Coronavirus and Walt Disney World general discussion

[Tom P.]

It's not a fair point. The vaccines work as they are supposed to: around 90% effective, not 100%. Also, obviously, not everyone has been vaccinated, and we are supposedly not allowed to ask for proof of vaccination. The argument is circular, the conclusion, erroneous.

It doesn't. There is no "good" here. There is only new bad. Regardless of whether or not you know it, we already know it: the local mandates take the heat off the local businesses.

Also, masks have zero to do with "freedom."

100% is not the goal. 100% has never been the goal. 100% will never be the goal. Because 100% is unattainable.

Also, if you had the choice to wear a mask or not, and then an executive order or law requires you to now wear a mask, that is a degree of freedom that has been legally restricted. That's just a fact. Now, it might be a minor restriction, it might be an insignificant restriction, and it might be a necessary restriction. But it is still, in fact, a restriction of a freedom.

 

[GhostHost1000]

I’m not sure what that means.

15 cases of blood clots were possibly linked to the JnJ vaccine. 3 people died. 15 out of almost 9,000,000 doses means 99.9998% did not have blood clot issues, 99.99997% of people who got that vaccine didn’t die from a blood clot after. Statistically speaking that rounds to 100% in both cases.

Isn’t that close to the covid survival rate as well?

 

[CaptainAmerica]

Isn’t that close to the covid survival rate as well?

No. It is thousands of times better than the COVID survival rate.

 

[jinx8402]

Isn’t that close to the covid survival rate as well?

Nope. Using worldometers for know cases and deaths, we are at about a 98.2 survival rate. That isn't statistically close to each other.

 

[Sorcerer Mickey]

Isn’t that close to the covid survival rate as well?

others have responded to this point already, but I also wanted to add that death is not the only unfavorable conclusion to a COVID diagnosis. Don’t forget “long COVID”, lung damage, etc.

 

[seascape]

I made it back from Florida. I will start by saying I was wrong and we didn't make it to single digits nationally by May 1. However, today the NY Times is reporting the US is fown to 13 per 100,00 and Florida finally broke 20 and is at 19. Plus, being a NJ resident, I am glad that my state is finally down to the National average of 13 and below NY's 14. As for the breakdown of States only 7 are over 20 and 11 are in single digits. Progress is continuing but slowing because of the drop in new vaccinations. We should be doing better but slow progress is better than none.

Now, I also and glad to report that I saw amost everyone at WDW following the mask requirement even if they were a little lax in keeping the 6 foot social distancing but no one ever came within 3 feet.

 

[donaldtoo]

others have responded to this point already, but I also wanted to add that death is not the only unfavorable conclusion to a COVID diagnosis. Don’t forget “long COVID”, lung damage, etc.

Yep, for some reason, too many folks don’t factor it all in.
HUBS (Head Up Butt Syndrome) is a real problem...

 

[corsairk09]

Ok all you elitists and Covid deniers , changing the subject back to Disney. We went last September and most of the mitigation really didn’t bother us in fact we had a wonderful trip. The hardest part of the trip for us was the fact that there were no trams from the ticket station back to the parking lot. Maybe it shouldn’t have been a big deal but I was pregnant we had two little kids and that asphalt is hot!! Is there any word or rumors or ideas if the trams are coming back?

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Being forced to cover your face is absolutely an affront one's freedom.

Not during a pandemic, it's not.

 

[GaBoy]

Fernandina Florida report. Went downtown after Ft Clinch shell picking yesterday. Crammed. No parking. No masking in site. Ate lunch with the family at a restaurant on the waterfront. Tables are not distanced, no servers or patrons in masks. We stopped at Dunkin to get the girls a sprinkle doughnut and one woman was wearing a mask but dropped it to talk to us... then back on. Point here is, this is what I'm seeing on the fringes and I assume will creep in toward more urban areas. We were all vaccinated so we only remarked about it this morning when it dawned on us. The vaccination has removed our awareness of measures in places and it is almost an inverse reality where we are starting to notice where measures are enforced rather than where they have been dropped. We didn't really think about it till we mentioned it at breakfast this morning. In all honesty we only really avoided people or places for the first few months when this thing hit hard last Spring, then had to get back out, with measures of course.

 

[DisneyFan32]

 

[ImperfectPixie]

Thanks for sharing - this is good news!

 

[ParentsOf4]

If any RN is skeptical, they need to lose their license.

Or we recognize that medical professionals and scientists do not agree 100% on everything.

Science is a never-ending investigation into the unknown. Science is learning that what we today as "fact" sometimes is wrong. It happens more often than you think.

I believe the vaccines are safe for the overwhelming majority. I have taken both doses, as have all my children.

But I'm not going to punish someone for having a different opinion.

No vaccine is 100% risk-free. Large numbers have had documented adverse reactions to this vaccine, especially the second dose.

I believe the benefits of getting vaccinated far outweigh the risks and I encourage everyone to get vaccinated.

But I'm not going to punish anyone who decides not to.

Just like I'm not going to punish anyone who insists on wearing masks in situations where the science tells us that masks are not needed.

"Follow the science" cuts both ways.

We could all learn to be a little more tolerant of one another.

 

[mmascari]

Dead or alive once vaccinated or naturally infected you aren’t likely to spread covid

Apparently, the vaccine protects better and lasts longer than natural immunity from having been infected.

Dead seems the most foolproof. You’re not going to catch COVID (again) after death. You’ll contact very few people and very quickly be unable to infect anyone, much better than Ebola post death.

I’m confident the breakthrough rate for catching COVID after death is lower than the vaccine rate.

The death hesitancy rate is extremely high though, and the anti-death movement is very mainstream.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Or we recognize that medical professionals and scientists do not agree 100% on everything.

Science is a never-ending investigation into the unknown. Science is learning that what we today as "fact" sometimes is wrong. It happens more often than you think.

I believe the vaccines are safe for the overwhelming majority. I have taken both doses, as have all my children.

But I'm not going to punish someone for having a different opinion.

No vaccine is 100% risk-free. Large numbers have had documented adverse reactions to this vaccine, especially the second dose.

I believe the benefits of getting vaccinated far outweigh the risks and I encourage everyone to get vaccinated.

But I'm not going to punish anyone who decides not to.

Just like I'm not going to punish anyone who insists on wearing masks in situations where the science tells us that masks are not needed.

"Follow the science" cuts both ways.

We could all learn to be a little more tolerant of one another.

Lies are not a difference of opinion. We have awful diseases returning to this country because we’ve labeled lies and misinformation as opinions to be respected. A person wearing a mask doesn’t hurt anyone else. The decline in vaccinations does.

 

[mmascari]

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2105000

Breakthrough study of 417 people. 2 cases, everyone fine, the vaccine works great. But this is why we want spread low, not just some vaccinated in the middle of large spread. Low spread would make even this less likely as there would just be less vaccinated and infectious interactions.

From the study, 1 lost her smell for a short time:

On March 10 (19 days after she received the second vaccine dose), a sore throat, congestion, and headache developed, and she tested positive for SARS-CoV-2 RNA at Rockefeller University later that day. On March 11, she lost her sense of smell. Her symptoms gradually resolved over a 1-week period.

 

[JD80]

Being forced to cover your face is absolutely an affront one's freedom.

No offense this is an idiotic statement.

You are "forced" to wear a seatbelt when in a vehicle.
You are "forced" to wear hardhats and safety glass when on certain job sites.
You are "forced" to get certain vaccines before going to school as a child.
You are "forced" to pay sales tax when purchasing something.
You are "forced" to drive on a certain side of the road.
You are "forced" to drive a certain speed on a road.
You are "forced" to wear clothing when entering a store.
You are "forced" register your vehicle.
You are "forced" to require a license when operating a vehicle.

I mean, we live in a society. You are "forced" to do a lot of things for the relatively safety for you and those around you.

 

[ParentsOf4]

Lies are not a difference of opinion. We have awful diseases returning to this country because we’ve labeled lies and misinformation as opinions to be respected. A person wearing a mask doesn’t hurt anyone else. The decline in vaccinations does.

What lie?

The previous poster said that an RN was “skeptical.”

In normal times, skepticism is a healthy aspect of science.

I’m all for presenting a counter argument to bad science (i.e. lies), and there is plenty of that going around right now. There is a group who are just making stuff up and it’s bad for everyone.

But a lot of you are ready to hang someone you’ve never met because they are “skeptical”.

Shame on you.

 

[ImperfectPixie]

What lie?

The previous poster said that an RN was “skeptical.”

In normal times, skepticism is a healthy aspect of science.

I’m all for presenting a counter argument to bad science (i.e. lies), and there is plenty of that going around right now. There is a group who are just making stuff up and it’s bad for everyone.

But a lot of you are ready to hang someone you’ve never met because they are “skeptical”.

Shame on you.

I think you might be misunderstanding him. That "skeptical" person wouldn't likely be skeptical to begin with if the anti-vaxxer (vaccines in general) lies hadn't become so pervasive.

 

[MrMcDuck]

I don't really see Incomudro's comment as an idiotic statement. It's approaching the basic question from a different point of view. And while I'm very pro-mask, I start with a similar point of view. Forcing people to cover their nose and mouth, without which we cannot take in air, and which can cause great distress in some people, is a very serious matter and is a denial of a very fundamental freedom and thus it can only be justified by an overwhelmingly good reason and only for as long as that reason exists. Where I disagree with anti-maskers is that I think this pandemic is just such a reason. But we are soon coming to that point where masks can no longer be justified.