The Spirited Seventh Heaven ...

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
The thing is UNI isn't waiting around for Harry Potter to get stale. They're already building KONG, not to mention the attractions that are in the planning phase. And that's the point, they're moving forward, which is nice.

You're correct about the four park advantage WDW has (I have never believed a water park gives that great of an advantage, imo) but those four parks true advantage is the park hopper pass. Alone, AK and DHS are stale, EPCOT too to an extent, but it's in better shape attraction-wise than the other two parks. And they are all riiding the cotails of Magic Kingdom, imho. And there's something to be said of the obsessed who will never see anything wrong with the parks also. I am curious about that UNI third gate, though...

WDW's real advantage is the family dark ride. There's just more to do as a family at WDW, including the grandparents, and that advantage UNI can't touch... I would say yet, but the cancled Lorax dark ride really has me peeved. :mad:
Well, they had Kong once before and it was a terrific attraction, then they got rid of it, now they are bringing it back and I will bet dollars to donuts that it will not be as good as the original. They replaced Kong with The Mummy which I could not ride because I wasn't one of the beautiful people that could fit in the vehicle. They did the same thing with HP. They cut out a large (excuse the pun) part of the population from ever experiencing it. I am not impressed.

All appearances seem to point to Disney coming alive as well. The obvious redoing of DHS, the current construction walls everywhere do not indicate that Disney has fallen over dead by any means. Every theme park constructed since 1955 has been riding the coattails of Disneyland. Nothing new there. Magic Kingdom being a close copy, at least in atmosphere, is the main draw and probably always will be.
 

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
MIB and Mummy may not be as popular as they once were but they did make great rides out of them. MIB is the best shooter ride in Orlando imo.
Even more proof that a film's popularity has nothing to do with the ride's quality. MIB: AA is the best shoot 'em up dark ride in the world - you'd be hard pressed to find one of higher quality. Revenge of the Mummy is a stellar indoor coaster that's only hurt by its convoluted storyline. If they ever update the ride in Orlando, they ought to remove any pretense of "this is a fake movie set which may be real in a not-real way". Also upgrade the coaster section to have better FX.
 

mahnamahna101

Well-Known Member
The thing is UNI isn't waiting around for Harry Potter to get stale. They're already building KONG, not to mention the attractions that are in the planning phase. And that's the point, they're moving forward, which is nice.

You're correct about the four park advantage WDW has (I have never believed a water park gives that great of an advantage, imo) but those four parks true advantage is the park hopper pass. Alone, AK and DHS are stale, EPCOT too to an extent, but it's in better shape attraction-wise than the other two parks. And they are all riiding the cotails of Magic Kingdom, imho. And there's something to be said of the obsessed who will never see anything wrong with the parks also. I am curious about that UNI third gate, though...

WDW's real advantage is the family dark ride. There's just more to do as a family at WDW, including the grandparents, and that advantage UNI can't touch... I would say yet, but the cancled Lorax dark ride really has me peeved. :mad:

Meanwhile MK and Epcot need 3-4 thrill rides/E-tickets. :D DHS and AK have Universal's problem - lack of family rides.
Agreed. USF and IOA each need 2-3 family dark rides in addition to E.T. and Cat in the Hat and they're about as family-friendly as every Orlando theme park except MK.

USF (just armchair rambling)
  1. GMR-esque dark ride to replace Shrek and Lucy (all-ages)
  2. Some new dark ride to accompany KidZone revamp - no clue on the theme
  3. Possibly allow an option on E.T. to ride in a spaceship RV that anyone can ride (elderly, infants, toddlers, handicapped, etc) - the bikes can still be 34"
IOA (armchair rambling)

  1. Dark ride in Toon Lagoon revamp/replacement - bulldoze the front area of TL... fit in a people-eating, well done show and a nice C-ticket/D-ticket dark ride (something slightly above the Fantasyland dark rides).
  2. Discovery Center dark ride - always thought Uni Creative should reclaim the Discovery Center, make Thunder Falls a year-round restaurant for JP, make an interactive queue, then put a nice Epcot-style Omnimover like in the first film. Nothing major... a 3 to 5 minute dark ride.
  3. Another Seuss dark ride - no brainer. As the kid-friendly area of the park, there should be something everyone can ride. And figure out how to make Cat all-ages again, along with a massive refurb/upgrade.
  4. Possibly a dark ride in LC - if they ever revamp or replace it, giving the area an easy-going indoor boat ride (Wonka, Seuss, LC or Potter themed... maybe something else entirely) would do wonders for the area and be an easy way to bring families to the area.
 

ChrisFL

Premium Member
Also, unfortunately far too many people who say they love Disney for the wonderful theming have no clue what "theming" really means.

THIS!

Agreed, they seem to think theming is wherever mouse ears and merchandise opportunities pop up. And TDO hasn't been helping out with that idea much either.

It used to be the idea that you're entering a unique land, transporting you to a different place and time....not oh this is a theme park with a massive, oversized mickey hat, because Mickey = perfect, nothing with Mickey is ever bad, Mickey needs to be everywhere...ugh. Might as well have a theme park called Mickeyland that everyone of THOSE kinds of people can go to and leave the rest of the true theme parks to the rest of us.
 

Soarin' Over Pgh

Well-Known Member
I saw that SDL castle picture on D&M yesterday. Brook Lopez was over in Shanghai a couple of weeks ago (most likely when the picture was posted/taken) because the Nets played the Kings in a scrimmage/preseason game on October 13th (both teams then played in Beijing the next day). The Nets spent a week in China playing preseason/exhibition basketball games.



Slightly off topic but doesn't the concept sketches for the castle look very similar to this 1976 Herbert ryman sketch for Tokyo? (Image from Walt Disney imagineering, volume one....that I picked up today!)
 

Attachments

  • image.jpg
    image.jpg
    147.8 KB · Views: 71

wdwfan4ver

Well-Known Member
All appearances seem to point to Disney coming alive as well. The obvious redoing of DHS, the current construction walls everywhere do not indicate that Disney has fallen over dead by any means.
The thing is DHS redo should have started years ago. Disney sat with DHS after Star Tours was redone before this year. The best way to put in prospective is the fact Disney made the mistake of doing a New Fantasy Land Expansion at a time when Animal Kingdom and DHS should've been bigger priorities. I argue Fantasy Land wasn't even the land at the Magic Kingdom needed a change at a time when Tomorrowland had issues and still does.

While Star Tours: The Adventure Continues was announced at the 2009 D23 expo, they needed more at DHS and Animal Kingdom. in 2009 Animal Kingdom needed more attractions after Everest was done in 2006. Animal Kingdom or DHS would have been the ideal announcement for Walt Disney World in terms of the 2009 D23 Expo.

The truth is Disney is playing catch up in terms of Disney Hollywood Studios in terms of stuff that should have been done before this year. Backlot Tour should have been gone years ago. Disney miscalculated with American Idol Experience based on the fact they expected more people to show up than they did. The rumors about Beauty and the Beast live on Stage going away is something that should've been done a while ago. The fact is stage shows like on Broadway aren't made for running 20 some years without being replaced and that the problem with Beauty and the Beast and Voyage of the Mermaid. Indiana Jones is another show under stale since without special events, there hasn't a been a change to the show.

The construction wells for Disney Springs actually is something Disney should've done years ago after they closed Pleasure Island. Disney did screw up with Hyperion Warf, but the amount of time before stuff opening from the closing of Pleasure Island Clubs to the start of construction shows Disney didn't have true thought out plan before Pleasure Island Clubs were closing.

The construction Walls at AK shouldn't be something bragging about because those walls should've been up years ago!. Disney didn't do a thing with Animal Kingdom from Expedition Everest opening in 2006 to the announcement of Avatar in September 2011. That is a big gap out of a park back in 2006 that was 8 years old that has expansion pads waiting to be used. AK after Everest did need more attractions also. The fact is Disney took that long to do something with AK speaks volumes about the people of TDO, and Burbank in terms of their speaking of attractions of the parks that doesn't involve mymagic plus.
 
Last edited:

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
The thing is DHS redo should have started years ago. Disney sat with DHS after Star Tours was redone before this year. The best way to put in prospective is the fact Disney made the mistake of doing a New Fantasy Land Expansion at a time when Animal Kingdom and DHS should've been bigger priorities. While Star Tours: The Adventure Continues was announced at the 2009 D23 expo, they needed more and Animal Kingdom in 2009 needed more attractions after Everest was done in 2006.

The truth is Disney is playing catch up in terms of Disney Hollywood Studios in terms of stuff that should have been done before this year. Backlot Tour should have been gone years ago. Disney miscalculated with American Idol Experience based on the fact they expected more people to show up than they did. The rumors about Beauty and the Beast live on Stage going away is something that should've been done a while ago. The fact is stage shows like on Broadway aren't made for running 20 some years without being replaced and that the problem with Beauty and the Beast and Voyage of the Mermaid. Indiana Jones is another show under stale since without special events, there hasn't a been a change to the show.

The construction wells for Disney Springs actually is something Disney should've done years ago after they closed Pleasure Island. Disney did screw up with Hyperion Warf, but the amount of time before stuff opening from the closing of Pleasure Island Clubs to the start of construction shows Disney didn't have true thought out plan before Pleasure Island Clubs were closing.

The construction Walls at AK shouldn't be something bragging about because those walls should've been up years ago!. Disney didn't do a thing with Animal Kingdom from Expedition Everest opening in 2006 to the announcement of Avatar in September 2011. That is a big gap out of a park back in 2006 that was 8 years old that has expansion pads waiting to be used. AK after Everest did need more attractions also. The fact is Disney took that long to do something with AK speaks volumes about the people of TDO, and Burbank in terms of their speaking of attractions of the parks that doesn't involve mymagic plus.

In order to "catch up" don't you have to be in a recognized race with someone that is way ahead? If anyone thinks that Uni is way ahead in terms of the big picture, then they are just kidding themselves. Did they need to do something with DHS, indeed they did, but they are only going to do what is necessary to maintain Guests expectations, not some other establishment. Call me when Uni has 21 sq. Miles of property and 4 theme parks, then we will talk about catch up. When they should have done something is strictly a personal observation. It's their ball park and they can play in it anytime they wish and the only pressure would be if revenue is lost because they didn't do it. That doesn't seem to be the case in recent years.
 

Mike C

Well-Known Member
In order to "catch up" don't you have to be in a recognized race with someone that is way ahead? If anyone thinks that Uni is way ahead in terms of the big picture, then they are just kidding themselves. Did they need to do something with DHS, indeed they did, but they are only going to do what is necessary to maintain Guests expectations, not some other establishment. Call me when Uni has 21 sq. Miles of property and 4 theme parks, then we will talk about catch up. When they should have done something is strictly a personal observation. It's their ball park and they can play in it anytime they wish and the only pressure would be if revenue is lost because they didn't do it. That doesn't seem to be the case in recent years.

They didn't mention Universal in that post, all it does it s. Catching up is to themselves, the fact DHS/Epcot/AK have issues with lack of attractions is really apparent with FP+ now.
It is the fact they let them sit so long without additions makes it more painful now.

Hollywood Studios is down 3 attractions now, in a park that didn't have much to do to begin with. Add the fact ticket and food prices nearly doubled in 10 years along with the fact there are less attractions and shows open currently at both Epcot and DHS now then back then also. Also more upcharge events, and crazy onsite hotel pricing (compared to say Swan/Dolphin)

They lack the capacity they need right now and ignored it, and that's what they are catching up to (or at least may be). The real oddity is expanding current attractions instead of new ones (I guess it's cheaper, no need for as much R&D?), and cutting entertainment.
 
Last edited:

PirateFrank

Well-Known Member
I honestly think the booze has nothing to do with BoG's popularity. They need more restaurants with theming like that.

I have an upcoming trip, where I am planning a three-family trip where the other families have been to wdw quite a few times (but no visits before bog's opening).....I spent an entire evening practically begging them to consider a location other than BOG....but as soon as I let slip that you can get wine and beer (chimay no less) at BOG...it was a complete losing battle.

The theming is certainly an aspect....but times have changed. It's no longer the 50's....and restricting adults to coke and root beer is quite old. I firmly believe that if you put alcohol options at the 4 other table service options at the mk, the popularity of bog would be vastly different.
 

BrerJon

Well-Known Member
Revenge of the Mummy is a stellar indoor coaster that's only hurt by its convoluted storyline. If they ever update the ride in Orlando, they ought to remove any pretense of "this is a fake movie set which may be real in a not-real way". Also upgrade the coaster section to have better FX.

Yup to removing the movie stuff. The ride is great, but that 'you forgot my coffee!' bit is excruciating and needs to go, especially if you're stuck watching it on loop while they do a long loading ahead.
 

Mike S

Well-Known Member
Yup to removing the movie stuff. The ride is great, but that 'you forgot my coffee!' bit is excruciating and needs to go, especially if you're stuck watching it on loop while they do a long loading ahead.
The facade does say "Museum of Antiquities." The answer is right there, also on the banners.
image.jpg

Make it like it's a museum exhibit that goes horribly wrong. The Egyptian theming in the later parts of the queue and the ride itself would only need very minimal changes if any.
 

twebber55

Well-Known Member
Uni is already stealing days from Disney. They are now working on stealing nights. Cabana Bay was step 1. Sapphire Falls is step 2. Adding an incredibly themed water park within walking distance of their 3 largest and most affordable resorts will be step 3.
yeah I think the water park is a big deal because steals another day and night from disney
 

TeriofTerror

Well-Known Member
I honestly think the booze has nothing to do with BoG's popularity. They need more restaurants with theming like that.
Would it be too much to ask for a MK restaurant that had great theming and served a tempting selection of high-quality food and alcohol at a reasonable price?
Oh, goodness; I almost made it entirely through that without cracking up. :hilarious:
 

Phil12

Well-Known Member
Exactly and it's the goal of most of the so called 'Haters' on this board. Just bring back the quality we USED to get, We understand it's not a museum, Attractions WILL change but as long as they are BETTER than what they replace most of us WILL be happy.
Thomas Wolfe said it best with his book, You Can't Go Home Again. The passage of time and your memories of the past are irrefutable. It's very much like the way some people admire classic cars. They revere the old cars and newer autos automatically get demerits because they have no nostalgia factor.

And, of course, better is always in the eye of the beholder.
Time for a tangent....

To the woman who was getting gas at Wawa on Poinciana Boulevard and 17/92… clearly you work it up got because you're wearing in Epcot winter coat. It's 64° out.

It's not winter, it's not cold, It's absolutely beautiful and gorgeous out. I'm wearing a T-shirt and shorts, there is no need for you to wear your winter coat.
I really thought you were talking about a woman that had an episode of flatulence at Wawa due to the steak and cheese subs.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Also, unfortunately far too many people who say they love Disney for the wonderful theming have no clue what "theming" really means.
To me there are two big groups of online Disney fans that really reflect a split that was big also within the Company itself. Studio fans and park fans. Studio fans are a very loud group but they are only interested in themed entertainment because it is mostly tied to studio projects. They want more "Disney" in the parks.
 
Last edited:

wdwfan4ver

Well-Known Member
In order to "catch up" don't you have to be in a recognized race with someone that is way ahead? .
No. Disney needed to catch up in terms of the standards they used to have. They even show in the profit margins in terms of the Park and resort Division. The fact Disney had to increase their amount of charged events for increasing a profit margin of the Park and Resort Division shows how bad AK, DHS, and Epcot is for stuff to do in the parks they have everyday of the year.

Personally I am not Universal Fanboy. I also didn't even mention Universal in my post. Disney was behind at Disney Hollywood studios and Animal Kingdom because they lacked attractions. They fact is you don't need FP+ to know AK and Disney Hollywood Studios needed more attractions from a capacity point and for keeping guests in the park for speeding money. The way you get guests spend more in parks is keeping them busy and Iger failed in that early in his tenure.

Disney gross margins in the Park and Resorts was 22 percent under Eisner compare to Iger's 14.7 percent. The percentage difference is more than Universal. It was a sign of Disney getting stale and needed Discounts to draw guests into the park at a time they raise hotel, theme park admission and food.

In the First 3 years, Iger's percentage 16 percent, but from 2009 to 2011 that percentage went down to 12.9 percent despite an increase of guests at Walt Disney World and Disneyland despite being a recession.

That 12.9 percent should be troubling for the Park and Resort division because that was at all Time low according to Parentof4. The stuff I underline is because they very important. Parentsof4 is the financial person of the forums matter of fact.

What caused that 12.9 percent was Disney lowering the amount of money spent P&R capital expenditures under Iger from 2006 to 2008. Eisner understand how to increase profits in the parks is by spending money in the parks in order to the gets in the parks and that is something the people under Iger didn't always get.

When Iger took charge in late 2005, he immediately slashed P&R investments. P&R capex was cut from $1.4B (Eisner’s last year) to $0.9B (Iger’s first year). It would be one thing if it were a one-year blip. However, P&R capex remained low for 3 years.

For amusement parks, capex is what drives future growth. The money spent this year pays for the new attraction next year.

In Disney’s case, projects take multiple years to develop. Thus, when Iger reduced capex from 2006 to 2008, it wasn’t until 2009 to 2011 that its effects were felt
. All the information I underline is stuff that Parentsof4 posted earlier in this thread.

I hope you get the point that guests spend less in the parks when your product doesn't have anything new and continue to raise prices.

If you still don't believe that Disney Hollywood Studios is behind, how do explain them needing a redo of most of the park and is showing up by closing up 3 attractions this year in stuff that the guests have to do? This problem with Studios is going to show up in the holiday season coming up and throughout next year.

This problem even shows up even more next year because Disney Hollywood Studios in the short term is really going hurt with even more attractions going down next year. Disney isn't going to stop by closing only 3 attractions at DHS based on the rumors even more going attractions closing down permanently with the information from insiders on this forum.
 
Last edited:

Bairstow

Well-Known Member
Yup to removing the movie stuff. The ride is great, but that 'you forgot my coffee!' bit is excruciating and needs to go, especially if you're stuck watching it on loop while they do a long loading ahead.

At least he dies in the end.

The facade does say "Museum of Antiquities." The answer is right there, also on the banners.
View attachment 71442
Make it like it's a museum exhibit that goes horribly wrong. The Egyptian theming in the later parts of the queue and the ride itself would only need very minimal changes if any.

I sort of like Mummy's Russian nesting dolls approach to storytelling.

You're in a hellscape inside an Egyptian tomb located a museum which is really a film set which is actually in a movie studios theme park which is actually just a regular theme park that mentions movies.

...and then the ride starts and the 6 layers of reality start to weave in and out and fight one another.

It's a neat approach for a dark ride.
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
Thomas Wolfe said it best with his book, You Can't Go Home Again. The passage of time and your memories of the past are irrefutable. It's very much like the way some people admire classic cars. They revere the old cars and newer autos automatically get demerits because they have no nostalgia factor.

And, of course, better is always in the eye of the beholder.

I really thought you were talking about a woman that had an episode of flatulence at Wawa due to the steak and cheese subs.

I did not get close enough to find out but her mission space winter coat certainly told me what she does for a living and where she works.
 

Register on WDWMAGIC. This sidebar will go away, and you'll see fewer ads.

Top Bottom