EPCOTCenterLover
Well-Known Member
Real villains to fight and conquer make real heroes. Remove the bad guy, and the story falls flat. Real life isn't safe and predictable either.
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News Splash Mountain retheme to Princess and the Frog - Tiana's Bayou Adventure
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MerlinTheGoat
Well-Known Member
First of all, Frozen doesn't even have any business being a post-movie ride. It still recreates the same basic scenes and has the same songs. If they didn't sprinkle dialog throughout stating that it occurs afterwards, then no one would know it wasn't a book report ride. I think Tokyo's is going to follow the movie events, and should hopefully also be a much better ride for various other reasons.
Secondly, what Magicart87 said is also true. Hans is not a popular villain at all. There's a reason that in spite of the MANY major complaints about Frozen, the exclusion of Hans isn't one that is often brought up. He's one of the worst Disney villains of all time. Even still, including him might have given the ride a little more of an impact than it has now (which is none). Facilier is entirely the opposite, he stands among some of the best Disney villains. The movie would be nowhere near as good without him. His song is also excellent and also arguably the best one in the film.
Thirdly, and again, Facilier is a Witch Doctor with magic sourced from evil spirits who reside in the realm of the dead. Among all of Disney's animated villains, he's one of the few who you could 100% justify either outright bringing back to life, or at least arrange a more in-person meeting with him in the netherworld.
Creating a ride based on Princess and the Frog IP and not having Facilier is like if they made a Sleeping Beauty ride without Maleficent, an Aladdin ride without Jafar, Lion King without Scar, Little Mermaid without Ursula, Hercules without Hades, Snow White without the Evil Queen, Peter Pan without Captain Hook etc etc.
I'm not sure of Disney's current opinions on Facilier, but he's one of the elements of the film often brought up for being "problematic". It wouldn't surprise me if they are indeed trying to quietly phase him out. Again, it's notable that they didn't find a way to include the character in the ride, despite his enormous popularity.
If Facilier is problematic though, Mama Odie is far more still, she's a massive stereotype. There's also a lot of uncomfortable things that can be inferred about the LaBouff family and how they gained their wealth ("sugar baron" leaves exceptionally little to the imagination). Or how poorly Eudora seems to have been paid by Big Daddy for her impressive dressmaking talents. I mention this because Big Daddy and Charlotte are both in the ride.
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EPCOTCenterLover
Well-Known Member
Agreed 100%. It's easy to overlook the problem areas of the movie when you're so intent of making sure it's a good fit for an attraction. Not the first time and probably not the last either.
TrainsOfDisney
Well-Known Member
There’s a reason that “wait Hans is the bad guy!?” is a line in the sing along. Haha.
TalkToEthan
Well-Known Member
Facilier is still, as for Disney characters, very young; he can’t be but 12 to 15 years old????
Cancellation(if even via “slowdown” or incremental phase out) seems out of control.
By the way Facilier reminds me of that James Bond voodoo freak from the early 70’s Live and Let Die
Cancellation(if even via “slowdown” or incremental phase out) seems out of control.
By the way Facilier reminds me of that James Bond voodoo freak from the early 70’s Live and Let Die
Cmdr_Crimson
Well-Known Member
That’s because both heavily evoke the Voodo diety Baron Samedi who according to Wikipedia:
“Baron Samedi is usually depicted with a top hat, black tail coat, dark glasses, and cotton plugs in the nostrils, as if to resemble a corpse dressed and prepared for burial in the Haitian style. He is frequently depicted as a skeleton (but sometimes as a black man that merely has his face painted as a skull), and speaks in a nasal voice. The former President-for-Life of Haiti, François Duvalier, known as Papa Doc, modeled his cult of personality on Baron Samedi; he was often seen speaking in a deep nasal tone and wearing dark glasses.[2]
He is noted for disruption, obscenity, debauchery, and having a particular fondness for tobacco and rum. Additionally, he is the loa of resurrection, and in the latter capacity he is often called upon for healing by those near or approaching death, as it is only the Baron that can accept an individual into the realm of the dead.[3][4]
Due to affiliation with François Duvalier, Baron Samedi is linked to secret societies in the Haitian government and includes them in his domain.[5]
Baron Samedi spends most of his time in the invisible realm of vodou spirits. He is notorious for his outrageous behavior, swearing continuously and making filthy jokes to the other spirits. He is married to another powerful spirit known as Maman Brigitte, but often chases after mortal women. He loves smoking and drinking and is rarely seen without a cigar in his mouth or a glass of rum in his bony fingers. Baron Samedi can usually be found at the crossroads between the worlds of death and the living. When someone dies, he digs their grave and greets their soul after they have been buried, leading them to the underworld”
So it’s not surprising they look alike.
“Baron Samedi is usually depicted with a top hat, black tail coat, dark glasses, and cotton plugs in the nostrils, as if to resemble a corpse dressed and prepared for burial in the Haitian style. He is frequently depicted as a skeleton (but sometimes as a black man that merely has his face painted as a skull), and speaks in a nasal voice. The former President-for-Life of Haiti, François Duvalier, known as Papa Doc, modeled his cult of personality on Baron Samedi; he was often seen speaking in a deep nasal tone and wearing dark glasses.[2]
He is noted for disruption, obscenity, debauchery, and having a particular fondness for tobacco and rum. Additionally, he is the loa of resurrection, and in the latter capacity he is often called upon for healing by those near or approaching death, as it is only the Baron that can accept an individual into the realm of the dead.[3][4]
Due to affiliation with François Duvalier, Baron Samedi is linked to secret societies in the Haitian government and includes them in his domain.[5]
Baron Samedi spends most of his time in the invisible realm of vodou spirits. He is notorious for his outrageous behavior, swearing continuously and making filthy jokes to the other spirits. He is married to another powerful spirit known as Maman Brigitte, but often chases after mortal women. He loves smoking and drinking and is rarely seen without a cigar in his mouth or a glass of rum in his bony fingers. Baron Samedi can usually be found at the crossroads between the worlds of death and the living. When someone dies, he digs their grave and greets their soul after they have been buried, leading them to the underworld”
So it’s not surprising they look alike.
Epcot81Fan
Well-Known Member
Like a giant tiara on a water tower in a swamp.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
For sure.
I don't have personal talks with Iger. I can only go by what I see. Iger was blunt about the status of SotS and pulled the trigger on the retheme. It would be odd if he didn't remove Facilier from the parks if TWDC though Facilier was problematic.
Disney had 3 years to phase out Facilier from significant rolls in WDW, and they haven't yet. Not thru #BLM, not thru the various DEI initiatives.
I haven't seen actual practitioners of Voodoo and its branches protest his presence in the parks. Probably because Disney's and Hollywood's version of Voodoo is as authentic as Santa Claus movies are to Christianity.
The very fact that Disney has Halloween parties that celebrate the darker side of Christian folklore should be a sign that Hollywood Voodoo will stick around as much as Hollywood witches.
Did you intend to quote me? I guess so. Hmm. I'm good either way. Would be nice to see Facilier in the attraction.
Tangentially. If he's being phased out elsewhere, he still hasn't at all in WDW.
True but we're talking WDW here. They're last to do (or get) anything. I could see it being a possibility even though I feel removal would be a great disservice to the Halloween events.
SpectreJordan
Well-Known Member
Are people who practice voodoo really that big of a group nowadays? Phasing out Facillier would be getting rid of one of the few, great black characters from Disney's animated movies.
He's also more of a slimy used car salesman instead of a stereotypical voodoo person. He uses voodoo because it's an easy way to trick people.
He's also more of a slimy used car salesman instead of a stereotypical voodoo person. He uses voodoo because it's an easy way to trick people.
Basil of Baker Street
Well-Known Member
He should turn people into Brer Rabbit, Fox and Bear
And that was the secret to Walt Disney's story telling.
TalkToEthan
Well-Known Member
Will this Bayou story have a conflict? An adversary? Without opposition or villain I think the storyline would bore us. We’re already working with an uninteresting backdrop for a ride(food/restaurant) so we best have some excitement by bringing in conflict.
Incomudro
Well-Known Member
The conflict is finding the missing ingredient.
I really hope there's a lot more to this ride than that, and some sort of scary or threatening element to overcome.
My fear is that they are going to make the whole thing light hearted.
I guess Splash was light hearted for the most part as well, but there may be a huge missed opportunity with this ride.
SteveAZee
Premium Member
Perhaps the villain is the supply chain?
MerlinTheGoat
Well-Known Member
The only villain here is Bob Iger i'm afraid.
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