave219]

That's just it - I've been in the middle, too. But asking a few simple questions suddenly turned into this blasphemous act, and considering we still can't get the answers to them, and so much has been strung out at this point, and as you agree - logically, this isn't the way to do this even if it is absolutely true (which I've said many times, it may well be), doesn't help go to the side of legitimacy.

That, and the fact that the last day or two suddenly we have some brand new people to the discussion who have a suspiciously similarly BRANDED style, and yeah, I admit, my BS detector has been going off more and more.

Honestly, what I think is going on is that folks want so badly to be part of some "BIG" story that they are ignoring the last few hundred pages and just keep going with whatever the most recent narrative is. I can't blame folks, I guess, but the more this goes on and the more folks seemingly ignore reality while claiming that anyone who has a question just doesn't know what they are talking about, because, media corrupt, the newest iteration - like I said, I honestly want it to be true because I hate seeing folks I like and respect being taken for what is increasingly appearing to be a ride.

To the gates of Valhalla! I will ride eternal, shiny and chrome!

 

[AEfx]

This isn't simply accusing them of taking too long to build an e-ticket or saving money by using plain napkins. He has accused people of fraud, bribery, misleading investors, and on more than one occasion sex crimes just to name a few. These are serious accusations that are probably best suited somewhere other than a Disney "fan" site. But if they are here they should be taken seriously and appropriately. Just believing them because you like the poster or because it is the popular thing to do is certainly not appropriate.

I have a feeling those allegations are only going to escalate, until someone gets a C&D.

That's the only way "out" at this point, and given the complete lack of logic as to how this venture has been gone about (no one is ever going to pick up this story and no one will ever care so long as it's broken up over a 950 page thread in bits and pieces), it's the logical way to get out of the hole now that it has been dug so deep.

Just like going to a journalist who covers WDC and eventually would have a WDC story anyway guaranteed that things would appear "covered up" (true or not, it was an insurance policy), by escalating the accusations like this it's an invitation for a C&D, and then it can be "my hands are tied, I have no choice but to stop".

And then the martyrdom begins.

Honestly, this couldn't be plotted any better if it was an HBO show. Except it would be more fun, you know, with cussin' and flashing junk and all.

 

[AEfx]

Hollywood Reporter is reporting that Disney is going to have a $120-140 million write off for Tomorrowland. Of course that's not a big deal for Disney this year as they will probably hit 5 billion globally with Inside Out, Ant-Man, and Star Wars still to come. I don't see this write off effecting their stock price

That still doesn't look good. They didn't offer them a story about Star Wars Land or Avatar Land to keep them from posting it?

Dang, I really want this to work that way just so we get some info about attractions....

 

[PhotoDave219]

That still doesn't look good. They didn't offer them a story about Star Wars Land or Avatar Land to keep them from posting it?

Dang, I really want this to work that way just so we get some info about attractions....

That would have been the appropriate deal to cut, so to speak. Frozen is old hat. People wanna know about when Star Wars will get built.

 

[EPCOTCenterLover]

To no one in particular- It must create quite a conflict in your inner soul if you are paid by Disney to be a brand advocate on the web and its discussion boards; even worse when you know the truth because you're inside Disney but have to support whatever the company says you must. Tough to sell your soul for a paycheck.

 

[Mike S]

That would have been the appropriate deal to cut, so to speak. Frozen is old hat. People wanna know about when Star Wars will get built.

Talk about a big exclusive.

 

[Shaman]

Hollywood Reporter is reporting that Disney is going to have a $120-140 million write off for Tomorrowland. Of course that's not a big deal for Disney this year as they will probably hit 5 billion globally with Inside Out, Ant-Man, and Star Wars still to come. I don't see this write off effecting their stock price

Sadly, it probably means Disney will take less chances with original, big-budget films.

 

[Shaman]

To no one in particular- It must create quite a conflict in your inner soul if you are paid by Disney to be a brand advocate on the web and its discussion boards; even worse when you know the truth because you're inside Disney but have to support whatever the company says you must. Tough to sell your soul for a paycheck.

What about the people paid to trash Disney? You think Disney is the only one with operatives? Get the tinfoil....

What we need is a Mother of Dragons to break the wheel.

 

[1023]

To no one in particular- It must create quite a conflict in your inner soul if you are paid by Disney to be a brand advocate on the web and its discussion boards; even worse when you know the truth because you're inside Disney but have to support whatever the company says you must. Tough to sell your soul for a paycheck.

Soul? Nah.... It's just time you won't get back... The question is, what is the "truth"?

*1023*

 

[Milk Crate]

would it? even on this specific thread, where we all come eagerly looking for higher level discourse, the china stuff has been met with a lot of, "MEH! WHO CARES?!" i know we're talking about the wall street journal here, and the business focus of the outlet would seem to imply the story would have more legs in the traffic department than a blow-by-blow breakdown of a frozen overlay, but try to explain each story to a layperson and see which they find more interesting. after all, we are talking about america here, land of the willfully ignorant.

Absolutely it would. And there hasn't been a chorus of "who cares". There have been a few posters genuinely asking why they SHOULD care. That is not the same thing.

And higher-level discourse? What, like sports and certain banned users? There is some good discussion here, certainly. I'm not disputing that. I read every word like the rest of you. Why is that certain insiders are taken at their word but Spirit isn't? Why does his information frequently seem to devolve into arguments like this?

Those questions are semi-rhetorical, as I think the answers should be fairly obvious.

In any case, there are folks making intelligent posts on both "sides". However "if you don't like it, don't read it" is an absurd reply to intelligent responses that aren't accepting Spirit's word as gospel. As are the "There's a lotta things...you don't know anything about, Dottie. Things you wouldn't understand. Things you couldn't understand. Things you shouldn't understand" replies.

 

[LieutLaww]

"The truth is out there"

 

[AEfx]

Soul? Nah.... It's just time you won't get back... The question is, what is the "truth"?

*1023*

And I'd love to see these folks called out if they are indeed plants, instead of more anonymous innuendo (because adding more of that to this discussion really isn't helping), because I don't see a single person here on either "side" who fit that description, as just about everyone agrees that Disney sucks at what they are doing at the parks right now and the decisions being made regarding them. Maybe he's talking about Twitter and those folks - 'cause you certainly don't see many of them around here (especially in this thread, they know better).

That's a far, far different thing, though, than not wishing to jump to conclusions about what amounts to accusations of criminal activity and negligence that affects the stock price of the company - if you really make a list of all the accusations thrown around about Bob Iger around here that's they accumulatively are. And I have to say, the only valid criticism I see is that he hasn't spent lavishly on the parks because that business unit is already so profitable. Most shareholders would applaud that - of course not here, but if that's the worst thing you have on someone, it apparently makes folks increasingly desperate to find something wrong.

 

[asianway]

Absolutely it would. And there hasn't been a chorus of "who cares". There have been a few posters genuinely asking why they SHOULD care. That is not the same thing.

And higher-level discourse? What, like sports and certain banned users? There is some good discussion here, certainly. I'm not disputing that. I read every word like the rest of you. Why is that certain insiders are taken at their word but Spirit isn't? Why does his information frequently seem to devolve into arguments like this?

Those questions are semi-rhetorical, as I think the answers should be fairly obvious.

In any case, there are folks making intelligent posts on both "sides". However "if you don't like it, don't read it" is an absurd reply to intelligent responses that aren't accepting Spirit's word as gospel. As are the "There's a lotta things...you don't know anything about, Dottie. Things you wouldn't understand. Things you couldn't understand. Things you shouldn't understand" replies.

You signed up...to post this?

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

This is EXHAUSTING. Look - this is an Internet message board; a thread started by one person as his platform for his news and rumors. No one is going to name sources on a message board, so you can either believe it or not. If you don't believe it, that's fine, but we're now on dozens of pages of nothing but the same couple people going back and forth.

We get it @AEfx. You don't buy it. Great. You're not gonna get more documentation from anyone - again, this is a message board, not a court of law. For the love of God, move on. This is the Spirit's thread where he posts his info, news and rumors. Your doubt has been duly noted - it will not change his position, and it's unlikely he could say anything to change yours. And frankly, you've typed so many paragraphs on the subject I'm not sure what else could possibly be said.

I don't mean this to be rude or insulting, so please don't take it that way. I'm just sure there are better uses of all of our time than to rehash the same arguments ad infinitum.

 

[Milk Crate]

You signed up...to post this?

Sure, let's go with that.

Better than posting an obnoxious breakdown of "Disney defenders" because anyone who disagrees with Spirit is probably on welfare or doesn't work, right?

Not like the OP himself who is clearly very busy, averaging 6 (long) posts a day for eight years on this site alone (yes I realize that's that's a simplification, BUT).

Ah, but now I'm just a hater or a troll or something. Not at all. I'm just a milk crate with nothing but time to read and post since recently becoming sentient.

 

[flynnibus]

Jumped 10 pages... didn't miss @!$%$

 

[AEfx]

This is EXHAUSTING. Look - this is an Internet message board; a thread started by one person as his platform for his news and rumors. No one is going to name sources on a message board, so you can either believe it or not. If you don't believe it, that's fine, but we're now on dozens of pages of nothing but the same couple people going back and forth.

We get it @AEfx. You don't buy it. Great. You're not gonna get more documentation from anyone - again, this is a message board, not a court of law. For the love of God, move on. This is the Spirit's thread where he posts his info, news and rumors. Your doubt has been duly noted - it will not change his position, and it's unlikely he could say anything to change yours. And frankly, you've typed so many paragraphs on the subject I'm not sure what else could possibly be said.

Thank you for your input. You misunderstand my intent, but that's fine. But if someone doesn't want things questioned, they should use a thing called a blog and disable comments. This is not "Spirits thread" - this is a thread he began but that does not imply ownership. It is a catch-all business/Disney thread that moves just as swiftly when he posts as when he does not.

I wouldn't have to keep typing so much if folks like yourself were not mischaracterizing my posts (never said we needed exact sources, I just had a couple of questions - same questions many others posted) or if WDW1974 was not continually digging himself deeper and making passive aggressive comments about anyone who has some questions. To say he didn't bring this on himself by his behavior would be ignoring even the facts that many of those who are friendly with him have admitted.

At this point, I'm with him - if this story is true, he needs to get it out there. If it's been triple-vetted, and he apparently doesn't have the resources to distribute it - I want to help him do that. Because apparently with all his influential and high-level friends, he doesn't seem to be able to do so - and I just hate to see someone that I once had a great deal of respect for falling so far over what is increasingly appearing to be stubborn ego.

But again, thanks for your input.

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

Thank you for your input. You misunderstand my intent, but that's fine. But if someone doesn't want things questioned, they should use a thing called a blog and disable comments. This is not "Spirits thread" - this is a thread he began but that does not imply ownership. It is a catch-all business/Disney thread that moves just as swiftly when he posts as when he does not.

I wouldn't have to keep typing so much if folks like yourself were not mischaracterizing my posts (never said we needed exact sources, I just had a couple of questions - same questions many others posted) or if WDW1974 was not continually digging himself deeper and making passive aggressive comments about anyone who has some questions. To say he didn't bring this on himself by his behavior would be ignoring even the facts that many of those who are friendly with him have admitted.

At this point, I'm with him - if this story is true, he needs to get it out there. If it's been triple-vetted, and he apparently doesn't have the resources to distribute it - I want to help him do that. Because apparently with all his influential and high-level friends, he doesn't seem to be able to do so - and I just hate to see someone that I once had a great deal of respect for falling so far over what is increasingly appearing to be stubborn ego.

But again, thanks for your input.

I don't understand how he's falling so far. He's right about American media - it's in the pocket of corps and has been for some time now. Important news stories are buried or suppressed all the time - look at the insanity over Caitlin Jenner while major stories were ignored or went unreported altogether.

American journalism isn't what it used to be, which is why the Guardian breaks almost anything of consequence having to do with our government.

Another issue is the stock price. Stories like this can pop a bubble and no one wants to lose money.

And sometimes there's no interest, especially when the press is so loath to tackle anyone anymore.