A Spirited Perfect Ten

[PhotoDave219]

Did you do I-64 through Beckley? That drop down into the New River Gorge is pretty impressive.

Edit: Never mind. I saw you went to Snowshoe. That mountain can get gnarley.

No, should have cut through elkins. The GPS took me through some very pretty places west of Harrisonburg. Just downright curvy.

 

[PhotoDave219]

New River Gorge is such an overlooked gem. I also really love Blackwater Falls; that whole area almost feels like stepping into another age.

The lack of cell phone service through most of the drive added to the "stepping into another age" from my POV.

 

[BrerJon]

Yes, spot on.

McDonald's reached the same conclusion as Staggs. Their menu has grown needlessly complex, and too unwieldy for guests and ops alike. You can give customers too many options. McDonald's America currently streamlines its menu, while simultaneously implementing a customizable create-your-taste platform. All not dissimilar to what WDW is doing in streamlining their offerings while implementing MyMagic, a customizable create-your-trip platform.

I think applying restaurant rules to theme parks is very limiting, and only serves to make a statement that if you don't like exactly what they're offering, you and your dollars are not welcome there.

Staggs' argument, that the more attractions and shows you close, and the more eating places you shutter, the more people will want to visit your park because it reduces choice anxiety, would only be true if almost everyone *wanted* a pre-packaged fixed itinerary vacation or the same experience every time.

But lots of people *like* the idea that there are lots of different rides to choose from, that you don't have to have the same day every time. One of the reasons many people come back is because they haven't done it all before, but the more you reduce the choice, the more you can say 'done that', and not come back.

By Staggs' logic, DHS's guest approval ratings should have gone up substantially when The Backlot Tour closed, while Universal's should have gone down when Diagon Alley opened, as it added a ton of pesky choices to a day. I'm no psychologist, but I just can't see that being the case.

 

[ford91exploder]

Jan/feb always have major ride closures. From the seasonal overlay removals to multiple closures. This is the norm.

Yup - DL is pretty quiet Jan/Feb you see the crazy Californians wearing parkas in 50 deg temps...

 

[GiveMeTheMusic]

Yup - DL is pretty quiet Jan/Feb you see the crazy Californians wearing parkas in 50 deg temps...

The parks at DL used to be quiet in January/February. They weren't this year. Despite massive refurbishments - Matterhorn, Peter Pan, World of Color, Soarin', Splash Mountain, plus the usual Haunted Mansion/small world closures in January - the crowds have been insane for this time of year.

It's really annoying actually. There is zero off-season now.

 

[ford91exploder]

That's really unusual - but I have not gotten to DL so far this year despite being in LA a couple of time.

 

[Cesar R M]

Could we just be wrong and our definition of spontaneous, is completely different?

as in spontaneously combustion?

 

[Cesar R M]

Staggs didn't say that, the author did but more or less he believes it and it is sorta correct. Most people like things simplified with less decisions to be made. Consider bringing a child to the Ice Cream truck, they see all those different things they can get and can't decide. If you limit it to only the top row, they can decide quickly.

It is an unfortunate reality that many people rather have a few good options to decide from rather than having to shop around through a plethora of options. People will opt for convenience if it means not having to put in full effort planning or deciding things.

Yes, spot on.

McDonald's reached the same conclusion as Staggs. Their menu has grown needlessly complex, and too unwieldy for guests and ops alike. You can give customers too many options. McDonald's America currently streamlines its menu, while simultaneously implementing a customizable create-your-taste platform. All not dissimilar to what WDW is doing in streamlining their offerings while implementing MyMagic, a customizable create-your-trip platform.

It is the current managerial best practise. The world looks very different when one does not automatically assume Disney is ran by sinister incompetents. Well it actually is, but they have a logic to their behaviour.

are you both really comparing a theme park with a fast food joint style of ordering?

 

[The Empress Lilly]

I think applying restaurant rules to theme parks is very limiting, and only serves to make a statement that if you don't like exactly what they're offering, you and your dollars are not welcome there.

Staggs' argument, that the more attractions and shows you close, and the more eating places you shutter, the more people will want to visit your park because it reduces choice anxiety, would only be true if almost everyone *wanted* a pre-packaged fixed itinerary vacation or the same experience every time.

But lots of people *like* the idea that there are lots of different rides to choose from, that you don't have to have the same day every time. One of the reasons many people come back is because they haven't done it all before, but the more you reduce the choice, the more you can say 'done that', and not come back.

By Staggs' logic, DHS's guest approval ratings should have gone up substantially when The Backlot Tour closed, while Universal's should have gone down when Diagon Alley opened, as it added a ton of pesky choices to a day. I'm no psychologist, but I just can't see that being the case.

But Staggs said nor implied anything of the kind.

The quote is also not his. The 'paradox of choice' quote is the author's: You make people happier not by giving them more options but by stripping away as many as you can.

Staggs presents a MM means to tackle that paradox: by streamlining the overwhelming choice into 'missions'. Into personalised preferences. For example, ride thrill rides, or, have a day of stopping to smell flowers. In your case the mission could read 'explore lots of different rides, have a different day than the ones before'. Staggs talks about how this can be achieved more easily, how it can be offered to the guest. One way to achieve this is to reduce necessary actions needed for a Disney day by eliminating the ones needed for the mass, leaving only the ones necessary for the personalised mission and subsequently enabling those with the least guest effort needed.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

are you both really comparing a theme park with a fast food joint style of ordering?

Yes.

And also with crowd flow in an airport. Or with spatial meaning in an urban environment. Or etc.


In the case of McDonald's, their similar solutions to unwieldy and cumbersome customer choice was picked for a reason. I stood at a US McDonald's some time ago, and did not even manage to order a burger. After half an hour of both they and I questioning each other what on earth we wanted I ended up just throwing five dollar on the counter and begging the employees in sign language to bring me something to eat for that amount.

 

[Nubs70]

But Staggs said nor implied anything of the kind.

The quote is also not his. The 'paradox of choice' quote is the author's: You make people happier not by giving them more options but by stripping away as many as you can.

Staggs presents a MM means to tackle that paradox: by streamlining the overwhelming choice into 'missions'. Into personalised preferences. For example, ride thrill rides, or, have a day of stopping to smell flowers. In your case the mission could read 'explore lots of different rides, have a different day than the ones before'. Staggs talks about how this can be achieved more easily, how it can be offered to the guest. One way to achieve this is to reduce necessary actions needed for a Disney day by eliminating the ones needed for the mass, leaving only the ones necessary for the personalised mission and subsequently enabling those with the least guest effort needed.

This assumes that consumer preference is homogeneous. MM+ homogenizes offerings available while it is advertised and promoted as a mass customizing tool. In reality, options for the customer are reduced.

 

[cheezbat]

The parks at DL used to be quiet in January/February. They weren't this year. Despite massive refurbishments - Matterhorn, Peter Pan, World of Color, Soarin', Splash Mountain, plus the usual Haunted Mansion/small world closures in January - the crowds have been insane for this time of year.

It's really annoying actually. There is zero off-season now.

That's what's happened down here in Orlando too. When I visited the MK in Feb it was insane! As a Uni passholder I got used to busy during certain months and slow during others...but the past six months I've gone, waits have been 30-90 minutes for rides I used to be able to walk on at the same time years ago!
More and more people seem to be vacationing at the Cali and Florida resorts.

 

[The Empress Lilly]

This assumes that consumer preference is homogeneous. MM+ homogenizes offerings available while it is advertised and promoted as a mass customizing tool. In reality, options for the customer are reduced.

How does it assume that preference is homogeneous? I, at any rate, was labouring under the assumption they are not.

At least the quotes that are the subject here are about consumer preference being heterogeneous. With better informed customers clamouring for personalisation.

' “I can’t think of a business that isn’t affected by more choice and more access to information and an increasing desire for personalization,” says Staggs.'

 

[Travel Junkie]

Yup - DL is pretty quiet Jan/Feb you see the crazy Californians wearing parkas in 50 deg temps...

It’s been a warm winter this year. High tomorrow in Anaheim is forecasted to be 90. Californians are crazy enough to live in a place where 50 is considered cold. (It's a joke, no need to get into another debate over weather)

 

[BrerJon]

But Staggs said nor implied anything of the kind.

The quote is also not his. The 'paradox of choice' quote is the author's: You make people happier not by giving them more options but by stripping away as many as you can.

OK I misread that Staggs said those words, fair enough, but that's clearly WDW policy whether Staggs used those words or not.

This is a company that never builds a thing without it replacing something else, or closing something. A company that reduces operating hours and seasons as much as it possible can. The Disney difference is to provide the minimum possible experience for the maximum amount of dollars, that's hard to deny.

I'm not saying this is always wrong, however - You only have to watch any episode of Kitchen Nightmares to see how misguided it is when restaurant owners complain about streamlining menus because it will put what few visitors they do have off coming back - you don't need those old guests, as the new menu will more than make up for them, is what owners are told, rightly so.

And WDW is the same - those that want new attractions, or expansions, or five star service... we don't need you anymore, there are thousands of Brazilians, Brandies and Frozenistas who can't get enough of the Magic Bands, so you Walties can moan all you like and go up I-4 for your kicks, Disney doesn't care in the slightest, as you're easily replaceable. Some of us may not like it, but that's the truth. Disney is a business, and numbers rule the day.

My main concern with this, however, is that Disney has underestimated how much that could effect income in the future.

Many guests *like* new attractions or expansions, even if does add more choice and lead to the McDonalds analogy of somebody looking at a park map and not being able to decide what to do - but they're relying too much on everyone being a first time guest with 'must-dos', and in the long-term - while the strategy may be boosting numbers today - there will come a time when the parks feel stale, when the economy changes so there's not quite as many new visitors, and when the rival offerings get to the point where a new guest sees little difference. When that day comes, the Disney minimalism approach could come crashing down on them like a falling house of cards.

 

[lazyboy97o]

That statement really says it all if one looks at it with a logical mind. No organization, profit or non-profit survives without cash. Every business is required to direct their business plan to the end result of the fact that "money is king". You don't operate a retail establishment to make a bunch of "pixie dust" encrusted museum lovers have a place to walk in, browse, get on a memory high (cleaned up for a mixed audience), and then walk out. If it doesn't sell it is out. The reason? Because if it doesn't sell the place closes.

Funny, I know I'm not the oldest person on this board, but, I am amazed at how I am able to flex with the times much better then the younger folks. They all seem to want time to stand still, to somehow alter the laws of supply and demand to fit their image and if it doesn't fit that image then it is condemned as being a group of people that just don't know how to operate a business, that, of course, is not a business. What worked 30, 40, 50 or 60 years ago will not necessarily work now no matter how much we wish it would.

That might be all well and good if the Disney Store was not an incredibly troubled business unit. One whose troubles started with the current emphases. How much has Disney Store changed their merchandise offerings or strategy since going bankrupt in early 2008? How is bankruptcy a sign of doing what provides the cash?

There is also something to be said for generating traffic and interest. This week it came out that Apple typically gets significantly lower rents at malls because of the volume of traffic they are able to generate. Apple Stores should not work. Malls are dying. The products are too expensive. The materials in the stores are too expensive. There is too much staff who are paid too much. There is a severe lack of product space. And yet the experience first philosophy of The Disney Store has been a massive success.

 

[DisDan]

That might be all well and good if the Disney Store was not an incredibly troubled business unit. One whose troubles started with the current emphases. How much has Disney Store changed their merchandise offerings or strategy since going bankrupt in early 2008? How is bankruptcy a sign of doing what provides the cash?

There is also something to be said for generating traffic and interest. This week it came out that Apple typically gets significantly lower rents at malls because of the volume of traffic they are able to generate. Apple Stores should not work. Malls are dying. The products are too expensive. The materials in the stores are too expensive. There is too much staff who are paid too much. There is a severe lack of product space. And yet the experience first philosophy of The Disney Store has been a massive success.

Did you mean Apple Store?

 

[Mike S]

That statement really says it all if one looks at it with a logical mind. No organization, profit or non-profit survives without cash. Every business is required to direct their business plan to the end result of the fact that "money is king". You don't operate a retail establishment to make a bunch of "pixie dust" encrusted museum lovers have a place to walk in, browse, get on a memory high (cleaned up for a mixed audience), and then walk out. If it doesn't sell it is out. The reason? Because if it doesn't sell the place closes.

Funny, I know I'm not the oldest person on this board, but, I am amazed at how I am able to flex with the times much better then the younger folks. They all seem to want time to stand still, to somehow alter the laws of supply and demand to fit their image and if it doesn't fit that image then it is condemned as being a group of people that just don't know how to operate a business, that, of course, is not a business. What worked 30, 40, 50 or 60 years ago will not necessarily work now no matter how much we wish it would.

"Quality will out" doesn't seem like a dead concept to me.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Did you mean Apple Store?

No, I meant The Disney Store. They were conceived of as mass market retailers that trick suckers into paying more for products that are also available at Target or Walmart. The emphasis was on creating an experience and selling unique merchandise. That changed when Paul Pressler pursued an aggressive expansion and shift in focus on higher volume, higher margin products. A strategy that worked for a small blip, but was clearly dead when Disney sold off the stores.

 

[ford91exploder]

It’s been a warm winter this year. High tomorrow in Anaheim is forecasted to be 90. Californians are crazy enough to live in a place where 50 is considered cold. (It's a joke, no need to get into another debate over weather)

Why debate weather it just happens