News Zootopia and Moana Blue Sky concepts for Disney's Animal Kingdom

[BlakeW39]

This is what I've said ad nauseum.

Of course IP helps with marketing, and it can also prop up a mediocre attraction busy because of connection to the IP (see Frozen Ever After, although there are limits -- the Nemo IP hasn't really helped that ride). I understand why Disney wants to use it from a business perspective.

But from an overall design standpoint and in terms of creating the best possible attractions, being forced to use a pretty small library of IP (it's not like ALL Disney IP is truly available -- management isn't going to greenlight something big based on a minor/unpopular IP because it defeats the purpose of using preexisting IP) really constrains what can be done.

I mean I see why Disney likes IP so much from a marketing standpoint, but I don't know if I am in full agreement that an IP mandate is the obvious economic decision that some people on this board have made it out to be. Surely the most successful movie and character IPs will sell more merchandise than most park specific IPs will (see Tiana vs Splash, unfortunately), but the number of IPs that have that much of a marketing advantage over original park specific IPs has to be really small. So surely Disney can't rely solely on those for new lands ans attractions. Especially since the four parks rely on lands and attractions with diverse settings and themes, something that is not the case with Disney's library of hyper-popular IPs. I mean will TRON really sell all that much merchandise?

Now combine this fact with knowledge that Disney's film and streaming divisions aren't actively creating very much new IP, mostly remaking and adapting things that already exist and often with little success (from both a financial and especially a critical standpoint) and surely Disney's current business model can't be viable for that much longer.

It can also not be understated how detrimental it is for the artistic quality of the parks that Disney mandates every single land and attraction they build must be based on some already established film IP or character tie-in. There is obvious value to creative freedom in any art form, theme parks included, and outlawing creation in all its forms simply cannot yield the best artistic results for Disney's theme parks. Sure, various film IPs can fit in the parks to varying degrees, but they'll never be an optimal choice. An attraction designed specifically to supplement a park as best as possible, or a land based on themes of the park itself rather than the themes of some popular movie or TV show, using artistic languages not from the park itself but from some completely unrelated popular movie or TV show, will more times than not be superior to the already existing film/television IP that is determined to "fit" in the park, which will always just be a matter of "close enough."

 

[Magenta Panther]

Never seen this before, this is awesome. Will always be sad this never happened, a volcano mountain attraction in Adventureland would be *chefs kiss*.

I’m a huge Indy fan and agree with you Indy would be great as a land.

I know it’s inevitable, that Muppet Vision will go the way of the dodo. The muppets are excellent though, and I really hope they find a permanent more stable area within DHS. That muppet movie ride would have been great. They should be adding muppet things not removing.

Well, I don't know. How do we know that Indy will be evergreen? After all, many assumed that Star Wars would be, but it looks like the movie franchise is winding down. And this new Indy movie will reportedly be the last. So maybe a new area with a new theme specific to WDW would be a better idea. Bring back Fire Mountain!

As for adding more Muppets, nah. Dead franchise. They were kicked out of Disneyland and nobody shed a tear. I'd rather see a Roger Rabbit attraction as a replacement for the puppet theater. Disneyland has Roger, we don't. All we have is a broken window and a billboard. And Roger deserves a revival. He's the addition the DHS park needs, IMO. A 3D/4D movie starring Roger would be epic!

 

[999th Happy Haunt]

Well, I don't know. How do we know that Indy will be evergreen? After all, many assumed that Star Wars would be, but it looks like the movie franchise is winding down. And this new Indy movie will reportedly be the last. So maybe a new area with a new theme specific to WDW would be a better idea. Bring back Fire Mountain!

As for adding more Muppets, nah. Dead franchise. They were kicked out of Disneyland and nobody shed a tear. I'd rather see a Roger Rabbit attraction as a replacement for the puppet theater. Disneyland has Roger, we don't. All we have is a broken window and a billboard. And Roger deserves a revival. He's the addition the DHS park needs, IMO. A 3D/4D movie starring Roger would be epic!

No way you’re suggesting Indiana Jones and Star Wars are irrelevant franchises but a new Roger Rabbit attraction is what the park needs.

 

[Brer Panther]

being forced to use a pretty small library of IP (it's not like ALL Disney IP is truly available -- management isn't going to greenlight something big based on a minor/unpopular IP because it defeats the purpose of using preexisting IP) really constrains what can be done.

Exactly! It always has to be an IP that's popular right now. That's probably the reason why they're choosing Moana for Animal Kingdom over something like The Jungle Book or Tarzan.

 

[Elijah Abrams]

This whole Zootopia/Moana in AK project, along with other future IP-related park projects will, I bet, be forgotten once Iger leaves Disney and is replaced with someone else or two like Dana Walden and Alan Bergman.

 

[Magenta Panther]

No way you’re suggesting Indiana Jones and Star Wars are irrelevant franchises but a new Roger Rabbit attraction is what the park needs.

Fair enough. But WDW already has Indy. It already has Star Wars. Why does it need more of those IPs? At least Roger Rabbit would be something fresh for WDW. Or perhaps Zootopia could be an alternative, since some people object to that IP being in Animal Kingdom.

 

[KingMickey13]

I think it’s unlikely but possible that that Zootopia/Moana could fit in Animal Kingdom. I wouldn’t say that the Avatar IP really fit AK, but Pandora is amazing and definitely dies.

 

[BlakeW39]

This whole Zootopia/Moana in AK project, along with other future IP-related park projects will, I bet, be forgotten once Iger leaves Disney and is replaced with someone else or two like Dana Walden and Alan Bergman.

While I appreciate your optimism, let's not be so hasty. I'd be pretty shocked if when Iger left, the IP mandate left with him. Sure, I'd wager there are other ways to sell merchandise and create successful theme parks and attractions, but the financial appeal for cheap character tie-ins and 'ride the movies' lands is undeniable.

 

[neo999955]

While I appreciate your optimism, let's not be so hasty. I'd be pretty shocked if when Iger left, the IP mandate left with him. Sure, I'd wager there are other ways to sell merchandise and create successful theme parks and attractions, but the financial appeal for cheap character tie-ins and 'ride the movies' lands is undeniable.

Yeah, I don't think there's really much chance for that to ever change. I do think the pendulum can swing back and there could be some non-IP developments occasionally - but I wouldn't get my hopes up on that either. Personally, I don't mind IP based rides, so long as they are done well and reasonably fit the location.

 

[EPCOT-O.G.]

There are so many IPs that better fit the parks than Zootopia in Animal Kingdom.

I don’t disagree, but how many of those properties made a billion and is hugely popular in China?

 

[EPCOT-O.G.]

Yeah, I don't think there's really much chance for that to ever change. I do think the pendulum can swing back and there could be some non-IP developments occasionally - but I wouldn't get my hopes up on that either. Personally, I don't mind IP based rides, so long as they are done well and reasonably fit the location.

This is the same reason we have so many sequels and so little original films. Why drop $100M on a new, unproven commodity when they could just make a surer bet on a known IP.

If you’re WDI, it’s tough to justify the huge budgets when they can’t rely on a positive reception to the new story/characters and attendant merch sales.

 

[BlakeW39]

Yeah, I don't think there's really much chance for that to ever change. I do think the pendulum can swing back and there could be some non-IP developments occasionally - but I wouldn't get my hopes up on that either. Personally, I don't mind IP based rides, so long as they are done well and reasonably fit the location.

It depends. The IP mandate is a symptom of a larger problem. Modern Disney is just obsessed with franchises and IP. That doesn't just go for parks. Disney creates very little these days, everything is sequels, tie-ins, spin-offs and adaptations. Until that mindset is gone, parks will follow suit. However because that business strategy isn't sustainable, I do think parks will eventually receive some more creative freedom (than they have now). I just don't think that will come with Iger's departure.

 

[KingMickey13]

So, the recent rumblings are this will be happening, with Moana opening as early as late 2025, I believe.

 

[Elijah Abrams]

So, the recent rumblings are this will be happening, with Moana opening as early as late 2025, I believe.

Too ambitious. Don’t count on it.

Also, I think they should cut back a little, or a half, on doing IP-based attractions after Iger leaves.

 

[Incomudro]

I think it’s unlikely but possible that that Zootopia/Moana could fit in Animal Kingdom. I wouldn’t say that the Avatar IP really fit AK, but Pandora is amazing and definitely dies.

Moana can fit. Moana has a Mother Earth message.
Zootopia however is miles apart in theme and substance from Moana. Zootopia is a modern urban metropolis.

 

[KingMickey13]

Too ambitious. Don’t count on it.

Also, I think they should cut back a little, or a half, on doing IP-based attractions after Iger leaves.

I don’t think they will though.

Moana can fit. Moana has a Mother Earth message.
Zootopia however is miles apart in theme and substance from Moana. Zootopia is a modern urban metropolis.

Agreed, it doesn’t fit AK at all (maybe HS) but I think it can still be a fun experience.

 

[Bocabear]

Moana can fit. Moana has a Mother Earth message.
Zootopia however is miles apart in theme and substance from Moana. Zootopia is a modern urban metropolis.

THIS! Exactly.....

 

[aladdin2007]

Moana can fit. Moana has a Mother Earth message.
Zootopia however is miles apart in theme and substance from Moana. Zootopia is a modern urban metropolis.

which is exactly why the journey of water mess and the giant buddha of moana should have gone to AK not epcot, but they dont have a brain anymore, epcot is a dumping ground, with a focus on being the w word in more ways than one.

 

[Incomudro]

which is exactly why the journey of water mess and the giant buddha of moana should have gone to AK not epcot, but they dont have a brain anymore, epcot is a dumping ground, with a focus on being the w word in more ways than one.

It's certainly not a mess, and is little more than a mildly themed landscaped, water feature area. I say that in a good way.
It's not presented as an in your face character laden IP.
It'd fit in AK for sure.
But I don't understand the ire it gets from some people for being in Epcot.
It's landscaping and a bit of the water cycle adjacent to The Seas.
It works in that location as well.

 

[BlakeW39]

It's certainly not a mess, and is little more than a mildly themed landscaped, water feature area. I say that in a good way.
It's not presented as an in your face character laden IP.
It'd fit in AK for sure.
But I don't understand the ire it gets from some people for being in Epcot.
It's landscaping and a bit of the water cycle adjacent to The Seas.
It works in that location as well.

Yeah, Moana works just as well in EPCOT as it does in DAK. People just get defensive about EPCOT because they've forced IP in there that really doesn't fit.

Not saying Moana is PREFERABLE in EPCOT, because it isn't, but it also isn't PREFERABLE at DAK.