TEA Attendance Report Now due June 3rd

devoy1701

Well-Known Member
Disney's growth shows that the Potter revenue isn't cannibalizing Disney's. It's not like guests are taking a dollar they would have spent at WDW and spending it at USO. They're taking dollars they wouldn't have spent at all and adding them to the overall "pie" that is the central Florida tourism industry.

I have no problem with IP attractions per se, but you need to be able to generate 3% growth without building a new attraction every year.

Because they can't afford to grow in perpetuity if their only path to growth is to be constantly building. See above: you need to be able to spin off 2-4% even in a year with nothing new.

Investors don't like volatile growth followed by stagnation. They want continuous, managed growth. Plus, there's no IP out there that will do for them what Potter has done. Once Potter has run its course, when then shall they turn? People are kidding themselves if they think Nintendo is on that scale.

I disagree, and think it's naive to assume Uni is having no impact on WDW. As others have mentioned, yes the pie is getting bigger, but even though WDW's overall attendance went up, they are still getting a smaller piece of the overall pie. Regardless of topline numbers, UniOrlando being able to recapture 10% of the market share in the past 5 years is pretty significant. More people are traveling and having to decide where to spend their money, many of them are choosing Universal, and Uni is investing in the infrastructure to support it. They are taking a page out of Eisner's book and working to keep people on site with new hotels, new waterpark, and revitalized CityWalk. Does anyone know if Eisner is acting as a consultant??? :cool:

On top of that, Avatarland is just gonna flop I believe. It'll be popular when it first opens, but there really isn't any fan base or popularity from it to be as great as Harry.

Disney needs to invest in things just as popular as Harry Potter.. That's what is financially successful as a business. Say what you will, but a Frozen-themed land would probably be almost as popular as Harry Potter land. Sorry that you don't like the idea, but it's true.

All I'm saying is Disney isn't going to gain back any percentage lost to Harry Potter with only single attractions and meet and greets. They need a full-scale land based on one of the most popular genres of all time.. And Star Wars should be the way to start. At least, I'd prefer that over Frozen.

To be fair...Avatar only has one movie out and 2 more on the way. The movies have also been delayed, which will work in the favor of the delayed Avatarland. The sequels will be significant when they hit, and regardless of storyline, the "world of Pandora" is what everyone wants to experience. As long as they spend the money to make it an amazing experience, we should have some good synergy's going with AK and the movie. I think it's way to early to say it will be a flop and that it won't be as popular as Harry Potter. It might not be since it isn't geared towards the teen crowd, but the land could still be a big hit.

That's fine, I just don't see 1.3% as a "huge chunk of Disney"

See above. Losing market share is losing market share. a 10% increase in market share for Uni over the past half dozen years is significant.

Like WDW cannibalized Disneyland?

The key is differentiation. A Texas park would allow a revisit to Zorro maybe even a second try at The Lone Ranger. Give Marvel properties their proper due. Texas is exploding and lacks a major park out side of a couple of Six Flags and a SeaWorld that has tons of potential but has been mostly ignored. I'd think it would be local heavy like Disneyland but would perform no worse.

Well when WDW was built DL hadn't become the resort destination that WDW is. Had WDW not been built it may have who knows. WDW just gets way too many people from the Texas region. Especially now with Universal upping their game, it would just be too tempting for people in that region to use that as an excuse to skip WDW. Who knows though if Universal really starts to have an impact on Disney in Central FL they could close a couple of the WDW parks and hotels sell some land and shift their focus elsewhere. I don't see that happening but you never know.

@s8film40 hit the nail on the head here. I want to add to it though that with DL and WDW being on the complete opposite sides of the country, there really isn't much cannibalization going on. People east of the Mississippi just aren't going to trek over to California and see DL and vice versa for everyone on the west coast. In addition, WDW is pulling in Europe and SA visitors, DL from Asia/Australia. Of course you're going to have a small segment (like us here) who will visit both Resorts...but living in FL, I still visit WDW more because of convenience. A new Resort in the center of the country could very well have a cannibalization factor on the 2 existing resorts, even if they offer a completely different theme (such as a Marvel World).
 
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SJN1279

Well-Known Member
That's just it...they didn't.

Well, Uni fanboys maybe - but they weren't here.

If even in 2010 someone had said here that the numbers would ever be this close, they would have been told to "go to some Universal board" or we would have called them off to the funny farm for being so crazy.

The astounding thing is how quickly they have caught up. I don't think you'll find many "Uni fanboys" here - just folks that have slowly realized that Universal is doing what Disney-Don't. And it's working.

That they are even this close is absolutely astounding.

Universal's best performing park in Orlando has over 2 million less patrons than Disney's worst performing park in Orlando. That is by no means close.
 

Shaman

Well-Known Member
Also laughing at the thought of Disney Springs having any effect on people visiting WDW. :hilarious:

People won't visit WDW as a result of Disney Springs, but they will spend more time on property because of it. The consistent crowds at DTD are not a figment of the imagination, nor are the giant parking garages that were needed to meet with the demand. People go on and on about Uni becoming a destination, but WDW is already there and strengthening its offerings. Everyone pretty much agrees that the parks need some attention, and I know Springs isn't a 5th gate, but its impact should not be dismissed.
 

majortom1981

Active Member
If Disney were to look at Texas, I would think they would be more included to build a resort (hotel) in Galveston -- like a new DVC -- and add DCL itineraries out of the area so they can be packed together.

They wont do that. IF they haven't done that in NYC they wont do that in texas. They have broadway shows, cruise line, and one of the most tourist based cities in the US and they haven't built DVC or a hotel.
 

BaconPancakes

Well-Known Member
People won't visit WDW as a result of Disney Springs, but they will spend more time on property because of it. The consistent crowds at DTD are not a figment of the imagination, nor are the giant parking garages that were needed to meet with the demand. People go on and on about Uni becoming a destination, but WDW is already there and strengthening its offerings. Everyone pretty much agrees that the parks need some attention, and I know Springs isn't a 5th gate, but its impact should not be dismissed.
Yet CityWalk blows Disney Springs out of the water in terms of shopping and entertainment.
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
Original Poster
I don't know about DHS attendance lowing much anytime soon unless what is being closed before the end of the Fiscal year. Disney has been closing attractions so far that weren't exactly popular.

If Streets of America is going to be closed this year, that is going to cause DHS a hit for Attendance for the Holidays. The Osborne Lights is a big draw for DHS and if SOA is closed, that would hurt Holiday attendance.

Sounds like its time for a chart!

DSH First 5.jpg


Thats the distribution of observed crowd levels at DHS for the first 5 months of 2013, 2014, and 2015.

The midrange crowds are down while the slow days are down but the peak days are up. Short version? Theyre performing better than 2014 and showing similarities to 2013.
 

twebber55

Well-Known Member
Where did I ever say Nintendo would be the same draw as Star Wars or Harry Potter? Marvel could be a great draw, to Universal when the rumored expansion happens. My only point is that Nintendo is nowhere near as irrelevant as you say. Even if sales aren't what they once were people know who Mario is, that's a fact. Why would any theme park operator in their right mind pursue a deal if they weren't relevant? And even if it's not as big in the US, you do realize Orlando is an international destination right?
Although im out of the nintendo demo i do think it has just as big potential as those
 

DisneyDebRob

Well-Known Member
If Disney were to look at Texas, I would think they would be more included to build a resort (hotel) in Galveston -- like a new DVC -- and add DCL itineraries out of the area so they can be packed together.
Galveston was a brutal market for DCL. Not enough consumer interest is why they stopped. I see they are going to try it again next year, hope it goes better then the past.
 

JordanNite

Well-Known Member
Again, I put that out in April about Star Wars and it has more to do with the movie's reception that anything.

Nonsense - it has nothing to do with the movies reception. The movie will be massive. The only question is how big it will be. It's all do with economics - you know it, i know it, and Winnie the Pooh knows it. The sad fact is we have a corporate CEO in charge and not Walt.
 

AEfx

Well-Known Member
Universal's best performing park in Orlando has over 2 million less patrons than Disney's worst performing park in Orlando. That is by no means close.

I just pulled the 2009 report.

DHS (9.7M) and AK (9.5M) had practically DOUBLE the attendance of IOA (4.6M) and USF (5.5M).

Now in 2014:

DHS (10.3M) and AK (10.4M) while now IOA (8.1M) and USF (8.2M).

They may still be the #2 resort in Orlando, but seriously...would it help if someone made a graph for you to comprehend just how insane those increases in such a short time are?
 

Donald Razorduck

Well-Known Member
Galveston was a brutal market for DCL. Not enough consumer interest is why they stopped. I see they are going to try it again next year, hope it goes better then the past.

I can fly to Orlando and cruise out of Canaveral on DCL cheaper than I can drive to Galveston and take DCL cruise. I've priced them recently although that's flying Allegiant from XNA.
 

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