BlakeW39
Well-Known Member
^^ ditto
It's not even about mission statements. Literally just have any theme at all. That's all I am asking
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News Walt Disney Company plans to spend $17 billion at Walt Disney World over the next ten years
- Thread starter wdwmagic
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^^ ditto
It's not even about mission statements. Literally just have any theme at all. That's all I am asking
erasure fan1
Well-Known Member
I'd say the studios has always been the place most accepted for IP placement. Star wars, indy, muppets, twilight zone... Sure there isn't really a theme outside of MOVIES! But if they are going to create a bunch of IP mini lands, I'd prefer it to be the studios. At least then you brand it as, step into your favorite movies....
There, I fixed it for you.
The only park that really has a strong theme left is Animal kingdom. Even Magic kingdom has slipped. But Epcot and the studios are on a whole other level of thematic dysfunction.
BlakeW39
Well-Known Member
I'd say the studios has always been the place most accepted for IP placement. Star wars, indy, muppets, twilight zone... Sure there isn't really a theme outside of MOVIES! But if they are going to create a bunch of IP mini lands, I'd prefer it to be the studios. At least then you brand it as, step into your favorite movies....
There, I fixed it for you.
The only park that really has a strong theme left is Animal kingdom. Even Magic kingdom has slipped. But Epcot and the studios are on a whole other level of thematic dysfunction.
DHS originally had clear themes and direction. Modern DHS is just IPland. I never cared for the original theme of DHS, but at least it was a theme. Movies isn't a theme. It's a subject. Visiting movie themed lands isn't a theme, it's a premise. What are the themes of DHS? It literally doesn't have one I'd wager, or at least it doesn't have one that's consistent across the entire park. The only thing stringing DHS together is the subject of film. Besides that, it simply lacks any singular direction or set of themes/ideas. Sure the rest of the parks have their issues, but DHS is just a complete mess, + it's tiny, + it has nothing to do. They literally removed their thesis statement dark ride in favor of literally just another dark ride, only this one doesn't have anything to do with film as a medium. Lmao, Bob what have you done.
'Tomorrowland' is under-rated, IMHO.
The parks need originality, execution, and showmanship (to borrow a line from "Dance Fever"). Bob has shown that he's not willing to do any of those three. Remember his now-infamous, "I just need to tweet that Galaxy's Edge is open" line and the thinking people would flock to it? It looks nice, but was it worth $1 billion? That $17 billion isn't going to go far in the current WDI climate. Also consider you can look and see no dirt being moved outside of existing projects. But I bet he green-lights a few more DVC properties.
erasure fan1
Well-Known Member
As I've said before, Disney doesn't care. While I wouldn't say I was absolutely in love with the "working studio, salute to Hollywood's golden era" theme it originally had. I also don't think it needed to go. Personally I think they should just bring it back, as we all know they will never spend the time, money and effort to fix it proper. At least then you have some sort of direction to lean into.
BlakeW39
Well-Known Member
Well yeah I know Disney doesn't care. Bob is an IP dude. He doesn't take risks nor does he value creativity in the Disney company. OG Disney-MGM Studios is never coming back. They spent hundreds of millions of dollars just to uproot the park's thesis-statement attraction, and replace it with something that doesn't even really fit the park's original theme. The best we can hope for is a change in leadership which seeks to assume a new thematic direction for DHS, one that still celebrates film but perhaps not in expressly the same way as the park did in the 2000s, which I would say is peak DHS. Honestly though, with how all over the place modern DHS is, I have no clue what set of themes Disney could construct to tie that park back together again.
Andrew25
Well-Known Member
The only thing they need to do is put some fake studio props/sets of lighting/camera equipment throughout the "dead spots" in the park. Put some director's chair photo op areas and some other stuff throughout the park and call it a day. There are several walkways like Animation Courtyard to TSL, ABC Commissary, Echo Lake that could use some minor thematic touches to enhance the idea of "celebrating the movies" and not just a bare soundstage wall.
erasure fan1
Well-Known Member
That's why I say it will never happen. It would cost too much. And besides that, I don't believe they have the right people to fix any of the parks thematic problems anyway. I have very little faith in the next leadership team. Why? If Iger is in charge of the next hire, we are most likely doomed until that guys fired and they start from scratch.
Ayla
Well-Known Member
This is a great idea and would maybe cost a couple thousand dollars. But it would make a huge difference in the ambiance of the park.
esskay
Well-Known Member
One little tidbit from the new lawsuit (WDW sueing Ron) document was that they were planning on (in addition to the $17bn) creating 15k new Disney jobs in FL. Presumably that would be for a major expansion somewhere, be it the 1 new major park that land was assigned for, or for the three minor ones whatever they'd be.
Henry Mystic
Author of "A Manor of Fact"
That is absolutely true. In spite of that, and alongside the crowding issue, I personally still think Hollywood Studios is a far better experience than it has ever been.^^ ditto
It's not even about mission statements. Literally just have any theme at all. That's all I am asking
However, from a park mission statement and theme it’s a pathetic shell of its former self.
The original concept was in my view, too limited in scope, I mean, it was originally just supposed to be a pavilion at EPCOT, but it executed that working film studio in LA perfectly as a half-day park.
With the loss of EPCOT Center (around 20 years ago), MGM Studios, and more recently California Adventure, the only two true theme parks we have left are Animal Kingdom and Tokyo DisneySea. Disneyland Parc Paris also has incredible themed design even if the mission statement itself isn’t as angled as those.
I definitely don’t think that’s the only factor that matters in the enjoyment of a theme park as I have thoroughly enjoyed many of the changes made to California Adventure (scoff, even Pixar Pier, I know, blasphemous), and I enjoy Disneyland Park and Islands of Adventure more than any other parks in America, so it’s not that I have a specific issue with not having a completely unifying theme, for instance, but it is unfortunate to see that shift to every park having looser themes which has promoted homogeneity.
Theme parks are an art form, and it appears we’re shifting to lands being an art form.
For the record, Jules Verne’s Mysterious Island land at Tokyo DisneySea and Avatar’s Pandora land at Animal Kingdom are perfect examples of how you can mesh plenty of original artistic freedom to use an IP to fit a park’s theme flawlessly. When aspects that are taken from IPs that work within a theme park are used, I genuinely believe they can often enhance the experience, even Cars Land, while not actually in California was probably a better product than Carland would have been, so I’m not in agreement with people that are vehemently anti-IP.
*BTW, if Moana is used in a way like Avatar in an Oceania land I don’t think it would destroy AK’s theme, but Zootopia could, given its anthropomorphic nature*
Would I like to see more original rides like Mystic Manor? Absolutely, but IPs (with a focus on originality) brought us Tower of Terror and Pandora, so I just hope they balance things more in relation to a park’s theme, as THAT aspect of theme parks I’m afraid we’re losing despite much of the actual experience being an improvement. If one in 4 rides were completely original, I feel that would be a much better balance.
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BlakeW39
Well-Known Member
I think the next 5 years or so will be very interesting to watch. Disney is in a difficult position right now, with most of its film divisions steadily losing money, Disney+ struggling, and the parks garnering increased negative sentiment from fans. I think TWDC is at a kind of crossroads. Who Iger chooses as his successor...how they lead TWDC...if TWDC continues its downward trend or if someone finallg steps in and turns things around. We'll see.
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BlakeW39
Well-Known Member
Hmm.. well, the whole IP thing is complicated. I don't think most of the people who complain about IP, such as myself, are like, firmly against any and all outside IPs being brought into the parks. That would be silly. I think moreso that the way Disney has obsessed over IP and completely abandoned original ideas has left such a bad taste in many people's mouths that they're just like, "you know what, **** IP." Those are my thoughts at least.
It's not so much that IP in the parks is bad, but rather that the parks cannot ever reach their full potential if original ideas are outlawed outright. There simply aren't enough IPs in Disney's library to flesh out a park based on a specific set of themes. If there were IPs for Disney to use that actually fit the themes of their parks, things would be different, but there aren't enough IPs in Disney's library to make that work. So naturally Disney can't focus on a narrow set of themes in their parks if they want to exclusively use popular movie IPs. That would be too limiting and it wouldn't work.
The way Disney uses IP also feels kind of just like ads as well. Just giant billboards for their "brands" and "franchises." It just feels so tacky, cheap, and corporate.
That said, I do agree on what you said. Seems like the era of parks based on a set of themes that guide their creative direction has passed. Universal isn't doing it and neither is Disney. It seems, as you note, that things have been switched to where now lands are cohesive, and parks are just a collection of different themed lands that probably have nothing to do with one another.
And on the subject of Moana at DAK. It could work, thematically, if as you said they focus on it being a land based on Oceania as a region and not just Moana as a franchise. If they use the animated film as inspiration though, I think the art styles will clash. However, if ANYTHING good could come of the live action remake, lol... it's that I could see it actually fitting into DAK better than the animated film would.
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He's not.
SpectreJordan
Well-Known Member
It'd be nice if Galaxy's Edge had all of that. But Hogsmeade (& Diagon) don't have a TSR. It also only had an E-ticket & C-ticket for 9 years until Hagrid opened. GE atleast has an E-ticket & a D-ticket. I imagine GE will get a third ride by the end of the decade.
Taking away the promised roaming droids is a big fail on Disney's part though. They need to do that ASAP.
Stupido
Well-Known Member
If I can be terrorized by him whenever I'm picking up fresh produce, there's no reason for the lack of droids.
BlakeW39
Well-Known Member
Mmmm yes that's correct, but he has a very strong influence. I can't imagine Disney's next CEO will differ substantially from Iger in terms of business strategy.
Henry Mystic
Author of "A Manor of Fact"
I think the design of the lands themselves is what’s better. The execution of Pandora and Hogsmeade, but especially Cars Land and Diagon Alley are a step-up despite them being smaller, ignoring the rides they have.
I think it’s partially because Star Wars is just a different IP than the others. Yes, there are some iconic locations, but the direction they chose to be an all encompassing place for all things Star Wars means they probably should’ve focused more on it feeling like it’s actually occupied by people in the galaxy.
Galaxy’s Edge is great, I most definitely disagree with people saying otherwise, but it is so large and has so many shops that comparatively it feels like it needs more things to walk through.
It just sort of seems lifeless, like there needs to be more in the way of it feeling like an actual place. Cutting the PeopleMover ride for capacity reasons in this sense hurt the land. I think that alone would’ve made the largest difference.
I know it’s a battle scarred location, but I don’t think that’s the issue. The original concept art seemed more vibrant despite it being a place that had seen “fighting.” I personally would’ve gone with that art direction.
The Cantina should’ve been large enough that you can just roam into. Again, to feel like a real place. It also is sort of just okay? The theming is great, but Trader Sam’s Tiki Bar I feel is a far better themed bar.
The interactive stuff and show elements throughout the land shouldn’t have been cut, again, because the land itself feels like less and it would’ve made it feel more real.
A TSR would balance out the land’s offerings and would make Disney a ton of money bringing more depth to the land as well. It’s a massive land, how does it only have one restaurant?
A third ride, perhaps a speeder bike coaster, would fix the dead space on the right side of the land.
They need some walk around aliens. Not people or stormtroopers. We need to see a Greedo and some other aliens walking around, the land should’ve been set up to have them interact with actual things going on in the land. Planned interactions if you will.
Some more greenery wouldn’t hurt either (which is why Tatooine would have been a terrible idea to build).
I know IPs shouldn’t matter in the execution of a land, but I do think GE is set back by it not being set in the original trilogy, which has far more interesting lore to explore.
You go to Harambe in Animal Kingdom’s Africa land and it feels lived in. There’s so much detail. GE has so many clever instances of that, from the repurposed engine for Ronto Roasters to the blaster marks on walls, but you also don’t know really know who lives in the land.
Pandora is just nature so let’s exclude that one, but the other lands, Cars Land, Diagon Alley, and Hogsmeade are more grounded. Star Wars I feel would be a lot harder to nail, but to do the IP justice that’s what it seems like it needs.
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erasure fan1
Well-Known Member
Ok, "picking" might not have been the best word. But
I think it was obvious as to the point. If Iger is working closely with the new CEO, he's going to have a pretty healthy influence on the hire I'm sure. And unless this new person goes rogue, my point is a solid bet.
After his last pick... maybe not so much.
