Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts IV

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Soarin' Over Pgh

Well-Known Member
What on earth...I don't even...


Another one just got magic banded into the ignore box. Too much nonsense and hen pecking for my liking. Over it.

@BrianLo thank you for your insight on the state of DLP and its sad studios park. How long were you there? Did you stay on property? How's the crowd levels? And did you take any pictures to share with us? :) what's the merchandise looking like right now?
 

Tim_4

Well-Known Member
Simply saying that "Disney is a business too" is almost like giving them a free pass because they have to make a profit.

They'll make a profit (probably a lot more than they're making now) if they go back to their core principles of show quality and efficiency about all else. Give the guests a REASON to visit the parks, instead of trying to find out how to cut costs and get more from the guests who are ALREADY visiting.
That's a much more reasonable position. You get much further when you criticize the STRATEGY the company uses to generate profit than you do by criticising the profit motive in the first place.
 

nytimez

Well-Known Member
Simply saying that "Disney is a business too" is almost like giving them a free pass because they have to make a profit.

They'll make a profit (probably a lot more than they're making now) if they go back to their core principles of show quality and efficiency about all else. Give the guests a REASON to visit the parks, instead of trying to find out how to cut costs and get more from the guests who are ALREADY visiting.

Right. It's the difference between "how can we create something awesome that people will pay for" versus "how can we squeeze more money out of our customers?"
 

devoy1701

Well-Known Member
That's a much more reasonable position. You get much further when you criticize the STRATEGY the company uses to generate profit than you do by criticising the profit motive in the first place.

I think it's how you chose to read my first comment. I did not criticize being motivated by profit, but chasing the "bottom line" as in putting profit before all else (and I would criticize any company who exclusively focuses on this). Though I will agree my next response was much more explanatory.
 

wdisney9000

Truindenashendubapreser
Premium Member
That is another funny thing. Some many people today seem to know with 100% certainty, what the founding fathers were thinking and the manner in which we are currently doing things does not fall in line with the Founding Fathers wishes. How can we possibly know this? There can be multiple interpretations of the written word, they are almost always going to be swayed by your own beliefs. That said, one can almost pigeon hole any Founding Father stance to meet their own.

Now, I understand Gru's minions are yellow, and the evil minions are purple. What color are Spirits minions?
It is just as amusing to think that some people do not realize that the Founding Fathers lived in a much more oppressive time than we currently do. They saw first hand how out of control tyranny can get when left unchecked. They FOUGHT for the freedoms we enjoy today and took painstaking measures to assure those freedoms could not be taken away. They did not pass laws at 4 am while Congress was on break or slip ear marks into a bill because a lobbyist bribed them to do so, or pass 10,000 page health care laws without letting anyone read them. (thanks Pelosi) Those are the exact type of evils our Founding Fathers exposed and eliminated.

Evil does not change its agenda over time, it just wears a different mask to hide amongst us and infiltrate our system. The men and woman running this country today should be ASHAMED of themselves for allowing tyranny to wiggle its way back into our system. The Founding Fathers were wise enough to recognize this could happen one day and put simple laws into place (Bill of Rights) that would protect our freedoms. They knew congress could not be trusted with our God given rights. The framers of the constitution had a deep distrust of Government and the laws they put into place should be a constant reminder of that. The argument that our Founding Fathers lived in a different era and that we couldnt possibly know the manner in which they meant these very SIMPLE laws to be applied is pure hog wash. They created these laws intentionally to withstand time and they are simple truths of good over evil. A man/woman chooses to be good or evil, its that simple. Thomas Jefferson stated it PERFECTLY: "When then the people fear the government there is tyranny, when the government fears the people there is liberty."
 

truecoat

Well-Known Member
Some of you may not have heard of Holiday World but it's a small family theme park in southern Indiana. I have never been there myself but I bet they have a lot of happy people and don't have to deal with the headaches Disney has created for itself. Admission includes both the theme and water park. They have free parking, free sunscreen and yes, free soda. My guess is that these simple gestures go along ways towards customer satisfaction.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Some of you may not have heard of Holiday World but it's a small family theme park in southern Indiana. I have never been there myself but I bet they have a lot of happy people and don't have to deal with the headaches Disney has created for itself. Admission includes both the theme and water park. They have free parking, free sunscreen and yes, free soda. My guess is that these simple gestures go along ways towards customer satisfaction.
They also have HoliCash, a prepaid debit system that guests can access via gift cards or wristbands.
 

George

Liker of Things
Premium Member
Some of you may not have heard of Holiday World but it's a small family theme park in southern Indiana. I have never been there myself but I bet they have a lot of happy people and don't have to deal with the headaches Disney has created for itself. Admission includes both the theme and water park. They have free parking, free sunscreen and yes, free soda. My guess is that these simple gestures go along ways towards customer satisfaction.

I've been. Everything you say is true. The first time I went I was actually amazed at how many soda (Pepsi products) kiosks there were around the park. Three great wooden coasters and a solid selection of supporting attractions...
 

George

Liker of Things
Premium Member
They also have HoliCash, a prepaid debit system that guests can access via gift cards or wristbands.

Yep. I had forgotten this since we drive down for the day from time to time and I have never used it (opted out in Disney speak).
 

71jason

Well-Known Member
Some of you may not have heard of Holiday World but it's a small family theme park in southern Indiana. I have never been there myself but I bet they have a lot of happy people and don't have to deal with the headaches Disney has created for itself. Admission includes both the theme and water park. They have free parking, free sunscreen and yes, free soda. My guess is that these simple gestures go along ways towards customer satisfaction.

They found a way to make money with a park giving away free parking, sunscreen and soda.

TDO seemingly can't figure out how to make money with a Brazil pavilion consisting of an overpriced restaurant and overpriced gift shops that takes a $90 ticket (+$15 to park) to get into.

The point of any business is to make money. But clearly you have MBAs running hotels and theme parks in Orlando that just don't get how those industries work.
 

COProgressFan

Well-Known Member
Probably...but I get the general feeling that lower level shift managers aren't really paid much mind in the hierarchy, and higher level middle managers (like the ones who were here today for the POFQ roll out), don't really care. It was like when I went to Coral Reef...I spent way too long in restaurants to pull punches, so I tend not to complain.
...
I assume that this would have upset her, and accomplished nothing. If the management above her doesn't care that her shifts are run so poorly, then any detailed observations from a mere "guest" will accomplish nothing.

You make a good point here. Often, people on the boards point out that if a guest has a problem then they should complain. But frankly, does Disney really care? If they did care, the beverage bar wouldn't be so dirty in the first place!

I guess my point is, is it really guests' job to tell Disney how to run their business? If they really can't get a handle on basic things like cleaning food areas, cleaning vomit from hotel rooms (see My Magic reports thread -- yuck), or maintaining attractions, then I'm not sure a few guests complaining will really help them. It doesn't take a genius to figure out how to do these basic items. They just simply don't care enough to address it. It's a shame.
 

DougK

Well-Known Member
If you ask they will empty out the minibar fridge and you use it for yourself. I always do this when we stay at the UNI hotels.

Wow I did not know that! Thanks! I will ask them to do that next time we stay there, which will be early next year - because I don't stay at only Disney hotels any more. I like the idea of a BETTER hotel for LESS money!
 

Funmeister

Well-Known Member
Some of you may not have heard of Holiday World but it's a small family theme park in southern Indiana. I have never been there myself but I bet they have a lot of happy people and don't have to deal with the headaches Disney has created for itself. Admission includes both the theme and water park. They have free parking, free sunscreen and yes, free soda. My guess is that these simple gestures go along ways towards customer satisfaction.

From what I hear there is a HUGE family fallout after one of the owners died and is the center of a nasty custody battle.
 

CDavid

Well-Known Member
I don't think that's true.

Let me ask you, how are shareholders pleased?

Shareholders would often be quite pleased at high returns generated in a manner which is not in the long term interest of the company, which can indeed be a problem. If you see Disney solely as a business investment, and give no thought to its legacy or reputation, then the stock price and profit are all that matter to you.

Want to dramatically raise profits this year, without regard for the future? Mercedes or Cadillac could make its cars like a cheap Kia, Rolex could make its watches like the $15 ones at Wal-Mart, and The Four Seasons could build its hotels more like a Motel6. There's a reason they don't.
 

MattM

Well-Known Member
Shareholders would often be quite pleased at high returns generated in a manner which is not in the long term interest of the company, which can indeed be a problem. If you see Disney solely as a business investment, and give no thought to its legacy or reputation, then the stock price and profit are all that matter to you.

Want to dramatically raise profits this year, without regard for the future? Mercedes or Cadillac could make its cars like a cheap Kia, Rolex could make its watches like the $15 ones at Wal-Mart, and The Four Seasons could build its hotels more like a Motel6. There's a reason they don't.

Agree with the 2nd paragraph more than the first. Institutional investors (mutual funds, etc) tend to be the largest holders of a company's stock, save for the CEO and members of the founding family. Vanguard, T. Rowe Price, Blackrock, Fidelity and the likes tend to be more long term investors when they accumulate stock. So they're not so much interested on short term fluctuations that "Wall Street" gets accused of here. Anyway, what I was getting at, shareholders are pleased when companies make money. How do they make money? Well largely by their product being consumed. If their products stop being consumed, then revenues stop coming in. Shareholders are not happy about that (missing a quarter is one thing, missing multiple consecutive quarters is another).

And I get what you're saying about Mercedes v Kia, etc, but there is a reason the lower products exist, and that is because there is a huge market for it. If I make the same amount of money as you with less money invested, then who is the real winner?
 

GiveMeTheMusic

Well-Known Member
Nope. Good points, all. I suppose I added the extra's in the reply to you since that is where I was at, at the time. Still, to some conspiracy theorists on this site, it would seem that Disney and evidently the government are doing what they do strictly to get their jollies and not with any 'good' in mind. To those they simply seem to believe we can all just co-exist with all of of liberties intact. I wonder, if we moved all the aircraft out to Davis-Monthan, mothballed all tanks, closed down military bases here and abroad, and shuttered the 'war machine' how things would turn out. I am assuming we would hear a collective hallelujah from the left

Let's just say some comments on here must be made from rose colored glasses. Sure there are the pixie dust huffers but it also seem like there are a bunch of whiners. Some people's jobs are to work for the defense of this country and everyone in it, even those that complain about it day after day, after day. Reminds me of the court scene in "A Few Good Men." Paraphrasing, "you sleep under the blanket of protection the military provides and then you question the manner in which it is provided." If you think it is scary now. . .

With all due respect, you and those who think like you, sir or madame, are the greatest kind of danger a free society can face. Your utter incomprehension of history and the cycles of government is self-evident.

Who is our military, full of brave men and women whom I respect in the utmost way, protecting us from? Who? Seriously, I'm curious. I haven't heard a name in quite some time, because supposedly they killed that bin Laden guy awhile back (despite the fact that experts assert he died of illness sometime in 2002 or 2003 - too bad he was buried AT SEA so we'll never find out for sure).

You can say, well, terrorists of course! Islamic extremists who want us all dead! They're gonna come over here and hijack our planes and blow up our buildings and maim and kill like their holy book tells them to! Their compulsion can't be stopped and we're all in mortal danger!

Have you ever stopped to wonder why Islamic extremists don't like 'murica? Because I have. I thought, what do I, some podunk 'murican across the world, have to do with these people? Why do they care what I do or don't do? (Hint: do some historical research on that region, and the look up "blowback")

Questioning the motivation is where knowledge begins. Questioning the government (and this stuff is not exclusive to one party - Bush and Obama have pulled the exact same crap) is the start of understanding. Follow the chain of events:

- Clinton arms bin Laden and Al Qaeda operatives to assist in American efforts in the Middle East
- a group of extremists arrive in America, publicly register for flight school and prepare in broad daylight
- 9/11 attack happens, government response during and after attack is nil, presidential reaction is hours after the fact
- bin Laden claims responsibility for 9/11 attack on US soil
- bin Laden is now Public Enemy No. 1, presumably manhunt ensues
- pre-written Patriot Act (what a name!) is pulled out the drawer and hastily passed, giving the government unprecedented and unconstitutional powers
- Department of Homeland Security is formed, a multi-trillion dollar agency that will eventually create its own military force and become one of the top domestic purchasers of ammo
- American people are angry and confused. To form a target, the Afghanistan and more importantly, Iraq wars are commenced
- Despite no obvious ties to bin Laden or 9/11, the Iraq war is unilaterally declared and Saddam Hussein is toppled
- Bush stands in front of a Mission Accomplished banner, and announces "Mission accomplished"
- Thousands more American soldiers and innocent Iraqi civilians continue to die despite said accomplishment
- The introduction of the TSA shortly after 9/11 makes airline travel a PITA as mostly inept employees perform glorified bag checks
- Americans grow tired of the war effort in Iraq/Afghanistan (the graveyard of nations, as it has been so aptly called) as it becomes apparent that "winning" is not an option
- Damning evidence of military contractors, such as Halliburton, suggests a far more corrupt vision of the reasons for declaring war. The ties between high-ranking officials and companies like Halliburton (why, Dick Cheney for example) ALMOST make it seem like war was initiated to line pockets
- Leaked documents show possible ways to ignite war with Iran as considered by the Bush-Cheney administration, including a false flag operation in which American soldiers would be killed while posing as Iranians to spark anger toward that nation and justify an invasion
- Obama runs on a platform of peace and change, trumpets devotion to civil liberties as his Constitutional law background would indicate
- McCain loses by a long shot, and Obama is inaugurated
- TSA starts to get serious: agents are now clothed in police-style uniforms with shiny boots and epaulets. Invasive and untested "o scanners" are purchased in bulk from a company run by former DHS head, Michael Chertoff. What a coincidence!
- Military defense budgets continue to rise exponentially, despite a supposed decrease in operations in Iraq and Afghanistan
- Deep into his first term, Obama shows no sign of winding down war operations or putting any kind of stop to unconstitutional practices as outlined in the Patriot Act. By the end of term, he has enshrined indefinite detention of American citizens without trial into law
- In 11 years, no Islamic extremists have attacked the United States on its soil. The FBI claims to have foiled several plots; the ones they choose to reveal in the public are quickly found to have been non-starters in the first place or outright fraudulent
- Snowden's leaks confirm what anyone who was paying attention already knew: our government has used a terrorist attack on 9/11/2001 to justify complete destruction of privacy for American citizens and citizens of other countries, with draconian abilities to read, track, intercept and wiretap all communications, including but not limited to Facebook, email, cell phone calls, Skype and real-time internet browsing.
- The DHS is now a multi-headed behemoth capable of enacting martial law at the drop of a hat in several of the nation's biggest cities. Military drills now occur within the country, some in the presence of civilians, as new "secret" bases have popped up, like the one on an old car dealership lot outside Las Vegas
- The leaders of the NSA and FBI have now repeatedly lied to Congress under oath about their surveillance operations. Despite the harsh consequences for baseball players who have lied under oath about steroid use, these men are still in positions in power and have experienced no repercussions whatsoever
- Despite an incredible tax base, our government is trillions of dollars in debt with no hope of ever emerging. We can thank Dick Cheney for getting that ball rolling ("deficits don't matter") and Obama for keeping it up
- Our men and women continue to die in combat to people who for the most part can't pitch a tent, let alone arrange transportation to America to inflict harm
- Our President wants to involve us in Syria's civil war, supporting and arming rebels who are affiliated with Al Qaeda and engage in cannibalism, rape and other war crimes

Are you seeing a progression? It's just incredible. War is a drug our government and its contractors are hooked on. It's not some noble effort to keep us safe; it's a profit machine and the lives of our military are callously disregarded, as is their care after they return home. To say otherwise indicates a mental illness beyond denial and insults the brave who have died in the process.

Our Constitution expressly forbids the vast majority of our federal government's operations, yet the American populace believes them to be working on our behalf and for our good. I am not so trusting, and that's because I can see the man behind the curtain. Money makes the world go around, not an altruistic sense of duty.

The government doesn't deserve our trust; it hasn't earned our trust. The NSA spies on American citizens. The DHS is armed to the hilt and outfitting local PDs with military grade weapons and vehicles, while FEMA orders masses of plastic coffins and sets up "detention" camps around the country, you know, just in case.

Who exactly is the enemy now?

You may say, I have nothing to hide! Let them read my stupid Facebook posts and follow me around while I browse Amazon, eBay and sites, I'm just an average nobody!

This is the most dangerous mindset to have. Information can be cobbled and take piecemeal, and then cobbled together to paint you as a horrible person, a dangerous possible terrorist, even though you're as innocent as apple pie. Information is a weapon - why do you think Disney has approved such a bloated budget for NGE? They must think the data it will yield is quite valuable, and they are correct.

Our Constitution and its Bill of Rights are brilliantly framed, and we will disintegrate as a nation if we don't stick to it. It's already happening.

"First they came for the communists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

Then they came for the socialists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists,
and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

Then they came for me,
and there was no one left to speak for me."

The question remains, who's the enemy now?

If you don't know, you're not paying attention.
 

BrianLo

Well-Known Member
@BrianLo thank you for your insight on the state of DLP and its sad studios park. How long were you there? Did you stay on property? How's the crowd levels? And did you take any pictures to share with us? :) what's the merchandise looking like right now?

Just a single day 10-11 (which I admit is not long enough with the crowd levels), I might have preferred two days if only to take our time a little bit more, but my companions were sufficiently crippled by Space Mountain 2.0.

DLP was super packed, the studios on the other hand were relatively light on crowds, apart from long waits for Crush everything else was reasonable.

Of course I towed around my DSLR all day but didn't charge it, I have great pictures from TDL/TDS/HKDL and they are all respectively in much better shape.

Merch does not seem to overlap as much as WDW/DL does, but there was some similar stuff and a good chunk of attraction specific merch still. A million times better than TDL/TDS though, at least for North American tastes. ;)
 
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