The Imagineering Movie Discussion Thread

[PerGron]

Wicked needs to not have been marketed on Defying Gravity because whole, I’m already tired of it and that’s supposed to be the huge showstopper. Between the marketing oversaturating that song, the fact it’s a part one, and Cynthia Erivo’s dumb comments about the fake poster, I’ve lost almost all hype I’ve had which sucks because I love the first act of Wicked and I wanted to be excited for this movie

 

[PerGron]

Folks, I’m ashamed to admit but it seems like I’ve found the hill I’m going to have to die on because I really enjoyed Here

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

Folks, I’m ashamed to admit but it seems like I’ve found the hill I’m going to have to die on because I really enjoyed Here

Damn. You haven't steered me wrong yet between Piece by Piece and The Substance, so I might have to take your word on this one. I still don't think I'll like it though. I'm one of those cynical jerks who hates Forest Gump for being too overly sentimental (and also...ahem...questionable representation for the "slow person" archetype)

I'm a bit mixed on Emelia Perez, but overall I walked away pretty positive about it. The movie just kind of lags in the middle with its pace which is a bit unfortunate. Honestly the closest movie I can compare it to is Annette. Really out there, unique concept, really striking musical numbers, but I just don't think it commits itself fully enough to being a musical. It has this great style where the musical numbers are very ambiguous on where the diagetic qualities of the scene end and the non diagetic qualities start, and the moments where that line starts to blur are genuinely thrilling. The problem is about half the musical numbers fall into the Joker 2 "character monologue their feelings" territory, and the more thrilling ensemble songs are all a little on the short side. Much like Annette the film kind of weirdly struggles to commit to the most audacious parts of its style and instead tries to blend the fantastical style with an almost "fly on the wall" level of cinematography.

As far as trans representation goes, it really doesn't get much better than this. I love how the title character is such a complete "warts and all" human being who both achieves stuff throughout the story that's truly inspirational but also has an obviously shady past as evident by the very set up for the story which bubbles to the surface time and time again. It's these kinds of three dimensional characters filled with both flaws and positive character traits that I truly think should be the blueprint for any kind of representation, not just Disney's lip service method of "were going to randomly fill out our background cast with POC people and roll out another First Gay Disney Character every couple years".

On another note, about to do the "Will Dune Part 2 hold up at home" test I've been putting off for literal months.

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

My grandma emphatically thanking me for recommending Piece By Piece to her and saying she absolutely loved it is definitely one of the most satisfying moments of the year for me, and something wholesome to counteract the...ahem...very UN-wholesome things that are currently happening...

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

We can certainly count The Apprentice out of Golden Tiki discussion, I hope

 

[PerGron]

We can certainly count The Apprentice out of Golden Tiki discussion, I hope

Yes.

I have my Juror #2 and Anora showings today and I’m 60% sure I’m gonna go

 

[PerGron]

Boston sucks. I drove out here to watch a damned movie and now I’m sitting at a light where a bus has entirely blocked the intersection instead of just waiting for the traffic to move

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

My theater is FINALLY getting Anora this weekend. Stoked that I don't have to take two busses there and back in order to see it.

 

[PerGron]

My theater is FINALLY getting Anora this weekend. Stoked that I don't have to take two busses there and back in order to see it.

It’s worth the hype. I had a blast (though it goes maybe like 15 minutes too long)

Packed theater and everyone was laughing and having a great time

 

[PerGron]

Heretic blew me away! I was really hoping I’d like it and it did even more than that for me. It jumped pretty high up my list for the year and it’s gonna be on many short lists for the Golden Tikis this year

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

I'm seeing both Anora and Heretic today. Single most exciting movie day for me since Barbenheimer, and in the spirit of that I thereby dub this day #AnorEtic

 

[PerGron]

I'm seeing both Anora and Heretic today. Single most exciting movie day for me since Barbenheimer, and in the spirit of that I thereby dub this day #AnorEtic

Man’s gonna say this and not update us

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

Sorry, it's been super busy today. Overall I'd give both of them a solid 8/10, with my preference definitely leaning towards Heretic. I might need to see Anora again. I definitely think the pace suffered a bit once Vanya disappears and on first viewing I thought things were definitely stalled in the segments where Anora and the Russians were looking for him in the city. That being said, knowing where things end up and how prominent of a character Igor in particular is to the overall narrative, I definitely want to watch the movie again with that in mind. When his scenes first started I was under the impression he was going to be a one-joke side character but obviously as things went on he evolved into being much more than that. I was so drawn to the actor playing Vanya that him falling out of the story in the second half did kind of make me need to readjust my expectations. I think Best Actress might be THE single most competitive category at the Golden Tikis so I don't want to call her a shoe-in just yet, but she's definitely on my shortlist and I'm going to love seeing her tear up awards season in general. Very much deserves to have her moment for this.

Heretic...Yea, it's definitely one hell of a ride. Hugh Grant SHOULD be a shoe-in for Best Actor all things considered, and he definitely won't be at the actual Oscars which is a shame. Ultimately I kind of feel the opposite of how I felt about Anora. I LOVED the journey. The board game monologue in particular was a huge high point. It's the destination I wasn't really thrilled with. When all is said and done, is this movie really that much more than the sum of its "lecturing the fallacies of religion" parts? The "Prophets" are certainly an unsettling component of the movie, but I didn't like how much the movie tried to stretch that concept. I could buy Hugh's character having one or two in capacity, but a whole torture chamber filled with them kind of broke my suspension of disbelief a bit and negatively elevated the character beyond just "Some Guy", which is the element of him that was so unsettling to begin with. The two lead performances are also fantastic, and I did really like how ambiguous the ending was even if the butterfly thing was telegraphed from a mile away. A24 has had a bit of a rough year and has lost some momentum to Neon in the indie horror market, so this definitely felt like a bit of a comeback for them in that department. I still can't get over how effective the "Blueberry Pie Candle" poster is in telling you literally everything you need to know about the movie without telling you anything at all.

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

Not a movie, but holy cow The Penguin is an absolute masterclass of a mini series.

 

[PerGron]

Damn. You haven't steered me wrong yet between Piece by Piece and The Substance, so I might have to take your word on this one. I still don't think I'll like it though. I'm one of those cynical jerks who hates Forest Gump for being too overly sentimental (and also...ahem...questionable representation for the "slow person" archetype)

I'm a bit mixed on Emelia Perez, but overall I walked away pretty positive about it. The movie just kind of lags in the middle with its pace which is a bit unfortunate. Honestly the closest movie I can compare it to is Annette. Really out there, unique concept, really striking musical numbers, but I just don't think it commits itself fully enough to being a musical. It has this great style where the musical numbers are very ambiguous on where the diagetic qualities of the scene end and the non diagetic qualities start, and the moments where that line starts to blur are genuinely thrilling. The problem is about half the musical numbers fall into the Joker 2 "character monologue their feelings" territory, and the more thrilling ensemble songs are all a little on the short side. Much like Annette the film kind of weirdly struggles to commit to the most audacious parts of its style and instead tries to blend the fantastical style with an almost "fly on the wall" level of cinematography.

As far as trans representation goes, it really doesn't get much better than this. I love how the title character is such a complete "warts and all" human being who both achieves stuff throughout the story that's truly inspirational but also has an obviously shady past as evident by the very set up for the story which bubbles to the surface time and time again. It's these kinds of three dimensional characters filled with both flaws and positive character traits that I truly think should be the blueprint for any kind of representation, not just Disney's lip service method of "were going to randomly fill out our background cast with POC people and roll out another First Gay Disney Character every couple years".

On another note, about to do the "Will Dune Part 2 hold up at home" test I've been putting off for literal months.

I finally got through Emilia Pérez which took me three tries and unfortunately, I think it’s a pretty bad movie with a few decent performances. Zoe Saldaña and Karla Sofia Gascón put in the work and some of the music numbers were pretty solid, but beyond that I found little to like here.

Obviously I’m a CisHet white dude so I’m not gonna comment much on the trans representation, but I did find it to be shockingly transphobic for what it is. I don’t know if that was the intent or just another cishet white (French) dude writing this one, but it felt to me less about an exploration of a trans character and more like something you’d see in a 2005 Rob Schneider film where he gets gender reassignment surgery to avoid his past, like that’s definitely a movie that was written at one point and it felt like it was just released here. I’m sure there are tons of people waaaay more qualified and able to eloquently represent my point but I just found it kind of strange and poorly done if not in poor taste entirely. Maybe I’m wrong and maybe people will see this as great representation and if that’s the case I’m happy to not die on this hill, but to me it felt borderline offensive.

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

I finally got through Emilia Pérez which took me three tries and unfortunately, I think it’s a pretty bad movie with a few decent performances. Zoe Saldaña and Karla Sofia Gascón put in the work and some of the music numbers were pretty solid, but beyond that I found little to like here.

Obviously I’m a CisHet white dude so I’m not gonna comment much on the trans representation, but I did find it to be shockingly transphobic for what it is. I don’t know if that was the intent or just another cishet white (French) dude writing this one, but it felt to me less about an exploration of a trans character and more like something you’d see in a 2005 Rob Schneider film where he gets gender reassignment surgery to avoid his past, like that’s definitely a movie that was written at one point and it felt like it was just released here. I’m sure there are tons of people waaaay more qualified and able to eloquently represent my point but I just found it kind of strange and poorly done if not in poor taste entirely. Maybe I’m wrong and maybe people will see this as great representation and if that’s the case I’m happy to not die on this hill, but to me it felt borderline offensive.

Definitely an interesting perspective on the trans rep. I absolutely didn't get the Rob Scheider vibe but that's a BRUTAL comparison haha. I guess for me the big thing I liked about the representation is specifically that the character WAS so flawed. I'm used to trans rep like...let's say Angel from RENT. A literal embodiment of the "Kill Your Gays" archetype who's the emotional centerpiece of the story and also...ya know...a (bleep)-ing DOG MURDERER I think a lot of mainstream trans rep is really sanitized to make them seem like perfect human beings which I'm sure @Tegan pilots a chicken would agree with me on...is kind of a boring way to depict an entire sub-culture of people. (Tegan, get in on this Emilia Perez debate, I'd be GENUINELY fascinated to know what you think )

Ironically enough I think some of the best trans rep I've ever seen came from It's Always freaking Sunny of all places, and in an era when "calling someone gay = comedy" was prominent no less. Sure there were jokes made at the trans character's expense, but they were always coming out of the mouth of Dennis "I am a Golden God" Reynolds and the actual character was far and away one of the most "normal" people. God that show's such an enigma.

 

[PerGron]

I caught Red One and A Real Pain tonight and while Red One is exactly the movie you’re expecting to get and you’re either on board or not, I was really in love with A Real Pain.

It’s a small story about two cousins on a journey to discover their family history and Kieran Culkin gave THE performance of the year for me. I knew the guy was good but he blew me away here and if he’s not in the conversation for awards this year, it’s blasphemy. I see people saying he could take supporting actor but honestly I think he’s a leading role here pretty handedly (same with Zoe Saldaña in Emilia Pérez to continue that discussion, idk why people are saying she’s supporting she’s literally the lead) but yeah, go see A Real Pain it was hilarious and super emotional and definitely worth the watch

 

[TheOriginalTiki]

I caught Red One and A Real Pain tonight and while Red One is exactly the movie you’re expecting to get and you’re either on board or not, I was really in love with A Real Pain.

It’s a small story about two cousins on a journey to discover their family history and Kieran Culkin gave THE performance of the year for me. I knew the guy was good but he blew me away here and if he’s not in the conversation for awards this year, it’s blasphemy. I see people saying he could take supporting actor but honestly I think he’s a leading role here pretty handedly (same with Zoe Saldaña in Emilia Pérez to continue that discussion, idk why people are saying she’s supporting she’s literally the lead) but yeah, go see A Real Pain it was hilarious and super emotional and definitely worth the watch

OF COURSE Dragon is unironically stoked for Red One specifically because Captain America is in it.

 

[Tegan pilots a chicken]

I think a lot of mainstream trans rep is really sanitized to make them seem like perfect human beings which I'm sure @Tegan pilots a chicken would agree with me on...is kind of a boring way to depict an entire sub-culture of people. (Tegan, get in on this Emilia Perez debate, I'd be GENUINELY fascinated to know what you think )

I have not seen Emilia Perez so I cannot comment.

My favorite trans representation as far as trans people in film has been Hunter Schaffer in The Hunger Games: The Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes. Reason being that her transness had nothing to do with anything and that is absolutely my idealistic world. To me being trans is like having asthma or diabetes in the sense that it’s a medical condition and should be one of the least interesting things about someone.

As far as depictions of trans people in film, Eve Lindley’s character in the film All We Had absolutely nails it.

I would like to live in a world where cis and trans people can take cis and trans roles and it doesn’t matter and nobody bats an eye. Like if an actress was playing me in a movie I would want it to be Margot Robbie, but maybe that’s a bit too aspirational

 

[PerGron]

OF COURSE Dragon is unironically stoked for Red One specifically because Captain America is in it.

It's the most Netflix movie not made by Netflix I've seen. I had fun with it because Chris Evans and The Rock are charismatic and I love Christmas so I kind of grade Christmas movies on a curve, but it's certainly not a "good" movie. Excited to hear his thoughts on Memoirs though lol