DAK Why a Soarin' style attraction? Why not ... ?

toolsnspools

Well-Known Member
It's always interesting to realize how people can see things so differently. I agree that the flaws on the screen in Soarin' that have developed over time are distracting and inexcusable. However, I have been on every flight simulation attraction in Disney, Universal and many other parks and I think that Soarin' simulates real flight far better than any other ride I have been on.
It's best if you can get the center seat so you're right in the middle of the projection. I have a great story from our first family trip to WDW in 2006. If you're up for it keep reading. Otherwise you've been warned. :-)

It was the "Year of a Million Dreams" campaign and we were at EPCOT on our first day. We were milling around in The Land looking for what we could do when a small kid zipped in front of me and almost tripped me up. Not far behind him was a very apologetic grandfather trying to chase him down. I was all smiles and told him not to worry, it was no big deal, and good luck keeping up with the little trooper. Apparently a CM saw this encounter and was impressed by my level of compassion. He walked up and asked if we were going to ride Soarin'. I said we had hoped to, but the line was about 45 minutes so we were going to wait till the line died down. He said follow me, this is the "Year of a Million Dreams" and we had just been picked for a special treat. He walked us out through the greenhouses and out the back door of the pavilion. We came in one of the emergency exit doors right by the loading bays for Soarin'. They announced our names as special guests and winners in the "Year of a Million Dreams" and put in the center seats for ride. It's one of the customer service moments that made Disney stick out in my mind as great place to vacation. They need another campaign like that. It was a great way to create memories for guests, and to prompt CMs to look for ways to go the extra mile.
 

flyerjab

Well-Known Member
I agree, I love Soarin'. I could sit there and ride it over and over if they let me.

One other aspect of Soarin' that I love is the music and I am hoping that the music that is finalized is similar to the soundtrack James Horner made for the movie. It is brilliant.

It is so tragic that he passed away. Watching his interviews now after his death and he seemed like such a genuinely nice person. In addition to James Horner the man, he was an amazing musical talent. I can't express how much I love his Avatar soundtrack. I listen to it as background music in the car or at work. Hopefully they have enough source music from James Horner to work with as I am hoping it is present both in this ride and throughout the expansion.
 

rioriz

Well-Known Member
https://www.vekoma.com/index.php/specialities-and-attractions/panoramic-flight-simulator
This assumingly the ride mechanism we are getting. With 6 degrees of freedom this ride will move much like a coaster with the exception that it never leaves the show building. IMO the perfect set up for what James has in mind.

If we are truly immersing ourselves into the Pandorain world who the heck wants coaster tracks weaving in and out of the environment. With all the talk of keeping within theme...that would take me right out of it (plus the screams and yelling). Disney and Cameron want an environment they can control and I feel this and the boat ride were the best choices
 

bakntime

Well-Known Member
Count me in as someone who also loves Soarin. It's one of my favorites. Looking at the "pieces" -- a 2D film on a large screen, a barely-moving seat -- you'd think it might not be so convincing. But everything comes together so well that it's incredibly immersive. If you sort of "force" yourself to look straight ahead it's a very immersive experience. Add in a beautiful soundtrack and the smells, and it just seems to evoke a sense of beauty and wonder in a way that very few attractions do. When the film goes digital like they've done at DCA, it will be all the better.

The thing that has me excited the most for Flight of Passage is something you might not expect, and that's Mickey's Philharmagic. Specifically, the Alladin sequence. That's a convincing feeling of flight, despite the fact the seats don't even move.
 

bakntime

Well-Known Member
https://www.vekoma.com/index.php/specialities-and-attractions/panoramic-flight-simulator
This assumingly the ride mechanism we are getting. With 6 degrees of freedom this ride will move much like a coaster with the exception that it never leaves the show building. IMO the perfect set up for what James has in mind.

If we are truly immersing ourselves into the Pandorain world who the heck wants coaster tracks weaving in and out of the environment. With all the talk of keeping within theme...that would take me right out of it (plus the screams and yelling). Disney and Cameron want an environment they can control and I feel this and the boat ride were the best choices

Exactly. Roller coasters are terribly hard to theme. I'd rather Disney not try to compete with the "coaster parks" anyway. It's a losing battle to try and theme a mega-coaster convincingly so that it doesn't look, sound, and feel like a coaster. To do that, you need to scale down the coaster (smaller, slower, no inversions ... like Gringotts, Big Thunder, Seven Dwarfs, etc) in order to make it fit into an environment.

And I'll add that there are also segments in Transformers and Spider-Man where the vehicle is barely moving at all (just doing the "move-in-place" type of thing that a simulator like Star Tours does), and yet those "sitting in front of a screen" segments feel incredibly fast-paced and action-packed. Star Tours (specifically the new revision) does a great job of making you feel like you're not sitting in one spot. With that in mind, a well-done simulator attraction that doesn't actually physically move you through a space can do wonders in convincing you that you're moving.

I think that a good attraction relies as much on execution as it does ride system. You can have a great concept for a ride system, but if it's poorly executed, it amounts to nothing. It's all about finding the right ride system to immerse you in the type of experience they want you to have. In this case, I don't know of a better way to simulate flying through the Pandora environment than with the ride system they've chosen (big dome screen, motion base seats). Execution will be the key. With quality 3D visuals, a well-programmed motion base, and a great soundtrack, I'm ready to fly.
 

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
People started using "soarin 2.0" as an insult. In confident it'll be as much like soarin as back to the future was like soarin. A simulator of some type with some sort of large format image.

There aren't too many ways to Do a flying attraction, and even less to mimic the flying sequences of Avatar. And given that the movie was famous for its CG visuals and use of 3d - well it's definitely a logical type of attraction to build. Much more so than a coaster.

Assuming what we've heard is true and the fact Cameron is involved it's reasonable to suspect the image tech will be cutting edge in both use of 3d and dynamic range. I know personally that in Hollywood in general there's some truly groundbreaking stuff in development that redefines how realistic an image can look and people like Cameron have been the ones all over it. And there were rumors to this effect not too long ago.

Combine that with a much more capable ride system, and maybe some other physical elements (some have hinted at the possible use of animatronics and/or real set pieces in addition to the screen) and you can easily have a very impressive attraction that is like Soarin only in its basic principles.

^^^^
What this poster said.
You've got a tech movie, more famous for its visuals than anything else really - and its flying sequence is going to be rendered in ride form.
How else to do it? 'Cept maybe a Mission Mars style, but I'm glad it won't be.
 

Incomudro

Well-Known Member
also don't forget possible physical elements like animatronics and maybe some sets

Yeah, I'm wondering if there may be more theming mixed in.
Soarin is essentially a bare room.
This Avatar ride may be in a more heavily themed room - I think that is likely.
I also wonder about the possibility of some animatronics mixed in (a bit like A Bugs Life) as well as a greater use of scents, wind, water etc.
 

UpAllNight

Well-Known Member
It's always interesting to realize how people can see things so differently. I agree that the flaws on the screen in Soarin' that have developed over time are distracting and inexcusable. However, I have been on every flight simulation attraction in Disney, Universal and many other parks and I think that Soarin' simulates real flight far better than any other ride I have been on.


I only went on it once but the marks on the screen possibly affected my experience far more than it should have. They were just distracting and I kept looking at them not knowing what it was. Poor show. The affects of the distraction were vast because I actually don't recall any smells, and the music hasn't particularly stuck in my mind. We were also top left corner and I imagine it's better more central. I had high hopes for it but I genuinely came off it disappointed and a bit deflated and I couldn't understand the fuss.
 

wdizneew

Well-Known Member
According to the picture on the Vekoma site, the loading platform is very intimate (similar to Simpsons/Back to the Future). There is a door (right side in the photo) that will open up in front and the vehicle will move forward out toward the screen.

I'm speculating that the seats will be like sitting on a saddle rather than a flat seat. That would make it more realistic to sitting on a banshee and distinguish it from Soarin's hang gliders.

IMG_2121.jpg
 

andre85

Well-Known Member
According to the picture on the Vekoma site, the loading platform is very intimate (similar to Simpsons/Back to the Future). There is a door (right side in the photo) that will open up in front and the vehicle will move forward out toward the screen.

I'm speculating that the seats will be like sitting on a saddle rather than a flat seat. That would make it more realistic to sitting on a banshee and distinguish it from Soarin's hang gliders.

Interesting. Hopefully it's not better than Simpsons/BttF was, which alwayd felt really cheap to me--at least in the pre-show room where you could hear--and fell-everything happening in the ride itself (and that hallway leading to it felt so out of place)
 

cjkeating

Well-Known Member
Has Vekoma actually made any of their 'Panoramic Flight Simulators'? If so does anyone know the name so we can find some YouTube videos/reviews of the attractions?
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member
Has Vekoma actually made any of their 'Panoramic Flight Simulators'? If so does anyone know the name so we can find some YouTube videos/reviews of the attractions?

According to this article there is one in a theme park in Taiwan, but I can't find a video of it...

http://parkvault.net/tag/panoramic-flight-simulator/

I appears that this ride system was actually developed by the Taiwanese company Brogent. According to their web site there will be a Flying Over America attraction based on this opening at the Mall of America in Spring 2016...

http://www.brogent.com/en/news/view/621
 

Absimilliard

Well-Known Member
There is currently one Brogent i-Ride operating in North America: Flyover Canada in Vancouver, BC. It is a custom 61 seats installation and they are the same operator that is building Flyover America which is coming soon at the Mall of America. As for Taiwan Formosa/Fly Over Taiwan at EDA Theme Park in Taiwan, there are no videos of the attraction on youtube.

This video shows Flyover Canada.



I am not sure that Brogent Technologies is doing the Avatar ride system. There are many companies doing that kind of ride system and maybe WDI designed one themselves again?
 

Absimilliard

Well-Known Member
I rode Flyover Taiwan in 2010 when it opened and again in 2015 and I would rate it high over the original Soarin' over California. Music wise, it is similar to Soarin' and the images are breathtaking. Plus, as a bonus, they added in mandarin and english the name of the locations we fly over. The ride system is incredible and is capable of anything a Star Tours or Simpsons/BTTF ride vehicle is capable of. Very flexible operationally due to the multi level setup, since when I was there this year, they started with one level (3 cars of 5 passengers) and opened and closed the other levels to manage the waiting line.

The one ride I am looking forward to riding is "Fuji Airway" at Fuji-Q Highland in Japan. Picture Soarin'... but flying around Mount Fuji.
 

danlb_2000

Premium Member
There is currently one Brogent i-Ride operating in North America: Flyover Canada in Vancouver, BC. It is a custom 61 seats installation and they are the same operator that is building Flyover America which is coming soon at the Mall of America. As for Taiwan Formosa/Fly Over Taiwan at EDA Theme Park in Taiwan, there are no videos of the attraction on youtube.

This video shows Flyover Canada.



I am not sure that Brogent Technologies is doing the Avatar ride system. There are many companies doing that kind of ride system and maybe WDI designed one themselves again?


The layout of the ride that is being built appears very similar to what is shown for this ride system on the Vekoma site, and since Disney works with them a lot, it's likely they are doing the ride system.
 

cookiee_munster

Well-Known Member
hmm. i'm wondering if the actual vehicle you ride in will be something that looks like it's been developed by the scientists still on pandora, so it'll have this kind of unfinished/rough clunky quality of something that's meant for studying out in the field and just been bashed together seeing as they don't have any proper materials etc...

The banshee will be more "behind the scene's" and will pick up the vehicle with its claws and take you on your way... you won't be able to actually see the banshee above you because of the canopy. but im sure all kinds of effects will be included like sounds and air flow to simulate its wings flapping.

that's how i see it anyway. i honestly don't see how else they'll pull it off. riding on its back just gives me a headache trying to work out how that could be done technically and thematically...
 

bakntime

Well-Known Member
hmm. i'm wondering if the actual vehicle you ride in will be something that looks like it's been developed by the scientists still on pandora, so it'll have this kind of unfinished/rough clunky quality of something that's meant for studying out in the field and just been bashed together seeing as they don't have any proper materials etc...

The banshee will be more "behind the scene's" and will pick up the vehicle with its claws and take you on your way... you won't be able to actually see the banshee above you because of the canopy. but im sure all kinds of effects will be included like sounds and air flow to simulate its wings flapping.

that's how i see it anyway. i honestly don't see how else they'll pull it off. riding on its back just gives me a headache trying to work out how that could be done technically and thematically...
The only way I see them possibly trying to simulate riding on the back of anything is if they use the motorbike coaster seats. I don't think they will, though.

Vekoma-motorbike-launch-coaster.jpg
 

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