I believe there's a story about Eisner riding JIYI and basically telling WDI - This stinks. I don't know about his dislike of Figment, though, as the reading I've done suggests he didn't like JIYI because it didn't include him.
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Worst mistake in Epcot history
- Thread starter HMF
- Start date
I believe there's a story about Eisner riding JIYI and basically telling WDI - This stinks. I don't know about his dislike of Figment, though, as the reading I've done suggests he didn't like JIYI because it didn't include him.
Mickeynerd17
Well-Known Member
Although historical evidence may suggest it, I'm highly skeptical there was intentional sabotage of the pavilion. I think Disney was just advertising the latest and greatest thing to debut at the time, which unfortunately did not involve Imagination the ride.
Probably the biggest point of evidence to support sabotage would be the monorail spiel, which talks exclusively about HISTA and not the rest of the pavilion. It seems to be intentional, especially when they kept mentioning Horizons up to it's closure in '99. I will mention though Horizons was one attraction while Imagination was multiple, so there wasn't an opportunity with Horizons to leave it out.
TwilightZone
Well-Known Member
The sad thing is YOUR Imagination has one scene that showed the potential in the concept (IMO), where it might have been good with a proper budget.
That scene is the connection hall, a short charming scene before the upside down house where fibre optic lights "connect" to make fun shapes. It is the one scene in the entire ride that vaguely resembles it's predecessor and was cut out for an intermission with Figment when the ride was ultimately redone (a shame because I am sure many guests would have vastly prefered the connection hall over the infamous smell lab).
That scene is the connection hall, a short charming scene before the upside down house where fibre optic lights "connect" to make fun shapes. It is the one scene in the entire ride that vaguely resembles it's predecessor and was cut out for an intermission with Figment when the ride was ultimately redone (a shame because I am sure many guests would have vastly prefered the connection hall over the infamous smell lab).
Sir_Cliff
Well-Known Member
I've never quite got the conspiracy theories about forces within Disney actively working to sabotage Journey Into Imagination. My suspicion is that it was just an issue of Kodak having it in their contract that the attraction needed an overhaul at a certain time and that time came when Disney was going through a particularly rough patch of cheap (and generally bad) attractions. I don't see why people within Disney would have been working to bring down this attraction just so they could replace it with something like Journey into Your Imagination.
TwilightZone
Well-Known Member
Also while a lot of people mention wrongs of the ride, I rarely see the Imageworks mentioned. I remember once attempting to plot down what might have been there, but that post is lost to me now. Maybe I will redo that later. But for now just watch how sad this thing is, a certain downgrade of the fun upstairs one (though I prefer the music maker attraction here over the bare bones Figment's Music Maker).
Timestamp is 6:50 ish.
Timestamp is 6:50 ish.
TwilightZone
Well-Known Member
While searching for footage, I also came across this opening day video of the ride!
Politics and agendas. See also: 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea
CJR
Well-Known Member
Late to the party. So many things missing, but for these three I picked Imagination.
Now, here are a few notes.
IllumiNations: RoE leaving was sad, but ultimately, it's a fireworks show. They could recreate it quite easily if they wanted to. You already have the soundtrack so all you would need is the tech and you could have a new and improved IllumiNations. Will it happen? Probably not, but the point is it's the easiest to revive of the three. It wouldn't necessarily be cheap to revive it, but if they got creative, they could even use the existing Harmonious technology.
Mission: SPACE is probably not going anywhere and arguably the best replacement of the three, although, Horizons was a huge loss. If Mission: Space were built on an expansion plot instead though, I think people would view it as an asset. Its story is very similar to Mickey and Minnie's Runaway Railway. As an attraction, it's solid at least.
Imagination was a gem. There was nothing quite like it. EPCOT has not been the same since it was removed. Horizons was open and closed a few times by the time Imagination left, but the experience post-1999 was just never the same. There is hope that Imagination can be reinvented in the 21st century with new tech. It may not be the wonder that it was from the 1980's, but the bar is so low, whatever they put in could easily out perform what's there today. The problem: the people making the decisions over what would go in it. There's seemingly a million ways to do it right, yet, they could still easily come off short. Here's hoping that when they do pull the trigger and redo Imagination, they don't mess it up again. Of the three, Imagination has the most potential to be somewhat revived, even if it's different and lesser. I certainly don't expect them to rebuild what was lost.
What else though? Reliance on festivals, CommuniCore, the Fountain of Nations, the Sea Cabs and Hydrolators, Malestrom, Wonders of Life, Fiesta Tour, Universe of Energy, SSE ending/covered in curtains, Canada film, unfinished projects in the World Showcase.
The best thing they've done in recent time would definitely be Spaceship Earth's Beacon's of Magic and entrance re-do. Proof that they can do good things. Hopefully, they've noted people's reactions to this stuff. It's the most Disney thing they've done to the park in years.
Now, here are a few notes.
IllumiNations: RoE leaving was sad, but ultimately, it's a fireworks show. They could recreate it quite easily if they wanted to. You already have the soundtrack so all you would need is the tech and you could have a new and improved IllumiNations. Will it happen? Probably not, but the point is it's the easiest to revive of the three. It wouldn't necessarily be cheap to revive it, but if they got creative, they could even use the existing Harmonious technology.
Mission: SPACE is probably not going anywhere and arguably the best replacement of the three, although, Horizons was a huge loss. If Mission: Space were built on an expansion plot instead though, I think people would view it as an asset. Its story is very similar to Mickey and Minnie's Runaway Railway. As an attraction, it's solid at least.
Imagination was a gem. There was nothing quite like it. EPCOT has not been the same since it was removed. Horizons was open and closed a few times by the time Imagination left, but the experience post-1999 was just never the same. There is hope that Imagination can be reinvented in the 21st century with new tech. It may not be the wonder that it was from the 1980's, but the bar is so low, whatever they put in could easily out perform what's there today. The problem: the people making the decisions over what would go in it. There's seemingly a million ways to do it right, yet, they could still easily come off short. Here's hoping that when they do pull the trigger and redo Imagination, they don't mess it up again. Of the three, Imagination has the most potential to be somewhat revived, even if it's different and lesser. I certainly don't expect them to rebuild what was lost.
What else though? Reliance on festivals, CommuniCore, the Fountain of Nations, the Sea Cabs and Hydrolators, Malestrom, Wonders of Life, Fiesta Tour, Universe of Energy, SSE ending/covered in curtains, Canada film, unfinished projects in the World Showcase.
The best thing they've done in recent time would definitely be Spaceship Earth's Beacon's of Magic and entrance re-do. Proof that they can do good things. Hopefully, they've noted people's reactions to this stuff. It's the most Disney thing they've done to the park in years.
Centauri Space Station
Well-Known Member
The monorail spiel never mentioned the actual ride. From 82-86 it was, "Those glass pyramids are the gateway to your Journey into Imagination. You can also express your own creativity in the Imageworks. And take a Magic Journey in 3D." 86-94 replace the Magic Journeys spiel with, "and join Michael Jackson starring as Captain EO". The HITSA spiel was used from 1994 til the second ride rehab in 2002.
Mickeynerd17
Well-Known Member
Ah! Watched some videos and you're right. I stand corrected. Thank you.
Goofyernmost
Well-Known Member
The thing is that JII was a tremendous attraction, but Kodak was the sponsor and when it came time to renew Kodak was on the road to oblivion and the budget was a lot less than the original. There's a vacuum in space because JIYI sucked so bad. It is rumored that Eisner road it and almost immediately shut it down. They came up with JIYI.2 which was slightly better, but only slightly and that is what we have now. The only real difference is that they put Figment back in and changed the story line plus put One Little Spark back in. I disliked both of them. Eisner had seen the original so he knew how bad the change was from the original.
TwilightZone
Well-Known Member
I am making a post about YOUR Imagination's Imageworks and I believe part of the failure is that it was rushed. It was briefly advertised as part of the Millenium celebration. It makes total sense that Disney would want the redo of their most beloved attraction, that just so happened to have a fitting theme, to go along with it all, but the ride was barely even on the road, so by the time it did open they just threw what they had left. It would explain stuff like the odd Lava Lamps in imageworks.
TwilightZone
Well-Known Member
It took me a long time, but it is now done! This is all the information about YOUR Imagination's Imageworks I could gather.
Centauri Space Station
Well-Known Member
From videos it had a ball swirling in a tube, and monitor guests could stick their faces in and create effects. Figments melody maker was themed to a garage and you would make beats on things like a trashcan. The Stepping Tones had animal faces that made noises of said animal when stepped on.
tl77
Well-Known Member
Changing the Imagination pavilion of the 80's is the most disappointing thing, it needed "updating" not "replacing" ...if they put it back to how it was in the 80's it'd still be a great ride.
I loved Horizons, but by the mid 90's it was clear this wasn't "a plausible future we would see in out lifetimes". People really believed that original slogan of "The 21st Century begins October 1982" and if you look at at the "futuristic films" of the early 80's, with flying cars and whatnot, we really believe the year 2000 would be like living in an 80's Sci-Fi movie... Conan O'Brien used to do that bit on his first NBC show "In the Year 2000", kid of making fun of those kinds of beliefs ...but Horizons "became" a disappointment because the future it was predicting was starting to seem more like "fantasy" than "reality", same thing with Sea Base Alpha, some day the new Space restaurant will probably be just as dated...
I still have fond memories of 80's EPCOT Center, but the the Imagination ride and pavilion was the most timeless thing in Future World, they should have never let it get changed so badly
I loved Horizons, but by the mid 90's it was clear this wasn't "a plausible future we would see in out lifetimes". People really believed that original slogan of "The 21st Century begins October 1982" and if you look at at the "futuristic films" of the early 80's, with flying cars and whatnot, we really believe the year 2000 would be like living in an 80's Sci-Fi movie... Conan O'Brien used to do that bit on his first NBC show "In the Year 2000", kid of making fun of those kinds of beliefs ...but Horizons "became" a disappointment because the future it was predicting was starting to seem more like "fantasy" than "reality", same thing with Sea Base Alpha, some day the new Space restaurant will probably be just as dated...
I still have fond memories of 80's EPCOT Center, but the the Imagination ride and pavilion was the most timeless thing in Future World, they should have never let it get changed so badly
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
Casper Gutman
Well-Known Member
Imagination even has the wrong Python-who-will-do-anything-for-money. If you want a comically rigid authority figure who eventually loosens up in humorous fashion, you go to John Cleese. Idle is too inherently jovial and whimsical. Know what I mean?
ToTBellHop
Well-Known Member
It worked better when Honey…I Shrunk the Audience was next door.