A Spirited 15 Rounds ...

[britain]

There is a big difference between competitive ballroom dancing with people that could be his great-grandkids and acting in a film.

Especially with Carrie gone, I really think they need him.

I suppose so, especially if we’re ever going to see Finn reunited with his family.

 

[bhg469]

Kathleen Kennedy, the president of Lucasfilm, the studio that makes the “Star Wars” films, was more direct about whether she felt she had to placate these critics.

“I have a responsibility to the company that I work with,” she said. “I don’t feel that I have a responsibility to cater in some way.”

She added, “I would never just seize on saying, ‘Well, this is a franchise that’s appealed primarily to men for many, many years, and therefore I owe men something.’”

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/29/...story.html?smid=tw-nytimesarts&smtyp=cur&_r=0

She is turning the franchise into She-Ra.

Now, let me explain before you get your "-isms" lasers ready to fly.

This woman...is not telling good STORIES.

TFA was a basic fan-service movie...not bad, not great...in line with JJ's Star Trek movie. It set up new characters for us to care about, and created new and interesting storylines to pursue.

Rogue One was boring. Sorry, it was. But, even if you liked it...or TFA...both movies had lots of story potential that were squandered.

It's fine to have strong female leads. I applaud strong female leads. But, they shouldn't be interesting just because they are female!

I HATE crappy stories.

And, let's face it, that is what she is doing with this.

Even women agree.



And, there are plenty of others.

Do you know why She-Ra was a thing? 20% of He-Man sales were...to little girls. I know, I know, it was the "sexist 80s"...what sort of mysogenist men would buy their daughter's boy's toys to play with? Well...20% of the market share did, apparently. Anyhow, when the Barbie/girls line at Mattel found out, they decided they needed their own version...so, She-Ra was born, with unicorns.

Kathleen Kennedy, like pretty much every virtue signalling hollywood social justice moron, is fighting a paper tiger... A battle that was won long ago, but they won't let go of. They ARE the "first order" who won't follow Ren's advice to "let the past die"...

She, needs to go...before she kills the franchise with her backwards ideology.

I don't care if you replace her with another woman, or a transsexual Ewok...just give me someone who is committed to telling a STORY and building a UNIVERSE...not someone who is the epitome of the peter principle that she thinks she isn't susceptible to because she doesn't have a peter.

I think you're my best friend

 

[Cesar R M]

My first issue is with the opening scenes with the mega destroyer:

Imperial General Doofus:

his one liners were worse than something off of Friday night sitcoms. Not the evil master strategist one would envision in such a role.

Leia in Space:

How just how is she supposed to protect herself from the vacuum of space? Must be midichlorian insulation.

How is she able to sub consciously summon force powers when never trained? Luke must be developmentally challenged if he needed many years of training in the force where as Leia and Rey are masters without training.

The Force:

All these years, having the force abilities was a genetic unlearnable attribute, now anyone can have it.

Rey:

She is essentially an inter galactic Honey Boo Boo.


Just some initial thoughts..

Reading your comments makes me facepalm.
I think you're missing the entire point of the explanations both by Yoda and the midiclorians thing.

 

[Cesar R M]

Exactly. Vader simply said, "I am your father" and boom, that was it and people were satisfied. But with Rey, people are upset that that TLJ did not dedicated a significant portion of the movie to her back story. Or Snokes.

in Snoke's case, he said ZERO substance related to his past.

"just im a bad dude who managed to bring the empire old forces" great!

 

[Cesar R M]

Clip from Shannon Tindle’s (“Kubo and the Two Strings”) cancelled Haunted Mansion special for the Disney Channel.

Was looking good.. why did they cancel it anyway?

 

[Cesar R M]

Kylo lied.

It's what bad guys do.

I dont think he lied. He simple said "his version". Every person based on perspective can twist and distort what happened on their convenience and point of view.

 

[doctornick]

I'm going to be genuinely upset if Lando doesn't show up in Episode IX.

See, while you could come up with some reasonable ways to work him into the story, I think that's the kind of unnecessary fan service that undermines this series at times. I think the appearances on SW:Rebels are good enough and the character (albeit different actor) will be in Solo. There's no need to make Star Wars any "smaller" than needed.

 

[The Mom]

Please watch the language, and personal attacks are still not allowed.

 

[the.dreamfinder]

Was looking good.. why did they cancel it anyway?

It was in development and Disney chose not to move forward on it.
http://www.cartoonbrew.com/tv/watch...eries-kubo-creator-shannon-tindle-155601.html

 

[AEfx]

I dont think he lied. He simple said "his version". Every person based on perspective can twist and distort what happened on their convenience and point of view.

I have a hard time with that since they are little psychic buddies now and she "searched inside" for it to be true.

But they either go one of two ways with the last film - either they go back to what TFA set forth and ignore this part of TLJ, or they go along with this new "direction".

Apropos, I was looking at something today and found this quote from JJ Abrams after TFA - this kind of entirely puts to rest the whole claim that "Oh, they did nothing to encourage people to care who Rey's parents were!" There is a mountain of evidence to this, but this one quote pretty much sums it up:

"We're going to make sure that the answer is deeply and profoundly satisfying. Rey is a character that is important in this universe, not just in the context of TFA, but in the entire galaxy. She deserves it. We'll make sure that the answer is something that feels like it happened a long time ago, far away, and we're just telling you what happened."

Now, can anyone, even the most ardent defenders of the film, say that this criteria was met by TLJ? Was it "profoundly and deeply satisfying"?

 

[doctornick]

I have a hard time with that since they are little psychic buddies now and she "searched inside" for it to be true.

But they either go one of two ways with the last film - either they go back to what TFA set forth and ignore this part of TLJ, or they go along with this new "direction".

Apropos, I was looking at something today and found this quote from JJ Abrams after TFA - this kind of entirely puts to rest the whole claim that "Oh, they did nothing to encourage people to care who Rey's parents were!" There is a mountain of evidence to this, but this one quote pretty much sums it up:

"We're going to make sure that the answer is deeply and profoundly satisfying. Rey is a character that is important in this universe, not just in the context of TFA, but in the entire galaxy. She deserves it. We'll make sure that the answer is something that feels like it happened a long time ago, far away, and we're just telling you what happened."

Now, can anyone, even the most ardent defenders of the film, say that this criteria was met by TLJ? Was it "profoundly and deeply satisfying"?

As I mentioned in the other thread where you put that quote, it is actually from Colin Trevorrow, not JJ Abrams. Maybe his opinion about certain aspects of the story are exactly why he's no longer directing Episode IX. Lucasfilm did say the standard "we have all come to the conclusion that our visions for the project differ" when he was replaced so that might simply be the truth.

Anyway, I still vehemently disagree that they set up something different in TFA. In that film, you had Maz basically telling Rey to forget about her parents because they weren't important and look to the future by finding Luke instead.

And, actually, I did find the reveal to be satisfying because I was praying all the fan theories would be proven bogus and that Rey would be unrelated to anyone known. This makes her a more interesting character than just another Skywalker.

 

[asianway]

There is a big difference between competitive ballroom dancing with people that could be his great-grandkids and acting in a film.

Especially with Carrie gone, I really think they need him.

They need him, mace windu back from the dead, Liam neeson & Ewan McGregor & Luke as force ghosts, more Yoda, and Han flashbacks as the magnitude of fan service I'm expecting

 

[yeti]

They need him, mace windu back from the dead, Liam neeson & Ewan McGregor & Luke as force ghosts, more Yoda, and Han flashbacks as the magnitude of fan service I'm expecting

Why don't they just build another Death Star while they're at it?

 

[AEfx]

As I mentioned in the other thread where you put that quote, it is actually from Colin Trevorrow, not JJ Abrams. Maybe his opinion about certain aspects of the story are exactly why he's no longer directing Episode IX. Lucasfilm did say the standard "we have all come to the conclusion that our visions for the project differ" when he was replaced so that might simply be the truth.

Thanks for the correction. Makes a lot of sense now. Johnson decided to crap on TFA, and Colin was gong to you know, actually follow-up on it. Of course, this was before JJ took back over the job, and now he has to decide what he does - go back to what he started, or this new version created in TLJ.

In any case, there are still plenty of places where JJ himself discussed them. Here is a great one - where he made a statement that they "weren't in Episode VII" and then after it was picked up in the press had to make a release clarifying that statement, saying that "she doesn't discover them" in the film:

https://screenrant.com/star-wars-force-awakens-rey-parents-not-seen/

But no, no one making the films made this some mystery...it was all made up by fans, LOL.

In any case, Rian Johnson made a statement today distancing himself from it, that just further confirmed what I have been saying this whole time - that they are flying by the seat of their pants on this, that since he isn't writing the next one, JJ can change his mind (though as I have also said, that would be terrible storytelling because "Kylo was lying/misinformed" is hard to pull off since they did the whole "moment" where Rey searches her feelings and knows it's true, blah blah).

https://www.express.co.uk/entertain...son-The-Last-Jedi-JJ-Abrams-The-Force-Awakens

Anyway, I still vehemently disagree that they set up something different in TFA. In that film, you had Maz basically telling Rey to forget about her parents because they weren't important and look to the future by finding Luke instead.

Then how...

...is Rey intimately familiar with how the MF works? How can she both fix it, modify it, and fly it against trained pilots so expertly? And while we are at it, why is the MF there at all, just sitting and waiting for her? You can't just say "well she messed around with broken ships on Jakku and drove a speeder around" because even Rey herself seems constantly surprised at this knowledge she seems to be pulling out of thin air.

...does Rey know how to use a Jedi Mind Trick, and force pulls, which are advanced Jedi skills, that even Anakin, who was the most naturally gifted Jedi ever, needed training to be able to do?

...can she wield a lightsaber, having never even seen one turn on before, and beat someone who has trained since they were a child in using it?

And why...

...does BB-8 attach himself to Rey? And don't say "R2 and Luke", because R2 knew exactly who Luke was

...does Kylo Ren absolutely flip out when he hears about "the girl" on Jakku who escaped with them (go watch the scene before you say he just freaked out because they got away, he was clearly upset at that point but didn't go into a full-on temper tantrum and try to kill someone until "THE GIRL!" came up - the girl he had never even met before)

...does Harrison Ford basically spend his entire time with Rey staring at her, most often with a horrible look of guilt/regret on his face? Let's not mince words, Ford is a fine movie star but not a terribly deep actor - he only has a few expressions, and either Han knows more about Rey than he is letting on, or he is some incredible perv who feels guilty about wanting a young girl.

...does Leia instantly know who Rey is and embraces her when she gets off the ship? She has never even met her before.

I could go on. If you watch that film and don't realize that something is up with Rey and that everyone knows who she is but her (and not necessarily a Skywalker, mind you - but just someone), I just don't think you watched it very carefully. And if she literally never had any Jedi training whatsoever, she really was the ultimate Mary Sue that all those folks critical of how unbelievable her character in TFA was said she is.

I'm sure you will go point by point and try to dismiss all of these things on their own one by one with some type of mental gymnastics or the other (sadly, something we as Star Wars fans have always had to do - though I did dearly hope Disney would do better), but dismissing ALL of this is just impossible.

 

[lazyboy97o]

...is Rey intimately familiar with how the MF works? How can she both fix it, modify it, and fly it against trained pilots so expertly? And while we are at it, why is the MF there at all, just sitting and waiting for her? You can't just say "well she messed around with broken ships on Jakku and drove a speeder around" because even Rey herself seems constantly surprised at this knowledge she seems to be pulling out of thin air.

The Millenium Falcon, while heavily modified, is not a unique ship. It is a Corellian YT-1300 and so the junk yard excuse does work. It’s not a stretch that other YT freighters have been junked on Jakku.

 

[AEfx]

The Millenium Falcon, while heavily modified, is not a unique ship. It is a Corellian YT-1300 and so the junk yard excuse does work. It’s not a stretch that other YT freighters have been junked on Jakku.

Okay, that's fine. Although if you watch her scenes in the Falcon, unless Ridley is a terrible actress, as I said, she herself seems constantly amazed that she knows all these things, and these ideas that keep popping into her head. She doesn't have the "oh, I've seen this before" assurance - not to mention, while you are absolutely correct about the YT-1300 being a standard model, the Falcon was also heavily modified as well. Yet she seems to have no problem with any of that - heck, she even bests Han's knowledge at one point about it. And that's just the fixing part - she later modifies it, and flies the thing like she has been doing it her whole life. All the while looking thrilled and exhilarated that she knows how to do it.

Like I said, we can go through that list point by point and come up with "well it's possible that..." but when you go through that film, scene after scene...it's like, either the entire thing is just a bad film, or they were building up to something saying that "she has been here before, these people know who she is".

 

[shortstop]

Okay, that's fine. Although if you watch her scenes in the Falcon, unless Ridley is a terrible actress, as I said, she herself seems constantly amazed that she knows all these things, and these ideas that keep popping into her head. She doesn't have the "oh, I've seen this before" assurance - not to mention, while you are absolutely correct about the YT-1300 being a standard model, the Falcon was also heavily modified as well. Yet she seems to have no problem with any of that - heck, she even bests Han's knowledge at one point about it. And that's just the fixing part - she later modifies it, and flies the thing like she has been doing it her whole life. All the while looking thrilled and exhilarated that she knows how to do it.

Like I said, we can go through that list point by point and come up with "well it's possible that..." but when you go through that film, scene after scene...it's like, either the entire thing is just a bad film, or they were building up to something saying that "she has been here before, these people know who she is".

Regardless of your point, what does this have to do with TLJ? This is all TFA. Being familiar with a ship is not a genetic trait so her familiarity with the Falcon is not related to her family lineage.

 

[asianway]

Why don't they just build another Death Star while they're at it?

I'm counting on it, bigger of course

 

[lazyboy97o]

I'm counting on it, bigger of course

The Death Red Giant!

 

[AEfx]

Regardless of your point, what does this have to do with TLJ? This is all TFA. Being familiar with a ship is not a genetic trait so her familiarity with the Falcon is not related to her family lineage.

Go back and read the post he was responding to. It's not just about her familiarity with a ship. It's one of many things that entire scenes are built around in TFA that show that Rey has some missing chunk in her mind that she is now starting to access. It was a response to the statement that "TFA didn't set up anything about" Rey's origins, so therefore we shouldn't have expected anything in TLJ.