What's Next For DHS And AK??

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
What expansion besides FLE is there?

The needs for Epcot aren't as glaring as those of DHS or DAK. Soarin was added to Epcot in 2005, The Seas with Nemo and Friends was added in 2006, Gran Fiesta Tour was added in 2007 Spaceship Earth underwent a major refurbishment in 2008, Kim Possible was added in 2009, Captain EO was added in 2010 and Test track is undergoing a refurbishment in 2012.

Comparitively in DHS, Toy Story Mania opened in 2008, The American Idol Experience opened in 2009, and Star Tours opened in 2011.

Not every addition/change can be an E-Ticket, but the parks are all evolving. The problem is people just aren't happy with the current pace.
 

menamechris

Well-Known Member
The needs for Epcot aren't as glaring as those of DHS or DAK. Soarin was added to Epcot in 2005, The Seas with Nemo and Friends was added in 2006, Gran Fiesta Tour was added in 2007 Spaceship Earth underwent a major refurbishment in 2008, Kim Possible was added in 2009, Captain EO was added in 2010 and Test track is undergoing a refurbishment in 2012.

Comparitively in DHS, Toy Story Mania opened in 2008, The American Idol Experience opened in 2009, and Star Tours opened in 2011.

Not every addition/change can be an E-Ticket, but the parks are all evolving. The problem is people just aren't happy with the current pace.

I don't think it is just the pace. I think about half of the additions you mentioned are less than stellar for most people... And I personally don't really put redesigning or refurbing a ride in the category of "expansion". No more than I think painting the confectionary is an exciting addition to Main Street. I think this is where the difference of opinion lies for many..
 

Zummi Gummi

Pioneering the Universe Within!
I don't think it is just the pace. I think about half of the additions you mentioned are less than stellar for most people... And I personally don't really put redesigning or refurbing a ride in the category of "expansion". No more than I think painting the confectionary is an exciting addition to Main Street. I think this is where the difference of opinion lies for many..

Exactly. Giving a ride an extensive refurb or re-theming it does not constitute an expansion.

The needs for Epcot aren't as glaring as those of DHS or DAK. Soarin was added to Epcot in 2005, The Seas with Nemo and Friends was added in 2006, Gran Fiesta Tour was added in 2007 Spaceship Earth underwent a major refurbishment in 2008, Kim Possible was added in 2009, Captain EO was added in 2010 and Test track is undergoing a refurbishment in 2012.

Comparitively in DHS, Toy Story Mania opened in 2008, The American Idol Experience opened in 2009, and Star Tours opened in 2011.

Let's clarify...Star Tours 2.0 was about 5 years (if not more) overdue, and American Idol Experience opened 2 years too late, just as the show's popularity began to wane.

Also, Captain Eo wasn't new.
 

NoChesterHester

Well-Known Member
The needs for Epcot aren't as glaring as those of DHS or DAK. Soarin was added to Epcot in 2005, The Seas with Nemo and Friends was added in 2006, Gran Fiesta Tour was added in 2007 Spaceship Earth underwent a major refurbishment in 2008, Kim Possible was added in 2009, Captain EO was added in 2010 and Test track is undergoing a refurbishment in 2012.

Comparitively in DHS, Toy Story Mania opened in 2008, The American Idol Experience opened in 2009, and Star Tours opened in 2011.

Not every addition/change can be an E-Ticket, but the parks are all evolving. The problem is people just aren't happy with the current pace.

I get what you are saying, but calling EO an addition is stretching it. Don't forget that a big part of the Epcot experience is strolling and eating. We have seen two major additions to the World Showcase restaurants and a fairly systematic refurbishments to the others.

Hollywood Studios has definitely seen the most action lately with Toy Story and Star Tours. Both are major additions /upgrades. Doesn't matter in my opinion if it was "over due" ir not, HUGE upgrade to the park. Unfortunately the park still needs a lot more.

I agree with some earlier posters sentiment that AK doesn't really need an "expansion" per se. The park already is not lacking in land area. If it were filled in with some smaller level attractions we would all be satisfied for the time being.
 

Spike-in-Berlin

Well-Known Member
The needs for Epcot aren't as glaring as those of DHS or DAK. Soarin was added to Epcot in 2005, The Seas with Nemo and Friends was added in 2006, Gran Fiesta Tour was added in 2007 Spaceship Earth underwent a major refurbishment in 2008, Kim Possible was added in 2009, Captain EO was added in 2010 and Test track is undergoing a refurbishment in 2012.

Comparitively in DHS, Toy Story Mania opened in 2008, The American Idol Experience opened in 2009, and Star Tours opened in 2011.

Not every addition/change can be an E-Ticket, but the parks are all evolving. The problem is people just aren't happy with the current pace.

No not every addition can be an E-Ticket. But it should be at least an addition, a really new attraction in the parks roster not the just the replacement or changing of an already existing one. But with the exception of Soarin' (Kim Possible isn't even a real attraction, as it is only an interactive quest for kids) every other change at EPCOT you mentioned was no addition but a mere refurb, plussing or exchange, even Innoventions is only the former Communicore, Mission Space was only the replacement for Horizons, Test Track for WoM. Since the opening of Norway there was ONE real addition to the attractions roster, Soarin' but WoL was closed so since 1989 we even have a negative count. I mean ONE real addition in the meaning of an expansion in 22 years, that's already really sad. But to have EVEN LESS attractions than there were in the early 90ies, that's annoying.

The same count btw. for the MK. No expansion of the roster since Splash Mountain. The FLE only gives us TLM for former 20kLutS and SDMTR for SWSA, Barnbuster only becomes Great Goofini and Dumbo is only doubled. Expansion of the number of attractions at MK even with the FLE since Splash is ZERO because the Flying Carpets (which I consider a complete desaster in imagineering IMHO) are countered by the loss of the Skyway.

Compared to the real additions and expansions in DL this makes up quite a picture.
 

yeti

Well-Known Member
The same count btw. for the MK. No expansion of the roster since Splash Mountain. The FLE only gives us TLM for former 20kLutS and SDMTR for SWSA, Barnbuster only becomes Great Goofini and Dumbo is only doubled. Expansion of the number of attractions at MK even with the FLE since Splash is ZERO because the Flying Carpets (which I consider a complete desaster in imagineering IMHO) are countered by the loss of the Skyway.

I never understood this mentality. 20K is closed, can't making use of what was an empty lagoon/lawn for almost seventeen years be considered an expansion? Who cares if the number of attractions on the park map is the same as it was in '92? The way I see it, replacing old rides means making them more popular. Which technically "expands" the park.

Admittedly, this argument only applies to Fantasyland. If all replacements in the MK were as good as they should be, then we wouldn't be having this discussion right now.
 

Master Yoda

Pro Star Wars geek.
Premium Member
I never understood this mentality. 20K is closed, can't making use of what was an empty lagoon/lawn for almost seventeen years be considered an expansion? Who cares if the number of attractions on the park map is the same as it was in '92? The way I see it, replacing old rides means making them more popular. Which technically "expands" the park.

Admittedly, this argument only applies to Fantasyland. If all replacements in the MK were as good as they should be, then we wouldn't be having this discussion right now.
When you look at what was on the old 20k site, one D/E ticket attraction, and compare it to what will be there at the end of the construction, a TS restaurant, a QS restaurant, shops and 2 D ticket attractions, it is quite correct to call this project an expansion.
 

disney fan 13

Well-Known Member
i really wish they would have just done something with toontown and give the expansion to a park that in my opinion needs it... animal kingdom
 

menamechris

Well-Known Member
i really wish they would have just done something with toontown and give the expansion to a park that in my opinion needs it... animal kingdom

AK just needs to fill in what is there. It is the hugest theme park - and yet most of it you are just trekking to opposite corners of the park to do something. Hollywood Studios, on the other hand, has the biggest attraction practically on top of each other, and TSM around the corner. I have been to HS many times and never had to go to the other side of the park....
 

_Scar

Active Member
AK just needs to fill in what is there. It is the hugest theme park - and yet most of it you are just trekking to opposite corners of the park to do something. Hollywood Studios, on the other hand, has the biggest attraction practically on top of each other, and TSM around the corner. I have been to HS many times and never had to go to the other side of the park....

Epcot also has this problem. When I ventured to WS @ around 2-3pm barely anyone was back there. Insane!

And I wouldn't necessarily fault DAK for being large. It's just the balance of attractions is off. Basically on one side is LK and KJS and everything else is on the other side.
 

cheezbat

Well-Known Member
Epcot also has this problem. When I ventured to WS @ around 2-3pm barely anyone was back there. Insane!

And I wouldn't necessarily fault DAK for being large. It's just the balance of attractions is off. Basically on one side is LK and KJS and everything else is on the other side.

Haha...everything else...there's hardly anything in that everything you speak of. Everest, Kali, Dinosaur, Nemo...not much in this park. Trekking through it...yeah, it's themed well in most places, and it is a pretty park, but there's just way too much walking and not enough attractions along the way.

DAK needs more rides badly. That's obvious. Studios needs some more too. MK...sorry, but it's the freaking busiest theme park in the world. It NEEDS all the capacity it can get. The FLE isn't going to be enough. They need another E ticket elsewhere in the park, and any other expansions will be very welcome. That park is almost always crowded year round. Basically, all of WDW needs some things added.
 

jt04

Well-Known Member
Haha...everything else...there's hardly anything in that everything you speak of. Everest, Kali, Dinosaur, Nemo...not much in this park. Trekking through it...yeah, it's themed well in most places, and it is a pretty park, but there's just way too much walking and not enough attractions along the way.

DAK needs more rides badly. That's obvious. Studios needs some more too. MK...sorry, but it's the freaking busiest theme park in the world. It NEEDS all the capacity it can get. The FLE isn't going to be enough. They need another E ticket elsewhere in the park, and any other expansions will be very welcome. That park is almost always crowded year round. Basically, all of WDW needs some things added.

One of the ways to deal with the capacity issue is to add compelling elements to the other parks to draw crowds away from the MK. While I like the FLE, I think in this case they may have gotten the cart before the horse and it will only add to the MK's capacity issues. Whereas if they had expanded the other parks first and then the MK they could have better balanced out the crowds. But they are the experts so they know more than any of us.

As to what is needed at the Studios and DAK, no doubt a new land at DAK on the scale of Africa or Asia. It wouldn't have to be fully developed like Carsland but that would be nice. The Studios needs a couple more intense rides along the lines of ToT and RnRC in my opinion. Perhaps Marvel related content and the rumored Monsters coaster.
 

KCheatle

Well-Known Member
Abbreviation Overload!

While I agree with what I can understand of your post (e.g., there needs to be some serious work done to Hollywood Studios, and some, although not as much in my opinion, done to Animal Kingdom), my suggestion to you is that if you are going to use that many abbreviations, you should consider including a Key.

With that said, I love the idea of moving Pizza Planet next to Toy Story Mania!! With Narnia gone, that open space would be perfect and fit right in! I also love the idea of brining back Minnie and Mickey's houses to HS - great idea!

Disney really needs to get the creative juices flowing in HS. It's just too much merchandise and not enough to do ride- or entertainment - wise. It's definitely neither my nor my family's favorite park, and we usualy skip out early to go back to other parks or take the boat to the Beach Club to go to Beaches and Cream.

If they don't do something soon, people will start leaving the Disney property to get "thrills" elsewhere. People want to go on rides, and there are plenty of them in Orlando. If Disney doesn't do something soon, to at least HS, I'm certain people will start going elsewhere; myself included.:wave:
 

RSoxNo1

Well-Known Member
No not every addition can be an E-Ticket. But it should be at least an addition, a really new attraction in the parks roster not the just the replacement or changing of an already existing one. But with the exception of Soarin' (Kim Possible isn't even a real attraction, as it is only an interactive quest for kids) every other change at EPCOT you mentioned was no addition but a mere refurb, plussing or exchange, even Innoventions is only the former Communicore, Mission Space was only the replacement for Horizons, Test Track for WoM. Since the opening of Norway there was ONE real addition to the attractions roster, Soarin' but WoL was closed so since 1989 we even have a negative count. I mean ONE real addition in the meaning of an expansion in 22 years, that's already really sad. But to have EVEN LESS attractions than there were in the early 90ies, that's annoying.

The same count btw. for the MK. No expansion of the roster since Splash Mountain. The FLE only gives us TLM for former 20kLutS and SDMTR for SWSA, Barnbuster only becomes Great Goofini and Dumbo is only doubled. Expansion of the number of attractions at MK even with the FLE since Splash is ZERO because the Flying Carpets (which I consider a complete desaster in imagineering IMHO) are countered by the loss of the Skyway.

Compared to the real additions and expansions in DL this makes up quite a picture.

If refurbishments are improvements to what preceeded it then I considered it an addition. Star Tours 2 is a replacement/addition, but it improved the quality of the attraction in that space. I would argue (and I'm sure I'll catch some flack for this) that The Little Mermaid is an improvement over 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea.

The parks aren't standing still - they're not improving at the pace we would all like, but they're certainly not standing still.

I wasn't going to mention the new restaurants in World Showcase, but that's also a plus (at least in Italy). I also neglected to mention Sum of all Thrills - a very quality B ticket.

Having said all this - most of the parks have large areas for actual expansion, but personally I would rather see dead areas of the parks addressed before the footprint is expanded. Sure, I don't think something like Sounds Dangerous should close if there's no replacement under construction (anything that takes 2 guests out of the Toy Story line is a positive), but I'd rather see Sounds Dangerous replaced before they expand into the backlot area.

Over at the Animal Kingdom, I really don't think Dino-Rama is going to be replaced before an expansion. That doesn't make a lot of sense. That area was added for capacity purposes, so to demolish it without an additional Expansion would decrease that function. The problem is, for as well as that park was planned out, its prospects for expansion have many major hurdles. Removing Festival of the Lion King would be a huge mistake, and it may take some significant finagling to re-locate it. Otherwise that area needs to maintain a theme that includes Festival of the Lion King. In theory, Camp Minnie Mickey could be a gateway to another land and that would solve the problem.

There's a bit of room near Everest/Finding Nemo as well but that would require some infrastructure changes in and around the Discovery River Boat storage area.

The biggest issue (and biggest area for expansion) is behind Kali River Rapids. There really isn't enough room for a walking path to an entire land unless either the Wildlife Express Train and/or Maharajah Jungle Trek are removed/modified. This is part of the reason why I feel that this area should be used for a nighttime show, just because a winding path can be used for a queue, just not for a walking path to a land.

Part of the problem with the Animal Kingdom is that with most of the attractions being outdoors, they all take up a huge amount of space. People complain that the attractions are too spread out, but the reality is, the boundaries of the attractions are right next to each other.

The other possibility for expansion is the removal of the Discovery Island trails behind the Tree of Life and replacing them with elements of Flik's Fun Fair. This is a very well done done kiddy land in DCA, and while I enjoy walking behind the Tree of Life along those trails, those are animals that can easily be relocated or even integrated alongside the kiddy attractions.
 

Bairstow

Well-Known Member
\ I would argue (and I'm sure I'll catch some flack for this) that The Little Mermaid is an improvement over 20,000 Leagues Under the Sea.

Fire at will.
finestone-88mm-jpg.116
 

Zac Skellington

Well-Known Member
RSoxNo1; The other possibility for expansion is the removal of the Discovery Island trails behind the Tree of Life and replacing them with elements of Flik's Fun Fair. This is a very well done done kiddy land in DCA said:
:hurl:
Make that beautiful area into Chester and Hester's ?!?! Really?!
 

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