Walt Disney World Park Hours cut starting September 8 2020

[GoofGoof]

I just hope some things are more normal by April/May to warrant a trip. I think Fireworks and a few character meet and greets but who knows if meets will come back in the next year

It all depends on treatments and/or a vaccine. It’s entirely possible that by April/May the country is in much better shape. It’s also possible it won’t be. Way too hard to call right now.

As soon as the health threat is lower I think characters will be back. Fireworks are expensive but assuming the demand picks up should also be doable. This is just my opinion but I would think those things could come back in some form with people still wearing masks before the actual mask rule is lifted. Again, kinda hard to call since so much could change between then and now.

 

[maxairmike]

Be counted on to behave themselves and follow the rules.

To be fair to Disney, neither can BGT's guests be counted on to follow the rules, in my experience, they're just pressing on anyway. I didn't end up staying very long when I went because of that.

EDIT: To rephrase, I'd trust Disney (and Universal) guests to at least somewhat attempt to follow the rules and physical distance for nighttime spectaculars compared to the guests at BGT that were seemingly not interested in physical distancing or wearing masks. But that would require nighttime hours, which we're not getting.

 

[legwand77]

I know and that’s my point. You are saying I’m making things out to be worse than they are instead of using facts. I’m just stating a fact that is backed by your graph too. Down 70% is down 70%.

Yes, we are saying the same thing. Your perspective I think is (not wanting to put words in your mouth) flying is not going to improve fast, mine is things are improving regarding flying already and will continue to grow at a faster rate as the cases continue to drop.

Both opinions are 100% valid. You are very reasonable in these discussions, I totally respect your opinion. Heck we were both wrong on the park openning with 100% masks if I remember correctly, maybe it was just me, I didn't think Disney would require masks 100% when they opened because of the look of the brand.

 

[legwand77]

It all depends on treatments and/or a vaccine. It’s entirely possible that by April/May the country is in much better shape. It’s also possible it won’t be. Way too hard to call right now.

As soon as the health threat is lower I think characters will be back. Fireworks are expensive but assuming the demand picks up should also be doable. This is just my opinion but I would think those things could come back in some form with people still wearing masks before the actual mask rule is lifted. Again, kinda hard to call since so much could change between then and now.

Makes sense, I do think fireworks will be back before meet and greets because they characters are already out even though it is at a distance. However your point on costs of fireworks is a big factor too.

 

[GoofGoof]

Yes, we are saying the same thing. Your perspective I think is (not wanting to put words in your mouth) flying is not going to improve fast, mine is things are improving regarding flying already and will continue to grow at a faster rate as the cases continue to drop.

Both opinions are 100% valid. You are very reasonable in these discussions, I totally respect your opinion. Heck we were both wrong on the park openning with 100% masks if I remember correctly, maybe it was just me, I didn't think Disney would require masks 100% when they opened because of the look of the brand.

Yeah, it’s just a difference of opinion on how fast things pick up.

On the masks, my hope at the time before Disney re-opened was that things would have improved enough that they wouldn’t be needed. I thought they would wait until the masks and other restrictions were not necessary to even open. Everything sorta snowballed from there. Obviously since that time never came my plan would not have worked. I bought into some of the models and such that showed further declines in cases, similar to what happened in some parts of Europe. We never really brought the curve all the way back down in a classic bell shape, we sorta just plateaued half way down and then went back up. If you look at Germany or France or even Italy they have a lot more stuff open right now and a lot less cases. That was my hope for the US by July/Aug. No use crying over spilled milk now. If that was how things played out I believe WDW would be in a lot better shape right now and would have much higher demand.

 

[GoofGoof]

Makes sense, I do think fireworks will be back before meet and greets because they characters are already out even though it is at a distance. However your point on costs of fireworks is a big factor too.

I actually don’t think fireworks are as big of an issue as a show like Fantasmic that has crowd control issues. If they setup an area for fireworks where they could create socially distant viewing areas with ropes or something cheap it’s doable. I think the best bet would be EPCOT around the lake using tape on the ground for boxes or even possibly around seven seas lagoon in front of the path that runs in front of the monorail and leads to the new bridge to GF. Stakes in the ground and ropes could easily create little “boxes” for viewing there. I do think they need crowds to make it worthwhile financially but maybe if there is a bump around the holidays it’s possible.

 

[markc]

I see you as the outlier, but makes no difference either way.

You are incorrect, I share factual data that is positive, for perspective, a complete picture. That is all. My opinions are more mainstream than you think, from my experience and what is actually going on in the world, but then again my opinion.

Respectfully, fairly sound and credible data-based surveys would suggest your opinions are less mainstream than you think they are.

COVID is still a major reason that travel is at a standstill (a fraction of what it was a year ago). If people simply didnt care about COVID as you suggest, travel would be much higher than what it currently is across the country at almost all destinations. It's not.

In regards to point 6 - At least 15% of the population is either furloughed, out of work completely, or has had their salary reduced by at least 20%. That's 15% less people who would consider going on a trip at this time. That's a significant drop in potential guests - even for Disney.

 

[Hawg G]

Respectfully, fairly sound and credible data-based surveys would suggest your opinions are less mainstream than you think they are.

COVID is still a major reason that travel is at a standstill (a fraction of what it was a year ago). If people simply didnt care about COVID as you suggest, travel would be much higher than what it currently is across the country at almost all destinations. It's not.

In regards to point 6 - At least 15% of the population is either furloughed, out of work completely, or has had their salary reduced by at least 20%. That's 15% less people who would consider going on a trip at this time. That's a significant drop in potential guests - even for Disney.

Correction, the fear propaganda about Covid the media is pushing for political reasons is a major reason travel is at a standstill.

 

[Jrb1979]

Correction, the fear propaganda about Covid the media is pushing for political reasons is a major reason travel is at a standstill.

Correction, the fact many people are out of jobs is the major reason travel is at a standstill.

 

[TeriofTerror]

Correction, the fear propaganda about Covid the media is pushing for political reasons is a major reason travel is at a standstill.

Out of curiosity, can posts get deleted for spreading harmful misinformation?

 

[Lilofan]

Correction, the fear propaganda about Covid the media is pushing for political reasons is a major reason travel is at a standstill.

Is this a new title for a fiction novel?

 

[Touchdown]

Correction, the fear propaganda about Covid the media is pushing for political reasons is a major reason travel is at a standstill.

Correction: An invisible evil that is very infectious that affects people differently and has a chance of killing you or your loved ones (that you can pass it to without knowing) is what is scaring people.

It is not propaganda, you just don’t see the worst of it because those people don’t survive to tell their story, realatives can’t visit due to public safety and workers can’t get specific due to HIPAA.

 

[larryz]

That would be wonderful if true! But I’m not going to hold my breath.

I would...

 

[legwand77]

Correction: An invisible evil that is very infectious that affects people differently and has a chance of killing you or your loved ones (that you can pass it to without knowing) is what is scaring people.

It is not propaganda, you just don’t see the worst of it because those people don’t survive to tell their story, realatives can’t visit due to public safety and workers can’t get specific due to HIPAA.

So HIPPA is keeping people from telling their story, hiding deaths, that would be the worst of it ?

 

[legwand77]

Respectfully, fairly sound and credible data-based surveys would suggest your opinions are less mainstream than you think they are.

COVID is still a major reason that travel is at a standstill (a fraction of what it was a year ago). If people simply didnt care about COVID as you suggest, travel would be much higher than what it currently is across the country at almost all destinations. It's not.

In regards to point 6 - At least 15% of the population is either furloughed, out of work completely, or has had their salary reduced by at least 20%. That's 15% less people who would consider going on a trip at this time. That's a significant drop in potential guests - even for Disney.

I agree with all those, except your first paragraph your opinion, yes employment is down, and travel is down, but nowhere near a standstill like you said, already shared the numbers it is coming back. People obvious care about COVID but now as numbers are trending better they are traveling even more.

 

[wdwfan22]

These are the same as your reason 4, hours will increase in October, fireworks will be back by the end of October as well, if not earlier

Fireworks are not coming back in October.

 

[GoofGoof]

I agree with all those, except your first paragraph your opinion, yes employment is down, and travel is down, but nowhere near a standstill like you said, already shared the numbers it is coming back. People obvious care about COVID but now as numbers are trending better they are traveling even more.

More people are traveling today then were in April. That’s a fact. That’s why the airfare numbers went from down 95% to down 70%. That‘s because literally nothing was open in April. There was nowhere to go. People flying in April were either essential workers or people attempting to get home from wherever they got stuck. Now Las Vegas is open, WDW is open, Myrtle Beach is open. People are traveling to those places. There’s no disputing that, just way less people than would have in pre-Covid times. Some business travel has started back up too. The sales people for my company are back to work. Many other places are the same. They still are limiting travel when possible but it’s happening a little bit now.

Where I think the disagreement comes from is your assumption that because air travel went from down 95% to down 70% that’s a sign that demand at WDW will increase more and is due to people seeing number trends improving. There are some people who just don’t care about number trends. WDW opened at the worst possible time for numbers in FL. It opened near the peak of the spike and people still flew in to go. Same goes for a place like Myrtle Beach. Many young people flew to Myrtle Beach to party with no regard for case numbers. So I don’t see a trend in improving cases being the driver of that increase in flying. I think that’s just the people willing to travel no matter what and having just that demographic flying leads to a 70% decrease in passengers from the prior year.

The problem for WDW and Orlando as a whole is the summer is ending. Without Covid, demand would drop significantly in Sept as kids went back to school anyway. College students are going back to school too (even if it’s virtual for some) so they are less likely to be traveling starting soon. So the numbers are better right now vs April but its a fact that Disney and Universal cut their park hours and now Universal has joined Disney in moth balling some of the resorts. They are not expecting demand to increase any time soon.

 

[Dan Deesnee]

RV sales kept the gdp number from bring much worse. RVs are very expensive so the narrative that "Millions are out of work and that's a big reason why the parks are not crowded." doesn't make sense. Their are more examples like this.

Low wage jobs were hit, HARD. I feel for those people, it's a tough situation. But they are not Disney's target audience. Disney has been targeting high income earners for years and most of them are doing just fine (the economic data backs this up in many ways). White collar hasn't been effected by this anywhere near levels that would keep the parks empty.

It is much more related to decreased value for the money and the nuisance of air travel right now. People love fireworks and parades. If someone is only going to go 1-2 times to Disney World, why would they go now???

I feel strongly that once a mostly full experience is delivered, demand will skyrocket. Just think of everyone who pushed 2020 trips to next year...

Just my opinions with some data to back them up. Might be totally wrong.

 

[robhedin]

More people are traveling today then were in April. That’s a fact. That’s why the airfare numbers went from down 95% to down 70%. That‘s because literally nothing was open in April. There was nowhere to go. People flying in April were either essential workers or people attempting to get home from wherever they got stuck. Now Las Vegas is open, WDW is open, Myrtle Beach is open. People are traveling to those places. There’s no disputing that, just way less people than would have in pre-Covid times. Some business travel has started back up too. The sales people for my company are back to work. Many other places are the same. They still are limiting travel when possible but it’s happening a little bit now.

Where I think the disagreement comes from is your assumption that because air travel went from down 95% to down 70% that’s a sign that demand at WDW will increase more and is due to people seeing number trends improving. There are some people who just don’t care about number trends. WDW opened at the worst possible time for numbers in FL. It opened near the peak of the spike and people still flew in to go. Same goes for a place like Myrtle Beach. Many young people flew to Myrtle Beach to party with no regard for case numbers. So I don’t see a trend in improving cases being the driver of that increase in flying. I think that’s just the people willing to travel no matter what and having just that demographic flying leads to a 70% decrease in passengers from the prior year.

The problem for WDW and Orlando as a whole is the summer is ending. Without Covid, demand would drop significantly in Sept as kids went back to school anyway. College students are going back to school too (even if it’s virtual for some) so they are less likely to be traveling starting soon. So the numbers are better right now vs April but its a fact that Disney and Universal cut their park hours and now Universal has joined Disney in moth balling some of the resorts. They are not expecting demand to increase any time soon.

Air travel is going to be hurting for a while. A good bit of that is due to the flight itself, even aside from the destination. How does the phrase go? "It's the journey, not the destination"? Even people that may not be as concerned about WDW, may think twice about getting on an enclosed plane for several hours.

 

[robhedin]

RV sales kept the gdp number from bring much worse. RVs are very expensive so the narrative that "Millions are out of work and that's a big reason why the parks are not crowded." doesn't make sense. Their are more examples like this.

Low wage jobs were hit, HARD. I feel for those people, it's a tough situation. But they are not Disney's target audience. Disney has been targeting high income earners for years and most of them are doing just fine (the economic data backs this up in many ways). White collar hasn't been effected by this anywhere near levels that would keep the parks empty.

It is much more related to decreased value for the money and the nuisance of air travel right now. People love fireworks and parades. If someone is only going to go 1-2 times to Disney World, why would they go now???

I feel strongly that once a mostly full experience is delivered, demand will skyrocket. Just think of everyone who pushed 2020 trips to next year...

Just my opinions with some data to back them up. Might be totally wrong.

This is very much what I see too-- relatively affluent people who would go to WDW not wanting to because of 1) having to take a flight to get there; and 2) the relative value for what you get now (decreased hours, experience, etc). If they're close enough some have driven that would normally fly, but they also have AP or DVC or both.

If you look at the Sturgis rally, that has drawn over 270,000 people coming in from around the country. Attendance is down by about 10%, but spending is up by double digits. ( https://www.bhpioneer.com/covid-19/...cle_de610534-de57-11ea-962b-bbef366bb50e.html ) It looks like the experience was pretty "normal" with concerts, events, etc. While it's not WDW, it does show that people are willing to travel and spend if the perceived value is there.