Construction between Contemporary and TTC

[dsinclair]

Considering all the available space on property, this seems highly unlikely, when extending the lagoon west per the original plans could result in more practical resort space.

How would this work? Are there images of what this would look like?

 

[Pick145]

How would this work? Are there images of what this would look like?

 

[dsinclair]

View attachment 571802

This is interesting, though it seems you'd lose the advantage of being on the monorail that the other location has, as well as walkability to TTC.

 

[SteveAZee]

It really depends on the foundation design in concert with what is above ground.

True. Given the apparent marginal build value of the area, I guess I was wondering if you get a lower total build cost per room by going wider instead of taller... certainly more concrete and more cost due to floors being less stacked, but in order to support a taller building with more downward pressure per square foot to compensate for... just wondering if wider is cheaper than taller. I'm not a structural engineer, but I'm familiar with physics.

 

[flynnibus]

True. Given the apparent marginal build value of the area, I guess I was wondering if you get a lower total build cost per room by going wider instead of taller... certainly more concrete and more cost due to floors being less stacked, but in order to support a taller building with more downward pressure per square foot to compensate for... just wondering if wider is cheaper than taller. I'm not a structural engineer, but I'm familiar with physics.

or you just increase the price charged for each room... problem solved

In the 'people will pay anything' price landscape we are in now, that's why I think a ultra-level place is possible.

 

[SteveAZee]

or you just increase the price charged for each room... problem solved

In the 'people will pay anything' price landscape we are in now, that's why I think a ultra-level place is possible.

Regardless of how much they could charge per room, Disney will still want to build it as cheaply as possible.

 

[GimpYancIent]

Why worry about a foundation? Build a resort that floats. There are concepts for future cities that float why not a resort! Hey it's Disney!

 

[lazyboy97o]

Isn't a tower more likely to have foundation issues? Just wondering if it's better to do a wider four story building than a skinnier 8 story building.

No, a tower is not more likely to have issues.

True. Given the apparent marginal build value of the area, I guess I was wondering if you get a lower total build cost per room by going wider instead of taller... certainly more concrete and more cost due to floors being less stacked, but in order to support a taller building with more downward pressure per square foot to compensate for... just wondering if wider is cheaper than taller. I'm not a structural engineer, but I'm familiar with physics.

In general it is almost always going to be cheaper to go out instead of up. This is why the Value Resorts are sprawling campuses and not compact towers. Cost is not just raw materials but also systems and assemblies. Building codes have limits on height and area based on how the building is to be built and then an additional set of high rise requirements are triggered by having floors more than 75’ above where firefighters can access on the ground.

 

[castlecake2.0]

Or the more obvious as no permits have been filed could be the same thing that happens both to that piece of land and on here every so many years. They go in to clean up the growth for monorail visibility/safety and other justifications with no construction planned. Remember that they have the old River Country plot cleared with grading started for the new DVC resort that is "yet to be started". Considering all the available space on property, this seems highly unlikely, when extending the lagoon west per the original plans could result in more practical resort space.

That’s what I was thinking as I drove by the other day. It’s more likely related to maintenance/landscaping and they’ve just updated the accès point to make it a little more safe after the incident a few months ago with the truck and monorail beam.

 

[SteveAZee]

No, a tower is not more likely to have issues.


In general it is almost always going to be cheaper to go out instead of up. This is why the Value Resorts are sprawling campuses and not compact towers. Cost is not just raw materials but also systems and assemblies. Building codes have limits on height and area based on how the building is to be built and then an additional set of high rise requirements are triggered by having floors more than 75’ above where firefighters can access on the ground.

Good points. I guess my limited experience is with residential construction where it seemed like two stories was cheaper than one and square was better than rectangle. I guess some of that is the property cost, but I assumed the rest is the cost of siding, roofing, foundation, etc.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Good points. I guess my limited experience is with residential construction where it seemed like two stories was cheaper than one and square was better than rectangle. I guess some of that is the property cost, but I assumed the rest is the cost of siding, roofing, foundation, etc.

Land can very much be a significant factor in total project costs. It’s the big reason development does up instead of out. Residential construction is a lot different than commercial construction and different building typologies are going to have different modules that create efficiencies. The big standard hotel mid rise that you see off the highway is about as efficient as hotels get.

 

[James Norrie]

Land can very much be a significant factor in total project costs. It’s the big reason development does up instead of out. Residential construction is a lot different than commercial construction and different building typologies are going to have different modules that create efficiencies. The big standard hotel mid rise that you see off the highway is about as efficient as hotels get.

Yes, but also consider the RCID 2020 Comprehensive Plan says they intend to increase Density on the limited suitable land they have left (~2700 acres). I'd expect to see more UP and less OUT, meaning values are staying as is and Deluxe/Ultra will be the new focus

 

[danlb_2000]

Yes, but also consider the RCID 2020 Comprehensive Plan says they intend to increase Density on the limited suitable land they have left (~2700 acres). I'd expect to see more UP and less OUT, meaning values are staying as is and Deluxe/Ultra will be the new focus

.. and we have already seen this twice now with Riviera and Grand Destino.

 

[GimpYancIent]

.. and we have already seen this twice now with Riviera and Grand Destino.

Both underwhelming!

 

[networkpro]

Why worry about a foundation? Build a resort that floats. There are concepts for future cities that float why not a resort! Hey it's Disney!

Hey it's Waterworld !

 

[GimpYancIent]

Hey it's Waterworld !

Does Disney own that I.P.? I thought Universal did. However, Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea Hmmmmmm? If you want to go with the Mediterranean vibe maybe an opulent Pompeii resort if not Atlantis?

 

[DisneySongbird]

World Drive sidewalks and/or a footpath from the Contemporary to points south, please.

It's honestly stunning to me that the Grand Floridian / Magic Kingdom pathway got built before any kind of walking solution between the Wilderness Lodge and anywhere else did. It doesn't get much cheaper than sidewalks as far as transportation improvements go and it looks like there's already a (CM-only?) stub sidewalk at the World Drive underpass which represents the only technically challenging part of this hypothetical route. Drop a couple crosswalks down and associated signaling or signage and it's good to go. Total slam dunk compared to carving a new pathway wholesale out of Grand Floridian.

Besides using it to walk between CR and WL at one's own convenience without needing to deal with a boat launch, the ~15 minute walk to TTC is likely time-neutral with boarding the monorail at CR and then transferring versus simply walking to TTC and boarding the Epcot monorail directly (disregarding relative security clearance times), and the return trip is almost certainly going to be faster than riding the Resort monorail on its full circuit. And speaking of circuits, there might be some fringe value in having a complete walkable loop path around the entirety of Seven Seas Lagoon.

 

[networkpro]

Does Disney own that I.P.? I thought Universal did. However, Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea Hmmmmmm? If you want to go with the Mediterranean vibe maybe an opulent Pompeii resort if not Atlantis?

20,000 Leagues under the Sea perhaps ? Now that would be a whale of a tale. It checks the boxes of the SJWs being anti war, non USA centric (except as the evil villains) , and plenty items to put in play like Vulcania and submarines.

 

[Master Yoda]

World Drive sidewalks and/or a footpath from the Contemporary to points south, please.

It's honestly stunning to me that the Grand Floridian / Magic Kingdom pathway got built before any kind of walking solution between the Wilderness Lodge and anywhere else did. It doesn't get much cheaper than sidewalks as far as transportation improvements go and it looks like there's already a (CM-only?) stub sidewalk at the World Drive underpass which represents the only technically challenging part of this hypothetical route. Drop a couple crosswalks down and associated signaling or signage and it's good to go. Total slam dunk compared to carving a new pathway wholesale out of Grand Floridian.

Besides using it to walk between CR and WL at one's own convenience without needing to deal with a boat launch, the ~15 minute walk to TTC is likely time-neutral with boarding the monorail at CR and then transferring versus simply walking to TTC and boarding the Epcot monorail directly (disregarding relative security clearance times), and the return trip is almost certainly going to be faster than riding the Resort monorail on its full circuit. And speaking of circuits, there might be some fringe value in having a complete walkable loop path around the entirety of Seven Seas Lagoon.

Disney seems rather hesitant to have guests walking in close proximity to traffic and the routes you suggested do just that. I think the last time they built sidewalks along a regularly traveled road was when they built the CM pathways along W Buena Vista between BB and the All Stars in the mid 90's

 

[GimpYancIent]

20,000 Leagues under the Sea perhaps ? Now that would be a whale of a tale. It checks the boxes of the SJWs being anti war, non USA centric (except as the evil villains) , and plenty items to put in play like Vulcania and submarines.

In full disclosure Disney does own the I.P. for 20,000 Leagues under the sea and even had a ride at MK 1971 - 1994! It would be quite creative for a Deluxe Resort to be developed with a 20,000 Leagues under the sea theme. Could you imagine Nautilus water taxis to and from MK!