There is no attendance problem at WDW

[fosse76]

Very good point ... and take it even further ... look at MK, Splash Mountain (and all that capacity) was closed for two weeks ... right across the way Pecos Bill Cafe (the second largest quick serve facility ... actually it may be the largest now with all the seating it added) has been closed as well ... labor cuts at the parks have reduced capacity at attractions as well ... and even things like HoP being closed means more people in the walkways ... it absolutely doesn't equate with actual attendance.

You can very easily make a day where 25,000 people are in the MK feel like there's over 40,000 by all of the above ... plus FastPass.

Exactly! When I went to DHS the walkways were packed! I was stunned because it was a wednesday in January. But every ride and attraction I went to was a virtual walk-on. I didn't have reservations for lunch, but none of the restaurants were full and anyone could walk-up and be seated. I think the only ride/attraction with any wait was Toy Story Mania and The Walt Disney story was crowded as well. It was very strange. So while the park was crowded, that doesn't necessarily mean it was busier than normal...the crowds just weren't following any kind of pattern.

 

[bgraham34]

I have to say the parks were much busier than I thought they would be. I got there last Wed and came home last night. I was surprised by how many people I saw at every park. There were just crowds off people all over.

 

[WDW1974]

Seeing as how s/he has posted elsewhere that s/he works for Guest Relations---your sarcasm might be misplaced.

I have never read a post by that individual before.

And a one sentence response with nothing to back it up says nothing.

Let's hear the numbers ...

And someone working in Guest Relations 'might' have reason for making things appear better than they are. Not saying that's the case here, just a possibility.

I think I made a very compelling explanation as to why parks can feel busier than they are.

 

[mcjaco]

Attendance means nothing without real numbers. Everyone's perceived thought of crowded is different.

What one person thinks is crowded, may not be to someone else. I've found fanboys to be overly critical of "crowded" numbers if they have to wait more than 20 minutes.

It's really just someone's perception of what is crowded without actual attendance figures.

 

[Brian Noble]

I have never read a post by that individual before.

Handy WDWMagic tip: click on a poster's name, and a menu will appear. Go to "Find all posts by <whomever>" Take a quick skim to get a sense of their past history, and you can quickly decide who is giving you information that may be accurate, but is perhaps abstracted so that said poster won't have to fear losing their job for telling tales out of school.

They may have pixie dust in their eyes, too, but usually it's pretty easy to tell the difference.

 

[smk]

attendance is up...nuff said.

While the economy is horrible right now, I am more than willing to suspend (my) reality if I can be at my happy place. If I lived closer, I would be there today because while I am there I have the ability to put the real world on hold for a day or two. Today, that sounds really good to me.

 

[mcjaco]

Handy WDWMagic tip: click on a poster's name, and a menu will appear. Go to "Find all posts by <whomever>" Take a quick skim to get a sense of their past history, and you can quickly decide who is giving you information that may be accurate, but is perhaps abstracted so that said poster won't have to fear losing their job for telling tales out of school.

They may have pixie dust in their eyes, too, but usually it's pretty easy to tell the difference.

Either way, her original post doesn't do anything to provide factual basis that crowds are really up. It came across as an opinion, which is all this thread is without any numbers to substantiate the claim.

And to assume someone is always going to click on a member's info and review their posts, is a bit ridiculous. I know WDW1974 isn't well liked, but c'mon. There are very few people that would go to that trouble before responding to such a post.

 

[Fade_to_Blah]

............I know WDW1974 isn't well liked, but c'mon. .........

Cause hes an evil disney hater! :fork:

:lol:

 

[Goofnut1980]

You can very easily make a day where 25,000 people are in the MK feel like there's over 40,000 by all of the above ... plus FastPass.

Here are some crazy figures a CM told me... For special events like MVMCP and P&P Party and MNSSHP... they allow 25,000 tickets and they dont sell out on all (halloween though does for sure) and the Ticket and Transportation Center handles 100,000 cars... I said... Say again.. and the guy at the TTC said yup.. 100,000... granted some take that to Epcot.. but just imagine what the park would be like if it was to full capacity... we complain about 20 mins in a line.. haha :ROFLOL:

 

[Goofnut1980]

December 5 was the start of the beloved invasion of the "OH SO WELL BEHAVED-MY CHILD WOULD NEVER DO THAT" Pop Warner football/cheerleading thing...that would explain the crowds at the Values

Thanks.. yea we found that out the hard way... although we had a great time... there was a lot of rude kids running around without parents... :brick:

 

[Brian Noble]

There are very few people that would go to that trouble before responding to such a post.

I did, because I didn't know that poster from Adam (or Joe, or...) and wanted to see what they were saying. Guess that's just me, but I often do that when someone makes a claim without evidence, 'cause I like to see whether they are truly making crap up, or might just have a vague reason for knowing something. I've got nothing against (or for) '74. Just pointing out that, sometimes folks here have a reason to know some of the things they say they know.

Those folks could be lying to us, but that's for us to decide.

More broadly, there are lots of signs that the predicted Apocalypse is not coming to pass, beyond what we've heard (or not heard) here. Disney is extending hours some for President's Week and a few other February weekends here and there. The Unofficial Guide's Stats Dude (who reputedly gets data fed to him from Orange County's convention/visitor office) is revising crowd estimates for February up a little bit more each passing week. So, the evidence seems to suggest that folks are booking, but booking late. Perhaps not quite in the numbers we've seen in years past, but still.

On the other hand, there is a big sign that the Apocalypse is right here, in that the 7-for-4 promotion got extended, again. But, that could also be due to late bookings freaking out the sharp-pencil boys. Hard to say without actually knowing something.

 

[WDW1974]

Either way, her original post doesn't do anything to provide factual basis that crowds are really up. It came across as an opinion, which is all this thread is without any numbers to substantiate the claim.

Yes, it did.

And I don't have time or the desire to research other posters, much like no one here has bothered to read me for years on other Disney sites.

If that person is a CM and has access to the numbers, and values their job there are ways to get the numbers out without them coming directly from said CM.

And to assume someone is always going to click on a member's info and review their posts, is a bit ridiculous. I know WDW1974 isn't well liked, but c'mon. There are very few people that would go to that trouble before responding to such a post.

NOT WELL LIKED?!???! WT&?!??!?

Seriously, what ever gave you that crazy notion?

People love me. They really love me!

 

[WDW1974]

I did, because I didn't know that poster from Adam (or Joe, or...) and wanted to see what they were saying. Guess that's just me, but I often do that when someone makes a claim without evidence, 'cause I like to see whether they are truly making crap up, or might just have a vague reason for knowing something. I've got nothing against (or for) '74. Just pointing out that, sometimes folks here have a reason to know some of the things they say they know.

Those folks could be lying to us, but that's for us to decide.

More broadly, there are lots of signs that the predicted Apocalypse is not coming to pass, beyond what we've heard (or not heard) here. Disney is extending hours some for President's Week and a few other February weekends here and there. The Unofficial Guide's Stats Dude (who reputedly gets data fed to him from Orange County's convention/visitor office) is revising crowd estimates for February up a little bit more each passing week. So, the evidence seems to suggest that folks are booking, but booking late. Perhaps not quite in the numbers we've seen in years past, but still.

On the other hand, there is a big sign that the Apocalypse is right here, in that the 7-for-4 promotion got extended, again. But, that could also be due to late bookings freaking out the sharp-pencil boys. Hard to say without actually knowing something.

All good and fair points.

I'd err on the side of things are going to get worse before they get better ... just look at all the job cuts announced in the past two weeks.

Disney isn't immune from this stuff. No one is.

I've seen stores and fast food and casual dining restaurants here in SoFla just close up overnight. Two hospitals closed.

I've sat in restaurants that used to be packed and been the only ones in the place.

I think anyone that just looks around the country should be able to tell that the economy is headed toward uncharted waters of bad.

When you hear people ... professionals who have been out of work for YEARS call CNN for advice on a job show and the talking heads all look around and finally stammer out comments about 'lowering expectations' and 'waiting tables at Ruby Tuesday's (which went out of business locally the other day, btw)' ... you get the feeling that nothing short of an FDR-like program to put people to work and strong tariffs on foreign goods are going to change things.

And I guess where I am going with this is people are going to be giving up their magical WDW vacations before they give up their homes or their cars or one of their kids!

Disney is holding up relatively OK due to busy weekends mixed with the Buy 4, Get 3 Free deal.

That can't last forever.

And I can't help but think Disney doesn't want anyone knowing how many people were in the MK or DAK today ...

 

[CaptainMichael]

Attendance should continue to appear okay this week as Superbowl crowds invade central Florida. (The SB is in Tampa on Sunday). Look for lots of Cardinals and Steelers jerseys.

 

[jt04]

Attendance should continue to appear okay this week as Superbowl crowds invade central Florida. (The SB is in Tampa on Sunday). Look for lots of Cardinals and Steelers jerseys.

Exactly, and then ESPN Weekend and then F&G and spring break and Star Wars weekends and then summer crowds and then F&W and halloween and then Christmas :xmas: and then MLK weekend and the marathon and then.......well you get the idea.

 

[WDW1974]

Attendance should continue to appear okay this week as Superbowl crowds invade central Florida. (The SB is in Tampa on Sunday). Look for lots of Cardinals and Steelers jerseys.

Yep.

And people will jump to conclusions that have no real world basis ... I would expect to see increased crowds for the 5-6 days before/after the Super Bowl. Not a huge increase, but a noticeable one.

but one that doesn't have any relevance to the big picture ...

 

[Brian Noble]

I think there are two things simultaneously happening to folks in the present economy.

One: folks are losing jobs. Plenty of that up here in the Erstwhile Automotive Capital of the World. They're not coming, even for "buy 1 get 7".

Two: people aren't really losing any tangible income, but they are afraid that they might. Those are the folks taking the wait-and-see attitude and, when it gets to be time that they want to get out of the cold, or whatever, they decide to come on down to thaw out (or whatever).

So, the real question is who is dominating the economic landscape for WDW's market---Type Ones or Type Twos. If it's Type Twos, then you can weather the storm by offering a nice little promotion (that really boils down to "40% off your room, and a few bucks on the ticket.") to stay in the consciousness until folks pull the trigger, and cutting costs where you can. If it's Type Ones, then Katie-bar-the-door.

Even so, there's going to be a lot of pullback on in-park spending even with Type Twos, because folks are nervous. Plus, Peak Season hasn't seen discounts even close to 40% for a long long time. Those lower per-cap and RevPAR numbers will mean that even if attendance and occupancy stay within spitting distance of 2008's, the Resort as a whole is still going to be missing '08's revenue numbers by a wide margin.

 

[pheneix]

The parks are going to be pretty busy this weekend because of the Super Bowl, surprisingly so I bet. That being said, no one is going to feel the heat more than Busch Gardens.

And I can't help but think Disney doesn't want anyone knowing how many people were in the MK or DAK today ...

I'll go ahead and throw it out there. DAK was operating on a 12-14k budget today*. A bit higher than they have been doing this month but this was the first good weather day in a while and the Super Bowl crowds are starting to emerge. Still, even on a below average day the park felt busier because DAK OPERATIONS IS TURNING INTO CRAP!!! Seriously, Val Bunting should be arrested for running that park into the ground. I had the joy of experiencing four ride stops on Dinosaur because they are two cheap to run both sides of the ride and don't care enough to cycle cars at a decent speed on the side they are running. And don't get me started on Everest's overselling of Fastpasses. The park is just a mess and doesn't even look show ready anymore since they've started running the park Magic Kingdom style (no pressure washing and under funded custodial so trash appears everywhere).

* And before anyone asks... NO, I don't have the final gate count but they most assuredly did not go over projection today.

 

[Brian Noble]

The parks are going to be pretty busy this weekend because of the Super Bowl, surprisingly so I bet.

I still find it curious that there's that much overlap. I was a Steeler season ticket holder for a year in the 90s, and most of those guys (and they're all mostly guys) don't strike me as big time Disney fans----or, for that matter, guys who'd feel bad about leaving the family home to go to the Super Bowl. I always assumed they'd be taking advantage of Central Florida's, ahem, "nightlife" in all of its many splendored forms before visiting Mickey.

 

[sknydave]

Taking the kids and wife to Disney World is a good cover for traveling all the way to central florida for the Super Bowl.