Wish (Walt Disney Animation - November 2023)

[Willmark]

The only Pixar films I love are WALL-E and Brad Bird's films (Incredibles + Ratatouille). Toy Story 1-3 are also good. Luca is cute but not outstanding.

It’s awesome that there is a Dug cameo (albiet brief) in Ratatouille.

 

[Stupido]

Crazy, I really must be a Pixie Duster™.

Wish was by far my favorite animated movie since Princess and the Frog. And if that wasn't shocking enough, my biggest issue with it seems to be the one thing other people liked: Chris Pine. The writing for Magnifico is all over the place, and what he "sings" about in his song has very little reflection on his actions shown in the movie. You can tell that there were several rewrites of this story, and I think Magnifico's entire character shows it most obviously. Also, if they wanted to return to traditional villain songs, they should have cast someone who could actually sing it. It was way too speak-sing for me.

Outside of that? I think the movie was really strong. My only other critique is that we could have used a 'Welcome to Rosas (Reprise)' establishing the new kingdom a bit better. I'm seeing it for the third time tonight with a different group of friends, and I'm actively looking forward to it.

If you're on the fence on this one, I'd recommend seeing it for yourself and forming your own opinion.

 

[Disney Irish]

Maybe they shouldn’t have fired Lasseter?

Any personal issues aside, Lasseter isn't the creative audience whisperer that some thinks he is anyways.

Just have to look at his offering after leaving Pixar, Luck. Didn't connect with audiences at all, has an even lower audience score than Wish does.

We'll see if any of his other films currently under production fair any better, but I'm not holding my breath.

 

[mickEblu]

Any personal issues aside, Lasseter isn't the creative audience whisperer that some thinks he is anyways.

Just have to look at his offering after leaving Pixar, Luck. Didn't connect with audiences at all, has an even lower audience score than Wish does.

We'll see if any of his other films currently under production fair any better, but I'm not holding my breath.

Well I guess one lackluster movie negates his entire career then.

 

[Disney Irish]

Well I guess one lackluster movie negates his entire career then.

The point is that he himself wasn't the key to Pixar's success, it was the entire team. Something that he so far hasn't been able to replicate since leaving. At least Pixar had some success after his leaving.

As I said we'll see if any of the other 4 movies currently in production fair any better.

 

[mickEblu]

The point is that he himself wasn't the key to Pixar's success, it was the entire team. Something that he so far hasn't been able to replicate since leaving. At least Pixar had some success after his leaving.

As I said we'll see if any of the other 4 movies currently in production fair any better.

Much different statement than the post I originally responded to.

 

[mickEblu]

The point is that he himself wasn't the key to Pixar's success, it was the entire team. Something that he so far hasn't been able to replicate since leaving. At least Pixar had some success after his leaving.

As I said we'll see if any of the other 4 movies currently in production fair any better.

And also this is kind of like saying Michael Jordan can’t beat the 5 guys on the other team by himself. Obviously but that doesn’t mean he isn’t the best player on the floor or the leader of the team. It also doesn’t mean that his team would go 0-82 without him.

 

[Disney Irish]

Much different statement than the post I originally responded to.

Not really, as some think that it was him that caused Pixar to be successful, that he had the golden touch (no pun intended). And that if you just bring him back all will be right with the company. I'm saying that isn't the case. As if it was really him that caused anything he touched to become audience gold that it would have been replicated at Skydance, didn't happen at least so far.

 

[Disney Irish]

And also this is kind of like saying Michael Jordan can’t beat the 5 guys on the other team by himself. Obviously but that doesn’t mean he isn’t the best player on the floor or the leader of the team. It also doesn’t mean that his team would go 0-82 without him.

Actually no, its like saying that if you stick Michael Jordan on any team he can take them to the final four every year. And that is not the case. Its all about the team around him, not one person.

 

[mickEblu]

Actually no, its like saying that if you stick Michael Jordan on any team he can take them to the final four every year. And that is not the case. Its all about the team around him, not one person.

Ok you re right. Lasseter was NOT a huge part of Pixar and Disneys success in animation the last 30 + years.

 

[Disney Irish]

Ok you re right. Lasseter was NOT a huge part of Pixar and Disneys success in animation the last 30 + years.

Did I say any of that?

Look the man had and left his mark on Pixar and WDAS, no doubt. But he was part of a team. A team that while it has faltered recently still did find success without him, and I expect will again. He so far hasn't found that same success without that team. Maybe he'll find it again, I don't know. But bringing him back isn't somehow automatically going to make Pixar or WDAS successful again. As its he who needs the team, not the other way around.

 

[MrPromey]

Crazy, I really must be a Pixie Duster™.

Wish was by far my favorite animated movie since Princess and the Frog. And if that wasn't shocking enough, my biggest issue with it seems to be the one thing other people liked: Chris Pine. The writing for Magnifico is all over the place, and what he "sings" about in his song has very little reflection on his actions shown in the movie. You can tell that there were several rewrites of this story, and I think Magnifico's entire character shows it most obviously. Also, if they wanted to return to traditional villain songs, they should have cast someone who could actually sing it. It was way too speak-sing for me.

Outside of that? I think the movie was really strong. My only other critique is that we could have used a 'Welcome to Rosas (Reprise)' establishing the new kingdom a bit better. I'm seeing it for the third time tonight with a different group of friends, and I'm actively looking forward to it.

If you're on the fence on this one, I'd recommend seeing it for yourself and forming your own opinion.

For me, I don't get the point of 90% of what happened.

Spoiler: Spoiler

The star was of such amazing power that the king was afraid of it before he decided to crack open the Red Witch's (Wanda's) darkhold and level up. It was apparently able to make wishes come true as well as do his/its own magic at will and was powerful enough to make her a fairy god mother in the end.

He/it was also on her side, 100%.

Why go through all the crap to free the wishes?

Why didn't he/it just do it the moment that whole thing came up?

He granted the useless goat's wish to talk. Why not grant hers?

Principle?

She had to earn it for him/it to be willing?

He/it was cool with helping in the most basic ways including the use of magic in a manner that was pretty unhelpful most of the time and willing to risk dying and/or being permanently enslaved to force a journey that might and basically did fail spectacularly for no obvious reason when she was already of the right mindset and on the right "path" when he/it encountered her?

Before the power of a musical number saved the day with no further explanation, he/it was almost toast because he/it didn't just do what he/it apparently could have from the start or at any step of the way further along when it looked like they were all scr#wed multiple times.

As soon as they showed he/it using magic to do spectacularly dumb/funny stuff but almost nothing helpful despite he/it being on her side and trying to help otherwise, the whole thing fell apart for me.

They made an overpowered character and instead of creating a reason that character could't/wouldn't just save things, they chose to just ignore that point and hope audiences wouldn't question it, either.

The whole story feels like one big plot hole, to me.

... and that works in a kids movie where nobody is expected to think much about that sort of thing but as a family movie or one meant to entertain adults in general, I just don't see how that works.

 

[Phroobar]

What people forget is Lasseter had a different corporation mindset to work with when creating Luck. I'm not sure if he was there from the beginning or just stepped into the project. How much control did he really have? It was a movie for streaming so it was done on the cheap.

 

[Disney Irish]

What people forget is Lasseter had a different corporation mindset to work with when creating Luck. I'm not sure if he was there from the beginning or just stepped into the project. How much control did he really have? It was a movie for streaming so it was done on the cheap.

It wasn't that cheap, it was $140M, still pretty expensive for a streaming only movie.

 

[mickEblu]

Did I say any of that?

Look the man had and left his mark on Pixar and WDAS, no doubt. But he was part of a team. A team that while it has faltered recently still did find success without him, and I expect will again. He so far hasn't found that same success without that team. Maybe he'll find it again, I don't know. But bringing him back isn't somehow automatically going to make Pixar or WDAS successful again. As its he who needs the team, not the other way around.

How about we frame it a different way? Do you think Pixar/ Disney would be better off if he was still around?

 

[Phroobar]

It wasn't that cheap, it was $140M, still pretty expensive for a streaming only movie.

A bargain compared to Elemental and Wish.

 

[Stupido]

For me, I don't get the point of 90% of what happened.

Spoiler: Spoiler

The star was of such amazing power that the king was afraid of it before he decided to crack open the Red Witch's (Wanda's) darkhold and level up. The star was apparently able to make wishes come true as well as do his/its own magic at will and was powerful enough to make her a fairy god mother in the end. He/it was on her side.

Why go through all the crap to free the wishes?

Why didn't he/it just do it the moment that whole thing came up?

Principle?

She had to earn it for him/it to be willing?

He/it was cool with helping in the most basic ways including the use of magic in a manner that was relatively unhelpful most of the time and willing to risk dying and/or being permanently enslaved to force a journey that might fail spectacularly for no obvious reason when she was already of the right mindset and on the right "path" when he/it encountered her?

Before the power of music saved the day, he/it was almost toast because he/it didn't just do that from the start.

As soon as they showed he/it using magic to do spectacularly dumb/funny stuff but almost nothing helpful despite he/it being on her side, the whole thing fell apart for me.

The whole story feels like one big plot hole, to me.

Great points, and I'd love to use this thread to actually discuss the movie!

Spoiler: Spoiler

I don't think Magnifico was afraid of the star at first. He didn't even know it was the star that caused the lights. He outlawed the kingdom from participating in Magic, and to me, he seemed more afraid of the fact that someone dared defy him, and accomplished something that his kingdom celebrated. It seemed much more of an insecurity of loosing his adoring subjects, as opposed to the power of the star.

I do agree that more exploration of the Star, and its power and limits would have made a stronger finished product.

However, as for why bother rescuing the Wishes, I think the movie does an pretty decent job explaining this. It's made very clear that when Magnifico takes your wish and you forget it, you also forget a huge part of what makes you you. This was done primarily with Simon, how the whole friend group discuss how he's changed since turning 18 and giving his wish. I do think this plot point could have been better explored by having more adults in the kingdom seem more dejected. There could have even possibly been an explanation that Magnifico's powers of making people forget their wish and adjusting were slipping or something.

But, when Star meets all of Asha's friends, Star touches them all, and their heart glows until Star touches Simon. Simon never glows, and Star immediately gets super sad (for the only time in the movie). I took this to mean that if you've given up your hearts wish, Star's magic is useless to you. It's not that Star wouldn't help the people get their wishes back, it's that Star couldn't magically help get them back.

I also think that Disney is moving away from the 'wish on a star and all your dreams can come true!' narrative, and shifting to a 'you need to take your wishes and dreams into your own hands.' Having Star do a shimmy and free all of Rosas would have been a step back in this evolution. That's kind of the whole point of the movie too? The people just sitting around Rosas hoping for the king to one day maybe grant them their wish, vs Asha wishing for more for the Kingdom, wishing for them to have the opportunity to realize their own wishes.

 

[Disney Irish]

How about we frame it a different way? Do you think Pixar/ Disney would be better off if he was still around?

I cannot say for sure, I don't know if anyone can. But if any past actions caused any strife within the team, then no they wouldn't be better off with him still around.

 

[Disney Irish]

A bargain compared to Elemental and Wish.

Well that is debatable especially for a streaming only release.

 

[MrPromey]

Great points, and I'd love to use this thread to actually discuss the movie!

Spoiler: Spoiler

I don't think Magnifico was afraid of the star at first. He didn't even know it was the star that caused the lights. He outlawed the kingdom from participating in Magic, and to me, he seemed more afraid of the fact that someone dared defy him, and accomplished something that his kingdom celebrated. It seemed much more of an insecurity of loosing his adoring subjects, as opposed to the power of the star.

I do agree that more exploration of the Star, and its power and limits would have made a stronger finished product.

However, as for why bother rescuing the Wishes, I think the movie does an pretty decent job explaining this. It's made very clear that when Magnifico takes your wish and you forget it, you also forget a huge part of what makes you you. This was done primarily with Simon, how the whole friend group discuss how he's changed since turning 18 and giving his wish. I do think this plot point could have been better explored by having more adults in the kingdom seem more dejected. There could have even possibly been an explanation that Magnifico's powers of making people forget their wish and adjusting were slipping or something.

But, when Star meets all of Asha's friends, Star touches them all, and their heart glows until Star touches Simon. Simon never glows, and Star immediately gets super sad (for the only time in the movie). I took this to mean that if you've given up your hearts wish, Star's magic is useless to you. It's not that Star wouldn't help the people get their wishes back, it's that Star couldn't magically help get them back.

I also think that Disney is moving away from the 'wish on a star and all your dreams can come true!' narrative, and shifting to a 'you need to take your wishes and dreams into your own hands.' Having Star do a shimmy and free all of Rosas would have been a step back in this evolution. That's kind of the whole point of the movie too? The people just sitting around Rosas hoping for the king to one day maybe grant them their wish, vs Asha wishing for more for the Kingdom, wishing for them to have the opportunity to realize their own wishes.

Spoiler

He didn't know it was the star but he freaked the eff out the moment that happened and as soon as he understood what it was, he jumped straight to the forbidden zone without passing go.

I'm guessing it wasn't just him that got rewrites and massive changes but large chunks of the movie to make sure whatever Ts they had to cross and Is they had to dot got their moments. That's the only reason I can think of to have ended up with what we got.

My point wasn't why bother rescuing the wishes. It was why bother making everyone jump through hoops to do it when the star was clearly powerful enough to have done it from the start, alone without bothering to address why it couldn't or wouldn't.

It could have released all their wishes so they could find their own way to make them happen.

It did after all, seem to grant wishes at its own choosing along with doing magic nobody asked for when they (Disney) needed it for humor.

I don't think she asked for a magic wand but it had no problem offering one up to her to go off and be useless with it .
I mean, they almost failed because they couldn't get the roof to open for pete's sake!

I can understand as a construct "this is what we want to happen" and "we don't want to make this about people getting things handed to them" and if we want to talk about morals or the message Disney wanted to send that's a whole other discussion. I just saw no attempt at an in-world explanation for why that didn't happen at any point if all it took was opening a roof that for whatever nonsensical reason, was already designed to open.

Surely magically pulling a rope is less magical than granting a three week old goat the ability to speak English with the fleshed out fully developed thoughts of at least a teen human, no?

I don't go into a movie thinking "the film makers didn't want to make it too easy on them". I want a story written smartly enough that I don't have to think about what the filmmakers wanted in the moment of watching the movie. I'm of the opinion, the movie and story should be enough to do that.

As the creators of the story, this world and everything in it, they were free to write the rules however they wanted but it's like they just didn't even bother.

It's like, imagine if Lord of the Rings had been written without ever addressing there was only one way to destroy the ring. Without anyone mentioning trying any other method or anyone even saying the only way was to go on a long dangerous journey to drop it some place to destroy it, they just decide "hey, lets do it this hard way" and maybe they have a good reason for it or maybe they don't but you the reader have no way of knowing because Tolkien didn't bother to come up with that important plot detail.

... It's just like they didn't explain how a song turned everything around.

It just did and I guess we're supposed to be so impressed by the song we don't question how it fixed everything.

I mean, to compare it to a better Disney movie, think about how they resolved things in the fist Aladdin when faced with a similarly overpowered villain who had at that point clearly won with seemingly no way of stopping him.

They actually managed to write a story reason for how the good guys won, there.

They didn't even seem to bother to try, here.