Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts IV

[artvandelay]

Of. Course they are.

Problem #1 with DVCers: they are starting to use their units as true vacation homes and not go go WDW parks and not dine in WDW restaurants. Oh, and they are visiting other area attractions.

Problem #2 with DVCers: many are opting to NOT even use the points at WDW at all.

#1 Going to Kidani Village on Friday and not going to the parks at all (well maybe Sunday night at MK, but with free passs)

#2 currently staying at Hilton Head resort. A great resort in an awesome town. Plan on coming back here in the future.

 

[RSoxNo1]

Oh, yes...

And all the little doo-dads they are selling to decorate the bands? Ugh. They are gonna do their damnedest to make the bands the new pins.

Shoot me now.

None of which are watch faces. Just once I want to see them sell a tchotchke that serves a fricken purpose. I left the below comment on Jim's site:

Jim,

You know my thoughts on this. I really think the biggest headache here is the advanced booking. It is wholly unnecessary. The best of both worlds would be to limit advanced bookings to one per guest per day for DVC, Resort Guests and Annual Passholders. Day of Fastpass distribution would remain under the current rules, but if they want to allow guests access to book via their smart phone that's a plus.

This is going to be a harder sell to the public than Mars Needs Moms, John Carter and The Lone Ranger. Without changes, I don't see any way this can succeed in it's current format.

Tim

 

[71jason]

I did see some of this, too, but you see it at WDW as well with Annual Passholders, off duty CM's, and such. I did at least get a sense that overall, the DLR crowds at least appreciate and understand everything a bit more than your typical WDW guest.

I definitely saw a lot less of:
- disgruntled parents pushing their entitled children around in huge strollers; strollers in general
- "too young to really appreciate it" kids in general
- as wdw1974 would say, "Honey Boo Boo families"
- massively overweight people in ECVs
- "Eurotrash"
- no South American tour groups to be found

I was honestly expecting essentially the same clientele at DLR as WDW, so I don't think the fact that I noticed this was some sort of confirmation bias influenced from looking forward to seeing the differences between DLR and WDW. It stood out to me without looking for it.

Yeah, the two big things I noticed in April were the size of MSUSA/Castle (tiny), and the make-up of the clientele. Men in polos, women in sundresses, for the most part well-behaved children. And yeah, few double-wide strollers and maybe one ECV. It feels like a different crowd--more Winter Park than Disney World.

 

[alphac2005]

The key to WDW is even if you stay there a month you cannot do or see everything and both the guides i mentioned both emphatically state if the kidlets want to ride Dumbo 10 times LET THEM. The key is creating happy memories. Last year saw an uber planner family right down to color coded laminated cards with schedules. This family especially the kids looked more miserable each time we saw them. They may have DONE everything but they probably enjoyed NOTHING.

Disney is best explored spontaneously, I liked FP as we could grab one for something special we wanted to do day of yes it meant getting into park early - not at rope drop but early perhaps an hour after rope drop to get the FP for say TSMM. Choosing parks has generally been a 'Day Of' thing since the DDP crowd has sucked the life out of ADR's Being DVC we eat in room a lot and now only get a few Disney meals because the preplaning is a hassle. ADR's should go back to 'Day Of' walk up or concierge

WDW has become the mall Santa. American parents buying into this premise that they must go and do certain things to make their kid's childhood perfect. The end product is screaming kids in line, miserable parents, and a horrible time by all. Forcing and scheduling "memories" isn't how you create exciting and lifelong moments.

 

[englanddg]

WDW has become the mall Santa. American parents buying into this premise that they must go and do certain things to make their kid's childhood perfect. The end product is screaming kids in line, miserable parents, and a horrible time by all. Forcing and scheduling "memories" isn't how you create exciting and lifelong moments.

I haven't forced my kid into anything, and my parents didn't "force" me into Disney either.

 

[Clever Name]

WDW has become the mall Santa. American parents buying into this premise that they must go and do certain things to make their kid's childhood perfect. The end product is screaming kids in line, miserable parents, and a horrible time by all. Forcing and scheduling "memories" isn't how you create exciting and lifelong moments.

Forcing children to do new things is good for them. Taking them to WDW and forcing them to go to church and become believers is all part of good parenting.

 

[nytimez]

I haven't forced my kid into anything, and my parents didn't "force" me into Disney either.

But if you've spent any time people-watching at WDW you probably know exactly what @alphac2005 was referring to.

I know I've seen it.

Even worse are the folks who heard that if you say/do this or that, then some other thing is "supposed to" happen.

So much for spontaneity.

 

[englanddg]

Forcing children to do new things is good for them. Taking them to WDW and forcing them to go to church and become believers is all part of good parenting.

True. If my parent hadn't "forced" me into Red Cross Swimming certifications or Boy Scouts, I would just be some fat dude sitting my mom's basement right now.

 

[alphac2005]

I haven't forced my kid into anything, and my parents didn't "force" me into Disney either.

Look around most places that cater to families and kids and you will find that generally they do these activities because society basically tells them they should, it's what you have to do if you are a good parent, etc. It's not a blanket statement about everyone (so you shouldn't need to be offended), rather a general statement of how we live in a society of manufacturing moments instead of letting them happen spontaneously.

 

[alphac2005]

Forcing children to do new things is good for them. Taking them to WDW and forcing them to go to church and become believers is all part of good parenting.

You're misinterpreting what I said. See below.

 

[englanddg]

Look around most places that cater to families and kids and you will find that generally they do these activities because society basically tells them they should, it's what you have to do it you are a good parent, etc. It's not a blanket statement about everyone (so you shouldn't need to be offended), rather a general statement of how we live in a society of manufacturing moments instead of letting them happen spontaneously.

This is a highly cynical viewpoint, and one that is frankly false. Not all kids go to Disney, and not all parents take them to it.

Your assertion is just...false.

For every parent who thinks they should take their kid to Disney to be a good parent, there is another parent who thinks they should teach their kid to hunt, or that they should go to Six Flags, or Dollywood, or Mt. Rushmore.

To imply that Disney is somehow a national "rite of passage" is just silly.

And, on not one of my Disney trips has there been a "manufactured moment"...

Heck, this past trip we didn't even spend more than 3 hours at Hollywood Studios, because we didn't care to.

I think I see your point, that there are parents who try and "force" a good time upon their kids. But, in reality, I just don't think it is all that common.

 

[alphac2005]

This is a highly cynical viewpoint, and one that is frankly false. Not all kids go to Disney, and not all parents take them to it.

Your assertion is just...false.

For every parent who thinks they should take their kid to Disney to be a good parent, there is another parent who thinks they should teach their kid to hunt, or that they should go to Six Flags, or Dollywood, or Mt. Rushmore.

To imply that Disney is somehow a national "rite of passage" is just silly.

And, on not one of my Disney trips has there been a "manufactured moment"...

Heck, this past trip we didn't even spend more than 3 hours at Hollywood Studios, because we didn't care to.

I think I see your point, that there are parents who try and "force" a good time upon their kids. But, in reality, I just don't think it is all that common.

Really? Cynical, um, well, how about a tad bit more realistic? You don't see the endless stream of miserable people at WDW and their forced vacation memories ?

That's laughable. Where I live, it's a virtual rite of passage for all of these spoiled little brats and I've spoken to many parents and it is the same story over and over.

How do you make this giant leap from an analogy to some view that this is a blanket statement about all families? Analogy. Common sense from the get go because many don't celebrate a holiday with Santa and wouldn't hit up the mall Santa just like not every family is going to WDW.

 

[flynnibus]

For sure, a less hectic schedule and lighter crowds would have done wonders. Obviously I am high-lightening all the flaws because I want to see improvement. Nor did I have a "bad time", but when measured against the Asian parks it's easy to start becoming hyper critical.

Still DLP is > all the WDW parks in its current form, but I am afraid it is sliding faster and maybe (somewhat foolishly) think the future is brighter for WDW.

I think the issue is dlp had gotten so bad... Then they finally started dumping money into fixing things and added dreams... But the park's fortunes didn't really improve (economic climate. Is a huge part of it) so they've gone right back to their old wAys. Why spend the money if it doesn't bring in more revenue... Type of thinking. Add to that the debt concerns and being in the red and you can see how they easily stopped investing in clean up again

 

[englanddg]

Really? Cynical, um, well, how about a tad bit more realistic? You don't see the endless stream of miserable people at WDW and their forced vacation memories ?

That's laughable. Where I live, it's a virtual rite of passage for all of these spoiled little brats and I've spoken to many parents and it is the same story over and over.

How do you make this giant leap from an analogy to some view that this is a blanket statement about all families? Analogy. Common sense from the get go because many don't celebrate a holiday with Santa and wouldn't hit up the mall Santa just like not every family is going to WDW.

Well, those spoiled little brats are not your kids, are they? And, it's not your dollars that are spent on Disney, are they?

You may see it as a waste of money on those spoiled little brats, and that is your right to see it as such.

But, that is hardly a solid stance to take for a debate. It's a purely subjective (and highly questionable) observation.

So, what exactly is your point?

 

[flynnibus]

Yeah, the two big things I noticed in April were the size of MSUSA/Castle (tiny), and the make-up of the clientele. Men in polos, women in sundresses, for the most part well-behaved children. And yeah, few double-wide strollers and maybe one ECV. It feels like a different crowd--more Winter Park than Disney World.

Did you enter a time vortex on your trip?

I think what stands out in the dlr demographic (IMHO) is the number of teens and 20 something's there with just friends. And how much people wear the Disney merch... And not just a mismatched tshirt.

Add in the goths, tatoos, and little kids with Mohawks... The general SoCal style very visible in the parks. While o-town doesn't have any discernible style

 

[flynnibus]

True. If my parent hadn't "forced" me into Red Cross Swimming certifications or Boy Scouts, I would just be some fat dude sitting my mom's basement right now.

But now you have badges your mom hangs in the living room upstairs!

 

[englanddg]

But now you have badges your mom hangs in the living room upstairs!

Personally, I like that display!

You should see how cool my First Aid merit badge looks above the TV stand!

 

[Tom Morrow]

I think what stands out in the dlr demographic (IMHO) is the number of teens and 20 something's there with just friends.

This too. The only late teens/20 somethings you see at WDW are often just Cast Members.

Another thing I noted about the crowds at DLR, and I realize that having only spent a few days there ever I could be wrong, but more of the crowds seemed completely content with just "hanging out" and doing whatever came up, whereas at WDW, most people are on or trying to be on a strict schedule and are stressed out, trying to get everything in.

 

[TalkingHead]

To imply that Disney is somehow a national "rite of passage" is just silly.

Come on, really? Many (most?) young children want to take a trip to Disney World. It's a rite of passage that many parents indulge their children in. I don't know how you could argue, culturally speaking, it isn't perceived to be a rite of passage.

 

[TalkingHead]

Look around most places that cater to families and kids and you will find that generally they do these activities because society basically tells them they should, it's what you have to do if you are a good parent, etc. It's not a blanket statement about everyone (so you shouldn't need to be offended), rather a general statement of how we live in a society of manufacturing moments instead of letting them happen spontaneously.

Anytime you set foot on Disney property, you're bombarded with manufactured moments. Not that that is inherently bad, but -- yes -- taken to an extreme, it would seem to be.