Surprise! Red Tier Now Begins Sunday; Downtown Disney Restaurants???

[lazyboy97o]

The First Amendment of the US Constitution gives us five basic freedoms: Freedom of Religion, Freedom of Speech, Freedom of the Press, and the Right to Peacefully assemble.

No, it does not. The Constitution does not give you any rights. You have the right to religion, speech and assembly because you are a person, not because a government has been kind enough to let you have them for a time.

 

[el_super]

Today's update from Anaheim:

The scary part of course, is that it will take approximately 10 days for the impact of the stay at home order to be shown. Dark days ahead.

 

[MarvelCharacterNerd]

For what it's worth, I'm high risk in a couple of categories. I read all the VERY EFFECTIVE steps that the state was doing to ensure my safety...like wiping down the elevator buttons at least two times per day and setting up chairs for a room full of jurors 6 feet apart. I got a note from my doctor mentioning my risk factors, so they let me off. Of course they didn't text or email. I had to log on to the site and there was a teeny paragraph saying my service was complete.

Yeah, I won't be able to get a doctor's note to get out of it. But being legally required to enter a multi-story building with hundreds of strangers, repeatedly forced into elevators with them, then kept inside a room with dozens of others in an enclosed space with no ventilation for days, weeks or months at a time with people talking to each other non-stop and therefore constantly expelling aerosols: safe and mandatory says our governor.

Choosing of my own volition to have a churro outside socially distanced on a planter: deadly.

It may seem like I'm joking, but I'm not. Doing jury duty at this time seems legitimately one of the most dangerous things possible. And yet, I'm forced *by the state government* to do so - I've already pushed back my dates from earlier this year and don't think I'll be allowed to extend again.

I would really like to understand why being forced by the government to expose my health and safety (and by extension, my household's) to others in an enclosed space is completely safe and required - but the other action I might choose to do outside on my own of my own volition is totally unsafe and forbidden. I honestly do not understand.

It seems... arbitrary.

 

[drizgirl]

Today's update from Anaheim:

View attachment 517451


The scary part of course, is that it will take approximately 10 days for the impact of the stay at home order to be shown. Dark days ahead.

Can someone explain to me the odd shape of the "southern" California region?

 

[el_super]

Can someone explain to me the odd shape of the "southern" California region?

Mountains and valleys.

 

[drizgirl]

Yeah, I won't be able to get a doctor's note to get out of it. But being legally required to enter a multi-story building with hundreds of strangers, repeatedly forced into elevators with them, then kept inside a room with dozens of others in an enclosed space with no ventilation for days, weeks or months at a time with people talking to each other non-stop and therefore constantly expelling aerosols: safe and mandatory says our governor.

Choosing of my own volition to have a churro outside socially distanced on a planter: deadly.

It may seem like I'm joking, but I'm not. Doing jury duty at this time seems legitimately one of the most dangerous things possible. And yet, I'm forced *by the state government* to do so - I've already pushed back my dates from earlier this year and don't think I'll be allowed to extend again.

I would really like to understand why being forced by the government to expose my health and safety (and by extension, my household's) to others in an enclosed space is completely safe and required - but the other action I might choose to do outside on my own of my own volition is totally unsafe and forbidden. I honestly do not understand.

It seems... arbitrary.

It really is maddening. They closed down locations my husband's job required visiting, so his job went away, leaving us with no health insurance. We've been going about our lives in a very cautious manner to avoid catching the virus, including skipping my niece's wedding because we didn't consider it safe. Now they want me to go coop up in a very old office building downtown in tight quarters with a lot of other people? I'm right there with you in frustration over this.

 

[drizgirl]

Mountains and valleys.

That helps. But some of that area sure doesn't look "southern". Is there not much population there?

 

[el_super]

That helps. But some of that area sure doesn't look "southern". Is there not much population there?

Like Inyo and Mono counties on the eastern side of the Sierra? There are not many people out there. About half of a normal day at Disneyland. After someone asked last night I looked it up: there are only 3 ICU beds between the two counties total.

My assumption is, for emergency purposes, it makes more sense to transport someone from those counties to Victorville or Barstow (in San Bernardino County) via 395, than it would be to try to cross the mountains. In a normal year, many of the routes over the mountains are closed in the winter due to snow.

Of course for many of those communities, the closer metropolitan areas are in Reno and Las Vegas. But since those are in another state, it wouldn't make sense for the state to depend on utilizing another state's resources in their emergency planning.

 

[drizgirl]

Where did I say don’t try to solve them? My issue is with this false narrative that responding to the virus is resulting in drastically more economic losses. That has not been borne out anywhere. Even historically trying to just ignore issues of public health has done more, longer lasting economic harm.

I keep going back to the Walt Disney World layoffs because they are a good case study. Despite being open Walt Disney World was not spared layoffs. The layoffs did not disproportionately affect the Disneyland Resort despite the continued closure. The layoffs were rather uniform and of a similar scale regardless of Disneyland Resort being closed and Walt Disney World being begged by the governor to increase capacity. States that have and are taking a more lax approach are not booming. Sweden, which is starting to go back on its lax approach, has not fared better economically than its regional neighbors. The choice isn’t between a lot of jobs lost and a few jobs lost, it’s a choice between a lot of jobs lost, more illness, more deaths, overwhelmed hospitals and a likely slower economic recovery based on historic precedent or about the same jobs lost, less illness, fewer deaths, available medical care and a speedier economic recovery. Like I said before, we have the word quarantine because of merchants who intentionally hindered their trade.

We are not having a private discussion. My field has been absolutely decimated and while it is a bit of coincidence of timing, the worst has been in places with a more lax approach to dealing with the pandemic.

I'm sorry your field has been decimated. But that's not the same as losing your job or insurance. Trust me. Completely different.

Disney is an interesting case study for sure, but not typical of what smaller companies, including many mom and pop businesses are dealing with. Disney, and companies like them, have the resources to withstand this.

Who's advocating for ignoring issues of public health? Nobody. What I see are people advocating for being allowed to remain open with safety plans in place, rather than making broad generalizations and shutting down entire sectors.

 

[DisneyDrum]

I'm sorry your field has been decimated. But that's not the same as losing your job or insurance. Trust me. Completely different.

Disney is an interesting case study for sure, but not typical of what smaller companies, including many mom and pop businesses are dealing with. Disney, and companies like them, have the resources to withstand this.

Who's advocating for ignoring issues of public health? Nobody. What I see are people advocating for being allowed to remain open with safety plans in place, rather than making broad generalizations and shutting down entire sectors.

Why doesn't the government provide support to businesses, instead of them being forced to stay open in a pandemic? It seems depressing that the only choice these small businesses have is to remain open and risk their employees and communities. The sooner case levels drop the sooner we can reopen things.

It seems silly to argue about specifics, like that Orange county isn't at 15% ICU bed capacity yet. They are down to 18% percent ICU capacity today, with tons of new folks in the hospital. https://ochca.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/cc4859c8c522496b9f21c451de2fedae

 

[lazyboy97o]

I'm sorry your field has been decimated. But that's not the same as losing your job or insurance. Trust me. Completely different.

Disney is an interesting case study for sure, but not typical of what smaller companies, including many mom and pop businesses are dealing with. Disney, and companies like them, have the resources to withstand this.

Who's advocating for ignoring issues of public health? Nobody. What I see are people advocating for being allowed to remain open with safety plans in place, rather than making broad generalizations and shutting down entire sectors.

An industry being decimated does means lost job and health insurance. Those few who are left are tying up lose ups hoping they drag on just long enough because once everything is tied up they too are out the door where they get to join the many who are similarly experienced and swarming the small pickings available, again driving down wages that were very hard hit in 2008. All in a place without many restrictions so there is no hope that things will bounce back when restrictions finally ease.

Job loss is also not the only means of there being a negative financial burden. Maybe you do still have something of a job but your adult child had to quit her job because she’s a long hauler who had a mini-stroke. She should just suck it up because she is “fine” and didn’t die, right?

Then you haven’t been reading these threads on the Disneyland forum. They have been ride with misunderstand, misinformation, conspiracies and outright calls to just ignore public health guidance. Claiming the virus is just the flu is ignoring public health. Claiming that doctors are involved in wide scale fraud is ignoring public health. Saying diminishing hospital capacity is not a problem or is overstated is ignoring public health. Encouraging people to travel right now is ignoring public health. The return to broad restrictions are the direct result to diminishing hospital capacity and even then they are less restrictive than before by not being state wide and allowing more businesses to stay open.

 

[drizgirl]

Why doesn't the government provide support to businesses, instead of them being forced to stay open in a pandemic? It seems depressing that the only choice these small businesses have is to remain open and risk their employees and communities. The sooner case levels drop the sooner we can reopen things.

It seems silly to argue about specifics, like that Orange county isn't at 15% ICU bed capacity yet. They are down to 18% percent ICU capacity today, with tons of new folks in the hospital. https://ochca.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/cc4859c8c522496b9f21c451de2fedae

I'm not a big government person in general. But when government forces business to close through no fault of their own, when they cause jobs to go away through no fault of the employee, I think that's a time they need to step up with support.

That said, our politicians have placed a higher priority on politics than on taking care of people, so it is what it is. Even if help was passed today (and it won't be) help won't get into people's hands for weeks, maybe longer. Telling people that have no income that they can't go earn an income to feed their families is wrong. I get that some businesses are inherently more dangerous than others. At least stop lumping things together and allow businesses to bring forth a safety plan and monitor them to allow the ones enforcing guidelines to stay open.

This is patently absurd:

 

[lazyboy97o]

I'm not a big government person in general. But when government forces business to close through no fault of their own, when they cause jobs to go away through no fault of the employee, I think that's a time they need to step up with support.

That said, our politicians have placed a higher priority on politics than on taking care of people, so it is what it is. Even if help was passed today (and it won't be) help won't get into people's hands for weeks, maybe longer. Telling people that have no income that they can't go earn an income to feed their families is wrong. I get that some businesses are inherently more dangerous than others. At least stop lumping things together and allow businesses to bring forth a safety plan and monitor them to allow the ones enforcing guidelines to stay open.

This is patently absurd:

This is an example of what you claim you want. All food service is not being lumped together. Film and movie productions have put forward a plan of essentially creating bubbles that isolate the cast and crew members from others, including from their own families.

 

[TP2000]

Can someone explain to me the odd shape of the "southern" California region?

It's the Mono County Metro Area, home to 23 Million people. Duh.

 

[DisneyDrum]

I'm not a big government person in general. But when government forces business to close through no fault of their own, when they cause jobs to go away through no fault of the employee, I think that's a time they need to step up with support.

That said, our politicians have placed a higher priority on politics than on taking care of people, so it is what it is. Even if help was passed today (and it won't be) help won't get into people's hands for weeks, maybe longer. Telling people that have no income that they can't go earn an income to feed their families is wrong. I get that some businesses are inherently more dangerous than others. At least stop lumping things together and allow businesses to bring forth a safety plan and monitor them to allow the ones enforcing guidelines to stay open.

This is patently absurd:

I completely agree that we're dealing with a systematic failure of government, and I can't fault people for trying to make a living. But, if a film set is testing everyone on staff, that is a different risk level from a restaurant where anyone from the community can eat.

Why can't we have testing like that for everyone? Why can film sets afford prevention measures that aren't available to everyone? It's a failure of our pandemic response that has gotten us into a situation where we have to shut businesses down.

 

[TP2000]

Has nothing to do with OUTDOOR Dining.

In fact, a LA Judge has said so.

Judge wants to see evidence for LA County’s restaurant dining ban – Daily News

Thank you! And steering this thread gently back towards Downtown Disney specifically, this LA County legal issue this upcoming week will be very interesting to see. And could eventually impact Downtown Disney's outdoor dining.

Last week the LA County Board of Supervisors' legal team could provide absolutely no evidence in court to show that outdoor dining was inherently dangerous and leads to the spread of Covid. The judge was not happy and demanded they provide evidence this week in his court. Let's see what happens and what the office interns came up with over the weekend!

In the meantime, I have changed the topic of this thread to note that all dining (and even all food consumption on property) is now closed at Downtown Disney as of this evening.

It will be interesting to see how that changes now that journalists are asking the question they should have asked months ago of our betters in Sacramento and LA... "Can you show us the evidence and the data you are using to make these decisions that close businesses and industries? Please show us your work for our audience at home."

 

[MoonRakerSCM]

I just got a haircut at a local barbershop (I can't believe I've NEVER gone to it before), he did a great job and I'll certainly be returning. I wanted to make sure most of my hair is gone in preparation for my WDW trip (T-minus 11 DAYS!!!!!).

He filled me in on all the restaurants that are still doing outdoor and indoor dining and other barber shops that are and have always been open. There's quite a local backlash against the new shutdown order and law enforcement are in on it. I'll be checking some places out in the next few weeks for sure.

 

[TP2000]

I just got a haircut at a local barbershop (I can't believe I've NEVER gone to it before), he did a great job and I'll certainly be returning. I wanted to make sure most of my hair is gone in preparation for my WDW trip (T-minus 11 DAYS!!!!!).

He filled me in on all the restaurants that are still doing outdoor and indoor dining and other barber shops that are and have always been open. There's quite a local backlash against the new shutdown order and law enforcement are in on it. I'll be checking some places out in the next few weeks for sure.

That's what life is like in OC too. Plenty of restaurants are not going to obey this time, and my barber and my nail lady have all kept going. The barbeshop situation is a total scream! For months earlier this year they put black plastic tarps over the windows and you make an appointment and then park in back and go through the backdoor.

And you know what's nice about that? They don't have to follow a whole bunch of rules with that speakeasy setup! When they are in Speakeasy Mode my shop offers me a beer or a shot of whiskey and they really have a party atmosphere in there. I am actually looking forward to going there in a week or so now that barbershops are again illegal under the new Stay-At-Home order, because I'm gonna get a free glass of Jack Daniels with my cut!

And the speakeasy vibe they create is really a lot of fun. The young barbers get a real kick out of it.

No surprise that the Orange County Sherriff has joined many other Sherriff's and police departments in publicly stating this weekend that they will NOT be enforcing Newsom's mandates or orders.

Orange County sheriff says deputies won't enforce SoCal's new stay-at-home order

Orange County Sheriff Don Barnes said Saturday that his deputies would not be enforcing the regional stay-at-home order that has been issued for Southern California.

abc7.com

 

[drizgirl]

That's what life is like in OC too. Plenty of restaurants are not going to obey this time, and my barber and my nail lady have all kept going. The barbeshop situation is a total scream! For months earlier this year they put black plastic tarps over the windows and you make an appointment and then park in back and go through the backdoor.

And you know what's nice about that? They don't have to follow a whole bunch of rules with that speakeasy setup! When they are in Speakeasy Mode my shop offers me a beer or a shot of whiskey and they really have a party atmosphere in there. I am actually looking forward to going there in a week or so now that barbershops are again illegal under the new Stay-At-Home order, because I'm gonna get a free glass of Jack Daniels with my cut!

And the speakeasy vibe they create is really a lot of fun. The young barbers get a real kick out of it.

No surprise that the Orange County Sherriff has joined many other Sherriff's and police departments in publicly stating this weekend that they will NOT be enforcing Newsom's mandates or orders.

Orange County sheriff says deputies won't enforce SoCal's new stay-at-home order

Orange County Sheriff Don Barnes said Saturday that his deputies would not be enforcing the regional stay-at-home order that has been issued for Southern California.

abc7.com

Can you even imagine how much Disney could get for the speakeasy experience?

 

[SuddenStorm]

I just got a haircut at a local barbershop (I can't believe I've NEVER gone to it before), he did a great job and I'll certainly be returning. I wanted to make sure most of my hair is gone in preparation for my WDW trip (T-minus 11 DAYS!!!!!).

He filled me in on all the restaurants that are still doing outdoor and indoor dining and other barber shops that are and have always been open. There's quite a local backlash against the new shutdown order and law enforcement are in on it. I'll be checking some places out in the next few weeks for sure.

A friend of mine manages a smaller business in LA County. I shot him a message yesterday to see how they were going to adapt with new stay at home order. His response? "Right now we're gonna do what everyone else is and ignore it"