Trouble in paradise officially?

[Piebald]

Disney is so expensive I truly dont get how packed it constantly is.

I'm local so granted it's more accessible but it was cheaper for us to go to Japan for 2 weeks and visit TDR than it would be for like a weeks stay at WDW

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

actually isn't it the other way around? (question) Psychologist will say that "event's or experiences" are worth going in debt for not things.

So take the loan to go to Italy as oppose to buying a bike.

I can't throw rocks though because yep, I've taken loans to do fancy things and probably will do it again. July 1st I'm retiring (thank you Jesus. lol) I'm planning a 3 month tour of Europe next year. 1/2 on borrowed dough and feel absolutely no pressure to be "debt" free.

anyhoo, my perspective is totally skewed, I live in a city where a million dollars is consider reasonable for 1300 sq foot apartment. go figure.

the middle class has been whining for years about being pushed out of every thing. college, vacations and lately the price of gas and groceries. I assume maybe incorrectly that if they go to Disney it's because they see some value in it.

The article didn't have enough information about the poll imo to be really relevant.

if I was terminal...I’d agree.

a contract for riviera? Nyet

 

[MurphyJoe]

If anyone wants an alternate adventure to compare with I will offer this. I'm not going to do the research on what an approximate amount of WDW trip cost or time because everyone that is planning a WDW trip will already know what it is going to cost for their specific plans. So this is just for comparison.

In November of 2015 two of us took a four week long trip to Europe. We flew to Paris via Toronto and Iceland. Spent a few days there including a day at Disneyland Paris. Took buses and trains while in Paris to museums, local must see's and then flew to Venice for a while. We wandered around St. Marc's square, attended a concert in a 600 years old church, gondola rides and great Italian food. From there we took a train to Rome.

Like in Paris we rented a complete apartment for length of stay (a major savings btw) We toured the coliseum, the Roman ruins, did an audience with the pope, toured St. Peters and the Vatican. We used the local subway to make our way around Rome and also took another train to Pompeii for a day trip. And more outstanding Italian food. Among other things we went to the Trevi Fountain and every other touristy thing we could think of before catching another train to the Port of Rome for a week long Transatlantic Cruise back to Fort Lauderdale.

The cruise included Ports of call to Barcelona and Mallorca, Spain, Pisa and Florence, Italy and a stop in the Tuscany area for a wine tasting and pasta meal. Another stop in Toulon, France. Sailed by the Rock of Gibraltar and the last stop, Tenerife in the Canary Islands before heading west to Fort Lauderdale. Killing time waiting for our flights home we took a boat tour of the Everglades. Fantastic trip that cost us $8500 total for four weeks. You guys can do the onsite WDW cost math yourselves.

EDIT: I added to the cost an item or two that I had forgotten, but that should do it.

I've been planning a WDW trip annually since my last visit in 2013 and haven't made it back yet because of this. Before COVID shut things down in 2019 I toured Venice and the islands, stayed in a nice hotel a short walk from St Mark's Square, ate in several amazing restaurants, learned the Venetian style of rowing and rowed the Grand Canal, bought a 1/4 scale oarlock from one of the few men crafting them for the city's boats, and still spent less money than an equivalent length visit to WDW would have cost.

Looking ahead, priced out a WDW trip at today's prices for 2023 as my schedule is already full in 2022. After seeing the $$$, booked a 7 day Caribbean cruise with Princess. Even after springing for a deal which includes internet, gratuity, and their premium drink package my current estimates of final trip cost (including air and ground transportation, a hotel room the night before, etc.) is basically the same as what a similar length trip to the Mouse would be when staying off site. As others have said, it's hard to justify spending those dollars at Disney when there's other options which require less planning, less money, or more experiences. I'm sure I'll eventually visit WDW again, but couldn't tell you when at this rate.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

My dad was born in 1938 and we lived paycheck to paycheck for a while (although I never knew) and he took us to Disneyworld back in the 70s/80s - 3 times! So, I'm not sure what his world view was at that time....spend it while you got it?

your dad saved and budgeted for Vacations...how does that support the argument that excess is more of a thing now than then?

I need my decoder ring for this.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

If anyone wants an alternate adventure to compare with I will offer this. I'm not going to do the research on what an approximate amount of WDW trip cost or time because everyone that is planning a WDW trip will already know what it is going to cost for their specific plans. So this is just for comparison.

In November of 2015 two of us took a four week long trip to Europe. We flew to Paris via Toronto and Iceland. Spent a few days there including a day at Disneyland Paris. Took buses and trains while in Paris to museums, local must see's and then flew to Venice for a while. We wandered around St. Marc's square, attended a concert in a 600 years old church, gondola rides and great Italian food. From there we took a train to Rome.

Like in Paris we rented a complete apartment for length of stay (a major savings btw) We toured the coliseum, the Roman ruins, did an audience with the pope, toured St. Peters and the Vatican. We used the local subway to make our way around Rome and also took another train to Pompeii for a day trip. And more outstanding Italian food. Among other things we went to the Trevi Fountain and every other touristy thing we could think of before catching another train to the Port of Rome for a week long Transatlantic Cruise back to Fort Lauderdale.

The cruise included Ports of call to Barcelona and Mallorca, Spain, Pisa and Florence, Italy and a stop in the Tuscany area for a wine tasting and pasta meal. Another stop in Toulon, France. Sailed by the Rock of Gibraltar and the last stop, Tenerife in the Canary Islands before heading west to Fort Lauderdale. Killing time waiting for our flights home we took a boat tour of the Everglades. Fantastic trip that cost us $8500 total for four weeks. You guys can do the onsite WDW cost math yourselves.

EDIT: I added to the cost an item or two that I had forgotten, but that should do it.

I've been planning a WDW trip annually since my last visit in 2013 and haven't made it back yet because of this. Before COVID shut things down in 2019 I toured Venice and the islands, stayed in a nice hotel a short walk from St Mark's Square, ate in several amazing restaurants, learned the Venetian style of rowing and rowed the Grand Canal, bought a 1/4 scale oarlock from one of the few men crafting them for the city's boats, and still spent less money than an equivalent length visit to WDW would have cost.

Looking ahead, priced out a WDW trip at today's prices for 2023 as my schedule is already full in 2022. After seeing the $$$, booked a 7 day Caribbean cruise with Princess. Even after springing for a deal which includes internet, gratuity, and their premium drink package my current estimates of final trip cost (including air and ground transportation, a hotel room the night before, etc.) is basically the same as what a similar length trip to the Mouse would be when staying off site. As others have said, it's hard to justify spending those dollars at Disney when there's other options which require less planning, less money, or more experiences. I'm sure I'll eventually visit WDW again, but couldn't tell you when at this rate.

there is no “argument” that Disney has the value it once did in today’s market other than the standard “ITS WORTH IT TO ME!!”

...which of course is not objective at all by design.

it’s like bringing knives to the OK corral

 

[ppete1975]

Gen X here. (And Virgo lol.) I've been in plenty of debt and no debt. The amount of debt I had at any given time was no reflection on me as a person, my character, my values, etc. It is what it is. It's better to not waste money on interest if possible. Sometimes it's not possible. Sometimes it's totally worth it or no big deal. Sometimes it gets out of control.

After working 3 jobs in my 20's and probably still not cracking $30K, someone will have a hard time explaining to me why they are better than I, and can't or "shouldn't have to" do that. Some people are born with silver spoons. Some have to pay their dues and work their way up. That's life.

Re: Disney: first trip in the late 1990s: 4 day FL Resident tix, $35 motel on 192, cheap buffet next to the motel, McDonald's on site, went to the Poly one night to ask if it was ok to get a table just for dessert just to experience the place. 10 year wedding anniversary trip in 2017: AP's, Grand Flo, V&A. That's life.

My secret to make Disney more "worth it" is my Chase Visa card. I use it for my business, and I get a lot of points. (In fact, the dinner at V&A was 100% on points - or I couldn't have justified spending that much money on one meal.) That makes the crazy resort prices and the parking fees more affordable. When I can pay for tickets, room, and some food with points, I can easily justify spending some cash, making the whole thing actually quite a value and easily affordable. The points are my "savings" for our (typically short) trips.

I regret nothing. The good times and memories are worth it, and no one else pays for it but me/us. Tomorrow isn't guaranteed.

Donna Summer is awesome forever.

I was with you till donna summers lol

 

[Chomama]

if I was terminal...I’d agree.
Ah, but aren’t we all?

 

[dreday3]

I need my decoder ring for this.

Now you know how I feel reading most of your posts.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Now you know how I feel reading most of your posts.

I’ll try to talk slower next time...

how does your dad making it work in the 60s/70s/80s mean that people born when chumbawumba was on the radio should “live for the moment”??

I think the bus jump from Speed is an easier sell than that one.

and just to be clear: I have full respect for your dad.

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

@Chomama

...that we are...dust to dust

 

[dreday3]

I’ll try to talk slower next time...

how does your dad making it work in the 60s/70s/80s mean that people born when chumbawumba was on the radio should “live for the moment”??

I think the bus jump from Speed is an easier sell than that one.

and just to be clear: I have full respect for your dad.

Who cares what I meant. The internet is just so draining for me lately.

Have fun creatively putting me down

 

[Chomama]

@Chomama

...that we are...dust to dust

So I’m gonna try to have fun while I am here! ( But also live responsibly for the sake of my children and whatever lessons I may, perhaps, impression upon them)

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Who cares what I meant. The internet is just so draining for me lately.

Have fun creatively putting me down

I actually only posted because I wanted to get Speed AND Tubthumping in a post...

party on

 

[Goofyernmost]

Or they could....

Wait for it....

Wait for it....

Build more capacity? Iger, and especially Chapek, are all about extracting maximum profit on the backs of the investments made by those who came before them.

Perhaps we should put it all in perspective. Only certain parts of Disney are overpriced. Many like to think that the admission fee is one of those things, but it is not. Where else can you get 12 to 14 hours of constant entertainment and activity for more than likely less then $100.00. Is it much more expensive then it used to be, sure but what isn't. No, it's not the parks. they are worth every cent, it is the rest. It is the way they convinced people that they are not getting the whole experience if they don't spend thousands of dollars to stay, eat and generally get their pockets picked by Mickey and his thugs. I have been going for 38 years now and have only stayed onsite once. But, surprise, surprise I have loved it enough to have gone back, many years from Vermont, 48 times now. It doesn't take breaking the bank to feel the magic, the magic comes in a 6 or 7 inch wide package that is firmly planted between our ears. I'm living on social security now and drawing off some of my retirement account to cover everyday expenses, but if I decide that I want to go to WDW, I can still afford to do so. And hopefully will again as soon as what they have to offer is enough to make what I will have to pay worth the money. In all my years once I factored in what was a value to me, staying in Disney's fancy prison is not even close to worth it. But, that is me. Others feel completely different.

As for credit card usage, I pay it off in full every month. That's not bragging that is just the way one comes out ahead with those cute little plastic things. It wasn't always that way, and as most of you will discover, living isn't always smooth sailing unless you are born into a wealthy family. Where one is on the social scale determines how much effort is required to become solvent. I had to file for Bankruptcy in the late 90's. Life and situations became overwhelming and I will confess that a small portion of my debt was doing things like going to Disney. Your children are only children for a very short, short period of time and there is no way to back up and try later, so we make decisions that aren't in our best interest because we remain optimistic that things will get better. But they don't always sometimes they get worse, but that isn't what we intended. Oh, and somewhere along there you have children that have the audacity to want to go to college, hello plastic. There are very few people that do not get in that problem sometime in their lifetime. Some are lucky and can find a way out, others aren't so fortunate, however, they created the debt at a point in time when they truly thought they were going to be able to pay it off, no sweat.

 

[Sorcerer Mickey]

Lifelong Disney fan here recently back from a 1.5 week post-COVID family trip. We blew $4k+ on hotel, tickets, food, and souvenir. We had a blast and my three-year-old is definitely hooked, so we're definitely gonna have to go back within a year.

Personally, I could wait a bit longer as it's pricey and some things rubbed me the wrong way. RoTR lottery (been snubbed twice), wait times to get into gift shops, Epcot is in bad shape, Hollywood Studios is still not in great shape after three years of expansion, massive crowds, etc.

 

[Goofyernmost]

if I was terminal...I’d agree.

a contract for riviera? Nyet

There is a strong train of thought that we are born terminal, it's just a matter of when. We can exercise, we can eat right, we can do everything possible and still wake up dead. Now when you get my age, 73 in July, I can know that I am terminal and never really have to be diagnosed, but, damnit, I still can't just spend money because there is a possibility that I might live longer then expected and I don't want to run out of money and be dependent on my family. So, I don't mind spending money as long as I feel it is worth it. That trip to Europe was something that was worth it to me. Going to Disney now is just because I don't have the energy to do something more spectacular at this point. So unless it gets back to a point where I can enjoy it... the visits will be short and very seldom.

 

[eliza61nyc]

if I was terminal...I’d agree.

a contract for riviera? Nyet

Aaah but I learned the hard way that some times terminal comes a lot quicker than we think.
You heard my history before.
2012 baby brother died before 50
2013 husband of 30 plus years lost cancer battle after 6 short months
2014 sister heart attack

All of the above BEFORE 50. So I'm no longer put off for tomorrow what I can do today.

I guess it's all in perspective. Disney is pricey, I will say I always thought it was crazy expensive but we just booked our condo for Ocean city. 1 week 3400.00 and we're on central Ave not beachfront. I did think to myself "dang just through out another grand and go to Disney"

Now my brothers three grand daughters are his reason for life. He takes them to the tea thing every trip at the Grand Floridian 500 bucks. He'd mortgage the ranch and sell a kidney, for him every smile is worth what they ask. Right or wrong, not my dough.

Not really sure the purpose of these thread? Now Give an outlet for folks to commiserate over the increases??

 

[Sirwalterraleigh]

Aaah but I learned the hard way that some times terminal comes a lot quicker than we think.
You heard my history before.
2012 baby brother died before 50
2013 husband of 30 plus years lost cancer battle after 6 short months
2014 sister heart attack

All of the above BEFORE 50. So I'm no longer put off for tomorrow what I can do today.

I guess it's all in perspective. Disney is pricey, I will say I always thought it was crazy expensive but we just booked our condo for Ocean city. 1 week 3400.00 and we're on central Ave not beachfront. I did think to myself "dang just through out another grand and go to Disney"

Not really sure the purpose of these thread? Give an outlet for folks to commiserate over the increases??

Half orphaned at 14...second parent lost mental faculties over the next couple of years...full on orphan at 27...

If you don’t want to pay for the Jersey shore...I wouldn’t pay it

and it’s just the standard “why does it cost so much?” Musing thread.

I’m on record there.

 

[eliza61nyc]

Half orphaned at 14...second parent lost mental faculties over the next couple of years...full on orphan at 27...

If you don’t want to pay for the Jersey shore...I wouldn’t pay it

and it’s just the standard “why does it cost so much?” Musing thread.

I’m on record there.

Oh I love it, I think that's the same principal behind the mouse world.
The beach is my happy place, my goal is to eventually pay some ridiculous amount of money or at least borrow it to eventually have a shack ocean front

LoL I'm in the market for a new pickup truck, I've been asking that question a lot. Some where along the line some fool put leather seats in a pickup and now they are "chic"

Trouble in paradise?? Doubt it. It will lose some but pick up others.

 

[jt04]

Aaah but I learned the hard way that some times terminal comes a lot quicker than we think.
You heard my history before.
2012 baby brother died before 50
2013 husband of 30 plus years lost cancer battle after 6 short months
2014 sister heart attack

All of the above BEFORE 50. So I'm no longer put off for tomorrow what I can do today.

I guess it's all in perspective. Disney is pricey, I will say I always thought it was crazy expensive but we just booked our condo for Ocean city. 1 week 3400.00 and we're on central Ave not beachfront. I did think to myself "dang just through out another grand and go to Disney"

Not really sure the purpose of these thread? Give an outlet for folks to commiserate over the increases??

Orange county is lifting mask mandates Friday most likely. Hence the need for a new line of wdw is gonna go bankrupt or be sold to the highest bidding investment group.

The msm used to pick up stories like this but they can't anymore.

My advice to most everyone, unless it is disposable income, it is always best to wait a year or two. Put some money in a cookie jar each week. Then it becomes much more affordable.