Worst mistake in Epcot history

["El Gran Magnifico"]

Turning World Showcase into a bar and allowing “Drinking Teams”

 

[doctornick]

I kind wonder about the extent to which Test Track resonated. It's a popular attraction in the context of a park with few headline attractions, but do many people consider it among WDW's best attractions or a draw in its own right? I don't really have the answer to that, but my impression has always been that its popularity has more to do with it being amongst the best of a mostly mediocre collection of attractions and the only one with some thrill value that doesn't risk making you vomit.

I do think the concept was good and appropriate for the location, but I think that was also true of Mission: Space. In both cases, though, the end result just fell a little flat. Far more so in the case of M:S, though.

I don’t know but I will say that for my kids they really enjoy the design center and then seeing where their cars rank during the ride. And they have definitely asked to go back to Epcot to ride TT. My guess would be that it is probably on par with something like BTMRR in terms of how “popular” it is with the general WDW visitor.

I also think these boards skew classic Epcot fan so it tends to create a depressed view of anything that came later. I mean on this thread you have some folks kinda meh on Soarin’ yet everyone I talk to in real life about always seems to really like it.

 

[JustAFan]

Excellent question. In my opinion, the biggest mistake is not keeping current/future attractions up to date. Most of the front of the park celebrates and explores technology, space, science, inventions, etc. Horizons was truly an Epcot classic. I love Spaceship Earth, but it needed to be updated over 20 years ago. Journey Into Imagination ... ugh. It feels like they plopped some science down, shook each other's hands and said 'job well done'. That job would never be done though. Either keep up to date or don't tackle the theme at all. As it is, it's more of a celebration of the past of technology and science than it could or should be.

 

[Casper Gutman]

I think Test Track has resonated with guests and, in general, was a reasonable replacement considering it was the first second generation ride. Although I did really like WoM, it doesn’t seem to be regarded as the top of classic Epcot and was a reasonable choice to replace first (though why not both WoM and Test Track - they would be great compliments).

I love all three of the lost dark rides and would trade almost any modern ride for them in a second, but I think WoM gets unfairly overlooked in favor of the other two. Horizons (my favorite when I was very young) had a great opening - the retro-future section - but the more earnest attempts to visualize tomorrow were very dated very quickly (although they were still charming). Imagination has the highest high of the trio - the cut paper room - but the opening turntable got less enthralling quickly and the later film and science rooms were lackluster. WoM felt like a sequel to Pirates, with its wit and humor. It’s the only one that boasted the brilliantly caricatured faces that reflected the artistry of the great Disney animators and the scenes were complex, multilayered, intricately detailed, and very funny. I can understand why Imagination is mentioned more often - Figment pulls a lot of weight with some folks - but I never understood why Horizons took precedence.

 

[Goofyernmost]

I love all three of the lost dark rides and would trade almost any modern ride for them in a second, but I think WoM gets unfairly overlooked in favor of the other two. Horizons (my favorite when I was very young) had a great opening - the retro-future section - but the more earnest attempts to visualize tomorrow were very dated very quickly (although they were still charming). Imagination has the highest high of the trio - the cut paper room - but the opening turntable got less enthralling quickly and the later film and science rooms were lackluster. WoM felt like a sequel to Pirates, with its wit and humor. It’s the only one that boasted the brilliantly caricatured faces that reflected the artistry of the great Disney animators and the scenes were complex, multilayered, intricately detailed, and very funny. I can understand why Imagination is mentioned more often - Figment pulls a lot of weight with some folks - but I never understood why Horizons took precedence.

Neither could I. After SSE, WoM was my absolute favorite for all the same reasons you mentioned. I loved Imagination and never tired of the turntable mostly because it mechanically fascinated me, the rest of it was only a good way to plant the earworm called "One little Spark". Horizons was fun and different but I always thought the ending was not up to standards even though I'm sure mechanically that was impressive, just not entertaining as the rest of it. After a few years I hardly ever went to it.

 

[Mesa Azul]

I love Horizons. It was a big part of my childhood, and losing not only the ride, but also the building, is hard. I wish we could have gotten the space pavilion and update that Disney had planned for that attraction. It sounds like it would have been amazing, including a really cool simulator ride that would have been inspiring and very much a logical next step to Horizons.Sad thing is, I think if they had done what they were originally planning, they could have fit Mission Space into the attraction, as well.

I don't buy the sink hole theory. That's been disproven numerous times, but the building was rotting. The Hoot and Chief videos near the end of the ride's life show plenty of water damage, rot, and overall places where the building was failing and needed major TLC. I think that had more to do with the teardown, and simply it was probably cheaper to remove it than it was to fix it. But that building was so special, and it not being there any more still makes me sad.

I know there are a lot of people down on Mission Space.... I know the feeling. I also know if I had rode Mission Space as a kid I'd have freaking loved it, so although I'll never be happy that it is there and Horizons is gone... I can't hate it for what it is. As part of a bigger space pavilion, it would have been a great addition to the park and probably my favorite pavilion overall.

 

[doctornick]

Neither could I. After SSE, WoM was my absolute favorite for all the same reasons you mentioned. I loved Imagination and never tired of the turntable mostly because it mechanically fascinated me, the rest of it was only a good way to plant the earworm called "One little Spark". Horizons was fun and different but I always thought the ending was not up to standards even though I'm sure mechanically that was impressive, just not entertaining as the rest of it. After a few years I hardly ever went to it.

This is where I'm at as well. Although it got a decent replacement, WoM was a fantastic attraction and screamed classic Disney entertainment in the vein of POTC and HM. I also don't think there was much about it that would have been really that dated as (like SSE) it was more about the history of the topic than imaging the future. It's sad that WoM didn't get to co-oexist along Test Track as I think they would have been great compliments to each other.

OTOH, I know its blasphemy around here, but I don't really understand the degree of adoration that Horizons gets. To me, it definitely wasn't as entertaining or enjoyable as other classic Epcot rides (like the aforementioned WoM and Imagination).

 

[Mesa Azul]

This is where I'm at as well. Although it got a decent replacement, WoM was a fantastic attraction and screamed classic Disney entertainment in the vein of POTC and HM. I also don't think there was much about it that would have been really that dated as (like SSE) it was more about the history of the topic than imaging the future. It's sad that WoM didn't get to co-oexist along Test Track as I think they would have been great compliments to each other.

OTOH, I know its blasphemy around here, but I don't really understand the degree of adoration that Horizons gets. To me, it definitely wasn't as entertaining or enjoyable as other classic Epcot rides (like the aforementioned WoM and Imagination).

You needed to be of a certain age, probably. 80s kids saw the future in Horizons. You also needed to be a nerdy techie kid from the 80s. I'm actually surprised it is so well loved. I adored the ride as a kid, but I was a nerdy 80s kid in love with space and computers. The future that Horizons presented me inspired me to get into computers, to work for NASA, and to basically try and dream it and do it.

I take Horizons as a big part of what Epcot was all about for us back then. I actually like Journey into Imagination more now, looking back, than I did as a kid. I loved World of Motion, hell I loved Test Track... Spaceship Earth and Living Seas. I loved the whole park, although Journey was a bit of an outlier for me as a kid: What's this dragon dude doing in a technology park? As an adult looking back now, Imagination is amazing, and essential, but I wasn't into WDW like I was EPCOT, and Journey was more WDW than EPCOT to me back then

I can get why kids who experienced Horizons late in its life, or just weren't into what it was showing would shrug the ride off. I get that completely. It also has some how became the topic of countless online columns and videos. I can see why some people would shrug it off and say, "What's the big deal?" If you were of that certain age and nerdiness, though... It was pretty magical.

I have a few set pieces from Horizons in my office, a few props salvaged from the ride, and they're as important to me as some people would value a winning game ball or some other collectable that inspired them as to who they are today. I have friends that see them and go, "That's cool..." until they hear what I paid for them then they look at me very concerned... but for a nerdy 80s kids, they're a part of me.

 

[Goofyernmost]

You needed to be of a certain age, probably. 80s kids saw the future in Horizons. You also needed to be a nerdy techie kid from the 80s. I'm actually surprised it is so well loved. I adored the ride as a kid, but I was a nerdy 80s kid in love with space and computers. The future that Horizons presented me inspired me to get into computers, to work for NASA, and to basically try and dream it and do it.

I take Horizons as a big part of what Epcot was all about for us back then. I actually like Journey into Imagination more now, looking back, than I did as a kid. I loved World of Motion, hell I loved Test Track... Spaceship Earth and Living Seas. I loved the whole park, although Journey was a bit of an outlier for me as a kid: What's this dragon dude doing in a technology park? As an adult looking back now, Imagination is amazing, and essential, but I wasn't into WDW like I was EPCOT, and Journey was more WDW than EPCOT to me back then

I can get why kids who experienced Horizons late in its life, or just weren't into what it was showing would shrug the ride off. I get that completely. It also has some how became the topic of countless online columns and videos. I can see why some people would shrug it off and say, "What's the big deal?" If you were of that certain age and nerdiness, though... It was pretty magical.

I have a few set pieces from Horizons in my office, a few props salvaged from the ride, and they're as important to me as some people would value a winning game ball or some other collectable that inspired them as to who they are today. I have friends that see them and go, "That's cool..." until they hear what I paid for them then they look at me very concerned... but for a nerdy 80s kids, they're a part of me.

A lot of people felt like you did. After all, Horizons was the other end of the Carousel of Progress. As an inspiration it was great, but as a theme park attraction, it had a much smaller shelf life. There was no catchy tune like Great Big Beautiful, Small World or One little Spark. It tried to show the future and in some cases did, but truth be known, a lot of it still hasn't happened. With a little imaginative update it might still be there. However, they never even tried and the offer from HP was big enough to sway them easily. Partially due to the fact that attendance at Horizons had dropped almost to nobody. Sadly, it was no longer a draw that was necessary in a rapidly dying park.

 

[We love Edna Mode]

I really miss Horizons and World of Motion. Nice family fun rides!

 

[disney-gram]

Beautifully done. Thanks for the fun trip down memory lane

 

[spock8113]

Why isn't there a "D - All of the above - attach additional comments on the back" ????
I am almost as disappointed in Disney as I was when they opened Al Capone's vault, both with nothing inside.
Now "Storytelling Subdivisions."? Time for an Intervention, a serious intervention.

 

[Brer Panther]

Getting rid of the original Journey Into Imagination gets my vote. I do like Journey Into Imagination With Figment, flawed as it is, but it upsets me that I never got to ride the original version. It looked like such a cool ride. I still don't quite understand why they got rid of it.

World of Motion looked like a great ride too. I love Test Track but surely we could've had both.

 

[larryz]

I rather like the 3 caballeros addition. I don't think I remember the previous incarnation having any special elements. Is there any videos you can reference?

All you have to do is go to YouTube and search El Rio del Tiempo...

 

[DonaldDoleWhip]

Side note, that's how I feel about DHS losing both the animation studio (its heart) and Great Movie Ride (its soul). One justified calling it a "studio" at all and the other spoke to the idea of the park being a celebration of film history at large, not just a marketing tool for Disney.

I know this is an Epcot thread, but had to emphasize this point as well.

Can totally understand removing the Backlot Tour eventually, but the Magic of Disney Animation didn't need live animators sketching to have an interesting purpose. Given the changes animation has seen since then, that concept could have been more engaging and relevant than ever, had they refreshed it.

But it's the removal of GMR that really stings for me. While it could have used some updates, GMR inspired me to appreciate classics I probably never would have seen otherwise, such as Casablanca and Singin' in the Rain. Not only that, but the final montage felt like the park's thesis statement, showcasing the allure of Old Hollywood and the resonance of truly iconic films. Nothing in the park captures that sensation - it's all just pushing an IP.

The reason I'm sharing this in the Epcot thread is that I can't fully understand what the EPCOT Center fans are mourning, having no memories of Horizons, WoM, or the original Journey into Imagination. That said, the fact that people are so affected by these losses (particularly JII) compared to something like GMR speaks volumes.

The bottom line in both cases is that right now, these parks feel hollow and vacuous, in more ways than one. If Epcot has anything at all to say (thanks Harmonious), it seems to be that someday, life will be fairer and greed will not pay...but not today, plebs! Keep blowing those savings on booze and popcorn buckets.

Final tangent, but during my last Harmonious viewing I saw a group of four rowdy parkgoers who were all really into it, and really annoying. After that final 'message' promoting wisdom and kindness, they made their way toward the park exit–but not before leaving all four of their plastic drink cups on the ground, which others immediately began tripping over. Seemingly fits the culture that 'reimagined' Epcot resonates with:

 

[TikibirdLand]

All you have to do is go to YouTube and search El Rio del Tiempo...

I definitely will look. But, it's not really telling me why you prefer it though.

 

[WDWJoeG]

Just curious what you folks think is the worst mistake in EPCOT history. For me personally losing IllumiNations hurts the most personally since I never experienced JII and Horizons in person.

There is a special place in Hell reserved for those that gave us this:

 

[TwilightZone]

To add into the Horizons talk, I never got to experience the attraction in person, I am sure that makes the big difference in enjoyment, but I also haven't experienced any of the classic Epcot attractions in person and I still enjoy the likes of Imagination, World of Motion, The Living Seas, etc. Horizons just doesn't do it for me for some reason. I get why it is so beloved and I do love stuff that delves deep into optimistic futures, but the execution of Horizons tends to drag after a while. I think a ride like Horizons would have still been around to this day if it were an animatronic show or something like that rather than a ride. Or had the "short but sweet" execution of the Tomorrowland dark rides.

 

[Mesa Azul]

To add into the Horizons talk, I never got to experience the attraction in person, I am sure that makes the big difference in enjoyment, but I also haven't experienced any of the classic Epcot attractions in person and I still enjoy the likes of Imagination, World of Motion, The Living Seas, etc. Horizons just doesn't do it for me for some reason. I get why it is so beloved and I do love stuff that delves deep into optimistic futures, but the execution of Horizons tends to drag after a while. I think a ride like Horizons would have still been around to this day if it were an animatronic show or something like that rather than a ride. Or had the "short but sweet" execution of the Tomorrowland dark rides.

That's actually super interesting to me. I get the looking back and enjoying Imagination and World of Motion, but Living Seas is an odd choice. Mostly because 90% of that pavilion was the walk around aquarium and seeing exhibits afterwords. The only thing of it that you could consider a ride would be the elevator simulator and the tiny little ride through section of the aquarium. That was much more of a, "had to be there," kind of attraction that I can totally get people not appreciating or getting now having not experienced it.

 

[TwilightZone]

That's actually super interesting to me. I get the looking back and enjoying Imagination and World of Motion, but Living Seas is an odd choice. Mostly because 90% of that pavilion was the walk around aquarium and seeing exhibits afterwords. The only thing of it that you could consider a ride would be the elevator simulator and the tiny little ride through section of the aquarium. That was much more of a, "had to be there," kind of attraction that I can totally get people not appreciating or getting now having not experienced it.

I just really love aquariums lol, plus cool sci fi theming! It still looks cool even in a modern day lense, the "blue" makeover of the Nemo version is just lame in comparison.