News Tron coaster coming to the Magic Kingdom

[mikejs78]

I can point to two Disneyland Paris roller coasters as to why they overengineer their rides now. First, Indiana Jones et le Temple du Peril is an Intamin looping coaster that was pegged as "temporary" and was soon plagued with structural issues. In 1999/2000, when they added the 12 passenger trains, they had to change quite a few track sections. Next, in 2014, the ride was closed and the temple made "permanent" with new materials and the track itself had a major change: the loop was unbolted and a specialised construction company from Germany came in to yank the loop out. They used a tall crane and they were able to move the loop vertically, not damaging the rest of the attraction. Vekoma in the meantime engineered and fabricated a new loop that fit in the same space, yet was able to take "Disney loads" and have a smoother shape. The same company came back, assembled the loop on the ground and then reinstalled the loop. Impressively, this whole refurb only took 5 months!

The second attraction that had major issues was Space Mountain: De la Terre a la Lune. The ride was originally delivered with 6 trains, five of which could run at the same time. Alas, the tight layout, high forces and extreme cycles meant that by 2000, a short 5 years after the ride opened, the train chassis had to be replaced. The original chassis sourced by Disney were unable to take the loads and Vekoma designed and fabricated new weldless chassis. The idea here was that by minimizing welds as much as possible and by using bolts and large cast steel pieces, they would have more durable chassis. It worked with one slight issue: the new chassis were heavier than the old ones and it caused timing issues on the ride. Basically, when running 3 trains on one station or 5 trains on two stations then, the new trains would catch up to the old ones and cause ride breakdowns. As the old car shells were recycled and just bolted on top of the new chassis, the solution to keep the last row empty? Grab large Mickey and Minnie plushes and strap them in the back row. The cast members would keep the back row empty and when they spotted the two VIP guests, they would not send guests to fill it. Once all the trains were switched, Mickey and Minnie finally ended their endless rides.

In addition to the heavier cars, running five trains also put a ton of stress on the structure and when they did Mission 2 in 2005, the ride launch was reconfigured and removed the ability to run five trains. The most you can hope for now is two trains on one station or four trains on two stations. After that, Disney moved to the current specs that exceed anything you can imagine of and the rides are now able to take the cycles without complaining.

One perfect example of the overengineering is Expedition Everest. Did you know it was originally designed to run four trains at once? Since it has the best cast members on property and after carefully examining the design and testing, Disney was able to buy an extra train. It can now run five trains at once, giving it even more capacity and I have to say this: GREAT JOB DISNEY!

Also keep in mind that Disney has to ensure that all structures are rated to withstand the 200 mph winds of a severe cat-5 hurricane. That's not cheap.

 

[mikejs78]

And yet it's widely attributed to him...

It is widely attributed to him. It is also a myth.

 

[larryz]

Also keep in mind that Disney has to ensure that all structures are rated to withstand the 200 157+ mph winds of a severe cat-5 hurricane. That's not cheap.

FIFY
http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/aboutsshws.php

 

[larryz]

It is widely attributed to him. It is also a myth.

I wonder who started that rumor, then... Steve Jobs?

 

[Slowjack]

I wonder who started that rumor, then... Steve Jobs?

That quote has a very long history; I remember it in textbooks from the 1990s. But Gates has always denied it. And anyway, the original quote is more like, "640K ought to be enough for anybody," which is different from saying that 640K is more than any computer would need now or at any point in the future. The quote in its original context is supposed to be about whether the memory addressing capabilities of the Intel CPU under consideration were going to be enough for all of the current customer base; it wasn't a long-term prediction.

To be clear, as with all visionaries, not all of Gates's or Jobs's (or Disney's!) visions have been correct. Here's a (verifiable!) quote, from Arthur C. Clarke, that I love: "When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong."

 

[Voxel]

I wonder who started that rumor, then... Steve Jobs?

. First known reference is a pc magazine in 1985.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Also keep in mind that Disney has to ensure that all structures are rated to withstand the 200 mph winds of a severe cat-5 hurricane. That's not cheap.

The ultimate design wind loads for the EPCOT Building Code do not reach 200 mph for any risk category. The loads required are also similar to those enforced by Orange County, meaning they apply to Universal Orlando Resort and SeaWorld Orlando as well. Busch Gardens Tampa has to meet higher requirements than the Orlando parks.

 

[Lora Baines Bradley]

If Disney can spend this much on a coaster based on a film that supposedly "flopped" why can't they make a second season of a TV show for said film series? I have no idea how much cartoons cost but it's gotta be less than a million, right?

 

[larryz]

The ultimate design wind loads for the EPCOT Building Code do not reach 200 mph for any risk category. The loads required are also similar to those enforced by Orange County, meaning they apply to Universal Orlando Resort and SeaWorld Orlando as well. Busch Gardens Tampa has to meet higher requirements than the Orlando parks.

I went to look that up, but wasn't going to pay RCID $45 for a copy of their building code.

 

[Voxel]

If Disney can spend this much on a coaster based on a film that supposedly "flopped" why can't they make a second season of a TV show for said film series? I have no idea how much cartoons cost but it's gotta be less than a million, right?

Hahaha, to give you an idea many cartons cost around 100k to 400k an episode. It depends on the actors, the software license, etc. this doesn’t include the marketing and other things that going into it

 

[Lora Baines Bradley]

Hahaha, to give you an idea many cartons cost around 100k to 400k an episode. It depends on the actors, the software license, etc. this doesn’t include the marketing and other things that going into it

Oh Lord, that is much more than I thought. Considering this series had Elijah Wood and Mandy Moore (not to mention others) and a unique art style I bet it wasn't cheap to make.

 

[Lord Pheonix]

as far as wind loading codes are concerned, the highest i know of is 120. generally after that, there isnt anything aside from a square concrete box that can stand up to anything higher with no damage. idk tho, maybe florida is unique, but really after 120mph your getting into tornado speeds. theres a reason why storm shelters are underground in kansas...

 

[lazyboy97o]

as far as wind loading codes are concerned, the highest i know of is 120. generally after that, there isnt anything aside from a square concrete box that can stand up to anything higher with no damage. idk tho, maybe florida is unique, but really after 120mph your getting into tornado speeds. theres a reason why storm shelters are underground in kansas...

The ultimate design are 3-second gusts. Most of Florida is above 120 mph for Risk Category II.
https://cdn-codes.iccsafe.org/bundles/document/new_document_images/1032/FIGURE 1609.3(1).jpg

 

[Next Big Thing]

Out of curiousity, does anyone know what the hourly capacity is for this ride? @marni1971 @Magic Feather @MansionButler84

 

[Absimilliard]

Out of curiousity, does anyone know what the hourly capacity is for this ride? @marni1971 @Magic Feather @MansionButler84

Looking at an hour long video that a friend shot to record the land soundtrack, they dispatched a train every 30-31 seconds. This comes out to 1600-1680 pph per hour if you figure each train is filled with fourteen riders. A Single Riders line will keep those trains full and to give you an idea of scale:

Rock n Roller Coaster is around 1700-1800 pph, less if they are having issues with the LSM launch system.

Expedition Everest and Big Thunder Mountain are around 2100 pph.

Soarin' with two theaters is barely above 1000 pph at WDW.

Previously, the champion roller coaster at Disney for capacity was Space Mountain at DLP. Without a single riders line and keeping those trains moving, we were able to get 2350-2360 guests an hour on the ride. This was with no air gates, five train operations, two cast members assigning seats and a train leaving every 36 seconds. Theorical capacity was 2400 pph then. Sadly, like I said earlier, capacity went down to 1920 pph now with the current setup.

 

[EricsBiscuit]

Looking at an hour long video that a friend shot to record the land soundtrack, they dispatched a train every 30-31 seconds. This comes out to 1600-1680 pph per hour if you figure each train is filled with fourteen riders. A Single Riders line will keep those trains full and to give you an idea of scale:

Rock n Roller Coaster is around 1700-1800 pph, less if they are having issues with the LSM launch system.

Expedition Everest and Big Thunder Mountain are around 2100 pph.

Soarin' with two theaters is barely above 1000 pph at WDW.

Previously, the champion roller coaster at Disney for capacity was Space Mountain at DLP. Without a single riders line and keeping those trains moving, we were able to get 2350-2360 guests an hour on the ride. This was with no air gates, five train operations, two cast members assigning seats and a train leaving every 36 seconds. Theorical capacity was 2400 pph then. Sadly, like I said earlier, capacity went down to 1920 pph now with the current setup.

I thought Soarin had a better capacity. 87 going 8 times let's say an hour for two theaters is something like 1392. Now it has three so it should get around 2100.

 

[GlacierGlacier]

I thought Soarin had a better capacity. 87 going 8 times let's say an hour for two theaters is something like 1392. Now it has three so it should get around 2100.

He's talking about coaster capacity. If you want to get into the full attraction capacity game, the original Carousel of Progress' guide from the 1964 world's fair claims a 250+ person seating area with rotation every fiveish minutes. That's up there in the 3 thousands.

 

[Absimilliard]

I thought Soarin had a better capacity. 87 going 8 times let's say an hour for two theaters is something like 1392. Now it has three so it should get around 2100.

I was expecting the figure you said until I checked with internal sources. The real life number was around 1000-1100 and I was quite baffled to say the least.

 

[EricsBiscuit]

I was expecting the figure you said until I checked with internal sources. The real life number was around 1000-1100 and I was quite baffled to say the least.

Must be the load times

 

[Absimilliard]

Must be the load times

Load times for many Disney attractions have gotten quite bad for some rides. Seven Dwarves Mine Train in Shanghai was more efficient than at the Magic Kingdom, but then you have this factor: you have a lot less guests that require assistance entering and exiting the rides at the Asian parks.

The omnimover capacity numbers must be a shell of what they used to be: if you're stopping the belt for 30-45 seconds every 5 minutes, you're losing a ton of capacity and this is a factor in why Haunted Mansion wait times have been exploding since Fast Pass +.

The perfect solution to that is to have a separate loading area for disabled guests.