Splash Mountain re-theme announced

[manmythlegend]

Well, that was my point, that there’s nothing in the ride that says that it’s in Georgia. People jump to that conclusion based off of the movie, but developers worked to make the location fit more with the Frontierland scheme. They’re a bunch of fictional animals, so they could have lived there. And Brer Roadrunner? I don’t have time to analyze all the animals, there may be some eastern ones too, but he was one that stood out to me as a sign of being in the west.

Yeah I agree.

 

[manmythlegend]

And if that sort of thing were confined to just this movie, that would be an acceptable answer. Except we keep seeing movies where some white person needs advice, and oh, there's a friendly African-American there to dispense some sage wisdom! The Legend Of Bagger Vance and The Green Mile being two notable relatively recent examples.

2 movies which I happen to love.

 

[M:SpilotISTC12]

I get Small World and TSI. Could you please explain the others?

Tiki Room portrays natives and colonialism. People say it in tweets here. AK and AKL, same reason why people hate Ringling Brothers and Seaworld. They hold animals captive. CoP because of not enough mention of women's rights and only portraying Sarah as only a house wife. Other threads on here have mentioned why but I'm trying to find the exact quotes but its too many pages. Monster's Inc singles out guests as "that guy" and poking fun at guests' expense.

You could also add Hoop De Doo and the Liberty Bell.

 

[celluloid]

And if that sort of thing were confined to just this movie, that would be an acceptable answer. Except we keep seeing movies where some white person needs advice, and oh, there's a friendly African-American there to dispense some sage wisdom! The Legend Of Bagger Vance and The Green Mile being two notable relatively recent examples.

And Mary Poppins!

Just because an old sage is sometimes black does not make it racist.
Just because a sage character is old does not make it an ageist concept.

Ray
Mama Odie..
People just love to complain. It is good to switch things around for variety, but just because you see a trope, does not make it hateful.

 

[Brer Oswald]

And if that sort of thing were confined to just this movie, that would be an acceptable answer. Except we keep seeing movies where some white person needs advice, and oh, there's a friendly African-American there to dispense some sage wisdom! The Legend Of Bagger Vance and The Green Mile being two notable relatively recent examples.

Except, SotS did it before it was a common trope. If anything, this trope was born out of the Uncle Remus character, of which no malice was intended. The stereotyping came after.

It’s funny how this is the new complaint against SotS. Because, all of the other points get refuted. And even when this one is refuted, another new complaint will come up, because people desperately want this film to be the most horrible piece of cinema Disney’s created.

 

[21stamps]

I am curious as to how Elsa wasn't quite right

She was almost right.. look, I was thrilled with Frozen.. seriously. I just thought the glam-up change was a bit too much, though I understand it.. and still nearly perfect female story, finally.

and the stomach churning parts of Carousel.

Really? Maybe that’s why you don’t understand my issues with Disney on Tiana’s almost-storyline.

Tiana did both. She got all that she wanted and became a well-rounded person. She only gave up when all was lost, and found what was good about the current situation. She reached her ambitions and got more.

She didn’t though. She gave up everything for a man- to live as a frog. It was second hand magic that got her out of it and fulfilled her dreams... it wasn’t her own character doing it.

 

[Matt_Black]

2 movies which I happen to love.

And that's fine. The latter is a brilliant story. That doesn't change the fact that it's built on many problematic tropes (and that's one that Steven King uses A LOT. See also- The Shining.)

 

[celluloid]

Except, SotS did it before it was a common trope. If anything, this trope was born out of the Uncle Remus character, of which no malice was intended. The stereotyping came after.

It’s funny how this is the new complaint against SotS. Because, all of the other points get refuted. And even when this one is refuted, another new complaint will come up, because people desperately want this film to be the most horrible piece of cinema Disney’s created.

Exactly.
Finding Racism in movies where the opposite message tends to be true is like the new "Illuminati Confirmed" from years back.
Let's focus on the hate in the world and getting rid of it. No racist groups love these works. They would detest them.

 

[Matt_Black]

Except, SotS did it before it was a common trope. If anything, this trope was born out of the Uncle Remus character, of which no malice was intended. The stereotyping came after.

It’s funny how this is the new complaint against SotS. Because, all of the other points get refuted. And even when this one is refuted, another new complaint will come up, because people desperately want this film to be the most horrible piece of cinema Disney’s created.

A) Not a new complaint. This has long been said about the film.
B) It wasn't all that uncommon before 1946. (Remember Gone With The Wind?)

 

[orlandogal22]

And that's fine. The latter is a brilliant story. That doesn't change the fact that it's built on many problematic tropes (and that's one that Steven King uses A LOT. See also- The Shining.)

Stephen King's books (and the language therein) - and the fact that he's deemed "OK" - are a great example of selective outrage / selective cancel culture.

 

[21stamps]

* Stephen King.

sorry guys, had to though.

 

[orlandogal22]

* Stephen King.

sorry guys, had to though.

Yep. My bad. Fixed it! Thanks!

(I'm getting sleepy. Ha! bc I gently corrected Phil's "Berry / Barry" earlier!)

 

[21stamps]

Yep. My bad. Fixed it! Thanks!

(I'm getting sleepy. Ha! bc I gently corrected Phil's "Berry / Barry" earlier!)

Happens to all of us!

 

[SilentWindODoom]

Well, that was my point, that there’s nothing in the ride that says that it’s in Georgia. People jump to that conclusion based off of the movie, but developers worked to make the location fit more with the Frontierland scheme. They’re a bunch of fictional animals, so they could have lived there. And Brer Roadrunner? I don’t have time to analyze all the animals, there may be some eastern ones too, but he was one that stood out to me as a sign of being in the west.

Bwahaha. I'd never heard of this and in looking it up found a thread from 2014 where someone asked if he was still on the ride. This led to someone asking why there's a roadrunner when the entire rest of the ride is Southeastern animals.

Seeing him in video, I always thought that was Mr. Bluebird.

Overall, I never found the ride to be anything that would be out of theme with the Southeast so I never thought of attempt being made to retheme it for Florida.

She was almost right.. look, I was thrilled with Frozen.. seriously. I just thought the glam-up change was a bit too much, though I understand it.. and still nearly perfect female story, finally.

Glam-up change? Do you mean for the Let It Go montage? I'm not sure specifically what you mean.

Really? Maybe that’s why you don’t understand my issues with Disney on Tiana’s almost-storyline.

Hehehehe. This is even vaguer. Listen, I don't know if you know this, but there's people taking exception with everything. If you're looking to be offended, you could find something wrong with everything. Therefore, it's nigh impossible to know exactly what you mean when you're critiquing Carousel.

She didn’t though. She gave up everything for a man- to live as a frog. It was second hand magic that got her out of it and fulfilled her dreams... it wasn’t her own character doing it.

They'd lost their chance. They would need to find a princess. What did you want them to do? Princess and the Frog II: Journey to a New World? There's not a whole lot of princesses in the entire hemisphere.

Unless you mean when she was tempted by Facilier. Are you criticizing her for refusing to fall for the villain's trick?

 

[Matt_Black]

Exactly.
Finding Racism in movies where the opposite message tends to be true is like the new "Illuminati Confirmed" from a years back.
Let's focus on hate and getting rid of it. No racist loves these works. They would detest them.

That's a very reductive, simplistic view of a remarkably complex social issue, to say the least.

Look at the Fenner Brothers from The Princess And The Frog. They liked Tiana, or at least the didn't actively dislike her. They were very polite and complimentary. But they still pulled the rug out from under her, and then they thought they were doing her a favor.

Not all racists are cackling Red Skull style villains. Racism can come in many insidious, seemingly innocuous forms.

 

[Father Robinson]

Tiki Room portrays natives and colonialism. People say it in tweets here. AK and AKL, same reason why people hate Ringling Brothers and Seaworld. They hold animals captive. CoP because of not enough mention of women's rights and only portraying Sarah as only a house wife. Other threads on here have mentioned why but I'm trying to find the exact quotes but its too many pages. Monster's Inc singles out guests as "that guy" and poking fun at guests' expense.

You could also add Hoop De Doo and the Liberty Bell.

Last scene has Sarah seeming to be a working mom.

 

[seabreezept813]

And I believe Eisner came up w/ the name for Splash Mountain.

I am NOT a fan of Iger. When I worked at Disney and Eisner was at our hotel, he came across as very personable, very down to earth - even picked up a small piece of trash that was on the floor and just kept on walking. No airs about him.

I think Eisner actually likes the product the company sold, which makes such a difference. He was also much more visible..despite not having been CEO for awhile his face comes to my mind much more clearly than the Bobs..

 

[celluloid]

That's a very reductive, simplistic view of a remarkably complex social issue, to say the least.

Look at the Fenner Brothers from The Princess And The Frog. They liked Tiana, or at least the didn't actively dislike her. They were very polite and complimentary. But they still pulled the rug out from under her, and then they thought they were doing her a favor.

Not all racists are cackling Red Skull style villains. Racism can come in many insidious, seemingly innocuous forms.

I never said hate equals extreme melodrama. Hate is intentional though. You have shifted arguments.
That is not racist just because of different colors. That is just called being a jerk to fellow humans. If you claim something is racist there needs to be evidence of a bias that one race is superior to another as a motive. It can't just be the deafult.

 

[Brer Panther]

Brer Fox's voice is very much like that of Eddie Murphy. Are Donkey from Shrek and Mushu from Mulan offensive stereotypes too?

And Brer Roadrunner? I don’t have time to analyze all the animals, there may be some eastern ones too, but he was one that stood out to me as a sign of being in the west.

For what it's worth, he's in the Disneyland version too. Dunno if that counts for anything, just thought I'd bring it up.

 

[celluloid]

I think Eisner actually likes the product the company sold, which makes such a difference. He was also much more visible..despite not having been CEO for awhile his face comes to my mind much more clearly than the Bobs..

If you read Eisner's book you will find the reasons that is. Very great stuff. He had a passion for show business. Imagineers loved pitching to him. Splash Mt was the first major theme park project he pushed forward when his son Brek looked at the model at Imagineering with Tony Baxter.