What's Still On and What's Now Off

TrainChasers

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure how big of a deal this is, because I think most people who are uncomfortable with one-on-one interactions aren't going to meet and greets or character dining. If it's a parent who's uncomfortable, it probably doesn't matter because their kid likely loves it and that's why almost certainly why they are doing the activity.
Agreed. The people booking character meals (and paying the $$$) want the character interaction.
 

bcoachable

Well-Known Member
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In short most of the workers on EPCOT Center were laid off after the park was opened. Five years later the division was enjoying a renaissance albeit with new management.
Ok- yea- got ya! This is somewhat of a normal cycle for this profession, however, right? For instance, when Toy Story Land completes construction, many are sent packing- waiting for (let’s say) Universal to pick them up as their new park (would have) picked up pace?
Marni- what I’m alluding to is a Wholesale change in buisness model that would allow outside firms to “Dream it up” when a high up the CEO chain makes the call to build the next (let’s just say) Indiana Jones Land at Animal Kingdom- instead of going to what has been Imagineering.
 

marni1971

WDW History nut
Premium Member
Ok- yea- got ya! This is somewhat of a normal cycle for this profession, however, right? For instance, when Toy Story Land completes construction, many are sent packing- waiting for (let’s say) Universal to pick them up as their new park (would have) picked up pace?
Marni- what I’m alluding to is a Wholesale change in buisness model that would allow outside firms to “Dream it up” when a high up the CEO chain makes the call to build the next (let’s just say) Indiana Jones Land at Animal Kingdom- instead of going to what has been Imagineering.
I’m sure someone in a cubicle has a spreadsheet somewhere saying it’s cheaper for a few key in-house designers to come up with something and have someone else build it from start to finish for them. Third parties have been involved with Glendale for a long time already but outsourcing always works right?
 

bcoachable

Well-Known Member
I’m sure someone in a cubicle has a spreadsheet somewhere saying it’s cheaper for a few key in-house designers to come up with something and have someone else build it from start to finish for them. Third parties have been involved with Glendale for a long time already but outsourcing always works right?
I like the way they (Disney & Imagineering) have been doing it for years- except for how much more it seems to cost WDI to do similar in Scale projects at other theme parks...
 

peoplemover

Active Member
I'm not sure how big of a deal this is, because I think most people who are uncomfortable with one-on-one interactions aren't going to meet and greets or character dining. If it's a parent who's uncomfortable, it probably doesn't matter because their kid likely loves it and that's almost certainly why they are doing the activity.
This. Definitely taking advantage of CRTs lack of one-on-one interactions to pay a visit. 😂
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Ok- yea- got ya! This is somewhat of a normal cycle for this profession, however, right? For instance, when Toy Story Land completes construction, many are sent packing- waiting for (let’s say) Universal to pick them up as their new park (would have) picked up pace?
Marni- what I’m alluding to is a Wholesale change in buisness model that would allow outside firms to “Dream it up” when a high up the CEO chain makes the call to build the next (let’s just say) Indiana Jones Land at Animal Kingdom- instead of going to what has been Imagineering.
What your describing is how most parks operate and how Universal Creative operated for much of its existence. It’s also how, to a lesser extent, Shanghai Disneyland was supposed to be designed. It’s a process that can work, see Men in Black: Alien Attack or Hogsmead as examples. Even before the pandemic Walt Disney Imagineering would engage other firms for things like concept design. It’s a change that has been considered several times over the past 20 years but a lot of what hinders Imagineering from being light and nimble hinders such a drastic change.
 

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
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The whole point of character dining is 1 on 1 interaction without having to wait in line, while also saving time by having a meal.

No reason to pay full price without that personal touch.
People are paying it now for far away characters. For the most part the food isn't good but people will buy it up just to see people dressed as Mickey🙄
 

techgeek

Well-Known Member
This is somewhat of a normal cycle for this profession, however, right? For instance, when Toy Story Land completes construction, many are sent packing- waiting for (let’s say) Universal to pick them up as their new park (would have) picked up pace?

What your describing is how most parks operate and how Universal Creative operated for much of its existence. It’s also how, to a lesser extent, Shanghai Disneyland was supposed to be designed. It’s a process that can work, see Men in Black: Alien Attack or Hogsmead as examples

One critical point specific to the present day situation: Unlike previous business cycles where talent could easily drift from Disney to Universal to a 3rd party... whomever had the ‘gig’ at the moment, now nobody has work. Nobody is likely to have work for the foreseeable future. Not only is stuff not going to be designed in house, nothing is going to be designed at all... at least until the end of this is in sight and management decides to light up the furnace again.

When you’re looking at 6 months without work in your career, well...maybe you can wait that out. When it’s going to be at least a year and now maybe much longer? You start looking for a career change. Creative talent is going to be leaving attraction design and many other affected industries in droves.. I can paint this picture because I’m feeling the same pain in the live event industry. It may wind up being quite hard to ‘get the band back together again’ after all this shakes out. Time will tell.
 

GoofGoof

Premium Member
I’m still holding out hope that some of you guys are just wrong. I can’t imagine that Disney is just going to shift gears and eliminate parades, fireworks/nighttime shows, character meals and most of the entertainment in parks. I understand why it’s all gone today with Covid restrictions but I don’t think it’s a lock that none of it comes back ever. Some grim stuff for sure.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
I’m still holding out hope that some of you guys are just wrong. I can’t imagine that Disney is just going to shift gears and eliminate parades, fireworks/nighttime shows, character meals and most of the entertainment in parks. I understand why it’s all gone today with Covid restrictions but I don’t think it’s a lock that none of it comes back ever. Some grim stuff for sure.
I think the degree will correlate to how quickly tourism bounces back. Entertainment is easy capacity to add so if there is an actual bounce back then there will be a more sudden need for the capacity. If it is more gradual then that gives them more time to put off capacity and justify it as unnecessary.
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
I think so, but not before the nearly finished attractions are open to the public. They’d be out of their mind to rush this in the next year and a half, ahead of the nearly finished projects, to open a half baked Expansion. It would be bad for them financially, and it would bring them a lot of bad publicity (mostly from the Twitter Warriors expecting a modern masterpiece, less so from blokes like us).

Mind you, this is all speculation based on common sense.
Right...anything significantly vertical will be completed...they’ll just sit on them to save the “newness”

As far as new development?...could be 10 years.

I think the splash change will happen because it’s about repositioning for changing demographics...it’s not even political...they just know they will have to change their approach from 100 years of “waltiness”
 

Sirwalterraleigh

Premium Member
I’m still holding out hope that some of you guys are just wrong. I can’t imagine that Disney is just going to shift gears and eliminate parades, fireworks/nighttime shows, character meals and most of the entertainment in parks. I understand why it’s all gone today with Covid restrictions but I don’t think it’s a lock that none of it comes back ever. Some grim stuff for sure.

Well...I’m no expert. But I have been analyzing this for going on 30 years...
And my belief is that the travel/economic climate has changed...the company philosophy has changed...AND the consumers have changed.

That analysis says they don’t feel a need to spend at all to reward/entice. In that case - it’s only about numbers and those could suffer for a long time. The egg murders the chicken

I think the degree will correlate to how quickly tourism bounces back. Entertainment is easy capacity to add so if there is an actual bounce back then there will be a more sudden need for the capacity. If it is more gradual then that gives them more time to put off capacity and justify it as unnecessary.
I would agree...the problem is Disney no longer “prebuilds” to be ready for an influx...they let it happen and assume that more will immediately continue IF they build. Change in philosophy on a pretty big scale.
 

Brer Oswald

Well-Known Member
Right...anything significantly vertical will be completed...they’ll just sit on them to save the “newness”

As far as new development?...could be 10 years.

I think the splash change will happen because it’s about repositioning for changing demographics...it’s not even political...they just know they will have to change their approach from 100 years of “waltiness”
It probably sits well in their mind that it’s a retheme. Something “new” in advertisement that isn’t really that new at all.

Although it’s worth nothing that this will probably be their most expensive and difficult retheme of an existing ride. Splash is one of, if not the most detailed attraction in all of WDW. So yeah, good luck.
 

Surferboy567

Well-Known Member
Guardians, TRON, Rat, HarmoniUS, Play!, and the Galactic Star Cruiser will also happen at one point, so that will count as well.
To break it down further:

MK- 1 “E” Ticket and a retheme possibly.
Epcot- 4 additions, 2 can be argued are “E” tickets, 1 is a “E“ Ticket, a nighttime show, and a pavilion.
HWS- 1 hotel (too be fair though, it just got a huge expansion)
AK- ...wow AK really needs something eventually.
 

bcoachable

Well-Known Member
One critical point specific to the present day situation: Unlike previous business cycles where talent could easily drift from Disney to Universal to a 3rd party... whomever had the ‘gig’ at the moment, now nobody has work. Nobody is likely to have work for the foreseeable future. Not only is stuff not going to be designed in house, nothing is going to be designed at all... at least until the end of this is in sight and management decides to light up the furnace again.

When you’re looking at 6 months without work in your career, well...maybe you can wait that out. When it’s going to be at least a year and now maybe much longer? You start looking for a career change. Creative talent is going to be leaving attraction design and many other affected industries in droves.. I can paint this picture because I’m feeling the same pain in the live event industry. It may wind up being quite hard to ‘get the band back together again’ after all this shakes out. Time will tell.
My household understands... prayers and good vibes sent to you and all others as all involved in this boat figure out what is the best sail to hoist To move forward
 

Jrb1979

Well-Known Member
I’m still holding out hope that some of you guys are just wrong. I can’t imagine that Disney is just going to shift gears and eliminate parades, fireworks/nighttime shows, character meals and most of the entertainment in parks. I understand why it’s all gone today with Covid restrictions but I don’t think it’s a lock that none of it comes back ever. Some grim stuff for sure.
What if they went to only fireworks and parades in the busy season. Entertainment will come back but I have my doubts for inside resorts due to low ROI. A higher end Cedar Fair park wouldn't be that bad.
 

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