A Spirited Dirty Dozen ...

[tribbleorlfl]

BTW, to say Disney advertising is disingenuous regarding the entire Star Wars IP at DHS is putting it mildly. Bait and switch comes to mind yet one would think DHS is THE STAR WARS PARK in much the way people looked at IOA as the Harry Potter park.

Which is why I don't get why they cancelled SW Weekends. Even with the new entertainment, there's still not nearly as much going on as SW weekends. There's nowhere near as many meet and greets, not as many behind the scenes/trivia shows and I think the loss of film talent (even if they were just doing shows and motorcade and not autograph sessions) is staggering.

I know why they're not doing it (cost), but I am not at all impressed.

 

[rd805]

If only someone could see that coming back in 2012/2013, Oh wait.

Quote of the thread.

 

[Mouse Trap]

I'm having trouble believing you are serious, WDW and DL are among the top terror targets in the US since 9/11 and probably before Disney has been on a first name basis with every three letter agency in the US Govt and probably a bunch of non-US based ones as well.

Not quite sure where you pulled the idea that I don't believe Disney is an obvious terror target.

What I've been getting at is the fact that Disney is so darn obvious is what makes it all the more safe. It's when we become oblivious to potential danger and do not put stops in place that true danger occurs.

 

[Quinnmac000]

Are you entertaining the idea that Global Intelligence at Disney actually pulls some weight in terms of national security? I'm not going to get into the specifics of the departments responsibilities/knowledge, but if they know about a major security threat to the parks before the FBI does this country is in some serious trouble.

Yeah, they've got some good info about holes in park security procedures, but someone looking to cause some damage would be thoroughly disappointed during an interrogation. Frankly it would be a waste of time.

Regardless, terror attacks can happen ANYWHERE in the USA. Paris is a sickening example of such. Elaborate plots aren't quite as easy to get away with anymore. Enough damage can be caused, as I said earlier, in low-profile crowded areas anywhere in the USA.

A lot of those who do work in that division are ex military who probably some have access to things that would be beneficial to know. Just because the words Disney is in the name doesn't mean they don't know things.

2. Yea anyplace in the US is a good target but its not about what makes a good target but what can create the most fear. Disney has a huge amount of foreign travelers. Its a place of comfort and leisure. People go there thinking they are safe they don't pay attention to their surroundings as if you look most are on their phones, cameras etc not looking around them. It would give the most impact to their cause which is why its dumb to act like nothing would ever happen and discount it because it can happen anywhere. Yea it can happen in small town Wisconsin but it won't have the media impact Disney would create.

3. The fact Disney has created the illusion of being safe makes it less safe because it would rattle people even more so if anything happened.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Not quite sure where you pulled the idea that I don't believe Disney is an obvious terror target.

What I've been getting at is the fact that Disney is so darn obvious is what makes it all the more safe. It's when we become oblivious to potential danger and do not put stops in place that true danger occurs.

I'm not concerned about security at Disney.

While I think that the overt stuff is for perception/deterrence, its the stuff that we don't see that I'm rather comfortable with.

 

[raymusiccity]

It's hard not to notice some of this stuff like the small world problems or a half empty baby bottle in the HM load area.

Plus for some of us a trip to WDW doesn't cost a fortune so we don't feel as much of a sting. $140 (only $33 actually going to Disney) for last weekend was totally worth it for me.

The Kong finale problem as I've read it isn't anywhere close to the Yeti.

Same can be said of Steve Burke at Universal. I sense a trend here.

See, it's the way you look at things. Maybe that baby bottle was half full !

 

[FerretAfros]

Well we have been getting the paint lately....

WDW has been getting about the right amount of work to keep things up (I'm not entirely convinced they're even doing enough for that), but they have a huge backlog of deferred maintenance that will never be completed at the rate they're going. An occasional refurbishment on a single building is nothing like what WDW needs, or what DL had in 2004/early 2005

For comparison, here are photos from the week of 4/17/05 at Disneyland, by Darkbeer (photographer who frequented the parks at the time), with a quick rundown of the projects going on all at the same time:

• Repainting Main Street lampposts for 50th décor
• Storybookland/Casey Jr refurbishment
• Matterhorn refurbishment
• Repaving by Matterhorn
• New park entry procedure testing
• Monsters, Inc construction
• Dancing Waters retirement at Disneyland Hotel
• Turnstile structure refurbishment
• Club Buzz/Tomorrowland Terrace conversion
• Space Mountain rebuild
• Complete overhaul of Tomorrowland paint scheme
• Installation of new show equipment for Remember...Dreams Come True
• Conversion of Opera House to 50th exhibit
• New security tents
• Updated resort signage
• Submarine Voyage testing and drainage
• Tiki Room rebuild
• Jungle Cruise refurbishment
• Mark Twain refurbishment
• Railroad refurbishment
• Village Haus/restrooms refurbishment
• 50th décor installation
• Buzz Lightyear construction
• ASIMO installation
• Goofy's Bounce House refurbishment
• Toontown fountain refurbishment

https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Theme-Parks-2005-Photos/Disneyland-Resort-41705/
https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Theme-Parks-2005-Photos/Disneyland-Resort-41805/
https://darkbeer.smugmug.com/Theme-Parks-2005-Photos/Disneyland-Resort-41905/

This is just a sample of the magnitude of the work. Nearly every single facility in Disneyland was refurbished during the ~18 month lead up to the 50th, through a revolving door of refurbishment. Luckily, crowds were low at the time, and the park has plenty of capacity to soak in the guests; I can't say the same thing about any of the WDW parks at the moment. If WDW wants to restore its former glory, it will also need a swift kick in the pants to get things headed in the right direction

 

[TabulaRasa]

@WDW1974 there was some mention on the boards a couple of weeks ago about the potential of TRON, and Inside Out coming to Future World. Are there any plans currently in the pipeline for Epcot that you know of?

Also thank you for all the insight!

 

[WDW1974]

Interesting to see consumer products was down 8% - I wonder what happened to the guy who was in charge of that division...

Yup ... isn't that interesting.

There is such a laziness in CP and retail from Disney in general right now.

Whether it is slapping Star Wars characters on everything (I am waiting for Rey's visage on tampons for teens soon!) ... to simply creating or rifting on nostalgia and old designs (why are all the Epcot tees really retro EPCOT Center tees? Is it because Epcot is a bland, boring, huge outdoor bar and grill?) ... to just stuff that makes no sense (was in Walgreen's yesterday and saw garden shovels for kids that are Disney themed ... some are Minnie, some are even from Finding Dory -- because she loved her petunia patch, right?)

I don't get what Disney is selling or what it thinks it is. The 28 and Main collection is a bizarre and overpriced ($37 tees that will last three washes, really?) ode mostly to things that no longer exist. Amazing to see how much of that collection is already at Cast Connection and the outlets. Because fans just can't get enough of it, right?

Speaking of Cast Connection/Property Control, what bizarre stuff they keep and attempt to sell. Everything from 2007 DL Half Marathon Magnets for $2 to what were free 2008-09 era hip Mickey art cards left in resort rooms to shill the new BLT for $1 a piece to pricey Tommy Bahama tees marked from $45 to the low-low price of $32 to Atlanta Braves and Grapefruit League tees for $4.99 to loads of Star Wars toys and DLR 60th crap (all for a celebration that is going on for another four months!) to a LE SW photo set from last year's final event that was $90 for $45 (please explain to me how an item with a 300 edition run over something so popular has at least half of that number on sale a year later for half price for CMs) to very nice items from the Germany and Mexico pavilions that in no way one would associate with WDW (I have a new set of hand blown glasses from the latter that are beautiful and were $2.70 each) to a giant painting of a comic with Captain America and Iron Man signed by Stan Lee himself for just under $600.

I know we were ripping Chappie (and he deserves it ... the guy is still utterly clueless about his division, how you can run Disney P&R without a basic understanding 18 months in tells you all you need to know!), but I don't understand Disney merchandise, the people who create and sell it and the people who buy it. Not at all.

I will say, though, that quality shopping exists at DAK and WS IF you don't buy items created by Disney.

 

[WDW1974]

Just need to drop a post in (since we are moving, unfortunately, at light speed here) about the difference between UNI and WDW.

UNI TMs are happy. They seem to feel they are part of a resort that is great and getting better (and it is ... and look for a MAJOR announcement from the folks there in the near future regarding expansion of both the parks and new hotels -- multiple hotels). The parks are noticeably cleaner and better maintained than Disney's. You don't see facilities where things are just rotting away like you do at WDW (or if you don't it's either because you aren't looking, don't care or are simply not discerning). The place doesn't feel sticky (no fanboi/Imagineer jokes, please) like much of WDW does. Shops and show buildings are air conditioned comfortably (ride SSE where it is about 83 degrees most days and tell me Disney isn't penny-pinching because tourists are stupid and expect it to be hot in FL). Merchandise is themed to the areas and shops don't have huge empty places where displays have been removed too make way for ECVs and double-wide strollers.

There is just a much better vibe going on. Even if it is simply the vibe of a successful business.

Contrast that with the corpses of EPCOT and The Disney-MGM Studios. How and why people go to these parks, beyond having park-hopping ability just astounds me. Completely. I don't understand and I love to observe and people watch. But what do you do there? There are no attractions. Do you plan a trip because Joy and Sadness are now meeting and greeting at EPCOT? Do you plan a trip because there is a SW movie clip show with a few performers who do nothing at the Studios? Or because you can buy a burger that Disney says is 'themed' to SW? Please help me understand the pathology of those who go to those parks beyond walking and people watching ... the people who actually go because they think there is substance.

I am tired of UNI right now, but that is simply due to the sheer amount of time I have spent there in the last five years. In now way is that a critique of the quality or value inherent in the resort.

 

[WDW1974]

Operationally yes the Fantasyland Theater will and needs to go. It will provide an additional access point to the land and also a further bypass for Star Wars.

Then there is that expansion plot beside Star Wars (which I thought was for Star Wars but maybe not). Quite a bit of room especially if there are any additional backstage facilities they can knock down behind Toon Town.

There is a big drive to get the Outter ring finalized. If people can traverse the park from Critter Country to Small World without having to pass through NoS, Frontier land and Fantasyland A LOT of the operational crowd flow woes of the parades and night spectaculars will finally ease off.

Or maybe crowds will be even worse because there is a giant new Star Wars land there with two major attractions?
Either way, SWE does NOT belong at DL. Not at all. There are no legit justifications for it beyond people liking Star Wars and not appreciating DL's history or purpose. None.

 

[njDizFan]

If you even have to ask why you do not understand, But I'll explain it for you all the biggest intelligence leaks in US history up to including Snowden involved young very low level people as they are easy to compromise and no one is watching them as they watch higher level people, And I'd posit that those who put themselves on LinkedIn are not very smart because they just painted a giant target on themselves.

There are 93 entries listed on LinkedIn under Disney Global Security. Many with pictures

 

[JohnD]

Just need to drop a post in (since we are moving, unfortunately, at light speed here) about the difference between UNI and WDW.

UNI TMs are happy. They seem to feel they are part of a resort that is great and getting better (and it is ... and look for a MAJOR announcement from the folks there in the near future regarding expansion of both the parks and new hotels -- multiple hotels). The parks are noticeably cleaner and better maintained than Disney's. You don't see facilities where things are just rotting away like you do at WDW (or if you don't it's either because you aren't looking, don't care or are simply not discerning). The place doesn't feel sticky (no fanboi/Imagineer jokes, please) like much of WDW does. Shops and show buildings are air conditioned comfortably (ride SSE where it is about 83 degrees most days and tell me Disney isn't penny-pinching because tourists are stupid and expect it to be hot in FL). Merchandise is themed to the areas and shops don't have huge empty places where displays have been removed too make way for ECVs and double-wide strollers.

There is just a much better vibe going on. Even if it is simply the vibe of a successful business.

Contrast that with the corpses of EPCOT and The Disney-MGM Studios. How and why people go to these parks, beyond having park-hopping ability just astounds me. Completely. I don't understand and I love to observe and people watch. But what do you do there? There are no attractions. Do you plan a trip because Joy and Sadness are now meeting and greeting at EPCOT? Do you plan a trip because there is a SW movie clip show with a few performers who do nothing at the Studios? Or because you can buy a burger that Disney says is 'themed' to SW? Please help me understand the pathology of those who go to those parks beyond walking and people watching ... the people who actually go because they think there is substance.

I am tired of UNI right now, but that is simply due to the sheer amount of time I have spent there in the last five years. In now way is that a critique of the quality or value inherent in the resort.

Agree about the total lack of attractions at Epcot. If you go only for that, you'll be disappointed. Which is why I reserve attractions for the morning and strolling WS in the afternoon and evening. It's a completely different vibe in WS and something you want to do beyond doing attractions. I guess WDW is trying to make up for it by putting a Frozen ride in Norway and kicking the A&E sisters out of MK, forcing families with children demanding to see them into Epcot in the near future.

 

[Mike S]

I don't know what you've heard, but if the rumor of a short AA payoff for a big buildup is true, it sounds like the Everest model to me.

I read that the truck simply keeps moving and doesn't stop when you get to him. Doesn't sound like the Yeti at all to me. Sounds more like how you pass some of the Dinosaurs in Dinosaur without stopping but there's no need to make this thread about Kong. It's about WDW and their next big promotion.

 

[Thanks phoenicians]

So I realize that DCA and shanghai are getting marvel attractions and Tokyo getting everything that our NFL should've gotten, but any word on any expansion at any of the four WDW parks? Or are we going in to another decade long lull after a half completed DHS and a rotting Epcot. As for the uni vs disney comparison this will be my first trip to the parks so i'll be able to judge better then, but in terms of the theming from what i can tell besides WWOHP the rest of those parks could use some work. Again i haven't really seen a lot of the parks so i can't judge too much yet. At least theyre spending the money to update the out of date attractions though

 

[WDW1974]

Sorry for the wall of text guys.

Wait, this past weekend? And you couldn't say hi to me?

How would I know you or @alphac2005 (who was staying at the same hotel as I was) were there. I would have loved to have met you both and said hi.

Also I thought those helicopters circling DHS on Friday looked suspicious. I guess now I know why

I believe they used copters to drop the American flag in at the opening ceremonies, but you'd have had to be dead to not notice all the security and what was very obviously the Secret Service around property.

I experienced the smaller portions first hand when we went to Pop for breakfast because the breakfast at our offsite hotel stunk. Less eggs and one slice of French toast rather than two. The Disney Difference indeed.

My salad at Columbia Harbor House (quite tasty) clearly had about 25% less lettuce and 10% less chicken than it did a year ago at higher prices, naturally.

Seeing mine and my brothers names on it's a small world and a Hitchhiking Ghost saying he's following me to Florida was so totally worth it

Rode both and never got either effect working ...actually rode both 2-3 times during the week.

Can't wait to see Everest with a working Yeti again in freaking CHINA.

Maybe he'll be in DIsco mode there from Day 1!

 

[ChrisFL]

I definitely noticed the lack of cool A/C when I visited 2 weeks ago. Most indoor places seemed to be at least 80 degrees, but hey, we saw our name on IASW, so that makes up for EVERYTHING!

It's like putting $2,000 wheels on a 30 year old car....the oil leaks, the a/c is bad, the paint is chipping, but OOOH, SHINY!!

 

[Mike S]

Just need to drop a post in (since we are moving, unfortunately, at light speed here) about the difference between UNI and WDW.

UNI TMs are happy. They seem to feel they are part of a resort that is great and getting better (and it is ... and look for a MAJOR announcement from the folks there in the near future regarding expansion of both the parks and new hotels -- multiple hotels). The parks are noticeably cleaner and better maintained than Disney's. You don't see facilities where things are just rotting away like you do at WDW (or if you don't it's either because you aren't looking, don't care or are simply not discerning). The place doesn't feel sticky (no fanboi/Imagineer jokes, please) like much of WDW does. Shops and show buildings are air conditioned comfortably (ride SSE where it is about 83 degrees most days and tell me Disney isn't penny-pinching because tourists are stupid and expect it to be hot in FL). Merchandise is themed to the areas and shops don't have huge empty places where displays have been removed too make way for ECVs and double-wide strollers.

There is just a much better vibe going on. Even if it is simply the vibe of a successful business.

Contrast that with the corpses of EPCOT and The Disney-MGM Studios. How and why people go to these parks, beyond having park-hopping ability just astounds me. Completely. I don't understand and I love to observe and people watch. But what do you do there? There are no attractions. Do you plan a trip because Joy and Sadness are now meeting and greeting at EPCOT? Do you plan a trip because there is a SW movie clip show with a few performers who do nothing at the Studios? Or because you can buy a burger that Disney says is 'themed' to SW? Please help me understand the pathology of those who go to those parks beyond walking and people watching ... the people who actually go because they think there is substance.

I am tired of UNI right now, but that is simply due to the sheer amount of time I have spent there in the last five years. In now way is that a critique of the quality or value inherent in the resort.

I squealed reading this!!! Is it the Avengers ride @marni1971 has been talking about? I also have some stories about my day in Universal that I've put elsewhere.

There's an interesting story I have to share as well. I got stuck on Spider-Man and got the usual offer of getting back in a short line to ride again. After getting seated an older woman sitting next to me said, and I quote, "they would never do that at Disney," to which a man replied, "yeah that's real top notch." This is the general public people. It will take a good amount of more time but they're starting to notice.

I actually just got to my hotel. I also have a nice review of the TMs in Diagon Alley. I was by the ice cream shop and asked where I could buy Butterbeer Fudge which I read about online (if it's possible to taste heaven, that's what it would taste like ). The TM told me about the new sweet shop that opened and where to go then actually walked me over there. When I got there the TM working the counter took my order before I even got to the register to make things a bit faster even though it wasn't that long of a wait. TMs just seem very happy overall. I also saw trash being taken care of multiple times to prevent overflowing cans. Let's see how Disney goes.

 

[WDW1974]

So what you're saying is #EverythingIsAwful?

No. That isn't what I am saying.

What I am saying is WDW was and remains a very troubled place and it is incredibly sad to see how far the place has fallen from its first 25-30 years to now.

To be clear, I firmly believe that WDW has never been worse than it is right now overall.

Small things are absolutely better and improving. But as a whole? Never been worse.

 

[JohnD]

I definitely noticed the lack of cool A/C when I visited 2 weeks ago. Most indoor places seemed to be at least 80 degrees, but hey, we saw our name on IASW, so that makes up for EVERYTHING!

It's like putting $2,000 wheels on a 30 year old car....the oil leaks, the a/c is bad, the paint is chipping, but OOOH, SHINY!!

Gotta justify that $3B sunk into MM+. Who cares about the disrepair of the rest of the attraction when I get to see my name at the end. Excuse me while I take a selfie of me and my name while I blind you with my flash.