Rumor The EPCOT Hotel

[HauntedPirate]

Per insiders the tent won't go away, this is additional space for folks to see the evening show and cool off in air conditioning... and such. Oh and get more beer.

The bathrooms are massive. We had a delightful dark chocolate raspberry tart in the adjoining “tent” a few days ago. Three, to be exact, we couldn't get enough of them. But that space really needs something permanent to bring people in. If that means leveling it and starting something from scratch, so be it. Not that this has anything to do with a hotel being built somewhere around Epcot.

Edited for clarification

 

[HauntedPirate]

Oh my goodness, yes. Room number is relatively unhelpful. Instead you need to memorise the room location by number of turns in each direction from the lift, with landmarks such as coffee/ice machine on the way to indicate you are on the right path!

So very true! Walk past the check in desk, left, right, left at the coffee machine, right, left... 8 rooms down on the right. Or something like that. And when walking to the front desk, if you saw the restrooms, you knew you were close.

 

[trainplane3]

You're comparing the wrong angle:

View attachment 542046

View attachment 542047




I disagree with you. I don't think anybody staying or buying into Riviera thinks they are buying a NY/London/Paris true deluxe hotel.

I think it's quite simple: This is a "Disney deluxe" hotel, with nicer rooms and amenities than most of the other "Disney deluxe" hotels.

It feels like most of the loudest critics of Riviera fall into 2 classes:
1- Those who put transformative theming above all else. For me, Beach Club and Yacht Club are also failures in this category. The winners are Poly, Wilderness Lodge and Animal Kingdom Lodge. But I can certainly understand and agree that Riviera does not have the degree of theming as these top 3 themed resorts. I put Riviera more at the level of Beach Club, Yacht Club, Contemporary, Grand Floridian. I put Bay Lake Tower dead last in theming.
2 -- Those who have never actually been to Riviera, looked at a couple photos of the outside and shrugged that it looks like a Marriott. I'm amazed at the many people who thought they would dislike Riviera UNTIL they visited it.

I went to it last year. I walked around and explored the grounds for around an hour. The surrounding areas (Riviera's grounds specifically) are nice, just a shame they have a grey block in the middle of it.

The inside is fine enough though but not worth a DVC contract at all. And speaking with a few DVC employees on that trip, asking them how the sales are going, at that point they weren't going nearly as fast as expected.

I'll totally agree with BLT. While the Contemporarys theming is modern and...contemporary...it's a totally unique and interesting building. BLT is boring inside and out but the lounge is great. Really, the best things about BLT is the lounge, the walkability to MK, and the views.

 

[J4546]

lol i wish theyd gone big in the UK pav and expanded it with a great mouse detective ride like remy, but not remy haha. That would have been chill. then theyd still have the expansion plot beside france for a new pavilion in the future

 

[CastAStone]

It really doesn't make much sense that they would cancel a resort where construction had already begun only to shift and build a different new resort in another location a few months later.

I basically agree, but I do think the hybrid DVC-Hotel model has to be less attractive to them post pandemic. I am guessing whatever they build next will be one or the other, and DVC will stick to either stand alones or conversions or expansions of Deluxe resorts that have already have DVC (a la CCV). So canceling reflections makes sense, but so does a new stand alone hotel.

 

[MisterPenguin]

The bathrooms are massive, and we had a delightful dark chocolate raspberry tart there a few days ago.

Surprised they served food in the bathrooms.

 

[HauntedPirate]

Surprised they served food in the bathrooms.

Fixed that. Wow, that couldn’t have been worded any worse, could it?

 

[havoc315]

I went to it last year. I walked around and explored the grounds for around an hour. The surrounding areas (Riviera's grounds specifically) are nice, just a shame they have a grey block in the middle of it.

I get that criticism. But my main issue — how often is the building architecture affecting your stay. On the inside, the building is themed quite well. The rooms are beautiful — well appointed with plenty of “Disney touches.” The grounds and pools are beautiful. Many parts of the exterior are gorgeous.

So how often am I standing far back to just look at the exterior architecture and note a wish there were some more columns and flourishes.

The inside is fine enough though but not worth a DVC contract at all. And speaking with a few DVC employees on that trip, asking them how the sales are going, at that point they weren't going nearly as fast as expected.

The pandemic is mostly or entirely to blame for that. 3 months of the parks shutting down, when Riviera was only 3 months old. Since being open, limited capacity means limited sales opportunities as well.

I’ve heard mixed messages about how sales were going before Covid. Some have said sales were very strong until Covid, but also have heard some say they were a bit soft.

Data suggests sales were at least solid until Covid:

Direct Sales Strong in January 2020 | DVCNews.com - The essential Disney Vacation Club resource!

In the weeks following its grand opening, Disney's Riviera Resort posted its best-ever sales numbers in January 2020. Over the last 10 years, April and January have proven to be the best calendar mo

dvcnews.com

I'll totally agree with BLT. While the Contemporarys theming is modern and...contemporary...it's a totally unique and interesting building. BLT is boring inside and out but the lounge is great. Really, the best things about BLT is the lounge, the walkability to MK, and the views.

Love the Contemporary. It has a truly unique contemporary design, from the pyramid-like architecture, the open center of the building on the inside, and the wonder of a monorail flying through the building. The rooms are huge, well appointed. Lots of dining options. Only real negative is mediocre pools.

BLT has none of those positives. It’s got a basic contemporary design — but more akin to a 1990’s small city apartment building. The rooms are small — studios are some of the smallest on property. Furnishings and decoration feel cheapish. No dining located in the building, so it really is solely a residence.
And while some rooms have good views, a lot of the so-called premium views are primarily parking lot.
BLT has a couple big positives: great location, near monorail, and TOTW lounge.

 

[CastAStone]

And while some rooms have good views, a lot of the so-called premium views are primarily parking lot.
BLT has a couple big positives: great location, near monorail, and TOTW lounge.

Lol Disney’s gall in charging more for the parking lot view at BLT because you can sort of make out Space Mountain in the distance was the Bossest thing ever.

 

[lazyboy97o]

I get that criticism. But my main issue — how often is the building architecture affecting your stay. On the inside, the building is themed quite well. The rooms are beautiful — well appointed with plenty of “Disney touches.” The grounds and pools are beautiful. Many parts of the exterior are gorgeous.

So how often am I standing far back to just look at the exterior architecture and note a wish there were some more columns and flourishes.

Architecture includes the human scale and interiors. How is this image in any way emblematic of Beaux-Arts, Art Nouveau and/or Art Deco architecture?

 

[UNCgolf]

I basically agree, but I do think the hybrid DVC-Hotel model has to be less attractive to them post pandemic. I am guessing whatever they build next will be one or the other, and DVC will stick to either stand alones or conversions or expansions of Deluxe resorts that have already have DVC (a la CCV). So canceling reflections makes sense, but so does a new stand alone hotel.

I mostly agree too, I just don't think they'd make that shift on such a condensed timeline. Of course, even if they actually were going to build a hotel at EPCOT it likely wouldn't break ground for at least a year, so it's not necessarily that quick.

I still don't buy it's happening, though.

 

[havoc315]

Architecture includes the human scale and interiors. How is this image in any way emblematic of Beaux-Arts, Art Nouveau and/or Art Deco architecture?

The interior architecture is actually phenomenal, high end, well thought out.
Your complaint is that some of the gorgeous art doesn’t fit neatly into a determined style?

 

[UNCgolf]

Love the Contemporary. It has a truly unique contemporary design, from the pyramid-like architecture, the open center of the building on the inside, and the wonder of a monorail flying through the building. The rooms are huge, well appointed. Lots of dining options. Only real negative is mediocre pools.

BLT has none of those positives. It’s got a basic contemporary design — but more akin to a 1990’s small city apartment building. The rooms are small — studios are some of the smallest on property. Furnishings and decoration feel cheapish. No dining located in the building, so it really is solely a residence.
And while some rooms have good views, a lot of the so-called premium views are primarily parking lot.
BLT has a couple big positives: great location, near monorail, and TOTW lounge.

I like the exterior architecture of the Contemporary, and I love the open central atrium and the monorail. However, they've gone out of their way to screw up that atrium by putting up a bunch of walls in the middle of it that block some of the expansive views. Although the decor is certainly out of date, older photos of the Contemporary show a much better atrium than what currently exists.

The BLT is basically awful all around beyond the location next to the MK and the monorail access.

 

[lazyboy97o]

The interior architecture is actually phenomenal, high end, well thought out.
Your complaint is that some of the gorgeous art doesn’t fit neatly into a determined style?

You keep claiming the resort matches it’s models and is well themed. How is that image, or really any part of it, representative of the styles it is supposed to represent?

 

[havoc315]

You keep claiming the resort matches it’s models and is well themed. How is that image, or really any part of it, representative of the styles it is supposed to represent?

Actually, I said exterior theming is 1 of the more legitimate complaints, but that it does well representing European Riviera inspiration. I see very clear influence and inspiration from the European Riviera. And I find the entire hotel, inside and out, to be beautiful even if some particular elements are more bland.

But this article more thoughtfully describes where and how the imagineers utilized the source material:

Redirect Notice

 

[Haymarket2008]

Riviera is the sad McMansion of deluxe resorts. Most of the other deluxe resorts (yes including Crescent Lake) have put WAY more energy into placemaking through architecture. It fails against every other resort in this regard except maybe Saratoga. At Riviera your subconscious is not convinced for any extended period of time that you are in an exotic/foreign place. It always feels like a modern American hotel with "Riviera" decoration, whatever that means. I think this is really the greatest reason so many Disney fans dislike it, whether they realize it or not. The entire thing, in and out, is a gray shoe box with pasted on decoration. Most of the other resorts are designed to BE what they are emulating. You cannot pull decorations off of the Wilderness Lodge, Boardwalk, or Beach Club, and redesign them into the long rumored Venetian resort because their theme is part of the structure, inside and out. Even the Riviera lobby and associated common areas are completely deprived of built-in, structural design. Don't even get me started on the common areas! What common areas??

This EXACTLY.

 

[lazyboy97o]

Actually, I said exterior theming is 1 of the more legitimate complaints, but that it does well representing European Riviera inspiration. I see very clear influence and inspiration from the European Riviera. And I find the entire hotel, inside and out, to be beautiful even if some particular elements are more bland.

But this article more thoughtfully describes where and how the imagineers utilized the source material:

Redirect Notice

You’re not answering the question. You keeping talking about how you think it is so beautiful but like so many who defend it you won’t actually describe as what it is supposed to be. How is any of it Beaux-Arts, Art Nouveau or Art Deco?

 

[Animaniac93-98]

You’re not answering the question. You keeping talking about how you think it is so beautiful but like so many who defend it you won’t actually describe as what it is supposed to be. How is any of it Beaux-Arts, Art Nouveau or Art Deco?

It's "Disney". That's why people like it.

Replace any of the recognizable Disney movie art plastered on the walls with Shutterstock photos of beaches or the Mediterranean and people wouldn't like as much, even if the building was exactly the same.

 

[havoc315]

You’re not answering the question. You keeping talking about how you think it is so beautiful but like so many who defend it you won’t actually describe as what it is supposed to be. How is any of it Beaux-Arts, Art Nouveau or Art Deco?

When did anyone say it was going to be exclusively in those styles??? I don’t recall any imagineer promising exclusive use of those styles. It’s an irrelevant question.

My answer is simple: I don’t care whether it’s in those styles or not.

I don’t know why people feel the need to turn something entirely subjective into something objective.
Some people will love the Riviera, some will hate it. Ultimately, it’s a subjective opinion based on evaluation of many factors.

So why the need to turn a subjective opinion into something objective. Do you subjectively only like Beaux-Arts styles, and you refuse to stay in any hotel that lacks Beaux-Arts or Nouveau styles?

Ultimately... it’s either you subjectively like the style, or you subjectively don’t. To me, it’s ridiculous to turn it into some objective fact of, “it’s bad because it’s not Art Nouveau!”

May as well say, “Beach Club is a horrible resort, where are the New England beach influences in the Beaches and Cream menu?? It’s just a Friendly’s!”
“Grand Floridian is a horrible resort, it’s called the FLORIDIAN but replicates a classic CALIFORNIA hotel:

 

[lazyboy97o]

When did anyone say it was going to be exclusively in those styles??? I don’t recall any imagineer promising exclusive use of those styles. It’s an irrelevant question.

My answer is simple: I don’t care whether it’s in those styles or not.

I don’t know why people feel the need to turn something entirely subjective into something objective.
Some people will love the Riviera, some will hate it. Ultimately, it’s a subjective opinion based on evaluation of many factors.

So why the need to turn a subjective opinion into something objective. Do you subjectively only like Beaux-Arts styles, and you refuse to stay in any hotel that lacks Beaux-Arts or Nouveau styles?

Ultimately... it’s either you subjectively like the style, or you subjectively don’t. To me, it’s ridiculous to turn it into some objective fact of, “it’s bad because it’s not Art Nouveau!”

May as well say, “Beach Club is a horrible resort, where are the New England beach influences in the Beaches and Cream menu?? It’s just a Friendly’s!”
“Grand Floridian is a horrible resort, it’s called the FLORIDIAN but replicates a classic CALIFORNIA hotel:

View attachment 542156

Again, you are the one who claimed it did a good job of matching its inspiration. Disney says that is Beaux-Arts, Art Nouveau and Art Deco. You can like all those bare walls all you want but don’t toss out nonsense like claiming that it does a good job at theming and representing its supposed inspiration. Themed experiences are storytelling and the Riviera clearly does not tell the story it’s designers claim it is telling.