WDW IT Layoffs 1/30/2015

[ford91exploder]

That story is linked from the front page of Drudge right now.
That's going to put a lot of eyes on it.

Yep and perhaps Disney pulling this kind of stunt will bring the necessary attention to this issue, Although Rubio is showing the typical GOP tone deafness to the working american by wanting to increase the number of foreign workers while US workers continue to lose jobs to 'imported' labor.

 

[ford91exploder]

Update.

http://dailycaller.com/2015/05/19/as-floridians-are-displaced-rubio-demands-more-foreign-workers/2/

Two faced Bast--d, He actually expects those who are displaced by foreign workers being paid 20 cts on the dollar to VOTE FOR HIM.

 

[NelsonRD]

Two faced Bast--d, He actually expects those who are displaced by foreign workers being paid 20 cts on the dollar to VOTE FOR HIM.

You are getting very worked up by an article that was clearly written with bias, and with the designed goal to upset people. Left or Right, there is not one politician in the world that 'doesn't care' about people. This article and thread clearly lacks details. The OP clearly is more concerned focusing on blaming other people than looking for a new job, and the article is trying to make another case of 'evil' corporate america.

Many times employees charge to a contract, and when that contract is over, the need to reapply for another position, but I cannot make any informed decisions about this case, because details needed to make an informed decision are missing. I am not going to be told by an article that Disney is evil, and take their word without any doubt that they let go good people to hire foreigners.

 

[Bairstow]

You are getting very worked up by an article that was clearly written with bias, and with the designed goal to upset people. Left or Right, there is not one politician in the world that 'doesn't care' about people. This article and thread clearly lacks details. The OP clearly is more concerned focusing on blaming other people than looking for a new job, and the article is trying to make another case of 'evil' corporate america.

Many times employees charge to a contract, and when that contract is over, the need to reapply for another position, but I cannot make any informed decisions about this case, because details needed to make an informed decision are missing. I am not going to be told by an article that Disney is evil, and take their word without any doubt that they let go good people to hire foreigners.

Given what we know, what alternate theory do you propose?
http://www.computerworld.com/articl...es-at-disney-over-use-of-foreign-workers.html

 

[NelsonRD]

What stands out in the article to me was that Disney did not let people go and then directly hire people from India, they shifted in-house work to Contractors. One of the biggest advantages of using contractors is that it is up to the prime contractor to provide staffing, and Disney can contract out (or buy) the services they need, when they feel they need them, and this actually reduces letting people go that physically work for Disney. It then becomes the burden of the contractor to find qualified people, and maintain that specific workforce. Unfortunately, some contractors do not make the best decisions in staffing.

 

[Bairstow]

What stands out in the article to me was that Disney did not let people go and then directly hire people from India, they shifted in-house work to Contractors. One of the biggest advantages of using contractors is that it is up to the prime contractor to provide staffing, and Disney can contract out (or buy) the services they need, when they feel they need them, and this actually reduces letting people go that physically work for Disney. It then becomes the burden of the contractor to find qualified people, and maintain that specific workforce. Unfortunately, some contractors do not make the best decisions in staffing.

So you're suggesting that Disney was surprised to learn that their cheaper, H1B-using contracted labor turned out to be foreign?

 

[flynnibus]

One of the biggest advantages of using contractors is that it is up to the prime contractor to provide staffing, and Disney can contract out (or buy) the services they need, when they feel they need them, and this actually reduces letting people go that physically work for Disney

Or to put it simply... Disney can treat the workforce like a commodity and not have any interest or attachment to its labor force. Sounds like a fantastic way to build companies vested in their communities and their long term success doesn't it????

 

[NelsonRD]

So you're suggesting that Disney was surprised to learn that their cheaper, H1B-using contracted labor turned out to be foreign?

No what I am suggesting that maybe Disney made a decision to hire contractors to do something that was previously done in house, saving them the resources to hire people when they needed more work, and let people go when they needed less. Maybe this is a more balanced approach for Disney.

 

[NelsonRD]

Or to put it simply... Disney can treat the workforce like a commodity and not have any interest or attachment to its labor force. Sounds like a fantastic way to build companies vested in their communities and their long term success doesn't it????

Yes, that is what I am saying. btw, how does this hurt long term success? Should Disney keep the contractors on the payroll who built the Mine Train on the books, you know, wouldn't that be the nice thing to do, instead of letting them go?

 

[flynnibus]

Yes, that is what I am saying. btw, how does this hurt long term success? Should Disney keep the contractors on the payroll who built the Mine Train on the books, you know, wouldn't that be the nice thing to do, instead of letting them go?

Nice try to redirect.. but your analogy has zero relevancy here. We're talking about core sustaining business... not construction contractors.

A company's long term success will always include the need for great employees. When you treat them like disposable diapers... you won't get that, nor will great people want to work for you.

 

[NelsonRD]

Nice try to redirect.. but your analogy has zero relevancy here. We're talking about core sustaining business... not construction contractors.

A company's long term success will always include the need for great employees. When you treat them like disposable diapers... you won't get that, nor will great people want to work for you.

You clearly do not have business experience. This strengthens the core business. By allowing the in house team to remain stable in needs of additional, or less manpower, is what keeps them strong. The contractor team, is then replaceable (i.e. the great people you refer to).

But whatever, people come here to complain, and complain, and once you offer a suggestion from the other side, its immediately dismissed. People complain MyMagic too soon long, they throw more people at it, then everybody is upset they let them go after. People complain that CMs stand around all day and do nothing, and when they are let go, people complain. Its always sad to see people lose their jobs, but nobody looks at any reason why other than greed.

 

[flynnibus]

You clearly do not have business experience

Your clairvoyance is apparently as bad as your business mindset.

This strengthens the core business. By allowing the in house team to remain stable in needs of additional, or less manpower, is what keeps them strong. The contractor team, is then replaceable (i.e. the great people you refer to)

We're talking core business - not temporary surges in manpower. The problem here (and obviously with your approach as well) is they don't see Information Systems as something core to the business' practice or identity.

Your thinking is great for the accountants... and horrible for the actual people that steer and create incredible companies.

Crane operators - not core to the business. Something like information systems in a global company that is in the media and direct comsuner business... core.

But hey, maybe they want to lead by people like you who think workers are just machines to be turned on and off and you think they will work uniformly regardless.

 

[NelsonRD]

Your clairvoyance is apparently as bad as your business mindset.



We're talking core business - not temporary surges in manpower. The problem here (and obviously with your approach as well) is they don't see Information Systems as something core to the business' practice or identity.

Your thinking is great for the accountants... and horrible for the actual people that steer and create incredible companies.

Crane operators - not core to the business. Something like information systems in a global company that is in the media and direct comsuner business... core.

But hey, maybe they want to lead by people like you who think workers are just machines to be turned on and off and you think they will work uniformly regardless.

This is how I read this. Was that some IT support would be contracted out. Not the core you reference.
Don't get me wrong, I am not defending outsourcing to death, just look how well outsourcing tech support worked for Dell. I am simply making the point that in some cases, I see the value in contractors.

 

[NelsonRD]

I also think its very funny that everybody gets worked up about outsourcing american jobs overseas - then they get in their Toyota Camry while they talk on their Samsung phones. Oh, I know is 'made in the USA', but it is still not an American company, but that is another issue.

 

[flynnibus]

This is how I read this. Was that some IT support would be contracted out. Not the core you reference.
Don't get me wrong, I am not defending outsourcing to death, just look how well outsourcing tech support worked for Dell. I am simply making the point that in some cases, I see the value in contractors.

Many companies trivialize the importance of internal helpdesks... and ignore the reality that doing so basically is holding your company back by your own actions! Every minute your employees spend dealing with problems.. is time they are not adding value to your company. Any time and energy spent on dealing with ineffective helpdesks ... are impediments to your business that you created yourself. Instead of trying to figure out how to do it the cheapest way... you should be working to ensure you have the least amount of friction to people getting their work done. But when you build empires that need to justify their existence, or show a positive P&L even though they aren't products you actually sell.. all you do is drag your business down.

Instead of looking at support as a burden you just have to have... you can look at support as a way of improving the effectiveness of your company, or even be a differentiator in the market.

An example of using these things some companies just see as hassles as the way to lead the market... Look at Extron http://www.extron.com/index.aspx

Extron charges a premium for their products.. but is able to do so and remain a leading choice by integrators because of how Extron runs their business. They prioritize creating volumes of support information and sales support information to ensure their products are the easiest to figure out if 'it will do the job'. They GIVE AWAY training... because they know if you become the easiest to work with and you make people CHAMPIONS of your products... they will continue to use your products and advocate others use them as well.

Extron recognized that if you invest in these areas and excel... that can be how you differentiate yourself and advance your business. Meanwhile, others try to find the minimum needed in those areas because they see it as requirements.. and not something you might actually LEAD with.

If you treat things like helpdesks as just things you have to have... you'll always be holding your company back. Save in one department... to cost more in every other department. Brilliant!

 

[flynnibus]

I also think its very funny that everybody gets worked up about outsourcing american jobs overseas - then they get in their Toyota Camry while they talk on their Samsung phones. Oh, I know is 'made in the USA', but it is still not an American company, but that is another issue.

Nothing like using extremes to show you don't understand the details..

 

[danlb_2000]

Many companies trivialize the importance of internal helpdesks... and ignore the reality that doing so basically is holding your company back by your own actions! Every minute your employees spend dealing with problems.. is time they are not adding value to your company. Any time and energy spent on dealing with ineffective helpdesks ... are impediments to your business that you created yourself. Instead of trying to figure out how to do it the cheapest way... you should be working to ensure you have the least amount of friction to people getting their work done. But when you build empires that need to justify their existence, or show a positive P&L even though they aren't products you actually sell.. all you do is drag your business down.

I saw this exact thing at my last company. We were a smaller company with an onsite IT department that got bought out by a large conglomerate. They eventually replace all the onsite support with corporate level help desks (most of which were outsourced) and outside contractors. So we ended up with high paid engineers spending hours on the phone trying to get simple computer problems resolved, time that would have been much better spent working on our products. The other problem we ran into these help desks is that they tended to only deal well with specific requests. So someone needed to be able to tell them exactly what they needed, instead of being able to explain what they needed to achieve and letting he support person determine the best way to do it.

 

[flynnibus]

I saw this exact thing at my last company. We were a smaller company with an onsite IT department that got bought out by a large conglomerate. They eventually replace all the onsite support with corporate level help desks (most of which were outsourced) and outside contractors. So we ended up with high paid engineers spending hours on the phone trying to get simple computer problems resolved, time that would have been much better spent working on our products. The other problem we ran into these help desks is that they tended to only deal well with specific requests. So someone needed to be able to tell them exactly what they needed, instead of being able to explain what they needed to achieve and letting he support person determine the best way to do it.

Exactly... it's the same dumb thinking that says "lets get rid of the office admin and just let people handle stuff themselves". So you end up with people you pay 30-60/hr to do work that you could have someone you pay $12/hr take care of. Then you have your senior engineers wasting time trying to figure out how the company does fedex... or ordering paper for the printer... when you hired them to do far more valuable things.

It all boils down to people that try to run a business by managing COSTS rather than people that look to enable the business to succeed.

 

[Nubs70]

I also think its very funny that everybody gets worked up about outsourcing american jobs overseas - then they get in their Toyota Camry while they talk on their Samsung phones. Oh, I know is 'made in the USA', but it is still not an American company, but that is another issue.

So, the fact that the USA is the single largest recipient of FDI, and the jobs that come with it, is a bad thing?

 

[ford91exploder]

I also think its very funny that everybody gets worked up about outsourcing american jobs overseas - then they get in their Toyota Camry while they talk on their Samsung phones. Oh, I know is 'made in the USA', but it is still not an American company, but that is another issue.

Hmm, I drive a Ford F-250 and would buy an American built smartphone if one was readily available, I do buy American when possible because the jobs saved by doing so may one day be your own.

My personal favorites is when the Imported item is more expensive and lower quality than the American made version