What if this thing fails?

[s8film40]

Disney is such a mammoth company, it is such a complex question. If you just focus on WDW... Star Wars Land is going to be enormously popular - so much so that I don't want to be anywhere near Orlando for the first few months the land is open.

People will still go to WDW. It's an incredibly popular vacation destination. The better question is, "What will happen to the loyalty Disney has built over the decades?"

For many of us, WDW is an important part of our vacation planning. It's almost impossible to eliminate it entirely but all the bad decisions and declining value is leading to less frequent trips and reduced spend on the trips we do take.

Yeah for the near term future everything is fine. Where it becomes interesting is in the long term. My generation grew up going to Disney in the 80's and 90's and as you say we have a strong loyalty to "Disney", but what happens as that brand becomes more and more diluted with new acquisitions like Star Wars, Marvel, Fox, etc. These parks will eventually become nearly unrecognizable as "Disney" parks. For the next generation it's going to all be about IP so then it simply becomes who has the most relevant IP. I think it's incredibly possible for Disney to lose it's foothold in the future. With the Disney loyalty and brand eroding, and Universal likely heading towards also having 4 parks it sets up a race for continually switching out IP's to stay on top.

Then the other issue is how long can the theme park concept as a whole even stand up. It's easy to imagine that within 100-200 years theme parks will seem quite antiquated compared to other options.

 

[righttrack]

Keeping up with the times is the most important thing while maintaining the nostalgia. WDW must continue to innovate and be like no other place in the world.

 

[DisneyJoe]

With everything that has suddenly come through Disney World: Star Wars, Toy Story, major re-refurbishments, classic ride closures, rising costs and upcharges within upcharges

Do you see these things as sudden changes?

 

[graphite1326]

Mammoth companies fail, they just fail bigger then small companies. They are still riding on the coattails of Walt, but, they are slowly pushing him and his memory out of the picture. That should be their biggest concern. They still provide a quality product, but, the cost of experiencing that just keeps going on and on. They have targeted money, money buys a lot of things but it will not keep a rich person going to the resort when the world is their oyster. They have complicated the process so much that you practically need month

SEARS for example.

 

[Club Cooloholic]

Mammoth companies fail, they just fail bigger then small companies. They are still riding on the coattails of Walt, but, they are slowly pushing him and his memory out of the picture. That should be their biggest concern. They still provide a quality product, but, the cost of experiencing that just keeps going on and on. They have targeted money, money buys a lot of things but it will not keep a rich person going to the resort when the world is their oyster. They have complicated the process so much that you practically need month

I think the magic bands were a terrible idea myself they officially killed spontaneity and cost so much Iwonder if they will ever become a relic like a hard copy hotel key now that smart phones can fo much of the same thing. I figure they stick around because they are harder to hack

 

[graphite1326]

I have been going for 20 years. However, I will soon be on a fixed income when I retire. For now we can still go but after our last trip we just don't feel the "magic" we used to. Some is due to cost for sure and some is due to the direction Disney is going. I can't see going 5 years from now. My children are now on their own but are not financially able to go. The OP may be onto something or at least us commoners will not be patrons.

 

[s8film40]

I think the magic bands were a terrible idea myself they officially killed spontaneity and cost so much Iwonder if they will ever become a relic like a hard copy hotel key now that smart phones can fo much of the same thing. I figure they stick around because they are harder to hack

Yeah that whole thing was so short sighted. Such a phenomenal amount of money wasted. They didn't even anticipate the well known coming of the chip cards for all those custom made POS terminals with Mickey's on them. I think they only lasted one or two years. Magicbands are totally unnecessary and everything could be done with a phone. The only reason the Magicbands are still around is because luckily for Disney they became a fad in themselves and are selling fairly well. Once that dies off I suspect the Magicbands will disappear rather quickly.

Really this whole thing is just one of many signs that Disney as a company doesn't really understand the business anymore, in much the same way years ago Sears didn't see the changing trends in the retail business. The beginning of the end has already happened, we're really just watching it all play out now.

 

[KBLovedDisney]

Do you see these things as sudden changes?

I guess I see them as sudden because it feels like all of the biggest changes came at one time. May not have happened suddenly in retrospect, but because of the magnitude of changes, it does feel very sudden IMHO.

 

[KDM31091]

I do think they are slowly pricing people out, and people are spreading the vacations out further and further. I don't see WDW failing, per se, but I do see it changing and not all for the better.

People also do have other options for vacations, and Disney need to keep that in mind. Some of the magic and charm is and has been disappearing.

 

[Chef Mickey]

Star Wars has a good solid franchise foundation with the movies that came out in the 70s and so forth.

But I truly wonder if the same could be said if they had made a land solely based on something other than Star Wars like The Pirates of the Caribbean franchise. However, TPoC films haven't been doing so good versus Star Wars and from what I hear, Disney is talking about possibly rebooting this franchise because of how bad it is doing.

But I am curious how long Star Wars and Toy Story will hold up.

You always risk IP going out of "favor" with guests and having shorter lifespans than generic attractions like the Haunted Mansion. It's why I don't really like everything being based on a movie. You already see Frozen dying down and we are stuck with the ride longer term. Sure, they can change it, but basing an entire concept on a movie kind of dates the attractions.

 

[jloucks]

What does TDC stand for?
I will say this, it looks like Disney is planning on pushing their customers to the cost brink. They can always lower prices or more likely add incentives to come to the parks. They should watch it though, Universal just ran a promo where you buy an annual pass and get 6 months free.
Edit addition: You wonder if they price themselves out of younger people and lose a generation. It's like baseball and other pro sports. They price themselves out of average family budgets, so less families go to games, less interest, lower ratings, half empty ballparks. Disney wont be empty today or in 5 years but it might lose attendance in say 20.

Why do you think they are on the brink? I would say, based on crowd levels, they are far from any brink.

I am not saying you are not correct. I am just wondering why we have such polar opposite opinions on this.

 

[jloucks]

They are morphing to something else. It used to be Disney had a different standard and way of doing business than say Six Flags. They sold stories not just rides. Well now they sell restaurants and beer to pull you in. I find it is not coincidental that they add alcohol to Magic Kingdom while closing all the kids clubs at the resort. One day they might morph into have the Main Street Medical Marijuana Dispensary, I am only half kidding with that. But it wont close just keep chugging.

I will say, being a regular Six Flags member for over a decade, the parks are slowly becoming more similar.

But to be clear, they are no where near the same thing. Yet.

 

[lazyboy97o]

The big threat to Disney’s parks (and even other aspects of the business like the movie studio) isn’t outright public disinterest but moderate interest. Disney’s costs keep ballooning which means each project has to generate more and more interest. The recent panic over soft attendance demonstrates that Disney doesn’t know how to handle such a situation.

 

[jloucks]

Theme parks and department stores aren't very equivalent, though. The internet killed Sears. I have a tough time seeing how anything could threaten WDW in that way.

WDW is a luxury good. One super nasty economic issue and WDW is in real trouble.

 

[jloucks]

The big threat to Disney’s parks (and even other aspects of the business like the movie studio) isn’t outright public disinterest but moderate interest. Disney’s costs keep ballooning which means each project has to generate more and more interest. The recent panic over soft attendance demonstrates that Disney doesn’t know how to handle such a situation.

"soft attendance"

I'm not buying it.

 

[Club Cooloholic]

You always risk IP going out of "favor" with guests and having shorter lifespans than generic attractions like the Haunted Mansion. It's why I don't really like everything being based on a movie. You already see Frozen dying down and we are stuck with the ride longer term. Sure, they can change it, but basing an entire concept on a movie kind of dates the attractions.

I have said this for years, build attractions that can inspire movies(like potc), not the other way around.

 

[Club Cooloholic]

Why do you think they are on the brink? I would say, based on crowd levels, they are far from any brink.

I am not saying you are not correct. I am just wondering why we have such polar opposite opinions on this.

Well, I just know people that I know that used to go every 2 years now are waiting 5. But your right attendance is still up, and ya know what maybe Disney should not be something the average family goes to every year. When we were kids it was a luxury and we went every 6 years or so.

 

[TwilightZone]

Theme parks and department stores aren't very equivalent, though. The internet killed Sears. I have a tough time seeing how anything could threaten WDW in that way.

Walmart. It was dead way before the internet.

 

[Chef Mickey]

I have said this for years, build attractions that can inspire movies(like potc), not the other way around.

It's tough to do. The original question of "failing" attractions is a much greater risk when you're swinging for the fences.

It's far safer to just say, "Let's do the Frozen ride because the movie was already a home run." There is nothing fantastic about the Frozen ride. Used an old ride system, tons of unthemed space, and really nothing "Disney" about it other than it being based on a Disney movie. It's cheap, lazy, and will not be a long term classic.

Disney has the money to take risks in the parks...they just refuse to do so. Sad.

 

[Goofyernmost]

Sorry, but it seems that the rest of my post disappeared into cyberspace. So to finish....

Mammoth companies fail, they just fail bigger then small companies. They are still riding on the coattails of Walt, but, they are slowly pushing him and his memory out of the picture. That should be their biggest concern. They still provide a quality product, but, the cost of experiencing that just keeps going on and on. They have targeted money, money buys a lot of things but it will not keep a rich person going to the resort when the world is their oyster. They have complicated the process so much that you practically need months

of precise planning and grid patterns that would confuse Einstein to even start to prepare to go there. That can and, I believe will get old before too long. Yes, right now it simulates that "nobody goes there anymore, it's to crowded" syndrome which tends to make people feel that if it's harder to get into WDW then Harvard... It must be the place to be. I know of so many people my age and younger that went year after year after year that no longer do and I know hardly any new people that do it either. Once every two or three years, maybe, but, the field is getting smaller as other venues step up their show and keep it simple so that a vacation is actually a vacation. It's not noticeable right now, but, later, especially if we get what is a normal downturn in the economy for whatever reason, it will start to cut a deep hole in TWDC's revenue. There always comes a time to pay the piper.