willtravel
Well-Known Member
No trans fat...
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Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts Tres
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choco choco
Well-Known Member
Strangely enough, the concept of the gargoyles was appropriately grown up for the film: they were a manifestation of Quasimodo's, hallucinations created by his mind to cope with the loneliness of his isolation. That's pretty creepy.
It's all in the execution, the concept isn't fundamentally different than using a candlestick, a mantle clock and teapot as comic relief, but Hunchback took it to postmodern humor and the slapstick that never landed.
.....
The opening of Hunchback is as close to opera as Disney has ever gone, and Hellfire had an almost Wagnerian intensity. It is magnificent.
Soarin' Over Pgh
Well-Known Member
No taste either.No trans fat...
Although the cardboard plate tray thing they come in was pretty good.
Taylor
Well-Known Member
The blank napkins taste better then the fries.
willtravel
Well-Known Member
What I don't understand is why Tortuga Tavern is seasonal? Or on my last trip it was only open for lunch. I like there food. And Columbia Harbor House. Better than Disney hamburgers IMO.
englanddg
One Little Spark...
I loved the opening. Didn't like the movie. I thought it was over the top and predictable (just like Pocahontas).
I completely get that people love these films (and they are extremely good with some amazing animation, music and themes)...so please, don't take my dislike as obstinate criticism. It's merely my opinion.
I think my primary issue with those two films is the shallow nature of the villains. Sure they were evil, but a great villain is also slightly sympathetic. You need to be able to relate to why they are the way they are, and their frustrations, to truly understand why they are evil...otherwise the conflict is just silly because you don't feel any investment in the conflict.
A shallow villain sometimes works. In a film like Mulan where the villain character really isn't key to the story at all outside of being "the ultimate threat", which helps explain they key character's motivations.
So, with Radcliffe, I feel like they were trying (too hard) to recreate the Jafar/Iago relationship. There was nothing relateable about Radcliffe. The same goes for Claude, though he is obviously a more deeply disturbed character...no effort was taken to explain why.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
Because Efficiency is the true first Key.
willtravel
Well-Known Member
Huh? You mean because it is the only restaurant that serves that kind of food?
Californian Elitist
Well-Known Member
Hunchback is one of Disney's best. The opening is amazing, the story is awesome and the soundtrack is one of the greatest I've ever heard. "The Bells of Notre Dame", "Out There", "God Help the Outcasts", "Hellfire", "Heaven's Light"... Legit. And Frollo is Disney's greatest villain. It's a shame its only representation in Disneyland is a music box.
Californian Elitist
Well-Known Member
Maybe they will make it to Oklahoma in my lifetime.
Doubt that haha.
lazyboy97o
Well-Known Member
Disney supposedly operates under the guidance of Four Keys: 1) Safety, 2) Courtesy, 3) Show and 4) Efficiency. They're supposed to be in that order, but practice is different. It is easier for Disney to have fewer facilities open and thus Efficiency is more important than the Courtesy or Show of having the facility open and available to guests.
willtravel
Well-Known Member
That sounds like political talk............. But I understand. Close something else.
Taylor
Well-Known Member
Since there building in Texas right now the next logical step is to go into Oklahoma am I right
and there is a lot of transplanted Okies in Cali so who knows.
Californian Elitist
Well-Known Member
Since there building in Texas right now the next logical step is to go into Oklahoma am I right
Yeah but they skipped the rest of the west coast states, Washington and Oregon. They also skipped New Mexico, Colorado, Idaho, Wyoming and Montana. They have no plans to build in any other states right now, just expand in the current states. I wish they'd build one in Downtown LA already, let alone Oklahoma. No offense.
HMF
Well-Known Member
Ratcliffe was basically just Disney's way of deflecting having to explain mass-European xenophobia of the natives. Basically saying that one guy was the cause of tensions between the Europeans and Natives since obviously a serious comment about how European Manifest Destiny and how it literally all but destroyed the native culture would supposedly offend the Euro-Centric sensibilities that is taught to Grade -School kids these days.
Taylor
Well-Known Member
None taken.
HMF
Well-Known Member
Regarding Frollo, In the original novel He is the Pastor of Notre Dame Cathedral and is a somewhat more sympathetic character. In the Disney adaptation he was made a judge probably to prevent backlash from certain Religious groups (Who they were already on thin ice with because of the supposed subliminal messages inserted into Little Mermaid, Aladdin and Lion King). That said it is quite amazing that they kept as much of the religious aspects of Frollo's character as they did. I honestly don't think a film like Hunchback could be made (at least not by Disney) today since commenting on organized religion in any film (Especially, a "Family film") is considered taboo.
choco choco
Well-Known Member
OOOOOOooooohhhhhh, let me go first.
To start with, that show was bugnuts insane. It was held in the Festival arena, a circular expanse of concrete shoved way in the back of Disneyland and ringed by the trees of Frontierland. Even to this day, the place feels like you've stumbled into a clearing in the forest.
Into this clearing, they built what felt like an entire medieval village. The show was a theater in the round, so while there was a stage at the center, the rest of the set surrounded the seating area. The audience was let into this area and sat on the ground, so that the stages and platforms towered over and wrapped around the audience, and together with the trees this was so enveloping that it really felt like being in some ancient, old provincial town.
And the set, Oh that set! It was the most elaborate, three-level wooden set you can imagine. It looked all rickety and the railings were all jagged and there were platforms and landings that jutted out all over and all manner of ladders and hooks and twisty staircases to get up and down it. There were ropes criss-crossing where Quasimodo would swing to and fro. There was a magnificent bell that hung over everything that would ring during the title song.
Then the "festival" would start, and it seriously was just bedlam. The set filled to the brim with performers, so that everywhere your head swiveled there was something to look at. There would be performers on one side wearing goofy masks doing some magic tricks and squires in clothes with bright patches waving flags all about and Frollo in black to one side glowering and Phoebus on the other side pacing back and forth and and more crazy jesters doing flips down the aisles and wenches hanging on the railings waving handkerchiefs and Quasimodo up above swinging his way about and Esmeralda down below doing her dance and Clopin in the middle orchestrating it all.
All was bustle and apparently carefully orchestrated confusion and before you even had time to see it all or cheer the latest crazy brightly colored parading paper head, somehow all the characters have gotten to the top of the set and Frollo falls to his death and Quasimodo's won but he doesn't get the girl and "huzzah!" the confetti falls and the bell is swinging, and the colors are going crazy and every festival attendee is doing something or other and Clopin hits that crazy note at the end of "Bells" and show's over and everybody's cheering like crazy.
And despite the Festival arena still emptily sitting there, Disney never tried a show like this ever again.
englanddg
One Little Spark...
Yes, and he was obviously so (in my eyes). Which is what made him a shallow character to me. He was made to represent a group of people and ideas, rather than being an individual character with ideas and motivations of his own, that, while we as the audience may disagree with his actions, we at our core understand or at least relate to his reasons.
But, he was just a shallow character. A selfish, ignorant bigot. No relation at all. As I mentioned before, this works in certain stories where you need an overarching villain which merely presents a "threat", but that story arch requires that the primary characters don't interact too much with the villain outside of the "struggle" to work (take 101 Dalmatians, Rescuers or, as I mentioned before, Mulan)...
A shallow villain works in all those stories because the villain isn't REALLY part of the story, they merely exist to provide context and motivation for the heros and lead characters of the story...
Could a shallow Ratcliffe work? Sure...but only if they'd spent a LOT less time on him and his interactions.
Also, a true commentary on the colonization of the Americas wouldn't be so politically shallow as to imply that the "pale skins" didn't have Indian allies. The French, for example, had a whole war against the British colonies, relying on Indian partnerships, intelligence and troops.
It's a gross oversimplification of the situation and the motives, and with that I agree with your "grade-school" comment. With that character alone, and the oversimplification (and frankly poor representation) of American Indian culture, the movie talks down to the audience, and does little more than entertain...at the same level a straight to DVD movie does.
The inclusion of the mystical "tree of life" in this otherwise historical (not mythical) context furthers the bad storytelling arc that is this movie, to me.
It is by far my least favorite major Disney movie...if you can't tell. I was so excited to see it (after having seen the production cels being done at MGM at the time)...
Oddly, I thought the straight to DVD Pocahontas II was actually a better written plot structure.
alissafalco
Well-Known Member
Oh that reminds me, did you see an episode of "my crazy obsession" on TLC about this mental case who is obsessed with Disney? She makes her husband move to celebration, and they showed her house and her walls and floor are covered with Mickey plush.
http://leighcavanaugh.wordpress.com/2012/04/17/tlc-disney-obsession/
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