Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
82 games...gonna lose a couple
-
Welcome to the WDWMAGIC.COM Forums!
Please take a look around, and feel free to sign up and join the community.
Will Disneyland USA suffer? ALL Of Disney's Theme Parks Now Closed - Reopening Dates Unknown
- Thread starter TP2000
- Start date
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
88Ah! When were the Calgary Olympics again? 1988? 1992? I forget. I have always wanted to go to the Calgary Stampede! I've been to the Ellensburg Rodeo a few times, which is the Washington state version of the Stampede, but obviously not on such a grand scale as Calgary.
And I had no idea this website was based in Great Britain! They sure hide it well, what with all us Americans crawling all over it. I just assumed it was based out of Orlando.
I'm going to try to spell things the British way from now on here, like World of Colour.
Back OT, interesting article in the Journal today about the complete crash of Chinese tourism abroad.
From Bangkok to the Boulevards of Paris, Absence of Chinese Tourists Hits Hard
With Chinese visitors now the most lucrative group for many countries’ tourist industries, the coronavirus that is keeping those travelers at home is having a widespread impact.www.wsj.com
Ismael Flores
Well-Known Member
Just for correction If I remember correctly percentage ownership in equity changed.
Disney now owns 48% and Chinese Government owns 52% .
The contract changed in 2009 when the Chinese Government and Disney worked out a new deal when dealing out plans for expansion.
Disney would invest more for the expansion and therefore the government would reduce its investment and hand over Disney the additional 5% .
1998 terms = 43% Disney / 57% Chinese Government.
2009 terms = 48% Disney / 52% Chinese Government.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
The percentages changed again. I don’t recall to what but Disney’s stake decreased.
Ismael Flores
Well-Known Member
not really it just means that the Chinese government has control.
Ismael Flores
Well-Known Member
when did that happen? I do not recall any changes, what financial changes happen for Disney to give up those 5% they gained. Seems odd. I know that Chinese government wanted to limit its risks and backlash from the public but knew they needed to expand and that is why they made the change in 2009. thanks for heads up I will have to read up on that
Ismael Flores
Well-Known Member
Just checked the Hong Kong site and the corporate information page and the break down is
53 percent Hong government
47 percent Disney
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
I don’t live in a world where control does not mean ownership
...you’ll see when I buy 51% of Disney
I'm afraid you're reading way too much into my comments on Wuhan. China is huge, but it is also a poor country with a GDP per capita of only about $9,000 per person per year. It just surprises me how there is a few hundred million people in China who are wealthy enough to travel internationally, while the other Billion are not. What changes that country has seen in the last 20 years!
But a week ago I'd never heard of Wuhan. Had you??? A week ago could you point out Hebei province on a map, much less Wuhan? I certainly couldn't pick out Wuhan on a map, and I doubt most Americans could. I still can't, although I now know it's in the central interior area of China, southwest of Shanghai. Thus, I stand by my claim that Wuhan is an obscure place for me and most Americans.
Obscure. adjective
- not discovered or known about; uncertain.
But if you had a previous relationship and affinity for Wuhan and/or Hebei province prior to a week ago, then even you must admit that's a pretty rare thing for an American.
Otherwise, I'll keep reading my subscriptions to the New York Times, Los Angeles Times and whatever else realclearworld.com throws my way each morning and see what else they have to say about Wuhan and Communist China.
My understanding is that my retired life of leisure allows me to be actually pretty well read, compared to most Americans who barely have time to tune in to news radio on their commute or watch 20 minutes of the local TV news. I did, after all, start this thread within a few minutes of waking up last Friday and reading the breaking news from the BBC that Shanghai Disneyland had closed indefinitely.
This was literally what you said:
"What the heck was that person doing in Wuhan, and why would they then come to Orange County, California???"
I don't know how I or anyone can read that line to mean anything other than you're surprised someone from a Chinese city would even be in Orange County because its some backward watered city. And you're literally talking about ONE person, so yes its not a shock people from any part of China could come.
And I wasn't saying you're not well read or educated in general, clearly you are. But it doesn't mean you are well read in everything and that obviously includes China. You said it yourself you didn't know anything about Wuhan until a week ago and that's probably 90% of the world who were not raised or lives in China, including myself. I'm not pretending to be some expert on China. I have traveled there a few times on and off for the last twenty years so I know a little more about it than someone who may not have been there but still not that much. But again none of that is my point. My only point was sadly you just ASSUMED the city was poor and backwards without even learning anything about it beyond the current crisis its under. THAT'S my point man. Read your above sentence again. You made a really ignorant statement of a city you already said you knew nothing about. You included 'modern times' as if Wuhan wasn't a modern, diverse and prosperous city. Guess what, it IS. It's not Hong Kong or Shanghai either which everyone knows and thinks of just like many outside of America thinks of New York and Los Angeles as modern and well off places but may not think about the many others they never heard of.
And nearly half of America lives in poverty today. 140 million Americans lives UNDER the poverty line. Yes we're obviously richer overall but no one acts shocked when Americans go places or do things regardless where they are from because people globally perceive most Americans to at least be well off even when in reality most Americans are actually struggling to some degree. It's no different than the Chinese and most countries. America just has a stronger middle class fortunately which China's is much smaller by comparison.
Anyway I'm not trying to paint you as a bad person, You're a good guy, I know this. But I really can't stand how pretentious your posts come off sometimes about other people. I ignore it because I know you don't mean any harm by it, but this one just went too far IMO so I spoke up. I was really just trying to make it clear your thoughts on the city were in fact wrong and very off. And I know that was not your intent with this thread but it was really just to talk about the economic impact it would have on the other parks. But I knew it was going go beyond that with people who are clearly ignorant about China as a country and it would lead into those discussions. China is not perfect by a wide margin and people are correct about many issues of the government, but all the people there don't represent the government's views just like we know not all Americans represents its governments views, especially now.
OK, I'm done.
Where the heck did you get that stat from?
This chart only shows through 2017 at 12.3%, but the poverty rate in the USA declined further to 11.8% in 2018, and declined again in 2019 (official stats not released yet) likely to around 11.5%.
Last edited:
Where the heck did you get that stat from?
The current poverty rate in the USA declined to 11.8% in 2018, and is well under 12% for 2019 and still dropping.
From here:
Millions of us are living in poverty — we need investments to raise the standard of living
The official poverty measure is a very poor indicator of economic hardship in this country. In 2018, the Federal Poverty Level for a family of four in the mainland United States was $25,1…
thehill.com
In a 2017 study, the Institute for Policy Studies and the Poor People’s Campaign counted the number of people living at up to twice the SPM. All told, they found around 140 million Americans who are poor or low-income. These roughly 140 million people make up over 43 percent of the population — about equal to the proportion of Americans the Fed found who can't afford a single $400 emergency.
Look dude we can quarrel over the statistics all day long, the point is a large segment of the richest country in the world are deeply poor or at the very least just a few pay checks away from falling into homelessness. My only point is end of the day despite our freedoms and opportunities that still doesn't translate to a huge portion of people many right here in California.
As if half of the United States being plunged into poverty this afternoon wasn't already bad enough, the Coronavirus fallout is now adding insult to injury today for Disney theme parks in this country.
Over on the WDW side of this British forum, a solid insider named @WDW Pro just dropped this unfortunate news (bolded the key sentence for this thread)...
"Per a reliable source, I'm informed that an upcoming meeting in two weeks to determine potential changes / expansions for Galaxy's Edge has been put on hold with a tentative meeting in April that exists more as a placeholder than anything. This meeting was to be attended physically or via teleconference by Bob Chapek, Megan Crumpacker, Vanessa Morrison, Kris Theiler, Josh D'Amaro, Phil Holmes, and Kareem Daniel (among others). The cancellation of this meeting is directly due to the closure of parks in Asia, which is placing a hold on all potential future expansion expenditures for domestic parks until a more firm outlook in that region can be determined. Furthermore, I was told that a contingency plan is in place should Asian parks remain closed for significant durations that would see one of the water parks at WDW closed for the spring, as well as all mini-golf venues, and reduced hours at the parks (think opening times of 10 am for non-MK parks). All of these changes are ONLY on the table if Asian parks stay closed for months. The belief is that WDW can absorb cuts much better than DLR, which is already being run on lower staffing due to the summer "Close the Gap" initiative. Regardless though, any changes for Galaxy's Edge at either US park is now on hold."
Our favorite insider @marni1971, who even I know is British, responded immediately with this unsurprising yet very interesting point about Disneyland...
"Disneyland was hit hard last summer. I had a chat last week with someone who went into detail about how badly. This would be a double whammy that would also have a knock on effect on the east coast."
And so it begins...
Over on the WDW side of this British forum, a solid insider named @WDW Pro just dropped this unfortunate news (bolded the key sentence for this thread)...
"Per a reliable source, I'm informed that an upcoming meeting in two weeks to determine potential changes / expansions for Galaxy's Edge has been put on hold with a tentative meeting in April that exists more as a placeholder than anything. This meeting was to be attended physically or via teleconference by Bob Chapek, Megan Crumpacker, Vanessa Morrison, Kris Theiler, Josh D'Amaro, Phil Holmes, and Kareem Daniel (among others). The cancellation of this meeting is directly due to the closure of parks in Asia, which is placing a hold on all potential future expansion expenditures for domestic parks until a more firm outlook in that region can be determined. Furthermore, I was told that a contingency plan is in place should Asian parks remain closed for significant durations that would see one of the water parks at WDW closed for the spring, as well as all mini-golf venues, and reduced hours at the parks (think opening times of 10 am for non-MK parks). All of these changes are ONLY on the table if Asian parks stay closed for months. The belief is that WDW can absorb cuts much better than DLR, which is already being run on lower staffing due to the summer "Close the Gap" initiative. Regardless though, any changes for Galaxy's Edge at either US park is now on hold."
Our favorite insider @marni1971, who even I know is British, responded immediately with this unsurprising yet very interesting point about Disneyland...
"Disneyland was hit hard last summer. I had a chat last week with someone who went into detail about how badly. This would be a double whammy that would also have a knock on effect on the east coast."
And so it begins...
SuddenStorm
Well-Known Member
As if half of the United States being plunged into poverty this afternoon wasn't already bad enough, the Coronavirus fallout is now adding insult to injury today for Disney theme parks in this country.
Over on the WDW side of this British forum, a solid insider named @WDW Pro just dropped this unfortunate news (bolded the key sentence for this thread)...
"Per a reliable source, I'm informed that an upcoming meeting in two weeks to determine potential changes / expansions for Galaxy's Edge has been put on hold with a tentative meeting in April that exists more as a placeholder than anything. This meeting was to be attended physically or via teleconference by Bob Chapek, Megan Crumpacker, Vanessa Morrison, Kris Theiler, Josh D'Amaro, Phil Holmes, and Kareem Daniel (among others). The cancellation of this meeting is directly due to the closure of parks in Asia, which is placing a hold on all potential future expansion expenditures for domestic parks until a more firm outlook in that region can be determined. Furthermore, I was told that a contingency plan is in place should Asian parks remain closed for significant durations that would see one of the water parks at WDW closed for the spring, as well as all mini-golf venues, and reduced hours at the parks (think opening times of 10 am for non-MK parks). All of these changes are ONLY on the table if Asian parks stay closed for months. The belief is that WDW can absorb cuts much better than DLR, which is already being run on lower staffing due to the summer "Close the Gap" initiative. Regardless though, any changes for Galaxy's Edge at either US park is now on hold."
Our favorite insider @marni1971, who even I know is British, responded immediately with this unsurprising yet very interesting point about Disneyland...
"Disneyland was hit hard last summer. I had a chat last week with someone who went into detail about how badly. This would be a double whammy that would also have a knock on effect on the east coast."
And so it begins...
Yikes. A long timer I worked with (I'm talking 30 years) who I really enjoyed talking old school Disneyland with when it was slow talked about how signficant the changes were when Pressler took over. When asked what they thought of the changes we saw this last summer, their response was "it's even worse now'.
Granted, this is from a lower level employee in the park who probably hasn't been to TDA since Traditions- but it was still an interesting take on modern Disneyland.
I am genuinely curious though... how would closing a water park make up for lost revenue in Asia? I assume the water park makes money, so wouldn't closing it decrease revenue- which I assume will be desperately needed?
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
Woah woah woah...
Let’s just nip this “changes or expansions for Abrams Edge” nonsense in the bud now...
That would have ZERO to do with China. It was already not an option.
I get people love baby yoda (if they haven’t forgotten him...as a year long hiatus is underway...) but are we STILL not accepting what has happened with that franchise and the parks??...they have bigger problems there already.
Don’t want to Jack the thread...so I’ll offer this take and move on.
Let’s just nip this “changes or expansions for Abrams Edge” nonsense in the bud now...
That would have ZERO to do with China. It was already not an option.
I get people love baby yoda (if they haven’t forgotten him...as a year long hiatus is underway...) but are we STILL not accepting what has happened with that franchise and the parks??...they have bigger problems there already.
Don’t want to Jack the thread...so I’ll offer this take and move on.
I think it's probably an easy way for them to cut labor costs, which are often a businesses biggest expenditure.
No one goes to Disney World for the water parks, they go for the rides and the whole "Disney!" thing. So they could close a water park and a mini golf course, plus cut out a few Jungle Cruise launches and shave an hour or two off the park operating hours, and people would still show up. They would be trying to squeeze more customers through a smaller operational hole, but it would mostly work and the customers wouldn't cancel their vacations over it. And they'd save money in America as the Chinese parks bleed cash.
No, don't move on, it's a valid point!
There are definitely creative problems with how Star Wars Land turned out and what they decided (well, what Mr. Chapek decided) to cut and remove from the final product before they opened it to the paying public. For the long term health of the land on both coasts, I am now of the opinion they have got to figure out how to back away from the restrictive timeline and character issues they created for themselves.
If I pay good money to go to Star Wars Land, I need to see Darth Vader and C3PO and the whole gang! Not that blue-haired woman no one cares about who mumbles nonsense to you in passing.
That said, there was apparently a meeting to discuss Star Wars Land expansion and the meeting included top executives from LucasFilm, Imagineering, and the two theme parks that Star Wars Land is in.
So something was afoot for Star Wars Land until last week when the Chinese parks were closed indefinitely and the entire Communist China business model began to collapse.
Last edited:
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
I’ll pass...this is turning to a great discussion...and I’ll ignite the Disney Wars Defense League if I go on.I think it's probably an easy way for them to cut labor costs, which are often a businesses biggest expenditure.
No one goes to Disney World for the water parks, they go for the rides and the whole "Disney!" thing. So they could close a water park and a mini golf course, plus cut out a few Jungle Cruise launches and shave an hour or two off the park operating hours, and people would still show up. They would be trying to squeeze more customers through a smaller operational hole, but it would mostly work and the customers wouldn't cancel their vacations over it. And they'd save money in America as the Chinese parks bleed cash.
No, don't move on, it's a valid point!
There are definitely creative problems with how Star Wars Land turned out and what they decided (well, what Mr. Chapek decided) to cut and remove from the final product before they opened it to the paying public. For the long term health of the land on both coasts, I am now of the opinion they have got to figure out how to back away from the restrictive timeline and character issues they created for themselves.
If I pay good money to go to Star Wars Land, I need to see Darth Vader and C3PO and the whole gang! Not that blue-haired woman no one cares about who mumbles nonsense to you in passing.
That said, there was apparently a meeting to discuss Star Wars Land expansion and the meeting included top executives from LucasFilm, Imagineering, and the two theme parks that Star Wars Land is in.
So something was afoot for Star Wars Land until last week when the Chinese parks were closed indefinitely and the entire Communist China business model began to collapse.
So “carry on”
By the way though...the management of lucasfilm is going to be totally replaced. There’s already hints of that in motion. The timing and how they spin it isn’t known - but it won’t change the truth behind it.
socalifornian
Well-Known Member
I vote FiloniI’ll pass...this is turning to a great discussion...and I’ll ignite the Disney Wars Defense League if I go on.
So “carry on”
By the way though...the management of lucasfilm is going to be totally replaced. There’s already hints of that in motion. The timing and how they spin it isn’t known - but it won’t change the truth behind it.
I would think closing one water park will increase attendance for the other water park, thus concentrating attendance and labor.
They are still faced with Star Wars Land as an upcharge and unpopular sequel trilogy experience, not helped by inability for anyone to get a Rise of Resistance ride who doesn’t show up early. “Invasion of the Body Snatchers” Star Wars. Whose Star Was?”
They are still faced with Star Wars Land as an upcharge and unpopular sequel trilogy experience, not helped by inability for anyone to get a Rise of Resistance ride who doesn’t show up early. “Invasion of the Body Snatchers” Star Wars. Whose Star Was?”
This might seem crazy but can WDW deny entrance to a guest who attempts to enter a water park who is visible sick ( coughs, sneezing) ? It would be a illness waiting to spread.
Sirwalterraleigh
Premium Member
This is the thought process
Waterparks have always been “break even”. Which is treated as a disaster in the swamp. The reality is near ALL of the profit is generated from merch in the parks and the waterparks do basically zilch. The rest is gobbled up by overhead and waterparks have to be “over staffed” due to what they are.
If Disney had it to do overagain...they would not have built waterparks in the design they have...it would have been more of a hybrid approach - somehow.
How has the crowd been for the force awakens ride in Disneyland? I haven’t been watching that. Florida is indicative of one thing as always: desperation for anything due to a reduction of investment decades ago. They drink the sand. See: mine train, Dopeys dinky coaster
Last edited: