5th Park Opening in Time for WDW's 50th (Jim Hill)

[maxairmike]

I don't think that people will warm to the idea of a niche park for the rich in this economic environment.

Sure, if you want to ignore the niche park halfway up/down I-Drive that keeps expanding...*


*That would be SeaWorld's Discovery Cove for those that never venture outside the Mouse's gates.

 

[WDW1974]

Good to see you back. Where you been hiding?

Thanks. I'd tell you, but then I'd have to kill you and make it look like suicide by Pixie Dust!:animwink:

Seriously, just taking a break from online activities (does wonders for your frame of mind) and spent a busy month on the west coast with business and fun (DLR, Emmys, mountains!)

 

[WDW1974]

There was a time when I would give Jim Hill the benefit of the doubt, or at least tolerate his writing style because the content was at least amusing. That time passed long ago, and his credibility has been shot for a long time. Other readers have pointed to the likely reasons he wrote this article, so there's no point going there.

Everything else Disney is doing--from X-Pass (including multiple coming NextGen queues along with 'memory-targeted' product development, among data mining and other things) to the currently announced expansion totally flies in the face of this rumor. These are huge CapEx projects inconsistent with the impetus behind a fifth gate that, more importantly, won't be done until around 2017. So between 2017 and 2021 Disney will start building a fifth gate? Right...

This doesn't even take into account economics and guest habits that have gradually been changing over the past several years making the idea of a fifth gate even less viable. There's no sign that these habits are going to reverse themselves anytime soon.

So unless Jim Hill can now accurately predict the future of the economy AND vacationing habits on top of moves by Disney, he doesn't currently *know* that this is going to happen.

I wonder when I read a post that sums it all up so intelligently and concisely, why people just can't accept reality and move on.

But then I turn on the news or go out in public and realize that believing in just about anything, no matter how absurd, isn't a trait unique to overzealous Disney fans, unfortunately. :hammer::brick:

 

[Computer Magic]

There was a time when I would give Jim Hill the benefit of the doubt, or at least tolerate his writing style because the content was at least amusing. That time passed long ago, and his credibility has been shot for a long time. Other readers have pointed to the likely reasons he wrote this article, so there's no point going there.

Everything else Disney is doing--from X-Pass (including multiple coming NextGen queues along with 'memory-targeted' product development, among data mining and other things) to the currently announced expansion totally flies in the face of this rumor. These are huge CapEx projects inconsistent with the impetus behind a fifth gate that, more importantly, won't be done until around 2017. So between 2017 and 2021 Disney will start building a fifth gate? Right...

This doesn't even take into account economics and guest habits that have gradually been changing over the past several years making the idea of a fifth gate even less viable. There's no sign that these habits are going to reverse themselves anytime soon.

So unless Jim Hill can now accurately predict the future of the economy AND vacationing habits on top of moves by Disney, he doesn't currently *know* that this is going to happen.

Good post. I'm wondering how guest habits have changed over the years? Are they spending less time at WDW, less vacation days, how they spend their days?

 

[Brian Noble]

I don't think that people will warm to the idea of a niche park for the rich in this economic environment.

Actually, the well-to-do are doing just fine in this economic environment, for the most part. They are not feeling the recession much at all---except on paper in the form of stock market values. That does act as something of a brake, but not much.

For an example of what's going on, there was a Wall Street Journal article recently that discussed P&G's marketing approach in the near term future: going after higher-end customers, and lower-end customers, but abandoning "the middle". Here is a link, though it might be behind their paywall:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...61943984924.html?mod=WSJ_qtoverview_wsjlatest

 

[Scuttle]

Lee is as Lee does and in the opinion of this Wildcat, he is a trusted source. As for Jim Hill. . . Saw some movie last night on IFC called Teeth. . .

Exactly Jim Hill has plenty of credible sources, but he just opens his mouth way too early it seems. I feel like he just doesn't wait and verify it long enough and instead writes a column about it. I think he broke the news of
C-3PO being in the ST2. He also called the Mine Train for like a year before it was announced in Jan. So he without a doubt has sources, but your right he runs his mouth too much. I will say though Jim Hill has a story about nearly everything from Disney and he is very interesting to listen to when he is on podcasts.

 

[menamechris]

There was a song in the 60's called "Is That All There Is?" I think many fans must think of this song when they hang on these rumors. Quite frankly, WDW is what it is - and this probably will be all that there is. Through the years there will be expansion, new attractions, repurposing of existing areas - but I highly doubt that a full 5th gate will be opened. Even in the unlikely event of a huge economic boom and people started vacationing 2 weeks at a time even - Disney has learned their lesson. They can't count of the good times sticking around forever - and they will have to keep the resort up and running 365 days a year - even during the tourism slumps that will happen again and again. It is wise for them to not bite off more than they can chew - and right now, I actually think their mouth is pretty full....

 

[epcotWSC]

They really don't need a 5th park. Expanding and replacing unpopular attractions in the current parks should be (and seems to be) the main priority. I wonder what the percentage of WDW guests who actually visit all 4 parks on a trip as it is. I'm sure if they took the average of the number of parks that people visit on a trip, it's closer to 2. Epcot and MK can truly be two day parks if you try and do everything and not rush.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Exactly Jim Hill has plenty of credible sources, but he just opens his mouth way too early it seems. I feel like he just doesn't wait and verify it long enough and instead writes a column about it. I think he broke the news of C-3PO being in the ST2. He also called the Mine Train for like a year before it was announced in Jan. So he without a doubt has sources, but your right he runs his mouth too much. I will say though Jim Hill has a story about nearly everything from Disney and he is very interesting to listen to when he is on podcasts.

I haven't talked to Jim about this article yet, as of right now I'm just as skeptical as everyone else on here simply because the entire concept seems so far fetched.

Having said that, Lee had a similar reaction to a sources information about Avatar, and I had a similar reaction to Jim telling us off the record about the Mine (I originally typed this "Mien", perhaps that would fit better in a European Village) Train. Stranger things have happened than Disney being illogical with their investments. I'm not anticipatin a 5th park before 2021, but after the Avatar announcement I feel I've been reconditioned to expect the unexpected.

As for the Star Tours C3PO info, that was another thing that Jim passed along to me and ask around about it. A senior Imagineer mentioned it offhand at an event that I believe was called the Marvelous Mechanized Magic Kingdom - Jim wasn't the only person in the room, he was just the only one paying attention. I posted something on these forums and it was dismissed, then when Tom Fitzgerald started posting articles on The Disney Parks Blog I asked about it in the comments, he clarified officially in a follow up post that C3PO would "wind up" as our pilot.

I don't know what Jim's source is on the 5th gate rumor, but he sits on more things than he releases. I'd really love to hear what else he has to say about the 5th Gate, and I'm sure that we'll probably get some clarity on this within the next few weeks.

 

[Lee]

I haven't talked to Jim about this article yet...

I have.
I don't think he and I are all that far apart. Lot of potential gray area.

 

[RSoxNo1]

I have.
I don't think he and I are all that far apart. Lot of potential gray area.

Is this akin to his talking about Carsland in DHS - nothing has been greenlit but the writing is on the wall?

 

[Lee]

Is this akin to his talking about Carsland in DHS - nothing has been greenlit but the writing is on the wall?

Not really, no.

 

[WDW1974]

I haven't talked to Jim about this article yet, as of right now I'm just as skeptical as everyone else on here simply because the entire concept seems so far fetched.

It is. 100% so.

And being that Jim has a DECADE to have people forget what he said (or even who he is/was), he was pretty safe at releasing said info in hopes of gaining attention in the fan community when they were gathered (like lemmings?) at a non-celebration at WDW!

He wrote a similar column today about Flamingo Crossings, which says absolutely nothing but is said in a way that he'll never be wrong.

Having said that, Lee had a similar reaction to a sources information about Avatar, and I had a similar reaction to Jim telling us off the record about the Mine (I originally typed this "Mien", perhaps that would fit better in a European Village) Train. Stranger things have happened than Disney being illogical with their investments. I'm not anticipatin a 5th park before 2021, but after the Avatar announcement I feel I've been reconditioned to expect the unexpected.

Avatar wasn't an unknown, though. Both Lee and I had heard it mentioned in passing (and we don't have the same sources/channels). And neither of us took it seriously because ... well, it really didn't (doesn't) make sense beyond being an ego-boost for Iger and Staggs ... and Cameron.

Not sure what Jim told you about the endlessly and breathlessly hyped little mine train ride, but it was talked about as far back as 2009.

As for the Star Tours C3PO info, that was another thing that Jim passed along to me and ask around about it. A senior Imagineer mentioned it offhand at an event that I believe was called the Marvelous Mechanized Magic Kingdom - Jim wasn't the only person in the room, he was just the only one paying attention. I posted something on these forums and it was dismissed, then when Tom Fitzgerald started posting articles on The Disney Parks Blog I asked about it in the comments, he clarified officially in a follow up post that C3PO would "wind up" as our pilot.

I don't know what Jim's source is on the 5th gate rumor, but he sits on more things than he releases. I'd really love to hear what else he has to say about the 5th Gate, and I'm sure that we'll probably get some clarity on this within the next few weeks.

I feel bad for Jim in a way ... he knows his Disney history ... and he used to have some excellent sources at Disney. ... And I'd much rather see Disney lavishing him with free trips and swag versus (better not name the people, but just look at who they are doing it for) since he has the ability to at least start an interesting story ... but I feel his time has passed and he is just trying to find relevance in a very fractured (by Disney's own design) fan community.

I suppose it's still better than watching him take potshots at Pixar every time you turned around as he was doing for a few years when his WDI sources dried up.

 

[WDW1974]

Is this akin to his talking about Carsland in DHS - nothing has been greenlit but the writing is on the wall?

Carsland, at least anything close to what you see rising in Anaheim, isn't coming to Florida.

It isn't.

And not only will I say it here (so if things change, no one will say I said otherwise or was wishy-washy), but I will kiss a fanboi if it actually happens (after buying him a Mickey ice cream bar!):ROFLOL:

 

[menamechris]

Carsland, at least anything close to what you see rising in Anaheim, isn't coming to Florida.

It isn't.

And not only will I say it here (so if things change, no one will say I said otherwise or was wishy-washy), but I will kiss a fanboi if it actually happens (after buying him a Mickey ice cream bar!):ROFLOL:

While I am indifferent as to if they clone Carsland for DHS, I think we can expect something happening there pretty soon. They cannot be pleased that attendance apparently dropped behind AK last year. That will only get worse as the years go on, I would assume. And no, I don't think an updated Star Tours and Fantasmic every night will get those numbers back up. I think management has to be facing the fact that the park is growing stale and needs something - and something sooner, rather than later...

 

[hrcollectibles]

Anything written by Jim Hill should come with a High sodium warning... Everything he says or does needs to be taken with a grain of salt...In his case mountains of salt.

 

[distopi68]

...

 

[Disaddict]

In May of 2023 Disney will have a new, smaller park, in Wisconsin. It will have everything that WDW and DL have combined.



See what I just did? I pulled a "J-Hill". Now, prove me wrong between now and 2023. LOL

 

[unkadug]

...

you just deleted half of your posts on this forum ! :lol:

 

[RSoxNo1]

Carsland, at least anything close to what you see rising in Anaheim, isn't coming to Florida.

It isn't.

And not only will I say it here (so if things change, no one will say I said otherwise or was wishy-washy), but I will kiss a fanboi if it actually happens (after buying him a Mickey ice cream bar!):ROFLOL:

Not it.