The Spirited Back Nine ...

[flynnibus]

But once every three or four months the Miceage team remembers that there is a Disney theme park also in Florida and mentions it in passing. This is one of those updates.

Since they were all just here last month.. probably the roundup of rumors they found from the locals.

 

[flynnibus]

The most interesting bit to me in the MC update is the bit on curbing DAS abuse

The new electronic version will force all DAS holders to declare in advance the exact people who are in their party, and then all of those people will have their ticket or AP electronically linked by Guest Relations to the person who has the DAS privileges. Each park ticket or AP will only be allowed to be linked to one DAS ticket holder at a time, thus eliminating the growing practice of families or groups of friends collecting multiple DAS cards and then rounding up multiple ride entries at a time for the entire group.

I called out this way to game the system from the very moment it was launched. Sounds like a pretty burdensome way to address it (as now everyone in the party must have their ticket scanned) but it shows Disney is pretty adamant about trying to break this cycle of abuse. I don't know if they'll be able to withstand all the legal challenges (there is virtually no protection for the business in the disability laws to be able to stand up to abuse).. but I at least am happy Disney has not turned a blind eye to this.

 

[PhotoDave219]

All they really need is a simple irrigation system. For $250k, I could get the job done in 2 days.

Well first you would have to become an approved WDI vendor and contractor. Do you like meetings?

 

[PhotoDave219]

Since they were all just here last month.. probably the roundup of rumors they found from WDWMagic.

Fixed that for ya

 

[xstech25]

improvements like BOG's cupcakes?

Mostly how in the 90s they changed almost all the QSRs to high margin items like frozen pizzas and burgers/fries and over the past 10 years or so they have focused on having a wider variety of foods. Granted each park still has one or two of those "typical" pizza/burger places, but overall WDW now they have more themed items and you won't find the same thing at every place.

 

[Goofyernmost]

The custodial role is one of either two things: Streets or Bathrooms. Both are fairly easy and bathrooms aren't nearly as bad as most would think.

Once custodial clock in, you get told what your task is for the day, and you basically have all day to do it. Streets is basically keeping the area clean, doing trash runs a few times a day, and guest service. They don't call the role "Custodial Guest Service" for nothing. The amount of questions you get asked is really mind boggling at first. No one sees it coming. Then there's pin trading, water art, etc.

Yes, the highest priority for custodial is Code V's, but everything else gets done as well. As I said, guest service is a main part of the custodial role, so talking is part of the job. Talking amongst co-workers could be as simple as asking if someone knows the answer to a question or most likely, waiting during the parade/fireworks because tasks can't be done while those are going on.

Reality and logic are two things that are totally scorned on a discussion board. Stop that... the next thing you know people will start to doubt their own opinions of what is happening.

I should point out that it is a fad that is country wide, not just about theme parks. Everyone knows how to do everything and are dead sure that they see glaring problems where none exist. Human nature I guess.

 

[TalkingHead]

I think this is all fair, under 6 or 7 I can see there wouldn't be much appeal, but at that age much of entertainment is sensory and they are usually as pleased with seeing a duck waddling or a custodial make a Mickey with a broom as they are with attractions, so there's no need for WDW to design its parks to the whims of 5 year olds who will barely remember the trip in years to come at the expense of every other age group's interests (especially when they're not the ones paying thousands of dollars).

By 7 or 8 years old kids are totally able to appreciate it though, so it's doing them a disservice to say they, or any kids older than that, would be bored by EPCOT.

Knowing how indifferent WDW is to the under-7 crowd, I imagine the fanbois will be complaining about Epcot for the rest of their lives.

 

[CentralFLlife]

Saw someone post this online today. I think it shows just how well OLC takes care of its attractions, the amount of refurbs on here is staggering. http://www.tokyodisneyresort.jp/en/schedule/stop/

 

[GoofGoof]

I feel there are different categories of need for the parks. The two main ones seem to be thematic identity and/or need of improved/upgraded/more attractions

DHS needs help in both establishing a concrete identity and more attractions. DAK has a strong story and identity. All it needs is some more attractions to help complete the park.

That's why, for me, if any park needs improvement it's DHS because of the thematic mess it's in.

Agreed. DHS is in the worst shape. MK is in the best. I think the debate is did EPCOT need more love than AK.

 

[ToTBellHop]

Agreed. DHS is in the worst shape. MK is in the best. I think the debate is did EPCOT need more love than AK.

Obviously DAK. It is a park that opened in 1998, saw investment in 1999, and then basically nothing for 15 years. At least Epcot has things to do. Disney built DAK (a beautiful and inspired park in 1998) and then basically did nothing with it. While it is too young of a park to be falling apart, Disney has failed to grow the park. One ride of substance has been added in the last 10 years with a broken, once-impressive animatronic. Imagine if they built MGM in 1989 and didn't add Sunset Boulevard until about 2008. That is basically DAK's fate. Only they would have also let the screen go black on Star Tours and installed a strobe light instead. Disco Death Star, if you will.

 

[RSoxNo1]

For what it is, it's a pretty good ride. So if we have to get TSPL, I see this as a good thing.

I've been on Flying Tires and it's mediocre at best. Even prior to it opening I had suggested using an LPS system like Aquatopia to improve capacity. That's exactly what they're doing and hopefully it improves the ride significantly as well. I'm looking forward to the change.

 

[Next Big Thing]

I've been on Flying Tires and it's mediocre at best. Even prior to it opening I had suggested using an LPS system like Aquatopia to improve capacity. That's exactly what they're doing and hopefully it improves the ride significantly as well. I'm looking forward to the change.

This isn't Luigi's we're talking about here... it's Mater's.

 

[DisDan]

I've been on Flying Tires and it's mediocre at best. Even prior to it opening I had suggested using an LPS system like Aquatopia to improve capacity. That's exactly what they're doing and hopefully it improves the ride significantly as well. I'm looking forward to the change.

Luigi's was not the ride being rumored to be coming to O-town and re-themed. Mater's was the ride being referenced.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Obviously DAK. It is a park that opened in 1998, saw investment in 1999, and then basically nothing for 15 years. At least Epcot has things to do. Disney built DAK (a beautiful and inspired park in 1998) and then basically did nothing with it. While it is too young of a park to be falling apart, Disney has failed to grow the park. One ride of substance has been added in the last 10 years with a broken, once-impressive animatronic. Imagine if they built MGM in 1989 and didn't add Sunset Boulevard until about 2008. That is basically DAK's fate. Only they would have also let the screen go black on Star Tours and installed a strobe light instead. Disco Death Star, if you will.

I really hope that Disney adds at the very least a well themed B-Ticket as well as a walk through between Lion King and Avatar. I know there was a Lion King ride on the table a while ago, does anyone have details as to what that was?

 

[RSoxNo1]

This isn't Luigi's we're talking about here... it's Mater's.

Luigi's was not the ride being rumored to be coming to O-town and re-themed. Mater's was the ride being referenced.

Forgive my confusion, but @Next Big Thing's response was to my comment on Luigi's. I couldn't figure out what the acronym TSPL meant so my comments continued to be about Luigi's. I'm aware that it's a re-themed Junkyard Jamboree in the rumor.

 

[John]

I think you're making it sound way worse than it actually is. In my opinion the parks are very clean, i've been going since the 80's and don't think that the cleanliness is any worse. I noticed a big slide in service and employee attitude the late 90s-early 2000s but it has gotten better since then, and the selection/quality of food since then as well has been much improved as well.

It's a shame that so many people on these boards are convinced that Disney quality is terrible nowadays, I think a lot of it has to do with people having such easy access to being able to complain together online. Also the price hikes have exacerbated it as well (but the reality is attendance has grown so there is no way the prices are going to go down).
Have you ever been to Six Flags Magic Mountain? Now THAT is declining quality. As a Socal resident I have had to sit around and watch that once really nice park be mismanaged into complete despair (although it started happening like 15 years ago, it never recovered). WDW made a few deep cuts during the height of the recession such as less frequent bus service when gas was $4/gallon and Fantasmic showing only a few nights a week, but that seems to no longer be an issue and I think visiting the parks now is more enjoyable than back then.

You're entitled to your opinion of course but to me the big problem is still all of the old/outdated attractions that need to be replaced (which looks like its being done with many of the rides I had gripes with: now if we could get Universe of Energy, Imagination/EO, and Stitch's Great Escape done next i'd be one happy camper )

Really? I stood there and watched my mother come to tears after seeing the condition of Pop Century. Who is she? She was on the opening day crew that trained Cm's. She refers to it as "her resort". If there is one area of WDW where I feel I might have some "inside" knowledge is maintenance and janitorial. Both my mother and her husband were CM's in those areas at one time or another. My mother had 20 years in the company working in as many as a dozen different jobs from working as a concierge to renting strollers and everything in between. Her husband worked in maintenance and janitorial.....he had 18 years of service. Between them both...that's 38 years! I think they are more of an authority then just about anyone here.

Food quality? Again.....really? There was a time when at all the resorts had a chef that was always present and constructed the menu. A simple hamburger was cooked to order. Now? Precooked and reheated. That's better? Most of the restaurants have basically the same generic menu. Is it possible to get a good meal on property? absolutely...at an exorbitant cost. The DDP and its effect on the menus have been well documented here. When the DDP started you received an appetizer, entre, desert and the tip was included. Now you get a entre and a joke of a desert. That's it! That's better?

Any worse? I seen a puddle of coca cola lay and dry up in a resort elevator for FOUR days! I know for a fact that most maintenance crews have been cut. How can this result in the same quality of cleanliness? The majority of maintenance is now contracted out.

Your right everyone can have their opinion but it doesn't make it a correct one.

 

[John]

I will just leave this here as a reminder. Its only been a hand full of pages and we soon forget.


It appears you and I are in agreement. A broken window does not justify guests breaking more windows. "Everyone else was speeding" is no reason not pay your speeding ticket. (Although that has been argued, sometimes successfully, in court. )

What I am suggesting is that the overwhelming culprit of this bad behavior at WDW is Disney itself. It is the way Disney as a business has been treating its 'guests' in recent years, versus how Disney used to treat its guests.

When I pay $15 for a meal, I have one level of expectation. When I pay $60 for a meal, I have a different level of expectation.

$15 and $60 are not arbitrary numbers. That's how much the price of a meal at Cinderella's Royal Table has increased in the last dozen years. At $60 per plate, doesn't the consumer have a right to demand more, and be upset about it if Disney fails to deliver?

At the hotels, rooms at the Contemporary used to be available for the inflation-adjusted equivalent of about $150-to-$200/night.

Back in the 1970s and 1980s, today's equivalent of $200/night was not cheap and many families had to stretch to afford it but service was outstanding. Year after year, Disney reported occupancy rates of 95% or above. People knew they were getting a great deal.

Heck, it wasn't that long ago (mid-2000s) that I remember getting a room in the Garden Wing of the Contemporary in the spring for about $230/night with no discount.

Today, that same room lists for $436/night.

Disney was famous for its army of comparatively well-paid custodial staff. A CM might receive 30-50% more than they do today, and with better perks. It encouraged harder work since CMs knew they had a plumb job.

High-level managers were there on the front lines every day, leading by example. Today, they hide behind their desks or sit in endless meetings with their heads buried in their smart phones.

The higher pay coupled with more involved management led to the most valuable asset when running an organization: pride of work. Sadly, 'leaders' such as Iger and Rasulo don't understand what a transformational effect this has on a workplace. They think a bunch of PowerPoint slides titled "The Disney Difference" is a substitute for real leadership.

Back in WDW's Golden Age, broken and worn items were replaced immediately. My favorite personal example is what I call the "bench incident".

I was at the central hub at MK in the 1980s with friends and noticed a bench with chipped paint on one arm. We joked about it for the rest of the day. We even took a photo. Wouldn't you know it, we came back the next day and the chip was fixed to the point that we couldn't see where the chip had been! That was the level of maintenance WDW provided to its guests.

Let's consider alcohol. Even after it became available at the parks, alcohol was found only in the restaurants. Guests didn't get sloshed the way they do today because alcohol wasn't "in your face" the way it is today. Guess what? Drunk people tend to behave worse than sober people.

As we read over-and-over, the theme parks have never been so crowded. 'Guests' are waiting in lines that are longer than ever. Guests are spending huge sums only to be treated like cattle.

Meanwhile, Disney's domestic capital expenditure is once again at a record low under Iger and Rasulo. Hey guys, rather than dragging your feet, why not stop spending tens-of-billions lining your own pockets with stock buybacks and start spending on additional capacity, new attractions, and even a 5th Gate to help relieve the overcrowding?

The point is that all these changes, instituted by Disney management in order to squeeze pennies out of their 'guests', have changed the way Disney treats its 'guests', resulting in a cultural shift in the way 'guests' behave at WDW.

Yes, 'guests' might be behaving worse than they did before, but it's largely because Disney has never treated them this badly before.
Last edited: Yesterday at 4:06 PM
ParentsOf4, Yesterday at 1:18 PM Report
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[SirLink]

Well this DHS expansion isn't exactly inspiring confidence in me so far. Osborne Lights almost certainly leaving in 2015 in its current form (with no word on whether it'll return in some way), only carnie rides confirmed for Pixar so far (maybe all we're getting there, probably lacking a RSR caliber ride), no one knows what the heck Star Wars will be and even mixed messages from trusted people about the future of Great Movie Ride (74 says it's not among the rides that are safe while photodave says it's entirely safe). So far, except for the removal of the hat I am feeling very turned off by this mess...

I think when the words "Toy Story Play Land" were uttered it was kinda showing you want Disney wants this to be an offshoot of MK part 2, which is the wholly wrong approach, but get ready to enjoy "Woody's Backyard Jamboree" in that park in 2019...

 

[xstech25]

Clearly you're very angry but i've been to many theme parks and still put Disney as #1 in all categories. I have never noticed that the place is dirty and falling apart like you have (and I was just there a few months ago). I don't stay at the hotels because I have friends in the area and the hotels are way too expensive, but I don't make it a personal attack on the company because they don't price things the way I want. That's not how business works. That's like getting angry with BMW or Mercedes because you can't afford their cars. Get real its 2014: pricing is a science and has no human element to it whatsoever.

 

[RivieraJenn]

Clearly you're very angry but i've been to many theme parks and still put Disney as #1 in all categories. I have never noticed that the place is dirty and falling apart like you have (and I was just there a few months ago). I don't stay at the hotels because I have friends in the area and the hotels are way too expensive, but I don't make it a personal attack on the company because they don't price things the way I want. That's not how business works. That's like getting angry with BMW or Mercedes because you can't afford their cars. Get real its 2014: pricing is a science and has no human element to it whatsoever.

You are absolutely entitled to your opinion that WDW is the number 1 theme park (in the U.S.? in the world?). However, @ParentsOf4 can explain better than anyone else here that posters' reactions to current WDW hotel pricing strategy are in no way based on the company "not pricing things the way we want" but rather on recognition that the current strategy is unsustainable and is greatly hindering occupancy rates. Pricing is a science, but WDW is using that science to realize short-term gains over long-term company health. It's like starving yourself for a month to fit into an outfit for a party with no thought to the overall repercussions to your body.