Surprise! Red Tier Now Begins Sunday; Downtown Disney Restaurants???

[Mac Tonight]

Valid point. And since elderly men die at a higher rate than elderly women with Covid, it might be time to start using Grandpa as the example. Or a Great Uncle?

Lost an Uncle last month too.

 

[TP2000]

Lost an Uncle last month too.

Well, heck. I'm sorry to hear that.

How would you prefer people reference elderly Covid deaths, other than just "Covid deaths"?

 

[Darkbeer1]

You know, I laugh at this like many of us because it involves a particular type of venue.

But now that I think about it, these types of places have also been openly disobeying the regulations and curfew rules in OC too. And it sounds like they set up a very safe environment for the young ladies (ahem) to work in, which is more socially distanced than my local busy Target and the very crowded In-N-Out with over a dozen kids flipping burgers shoulder to shoulder in the kitchen.

I took that joke photo a few weeks ago outside Anaheim's Satin Topless convertible top store, but it was also obvious that the line of gentlemen (ahem) waiting to get in was socially distanced and standing on markers on the sidewalk outside. This industry seems to be taking it more seriously than the big box stores. Perhaps something to be learned here?

Since the Judge heard the case regarding "Strip Clubs", let's quickly discuss different type of locations. (Forgive me if I get some things wrong, as my knowledge is mainly from decades before. I happened to be part of Pacers sister bar, where our employees would walk over there to have a drink after work, and visa versa. We also traded Liquor and other supplies, plus worked as a bank for the other on weekends, such as us buying $1 bills from them using large bills, and they buying coin from us. Interesting to note, Pacers was the first unionized Strip Club in California.

The least regulated is a Bikini Club. So a performer dancing, but leaves all the naughty bits covered up.



Next are the topless places. So the chest area is exposed, but depending on local regulations, the bottom area must remained covered, and that includes the butt checks. In California, it has been deemed acceptable in locations that sell liquor.

Then you get the Full Nude places, which in California cannot sell liquor, as it violates Liquor License rules.

But they are all strip clubs, just the degree of exposure.

But they have been deemed an expression or art/speech.

So what is the difference.

An easy example in Sports is a Pole Vaulter. They basically learn a very specific dance that allows them to get over the bar, aka the "Art" of the sport.

Many would say that Hamilton, the Play is a Politically themed play, aka an expression of speech/art.

So lets talk about Theme/Amusement Parks.

Was "Frozen" at the Hyperion an artistic performance? The script writers expressing their speech, using Actors to help bring the words alive.

How about the Dapper Dans? The Calico Saloon Show, they offer Can Can Girls at times...

If we take the Judges ruling, basically any large venue, where people gather to watch a performance (Sporting Venue, Concert Venue, Theater (Plays, Movies, Music, etc.) and yes, Theme/Amusement Parks, should be allowed to offer their preferred type of speech.

It is a very interesting take on the issue of businesses being allowed to operate.

Yes, "Strip Club" does have a certain attachment to it, but when it comes down to it, it is a performance. And one where the better you perform (within the laws and regulations), the more money (tips) you make.

But strip clubs have been allowed to operate based on the Freedoms Americans are provided by the Laws of the United States.

 

[Mac Tonight]

Well, heck. I'm sorry to hear that.

How would you prefer people reference elderly Covid deaths, other than just "Covid deaths"?

Maybe you could just use the word "elderly"

Honestly though, I actually don't care what people say. My original post was written as a gut reaction in annoyance. I promise I'm not really that sensitive.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Judge confirms strip club ruling lifts restaurant closures as well | FOX 5 San Diego

>>SAN DIEGO – All San Diego County restaurants and businesses with restaurant service are exempted from enforcement of California’s regional COVID-19 stay-at-home order, a judge said Thursday.

San Diego Superior Court Judge Joel R. Wohlfeil granted a preliminary injunction Wednesday that allowed a pair of San Diego strip clubs — Cheetahs Gentlemen’s Club and Pacers Showgirls International — to remain open amid COVID-19 restrictions, as well as “San Diego County businesses with restaurant service … subject to protocols that are no greater than is essential to further Defendants response to control the spread of COVID.”

Wohlfeil’s ruling prompted the county to seek an emergency hearing Thursday afternoon for clarification, though officials issued a statement Wednesday night indicating the county was suspending enforcement against restaurants and live entertainment establishments.

At Thursday’s hearing, Wohlfeil said, “The court’s intention is that all businesses which provide restaurant service, meaning all restaurants in the county of San Diego, are encompassed within the scope of the court’s order.”<<

 

[TP2000]

Since the Judge heard the case regarding "Strip Clubs", let's quickly discuss different type of locations. (Forgive me if I get some things wrong, as my knowledge is mainly from decades before. I happened to be part of Pacers sister bar, where our employees would walk over there to have a drink after work, and visa versa. We also traded Liquor and other supplies, plus worked as a bank for the other on weekends, such as us buying $1 bills from them using large bills, and they buying coin from us. Interesting to note, Pacers was the first unionized Strip Club in California.

The least regulated is a Bikini Club. So a performer dancing, but leaves all the naughty bits covered up.



Next are the topless places. So the chest area is exposed, but depending on local regulations, the bottom area must remained covered, and that includes the butt checks. In California, it has been deemed acceptable in locations that sell liquor.

Then you get the Full Nude places, which in California cannot sell liquor, as it violates Liquor License rules.

But they are all strip clubs, just the degree of exposure.

But they have been deemed an expression or art/speech.

So what is the difference.

An easy example in Sports is a Pole Vaulter. They basically learn a very specific dance that allows them to get over the bar, aka the "Art" of the sport.

Many would say that Hamilton, the Play is a Politically themed play, aka an expression of speech/art.

So lets talk about Theme/Amusement Parks.

Was "Frozen" at the Hyperion an artistic performance? The script writers expressing their speech, using Actors to help bring the words alive.

How about the Dapper Dans? The Calico Saloon Show, they offer Can Can Girls at times...

If we take the Judges ruling, basically any large venue, where people gather to watch a performance (Sporting Venue, Concert Venue, Theater (Plays, Movies, Music, etc.) and yes, Theme/Amusement Parks, should be allowed to offer their preferred type of speech.

It is a very interesting take on the issue of businesses being allowed to operate.

Yes, "Strip Club" does have a certain attachment to it, but when it comes down to it, it is a performance. And one where the better you perform (within the laws and regulations), the more money (tips) you make.

But strip clubs have been allowed to operate based on the Freedoms Americans are provided by the Laws of the United States.

I'm serious gang, sometimes I really love where our conversations take us here!

Fascinating info Darkbeer!

And a really good example of how these lower county court cases (LA two weeks ago, now SD this week) that are quickly and easily being won against county bureaucracies who have absolutely no Science & Data to back up their arbitrary mandates are going to quickly elevate to the state level and reopen industries hopefully soon in 2021.

Because if giant and wealthy county bureaucracies like Los Angeles and San Diego (not exactly Mono County) have no Science & Data to present in court to substantiate their claims that restaurants and bars have to be closed to prevent the spread of Covid, then that means the same cases against the State will fail just as quickly and easily as the county cases.

Many of us have suspected this for months, but now in court it's being clearly proven that there is no Science & Data being used here by bureaucrats and the closure of entire industries via government mandate is entirely arbitrary. Strip clubs. Restaurants. Theme Parks. 2021 will be interesting to say the least!

 

[TP2000]

Maybe you could just use the word "elderly"

Done!

Honestly though, I actually don't care what people say. My original post was written as a gut reaction in annoyance. I promise I'm not really that sensitive.

I didn't take it that way at all, and your point was valid. It's been quite a few decades since my grandparents passed away, and then my parents and aunts and uncles, so I'm probably insulated to the issue by time. But it's never a fun thing.

 

[Darkbeer1]

Judge confirms strip club ruling lifts restaurant closures as well | FOX 5 San Diego

>>SAN DIEGO – All San Diego County restaurants and businesses with restaurant service are exempted from enforcement of California’s regional COVID-19 stay-at-home order, a judge said Thursday.

San Diego Superior Court Judge Joel R. Wohlfeil granted a preliminary injunction Wednesday that allowed a pair of San Diego strip clubs — Cheetahs Gentlemen’s Club and Pacers Showgirls International — to remain open amid COVID-19 restrictions, as well as “San Diego County businesses with restaurant service … subject to protocols that are no greater than is essential to further Defendants response to control the spread of COVID.”

Wohlfeil’s ruling prompted the county to seek an emergency hearing Thursday afternoon for clarification, though officials issued a statement Wednesday night indicating the county was suspending enforcement against restaurants and live entertainment establishments.

At Thursday’s hearing, Wohlfeil said, “The court’s intention is that all businesses which provide restaurant service, meaning all restaurants in the county of San Diego, are encompassed within the scope of the court’s order.”<<

So based on this wording, can SeaWorld, which offers multiple types of Live Entertainment (Animal Shows, Christmas shows, Cirque type shows, etc.) and multiple restaurant/dining options reopen?

 

[TP2000]

So based on this wording, can SeaWorld, which offers multiple types of Live Entertainment (Animal Shows, Christmas shows, Cirque type shows, etc.) and multiple restaurant/dining options reopen?

The writing is clearly on the wall here. It's just a shame it took this long for industries to begin to fight back in court, because the court cases are falling in their favor quickly and easily and with sweeping legal response by judges.

First LA County failed miserably in court. Now suddenly San Diego County. Wow!

The unfortunate thing here is the timing, because our state bureaucracy is going to be able to sit on this for at least a few weeks. Tomorrow is the Friday before Christmas, and the following week is New Years. Just like a summer Friday in Sacramento where everyone packs up and goes home by 4pm after a long 35 hour work week, our state and county bureaucrats will be going on a two week vacation less than 24 hours from right now.

It will be difficult to get any additional movement, legal or otherwise, on this issue until our bureaucracy we pay for returns from their long Christmas vacation on Monday, January 4th. So working people in this state who are seeing their family businesses dangle by a thread will have to keep hanging on a bit longer.

It's a shame these court cases couldn't have been handed down six or eight weeks ago, so the rest of the fall could be spent cleaning up the legal loose ends and reopening businesses and restoring livelihoods in time for the most profitable month of the year; December.

 

[Darkbeer1]

The folly of California’s outdoor dining ban – Orange County Register (ocregister.com)

>>The Newsom administration and three-fifths of the leadership of Los Angeles County do not care.

This outrageously cavalier attitude toward other people’s livelihoods is made worse by elected officials and their closest friends showing up at restaurants to enjoy dinner even as they told the public, without evidence, that this was terribly unsafe.

Under the U.S. Constitution, the government cannot take private property for public use without paying for it. Some elected officials may pay for it sooner than others.<<

 

[TheDisneyDaysOfOurLives]

The writing is clearly on the wall here. It's just a shame it took this long for industries to begin to fight back in court, because the court cases are falling in their favor quickly and easily and with sweeping legal response by judges.

First LA County failed miserably in court. Now suddenly San Diego County. Wow!

The unfortunate thing here is the timing, because our state bureaucracy is going to be able to sit on this for at least a few weeks. Tomorrow is the Friday before Christmas, and the following week is New Years. Just like a summer Friday in Sacramento where everyone packs up and goes home by 4pm after a long 35 hour work week, our state and county bureaucrats will be going on a two week vacation less than 24 hours from right now.

It will be difficult to get any additional movement, legal or otherwise, on this issue until our bureaucracy we pay for returns from their long Christmas vacation on Monday, January 4th. So working people in this state who are seeing their family businesses dangle by a thread will have to keep hanging on a bit longer.

It's a shame these court cases couldn't have been handed down six or eight weeks ago, so the rest of the fall could be spent cleaning up the legal loose ends and reopening businesses and restoring livelihoods in time for the most profitable month of the year; December.

TP! Glad to see you're alive and well.

California has gone too far. It's really a shame

 

[TP2000]

TP! Glad to see you're alive and well.

Hello! I'm here, just been busy-busy with Christmas prep and the season in general. Hope you are also well, and a Merry Christmas to you and yours!

California has gone too far. It's really a shame

Exactly. I think we all got the outdoor dining thing, especially with the radically enforced way it was set up at Downtown Disney. But then the bureaucrats started losing court cases left and right after they couldn't bring a shred of evidence of any Science & Data they'd been using that showed outdoor patio dining spreads Covid.

But when they had outdoor dining at Downtown Disney.... tables were 10 feet from each other and sanitized after every seating. Guest Relations CM's roving in plaid vests politely telling you to pull your mask up over your nose if you got lazy. Nothing but corporate tenants paying big rent to be there, so they all followed Disney's rules to the letter. Etc., etc.

Ballast Point Brewery, Downtown Disney - October, 2020 - You Couldn't Catch A Virus Here If You Tried!

But then Governor Newsom moved the goalposts again and rewrote the rules after August's roll out of the Blueprint For A Safer Economy thing, and came up with the Regional thing based on entirely new metrics that closed 99.5% of the state very suddenly three weeks ago.

And so now we have all the restaurants in Downtown Disney closed entirely, the mall is a ghost town, and the result is that people are now just congregating in private homes for entertainment where there is zero enforcement instead of going out to Downtown Disney or other restaurants where it would be safer.

Somehow this all makes sense to our betters in Sacramento. But then, they are going on a two week vacation after tomorrow, and won't even be picking up the phone after 3pm tomorrow anyway. So.... let them eat cake!

 

[TP2000]

I read this article earlier today and thought of this thread. Our constantly Virtue Signaling betters at The Atlantic would like to remind lecture you that you shouldn't celebrate Christmas or New Years or Hanukah this year.

You need to wait until March.

So you know what would help do that? Let's close all the outdoor restaurants and outdoor entertainment options after those businesses had just invested heavily in tents and outdoor heaters, in a state with already mild December weather, and force everyone to spend the holidays inside unregulated homes with groups of friends and family. Science & Data!

Hang On for 3 More Months

Some simple advice for anyone contemplating a holiday gathering: Wait until March.

www.theatlantic.com

 

[1HAPPYGHOSTHOST]

I read this article earlier today and thought of this thread. Our constantly Virtue Signaling betters at The Atlantic would like to remind lecture you that you shouldn't celebrate Christmas or New Years or Hanukah this year.

You need to wait until March.

So you know what would help do that? Let's close all the outdoor restaurants and outdoor entertainment options after those businesses had just invested heavily in tents and outdoor heaters, in a state with already mild December weather, and force everyone to spend the holidays inside unregulated homes with groups of friends and family. Science & Data!

Hang On for 3 More Months

Some simple advice for anyone contemplating a holiday gathering: Wait until March.

www.theatlantic.com

What's their stance on Kwanza?

 

[TheDisneyDaysOfOurLives]

Hello! I'm here, just been busy-busy with Christmas prep and the season in general. Hope you are also well, and a Merry Christmas to you and yours!



Exactly. I think we all got the outdoor dining thing, especially with the radically enforced way it was set up at Downtown Disney. But then the bureaucrats started losing court cases left and right after they couldn't bring a shred of evidence of any Science & Data they'd been using that showed outdoor patio dining spreads Covid.

But when they had outdoor dining at Downtown Disney.... tables were 10 feet from each other and sanitized after every seating. Guest Relations CM's roving in plaid vests politely telling you to pull your mask up over your nose if you got lazy. Nothing but corporate tenants paying big rent to be there, so they all followed Disney's rules to the letter. Etc., etc.

Ballast Point Brewery, Downtown Disney - October, 2020 - You Couldn't Catch A Virus Here If You Tried!
View attachment 519430

But then Governor Newsom moved the goalposts again and rewrote the rules after August's roll out of the Blueprint For A Safer Economy thing, and came up with the Regional thing based on entirely new metrics that closed 99.5% of the state very suddenly three weeks ago.

And so now we have all the restaurants in Downtown Disney closed entirely, the mall is a ghost town, and the result is that people are now just congregating in private homes for entertainment where there is zero enforcement instead of going out to Downtown Disney or other restaurants where it would be safer.

Somehow this all makes sense to our betters in Sacramento. But then, they are going on a two week vacation after tomorrow, and won't even be picking up the phone after 3pm tomorrow anyway. So.... let them eat cake!

I need to wonder away from the dark corner of the forums more often Glad you're doing well and everyone is doing good on this side as well.

And agreed. Newsom should be out of a job after this fiasco. I hope this torpedoes his chances to being President as well.

There's simply no balance whatsoever, in the most populous (and expensive) state in the country. Things have to change fast because when people follow the rules, as you said the goal posts are moved. This has got to end and we can find a balance that allows people to work and make money, bringing in tax revenue, while protecting everyone at the same time.

 

[TP2000]

We started this thread the first of December because Governor Newsom rolled out a brand new Regional Stay-At-Home Order that grouped 23 Million people spread across a 400 mile long landmass into "Southern California", and thus shut down all indoor dining in that "region". Downtown Disney is in that region, so the restaurants closed and the business dried up fast at that mall.

Here's the latest on how the SoCal Region will be remaining under Stay-At-Home orders for at least another month...

More vaccines on the way, in meantime Orange County likely under stay-home orders for another month

Southern California could remain under restrictions, with hospitals nearly full and case counts still growing.

www.ocregister.com

One vaccine against COVID-19 has already been rolled out and others are on the way in the coming weeks and months, but the virus’s unchecked spread and nearly full hospitals mean restrictions and closures aren’t likely to go away soon.

Southern California is under a three-week stay home order, and “we’re in week two, but I’m not foreseeing that we’ll be able to get out of the lockdown for (another) month at least,” Orange County Health Officer Dr. Clayton Chau said Thursday, Dec. 17.

So... unless Orange County can get that same nifty court case San Diego just won quickly after the holidays, or if a similar case strikes down the outdoor dining ban statewide, Downtown Disney is going to remain a ghost town for at least another month.

FYI for our out of state friends: Governor Newsom's Stay-At-Home order and 10pm statewide curfew is very strict, unless you want to go to Target at 11pm for mascara, or In-N-Out at 1am for milkshakes, or an Anaheim strip club, or Cost Plus for funky throw pillows, or South Coast Plaza packed with shoppers, or BevMo for a handle of booze, or a pot shop in a grimy strip mall for stinky cigarettes, or a speakeasy barbershop that serves whiskey shots to customers because the front windows are covered in black plastic, etc., etc., etc. Except for all those thousands of examples, everyone in California is staying at home and obeying curfew.

 

[Stevek]

We started this thread the first of December because Governor Newsom rolled out a brand new Regional Stay-At-Home Order that grouped 23 Million people spread across a 400 mile long landmass into "Southern California", and thus shut down all indoor dining in that "region". Downtown Disney is in that region, so the restaurants closed and the business dried up fast at that mall.

Here's the latest on how the SoCal Region will be remaining under Stay-At-Home orders for at least another month...

More vaccines on the way, in meantime Orange County likely under stay-home orders for another month

Southern California could remain under restrictions, with hospitals nearly full and case counts still growing.

www.ocregister.com

One vaccine against COVID-19 has already been rolled out and others are on the way in the coming weeks and months, but the virus’s unchecked spread and nearly full hospitals mean restrictions and closures aren’t likely to go away soon.

Southern California is under a three-week stay home order, and “we’re in week two, but I’m not foreseeing that we’ll be able to get out of the lockdown for (another) month at least,” Orange County Health Officer Dr. Clayton Chau said Thursday, Dec. 17.

So... unless Orange County can get that same nifty court case San Diego just won quickly after the holidays, or if a similar case strikes down the outdoor dining ban statewide, Downtown Disney is going to remain a ghost town for at least another month.

FYI for our out of state friends: Governor Newsom's Stay-At-Home order and 10pm statewide curfew is very strict, unless you want to go to Target at 11pm for mascara, or In-N-Out at 1am for milkshakes, or an Anaheim strip club, or Cost Plus for funky throw pillows, or South Coast Plaza packed with shoppers, or BevMo for a handle of booze, or a pot shop in a grimy strip mall for stinky cigarettes, or a speakeasy barbershop that serves whiskey shots to customers because the front windows are covered in black plastic, etc., etc., etc. Except for all those thousands of examples, everyone in California is staying at home and obeying curfew.

Yeah, I would not be surprised to see the lockdown end until end of FEB.

 

[TP2000]

And agreed. Newsom should be out of a job after this fiasco. I hope this torpedoes his chances to being President as well.

I actually doubt the recall campaign will succeed against him, and he has a decent shot of being re-elected in 2022. But what's interesting and even relevant to this thread is that his political troubles all involve Outdoor Dining.

I've read in several national publications the last few weeks that his November outing to The French Laundry is what turned the tide on that. Newsom not only lied about it being outdoors, but two days later the photo proved he was lying and it was a local scandal that blew up to represent an entire nation of hypocritical lying politicians. At the very least, The French Laundry scandal relegated Newsom to never being able to advance his career out of the state, sort of like Ted Kennedy at Chappaquiddick in July, 1969.

Teddy could still get re-elected for life in Massachusetts after that scandal, but his national ambitions were as sunk as his submerged Oldsmobile with a drowned blonde inside. Gavin Newsom's Chappaquiddick was far less grisly and came with very expensive wine pairings, but the damage done to his career was about the same...

On a personal note, Newsom's political woes have forced me to contemplate replacing my dining room chairs for something like those fabulous Saarinen knock-offs they use in the private dining room at The French Laundry. An iconic mid century design, covered in dark blue crushed velvet, with black lacquered legs and little brushed gold caps. I love those chairs!

 

[TheDisneyDaysOfOurLives]

I actually doubt the recall campaign will succeed against him, and he has a decent shot of being re-elected in 2022. But what's interesting and even relevant to this thread is that his political troubles all involve Outdoor Dining.

I've read in several national publications the last few weeks that his November outing to The French Laundry is what turned the tide on that. He not only lied about it being outdoors, but then the photo proved he was lying and it was the local scandal that came to represent an entire nation of hypocritical lying politicians. At the very least, The French Laundry scandal relegated Newsom to never being able to advance his career out of the state, sort of like Ted Kennedy at Chappaquiddick in July, 1969.

Teddy could still get re-elected for life in Massachusetts after that scandal, but his national ambitions were as sunk as his submerged Oldsmobile with a drowned blonde inside. Gavin Newsom's Chappaquiddick was far less grisly and came with very expensive wine pairings, but the damage done to his career was about the same...

On a personal note, Newsom's political woes have forced me to contemplate replacing my dining room chairs for something like those fabulous Saarinen knock-offs they use in the private dining room at The French Laundry. An iconic mid century design, covered in dark blue crushed velvet, with black lacquered legs and little brushed gold caps. I love those chairs!

How are you going to fit those next to your Nancy Pelosi-style refrigerators (I can't remember the name of them for the life of me, but I know you will)? Though they seem quite chic and right up your alley.

Yeah, Newsom has far stretched over the boundaries of his position and while I supported it in the early days, enough is enough especially with the number of hypocritical politicians (it's infuriating on so many levels).

 

[TP2000]

How are you going to fit those next to your Nancy Pelosi-style refrigerators (I can't remember the name of them for the life of me, but I know you will)? Though they seem quite chic and right up your alley.

Yeah, Newsom has far stretched over the boundaries of his position and while I supported it in the early days, enough is enough especially with the number of hypocritical politicians (it's infuriating on so many levels).

Sub Zero. Filled with $12 per pint gourmet ice cream.

Jeni's Splendid Ice Creams

Made for ice cream lovers. Order ice cream online, send a gift delivery nationwide, visit a scoop shop or find our ice cream in a grocery near you.

jenis.com

Each Sub Zero fridge model she has, the 36 inch wide model, is about $11,000. She has two of them. Matching. So it's a $22,000 refrigerator setup.

Even in Villa Park and other tony OC suburbs with maxed out credit cards, the schmoozy housewives only have one Sub Zero. They should qualify for some sort of federal program to upgrade them to a side-by-side lifestyle. Nancy should get on that in the new session of congress!