A Spirited Perfect Ten

[polynesiangirl]

Enjoyment of WDW isn't a binary thing where you either love it 100% without question, or dislike everything.

This. I still take a LOT of Disney trips. There are many things I love about WDW. I have children and I have always wanted to share WDW with them, since before I even had children.

AND, there's a lot of stuff that I think is of vastly inferior quality than it used to be, or places where they have clearly cheaped out, made bad decisions, etc.

I may not have personally reached the point where I significantly reduce my trips, but that doesn't mean that that point does not exist for me, or that I'll never get there. I will be very interested to see how the next several years play out for that place and how it impacts my behavior as their customer.

 

[Mike S]

Enjoyment of WDW isn't a binary thing where you either love it 100% without question, or dislike everything.

Most people who spent a lot of time calling the current company out on stuff does so because they got *so much* from the parks in the past that it was pretty life changing. When you enjoy something so much, a 80% reduction in quality still leaves 20% of quality and enjoyment, but just because you still enjoy that 20% doesn't mean you have to pretend the 80% drop never happened.

Maybe there's not many people who stop going completely, but I bet you anything the majority of people who complain on these forums don't go to the parks, and certainly don't stay in the Disney hotels, anywhere near as often as they used to.

You may not see any change if someone used to go two or three times a year but has now dropped that rate to one visit every two or three years, but I bet Disney does.

Strangely enough I go to the parks more often now than I ever did before. I don't spend anywhere close to what the average WDW vacationer does though

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Worse yet...imagine 40,000 of those employees taking up space in front of the parks.... Occupy Disney World....

LOL

BTW...For people who make $9.50 an hour, they need it.... When I owned a few franchise restaurants, my employees needed their paychecks. A lot of people make their money stretch an amazingly long way.

*1023*

It's easier for a person to find a gig that pays $9.50 than it is for Disney to create from whole cloth 66,000 replacement employees.

In a stand off between Disney and their CMs, Disney will cave first. The 50,000 guests staying on property that night would demand it.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Strangely enough I go to the parks more often now than I ever did before. I don't dpend anywhere close to what the average WDW vacationer does though

Really? This is the 4th year straight that I haven't claimed my 4 free tix I get through work.

 

[BrerJon]

Strangely enough I go to the parks more often now than I ever did before. I don't dpend anywhere close to what the average WDW vacationer does though

I think this is something else that those who say 'why do you even go?' don't get. I assume many of them don't live in Florida, but come from further away, visit rarely and stay in Deluxe resorts when they do... basically the sort for whom a WDW trip is a big expense.

They don't understand that for a local with no need for hotel rooms, with an annual pass or friends with maingates, not eating much more in the parks than the odd Dole Whip and not buying merchandise, it's really not that expensive beyond the cost of the pass to visit and check things out, so they're not spending thousands of dollars on something they 'hate', but more like $50 bucks a month on something they still quite enjoy, but feel could be a lot better.

 

[hopemax]

My quandary is how millennials will last to make it to the top. If you are working for lesser ethical superiors, you will have to have taken on the lesser ethical traits in order to remain and be considered for executive leadership.

They are also incredibly idealistic - almost to a Ned Stark-liability-level. Young = idealism has always gone hand in hand, but with the Millennials the issue is that they do not generally understand how the real world works until it's too late and it's smacked them upside the head.

They have been coddled and coo'd their entire lives, told that they are the most important people in the Universe, everyone deserves a trophy for just trying, and that certain ideals deserve a fascist-like response if anyone dare challenge any notion or tries to show even the slightest shade of gray. They are the most black and white generation in modern history - and it's scary.

Well, these are the seeds for big, societal changes. Our "real world" looks nothing like the "real world of old."

200 years ago, people were mostly in business for themselves. They owned a farm, a stable, were a tailor, a wheelwright, a general store owner, etc. Then came the industrial age and many people moved to working for someone else. To the point where people go to college to be more enticing for other people to hire them, and never consider starting their own. I think to the point where it's crushing real innovation. A person has a good idea, but no power to implement it (no time, management rejects it, etc), while it could have been revolutionary if the person had found a way to develop it themselves. This type of thing could flip things back the other way. And they might be idealistic enough to try. Millennials will make it to the top by creating businesses that operate under their own ideals. The ones that want to be worker bees, will find those companies, and like it or not, older companies will have to decide to adapt to compete (accepting their silly notions, like European standards for vacation, sick time, etc) or not. Like any other business, some will succeed, some will fail, some with take down dinosaurs. It's not scary, that's how free societies are SUPPOSED to work, right, no need for laws, because the populace will be the necessary force of change themselves. But the old guard yells and screams entitlement, when they get down to the business of actually doing it.

The Baby Boomer generation was so massive, I don't think my generation ever stood a chance or affecting real change, because the Boomers maintained controlling interest. I saw a chart with boomers, Gen X, Millennials, and Gen X had a tiny speck of time, when they were the dominant group in the labor market. Only 2011-2014. Already overtaken by the Millennials. One the Boomers die, Gen X won't have any power, it will all be in the hands of the largest generation, which is even bigger than the Boomers. So get use to it.

 

[BrerJon]

It's easier for a person to find a gig that pays $9.50 than it is for Disney to create from whole cloth 66,000 replacement employees.

In a stand off between Disney and their CMs, Disney will cave first. The 50,000 guests staying in property that night would demand it.

I think Disney would be fine. DHS shows that a park can still function without attractions, so they would just close much of the parks, have skeleton staff and management running a few things to keep people entertained, and deploy the full force of international CPs - who have to work 30 hours a week or legally will be deported, and would gain nothing from Disney improving labour conditions - to cover the bases. It would be messy, but do-able.

Also how many domestic CPs on month two of a three month program are going to risk termination for the sake of a pay rise coming into effect long after they've left?

Strikes can have an effect in companies where most people are permanent, but with as many transitory short-term CMs as Disney has, it would be much harder to pull off effectively.

 

[Nubs70]

Good employees for sure should be treated as an asset and rewarded. The problem is really not all are good and that is a fact. It also is a fact that the current generation is a entitlement generation and they feel they should be rewarded for just doing enough. They feel the fact they show up to work should get them a raise or a bigger perk etc. the world does not work that way! But because of this entitlement attitude employers are having to change how they operate. They can no longer expect people to go above and beyond in their jobs cause most just do enough to not get fired. And want to go home and smoke their joints etc.

It is really a sad sad state of our workforce right now. And these kids are going to wonder why they are worse off then their parents. The answer is simple because your parents worked hard!!

So within those hundreds of aged generation IT workers were treated as assets and rewarded? Even those that went above and beyond?

How many were offered another position within the company thus retaining the knowledge base? Or were specialized employees just switched out for commodity employees?

How many employees not affected Will be motivated to go above and beyond after seeing this event? How many potential employees will want to consider working for the mouse?

The IT purge will affect all other departments ny reinforcing the "just enough" mentality for why should I go above and beyond if I'm just as likely to be purged as the above and beyond employee?

 

[Disneyhead'71]

I think Disney would be fine. DHS shows that a park can still function without attractions, so they would just close much of the parks, have skeleton staff and management running a few things to keep people entertained, and deploy the full force of international CPs - who have to work 30 hours a week or legally will be deported, and would gain nothing from Disney improving labour conditions - to cover the bases. It would be messy, but do-able.

Also how many domestic CPs on month two of a three month program are going to risk termination for the sake of a pay rise coming into effect long after they've left?

Strikes can have an effect in companies where most people are permanent, but with as many transitory short-term CMs as Disney has, it would be much harder to pull off effectively.

A work stoppage at WDW would be devastating if it happened at an opportune time.

I am pretty sure this is the kind of talk that gives Disney palpitations.

Hopper is fully aware of the power of the worker ants en masse. He's just happy the ants aren't aware and are afraid.

 

[NowInc]

A work stoppage at WDW would be devastating if it happened at an opportune time.

I am pretty sure this is the kind of talk that gives Disney palpitations.

Hopper is fully aware of the power of the worker ants en masse. He's just happy the ants aren't aware.

Except the job market in Orlando is typically "desperate" and many would fear losing pay or their jobs by not going to work. Its fortunate for companies that the workforce NEEDS to work as badly as they do.

 

[gmajew]

That's lovely.

What does that have to do with anything? Seems just more rationalization for the way Disney treats it's employees.

Sounds to me like: "Sure, if there was one such employee, he surely should be rewarded. But we all know that all of today's employees are a bunch of entitled slackers and Disney is right to treat them all like doo doo".

Edited for harshness. This is a soft as I could make it.

You don't need to edit for harshness I am a a big boy and can handle someone else opinions.

What my comment means is that the current American work from this new generation is lazy! And they feel they should get the rewards for just doing enough! So with that kind of mind set it is incredibly hard to find enough high quality employees. It is not a matter of training them right etc they are just lazy! I have over 500 employees that work for me and trust me it is a serious problem today.

Work ethic in this country sucks compared to ten years ago. Let alone twenty and further.

So as an employer why would I continue to reward these workers for this attitude? I have to high and train more often as most get fired etc.

Now that is not an excuse for bad customer service or bad service but it is a fact of business these days. U ion or no Union the level of work ethic today is way way down.

 

[AEfx]

One the Boomers die, Gen X won't have any power, it will all be in the hands of the largest generation, which is even bigger than the Boomers. So get use to it.

That may be the case - and may The Force help us all if it is.

They have elevated moral relativism to a religious-fanatic level; there are no bad people - even killers/murderers are just "mentally ill" and deserve our pity, and those that are demonstrably mentally ill to the point of self-mutilation are lauded and celebrated as heroes. If you don't feel elated all the time, you need a pill for that. Human relationships have no complexity whatsoever, they are black and white with no shades in between. Everyone deserves to "win", everyone should have a job they "love", and everything works out in the end as long as you believe in your cause enough.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

Except the job market in Orlando is typically "desperate" and many would fear losing pay or their jobs by not going to work. Its fortunate for companies that the workforce NEEDS to work as badly as they do.

But finding a new gig for $9.50/hr is not insurmountable. Finding 66,000 new employees in Orlando is.

The employees hold the cards, and always have. They just don't know it.

And are afraid. Fear is a very powerful motivator. Disney uses it daily to control their employees. I would like to see the tables reversed.

I want to see the look in the execs eyes as he stands in front of a closed MK explaining to the 45,000 "guests" in front of him that they have some wonderful restaurants in Disney Springs that most likely...may be open later, hopefully, for them to enjoy today.

 

[gmajew]

So within those hundreds of aged generation IT workers were treated as assets and rewarded? Even those that went above and beyond?

How many were offered another position within the company thus retaining the knowledge base? Or were specialized employees just switched out for commodity employees?

How many employees not affected Will be motivated to go above and beyond after seeing this event? How many potential employees will want to consider working for the mouse?

The IT purge will affect all other departments ny reinforcing the "just enough" mentality for why should I go above and beyond if I'm just as likely to be purged as the above and beyond employee?

Nubs because most if I read it right were contract employees for that job! Once the job is complete they are dismissed. It is part of that industry. I hired three IT contract workers to build apps for me and the deal was when completed their contract employment was terminated and I hired one to maintain it and keep it updated.

Really it is part of the world you cannot fault any company for running that way. Especially since why would you keep those on if you don't need them anymore. That is wasteful!

 

[Nubs70]

You don't need to edit for harshness I am a a big boy and can handle someone else opinions.

What my comment means is that the current American work from this new generation is lazy! And they feel they should get the rewards for just doing enough! So with that kind of mind set it is incredibly hard to find enough high quality employees. It is not a matter of training them right etc they are just lazy! I have over 500 employees that work for me and trust me it is a serious problem today.

Work ethic in this country sucks compared to ten years ago. Let alone twenty and further.

So as an employer why would I continue to reward these workers for this attitude? I have to high and train more often as most get fired etc.

Now that is not an excuse for bad customer service or bad service but it is a fact of business these days. U ion or no Union the level of work ethic today is way way down.

What has your experience been with hiring seasoned individuals that have a work ethic but need some job specific training?

 

[Disneyhead'71]

You don't need to edit for harshness I am a a big boy and can handle someone else opinions.

What my comment means is that the current American work from this new generation is lazy! And they feel they should get the rewards for just doing enough! So with that kind of mind set it is incredibly hard to find enough high quality employees. It is not a matter of training them right etc they are just lazy! I have over 500 employees that work for me and trust me it is a serious problem today.

Work ethic in this country sucks compared to ten years ago. Let alone twenty and further.

So as an employer why would I continue to reward these workers for this attitude? I have to high and train more often as most get fired etc.

Now that is not an excuse for bad customer service or bad service but it is a fact of business these days. U ion or no Union the level of work ethic today is way way down.

What I see isn't a lack of work ethic. What I see is a lack of knocking yourself out just to be fired regularly because of corporate downsizing/restructuring. No raises for 8 years while the boss is floating around The Med. on the corporate yacht. What I see is CEOs making BILLIONS on the backs of close to homeless folks. And people like you saying it's the poor peoples fault.

Well, actually it is because they haven't stood up and said "ENOUGH!".

 

[Nubs70]

Nubs because most if I read it right were contract employees for that job! Once the job is complete they are dismissed. It is part of that industry. I hired three IT contract workers to build apps for me and the deal was when completed their contract employment was terminated and I hired one to maintain it and keep it updated.

Really it is part of the world you cannot fault any company for running that way. Especially since why would you keep those on if you don't need them anymore. That is wasteful!

I'm under the impression they were direct employees. If they were contract, that is different and I will extend and revise my remarks.

 

[hopemax]

Good employees for sure should be treated as an asset and rewarded. The problem is really not all are good and that is a fact. It also is a fact that the current generation is a entitlement generation and they feel they should be rewarded for just doing enough. They feel the fact they show up to work should get them a raise or a bigger perk etc. the world does not work that way! But because of this entitlement attitude employers are having to change how they operate. They can no longer expect people to go above and beyond in their jobs cause most just do enough to not get fired. And want to go home and smoke their joints etc.

It is really a sad sad state of our workforce right now. And these kids are going to wonder why they are worse off then their parents. The answer is simple because your parents worked hard!!

I believe it might be the opposite. Yes, you have your portion of entitled snobs, but see Little House and Nelly Olsen, not a new thing. But you also have a group who saw EXACTLY how hard their parents worked (because they were never home) and saw EXACTLY how they were treated (layoffs, not "allowed" to use time off, lost pensions, lost heath care) and decided that there wasn't a correlation to how hard someone worked and how they were compensated and valued (they read the productivity charts vs salaries too), and determined that that would not be their life, and they might actually be better off than their parents at the end of it.

1955, when the world was perfect and everyone worked hard and did what they were expected to, and so many people wanted to work for Disney that they could pick the cream of the crop, Walt Disney still hired Van Arsdale France to create an extensive training program. People have to be taught how to do their job, and monitored. Same thing with the military, although their methods are certainly different, lol. Apprenticeships from days of old. You mold people into what you want, you don't expect them to be that way when they walk in the door and then whine about it when they don't do it the right way. But recently, that's what business has decided what should happen in their ideal little world where you don't have to pay for such things...but that's a form of entitlement too.

 

[Disneyhead'71]

What has your experience been with hiring seasoned individuals that have a work ethic but need some job specific training?

Ain't nobody got time for that!

 

[asianway]

But finding a new gig for $9.50/hr is not insurmountable. Finding 66,000 new employees in Orlando is.

The employees hold the cards, and always have. They just don't know it.

And are afraid. Fear is a very powerful motivator. Disney uses it daily to control their employees. I would like to see the tables reversed.

I want to see the look in the execs eyes as he stands in front of a closed MK explaining to the 45,000 "guests" in front of him that they have some wonderful restaurants in Disney Springs that most likely...may be open later, hopefully, for them to enjoy today.

How much would A Bugs Life DVD cost if we bought 66,000?