Unfortunately you don't have a choice on that one! At least with whether or not to drop funds on a trip to WDW you do. LOL!
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You Hate Everything About It, Yet You Still Go
- Thread starter ExtinctJenn
- Start date
polynesiangirl
Well-Known Member
I like to think I fall somewhere in between on this issue. I have been going to WDW nearly my entire life (I was born in the mid-80s,) with only small breaks (no more than a few years,) and it is definitely different than it used to be. The service is undoubtedly different/not as high caliber. We started noticing that changing as far back as the late 90s; I remember my parents commenting on it. There have absolutely been times where I've commented to my husband about the lousy condition something was in (hello, Splash pre-recent refurb.)
But these things don't consume me while I am there, and it certainly hasn't yet caused me to leave my vacation thinking I've been swindled. I realize that the world, the Walt Disney company, etc are all things that will change over time, because that's life. Nothing lasts forever. There is still something special for me about being there, and it has definitely been special to start sharing it with my children. If I felt like it was a depressing waste of time, I would likely not go anymore. Life is way too short to spend my precious, precious vacation days doing something I don't especially like, or something that is just going to bum me out.
I assume that the "complainers" are not truly depressed/enraged every minute of their vacations -- because that is a crappy way to spend your free time and thousands upon thousands of dollars. I am guessing/hoping that they do still find enough redeeming qualities in their trips to make it worthwhile for them.
But these things don't consume me while I am there, and it certainly hasn't yet caused me to leave my vacation thinking I've been swindled. I realize that the world, the Walt Disney company, etc are all things that will change over time, because that's life. Nothing lasts forever. There is still something special for me about being there, and it has definitely been special to start sharing it with my children. If I felt like it was a depressing waste of time, I would likely not go anymore. Life is way too short to spend my precious, precious vacation days doing something I don't especially like, or something that is just going to bum me out.
I assume that the "complainers" are not truly depressed/enraged every minute of their vacations -- because that is a crappy way to spend your free time and thousands upon thousands of dollars. I am guessing/hoping that they do still find enough redeeming qualities in their trips to make it worthwhile for them.
Crazy Harry
Active Member
Unfortunately you don't have a choice on that one! At least with whether or not to drop funds on a trip to WDW you do. LOL!
Sure you do, you don't have to live in the United States, or on "the grid" in general, it is a choice. And apparently the only way to truely express your dissatisfaction with something is to not be a part of it, other wise you are "just part of the problem." After all, why would you give money to a government you disagree with so often?
Crazy Harry
Active Member
I'm sorry, but just like your head, your nutshell has some holes in it.
The majority of the points you make are already answered and refuted by my previous post.
What does the food industry have to do with themeparks? It shows that problems are present despite lack of notice or recognition by the general public. The phenomenon is the same even if the consequence of this inattentiveness is quite different. But this was already stated in my previous post.
Why the general public doesn't notice maintainaence issues like those more familiar, because if you aren't looking for it you won't miss it, not to mention the public's general skill at missing the nose on their face. Already answered in previous post.
Just for the record, I work at a hardware store, and "where is the bathroom" is no where near the top of the list. You missed the point of this ancedote. People can't see what is in front of them. I spend half my day reading packages and instructions to them and pointing at price tags in addition to the other examples I gave. My ancedote has nothing to do with why they are there. People these days have impaired observational skills. Why do more people not complain about issues vs those on this board, because they don't see them. Not because they aren't there, but because no one has pointed it out yet. If one of the "complainers" walked around WDW with a non-complainer, they would likely end up asking why all the issues have not been addressed.
Why is it an all or nothing proposition with you. You want to lump people into two general categories. I can go to Disney, notice things I don't like and things I would like to see addressed, and still have a good time. Just because I would like to see better quality merch, merch themed to the area it is located in, have certain effects addressed or removed, and not see so many attractions with screens or based on existing properties etc, does not mean I don't enjoy the rest that Disney has to offer. I'm not going to be a mindless drone who get's on my hands and knees and kisses Iger's feet everytime adds an interactive quality to a ride or a meet and greet.
People just don't go through life agreeing with every descision that is made, and I promise that in other facets of your life that you stray from you own philosophy. If you don't like descisions of the government, don't invest so much money through taxes, if you don't like playcalling or personel moves of your favorite sports team then don't go to games or buy merch, if you don't always agree with your boss then why would you invest years of your life there? You can disagree with aspects, but still be invested enough that you don't leave, either because the good outweighs the bad, or hope for the future.
What you propose is ignorance and unquestioned loyalty. Imagine the lack of progress in our society if everyone just excepted the status quo. There would be no progress.
And I would like to see some evidence to your claims, like no one other than those from this thread site issues with the parks. hat, have you been conducting surveys?
Again, like my previous post pointed out, what is mythical about prolonged mechanical failures? This is objective observation.
The problem with your nostalgia arguement is that the correlation of older generations pointing more issues than younger generations does not prove causation. It can just as easily be hypothosized that because the newer generation has not experienced the parks during the time and under the managment as the older generations that they obviously will not observe the same things. Someone going to a restaurant for the first time might be satisfied with the portion size, while someone going for years would notice that the price went up and the portions got smaller. Is that being a complainer whereas the other is content, or simple observation of previously held "standards". If you go back to your childhood home after thirty years, and see how run down the new ownership has allowed it to become, is this an affect of nostalgia or simple observation that the condition is clearly worse?
And yes, my other analogies of wages and manufacturing are relevant because they draw a parallel. If your philosophy is true for WDW, they why should it not apply to other facets of life? In truth, you would be doing the same thing you critisize others for doing, just in a different venue. It's ignoring issues because of sucess. You claim that if there is success and people don't act in difiance of the issues in significant numbers, then that means there are no issues.
Crazy Harry
Active Member
I work in retail, I make 11.50 an hour, 2.50 an hour extra on weekends, profit sharing, and a Christmas bonus, and the owner is still the richest man in our state. While having a job is great, I doubt you'll disagree that Walmart could pay their employees better if they wanted to. But this is off topic...
Yes they could. But you could also say that employees could volunteer to work for cheaper. Who is to say who is right?
copcarguyp71
Well-Known Member
Oh boy...I see this headed towards a social commentary including economic class discussion and politics (grabs popcorn)
Crazy Harry
Active Member
Would you volunteer to work for cheaper?
There are a lot of factors involved, but given the right circumstances, yes.
In fact, did it just today.
Crazy Harry
Active Member
Fair enough.
WDW1974
Well-Known Member
threads like this amuse me ...well, the subject because I haven't read the thread.
So provocative and biting.
No offense to the OP, but who in their right mind would go to WDW if they 'hate everything' about it?
Isn't the REAL issue the fact many fans KNOW the product isn't what it once was, is in other Disney destinations and should be at WDW while many others on forums like this one truly shut their brains off at the MAGICal arches and tell themselves that WDW has never been better? And the latter group doesn't like being challenged that maybe WDW isn't as good as they believe?
Just a thought.
So provocative and biting.
No offense to the OP, but who in their right mind would go to WDW if they 'hate everything' about it?
Isn't the REAL issue the fact many fans KNOW the product isn't what it once was, is in other Disney destinations and should be at WDW while many others on forums like this one truly shut their brains off at the MAGICal arches and tell themselves that WDW has never been better? And the latter group doesn't like being challenged that maybe WDW isn't as good as they believe?
Just a thought.
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jlsHouston
Well-Known Member
I kind of agree with this...not to say it wasn't better in the past under different management, but it's a pretty awesome vacation experience for me and my family and friends. We feel and see the magic. We have fun. Otherwise I wouldn't spend the money or waste my time if it was anything less than a very satisfying family vacation...
jlsHouston
Well-Known Member
No, if we shut our brains off completely we wouldn't read with interest the differing opinions and experiences splattered across this board. But many of us don't have the memories of WDW in the 70's,80's, 90's . What we have experienced on very recent trips does give us value for our dollars and so we continue to go and we don't write about the deficiencies we just don't really see or encounter while at the parks and staying on property. Our point of reference is different, our comparison criteria different, the entire WDW thrill is different for us and I think more than anything what we don't want is to experience that deep disappointment we hear on the boards from those that have the memories to way back when at WDW....
So why do the people who "hate" everything about WDW still go? I think it's because it's a fine line between love and hate....and when you once loved something, kind of hard to just turn your back and leave forever if you think there is a redeemable chance for change...
jlsHouston
Well-Known Member
Oh and watch out because the MOM already deleted pages of OP's weeks ago when we all descended into name calling...even my posts got deleted and I never get controversial or pick at people for what they think....
WDW1974
Well-Known Member
I said many folks did. I didn't say all. And I didn't even call out the OP despite the way the thread subject was worded. I take words very seriously myself.
I well understand the issue with folks who never set foot in WDW during its first quarter century ...or became regulars when they went once in 2001, loved the place, came back with the in-laws three years later and bought into DVC and now have 21 trips under their belts etc.
I don't want to spend much time here because I frankly have been having this discussion online since the late 90s.
It all comes down to perspective and saying that EPCOT has never been better when your first visit was eight years ago when you are talking with people (like myself) who have been regulars since Opening Day isn't going to come out very well for the newbies.
Imagine a WDW without FP, with limited dining reservations, with almost no buses, few character dining experiences, a classier resort vibe that didn't cater to kids and toons, one with no pin lanyards, no triple wide strollers, great swaths of greenery, no timeshares, one traffic light, ... One with parks that had equal hours for all guests, CMs who always smiled and looked professional and carried themselves that way, suits who actually wore them, trees in the parks, quiet areas, lots of live entertainers, merchandise that fit a theme, attractions that fit a themed area, resorts that were thereto other times and places and not the Disney BRAND ...I could go on all night, but I won't.
the above might sound like hell to you ...maybe you like planning vacations on spread sheets, homogenized pricey food, the same crappy merchandise in every location, foamheads everywhere, now reservations for everything, MAGICal buses, attractions that are operated without any care to show quality, parks that are tired and stale ...that has largely been the WDW of the past 15 years.
It hurts me because well ... I grew up on the place. It is VERY special to me. I don't think things used to be better. I KNOW it! I lived it! I still see glimpses in places.
But when I take a Disney Cruise or visit DLR, DLP, HKDL and TDR or even visit UNI or SW or BGT, I see that I am right and how far WDW has fallen.
I am not like.y to stay in this discussion long. I was caught by the thread title that was and remains provocative ... Because inherent in it is this idea that any of us hate the place, which is insulting and dumb on its face. Please note that I am not calling the poster insulting or dumb, just the words she chose.
You speak of not wanting to experience the 'deep disappointment' that some of us express and I honestly don,t know what to tell you. Because the more folks who are blind to the problems or believe that the WDW of 2013 provides anything close to true Disney quality we have, the worse the product is going to get for all of us. So, you may hate me, but I wish more newbies would open their eyes and expand their vacation horizons and then come on back and chat.
The disappointment will be there.
WDW1974
Well-Known Member
Oh and watch out because the MOM already deleted pages of OP's weeks ago when we all descended into name calling...even my posts got deleted and I never get controversial or pick at people for what they think....
thanks for the warning, but 'M' and I get along just fine ...and strong opinions shouldn't be deleted because some folks are incapable of having adult discussions and debate and take words from a stranger on the .net as some statement of their worth as a member of the human race.
Like I said, I take my words seriously and I know exactly what they mean.
But threads like this are usually a total waste because my history and perspective, opinions and facts, are not likely to change anyone's opinion that WDW has never never been better. And no one's MAGICal 2009 memories of a Christmas with Uncle Fred and the Cousins at the BW is going to make me believe WDW hasn't fallen as far as I know it has.
jlsHouston
Well-Known Member
I am not sure a majority on these boards think WDW has ever been better. Maybe. As we newbies discover on these threads we have missed a lot of magic being latecomers. I just know since I like the all-inclusive type of vacation WDW really has the corner on providing that, even more so than DL just by sheer size and diversity.
Already in the couple of years of "finding" this new vacation experience and diving in, I am suddenly being asked to switch things up with FP+ and Magic Bands. I can kind of be an old dog about learning new tricks. I may be invited by WDW to not return if I find myself in a foul mood over what this new system "takes" from my vacation experience. Sure I like the planning and the anticipation and excitement leading up to when we leave, but not so much I have ever booked a trip more than 90 days out and most trips I have booked at bout the 50 day mark. I hate waiting is why I like FP and EMH. I just don't do lines well....And because of info shared on this forum by knowledgeable OP's, I know TDO just invested a billion bucks in the RFID technology rather than address some expensive refurb issues on EE, the tree of life, Splash, etc, and besides the FL expansion, has done very little to introduce new rides and fresh themes into the parks over the past decades. So my better educated eye is upon them....
Ultimately I think these provocative threads are partly what holds interest to the forum members, why we keep coming back here to wdwmagic over some other disney boards out there. And the knowledge and experience and opinions shared...when they don't get too ugly and hateful...are the other reasons. I know my vacation experiences at WDW wouldn't have been nearly as enjoyable without the advice and info I have gotten from the OP's on this board.
Already in the couple of years of "finding" this new vacation experience and diving in, I am suddenly being asked to switch things up with FP+ and Magic Bands. I can kind of be an old dog about learning new tricks. I may be invited by WDW to not return if I find myself in a foul mood over what this new system "takes" from my vacation experience. Sure I like the planning and the anticipation and excitement leading up to when we leave, but not so much I have ever booked a trip more than 90 days out and most trips I have booked at bout the 50 day mark. I hate waiting is why I like FP and EMH. I just don't do lines well....And because of info shared on this forum by knowledgeable OP's, I know TDO just invested a billion bucks in the RFID technology rather than address some expensive refurb issues on EE, the tree of life, Splash, etc, and besides the FL expansion, has done very little to introduce new rides and fresh themes into the parks over the past decades. So my better educated eye is upon them....
Ultimately I think these provocative threads are partly what holds interest to the forum members, why we keep coming back here to wdwmagic over some other disney boards out there. And the knowledge and experience and opinions shared...when they don't get too ugly and hateful...are the other reasons. I know my vacation experiences at WDW wouldn't have been nearly as enjoyable without the advice and info I have gotten from the OP's on this board.
