Spirited News, Observations & Thoughts IV

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Soarin' Over Pgh

Well-Known Member
There is another way to reduce wait times. That is to not do anything (something that they are extremely good at) and eventually the crowds will thin out and go someplace else. And without any additional expense. It's a no brainer! :banghead:


The whole situation takes me back to the late 70's, early 80's. People were sent out from financial institutions to explain a new idea to the huddled masses longing to be free of the shackles of financial dependency. This new idea was going to replace the old pension system that relied on the health of the company to be able to pay off. Also, if you left you basically lost your built up pension. No transferability.

This new thing was called, strangely, a 401K. We were all promised that if we were in our 30's and we put in $35.00 per week in this plan, by the time we retired we would all be Millionaires and our life would be set. They had all the numbers set up to prove that point. If it weren't for a couple of things they would have been correct. The biggest one was that during that time-span Money Markets were paying upwards of 20% for deposits and all the number were based on investments in Money Markets. That alone obviously fell apart rather quickly and to make matters worse, had it actually made millionaires out of all of us the affect on inflation, that would be created by that, would have rendered a loaf of bread to a cost of about $500.00. However, it all sounded great and most people bought into it immediately. At least those that had the available cash that wasn't tied up in commodities (aka..groceries for the family). Now that is not to say that this plan didn't have some positive aspects especially when companies started to match funds as a tax free benefit. It just didn't manage to deliver what was promised. I suspect that this will be the fate of NextGen.

I suspect that management at Disney was razzel-dazzeled by someone selling them on an incredible sounding bill of goods. Something that didn't even exist yet except in the mind of someone, but with the ability to convince them that this would all work, electronically as well as psychologically on the easily duped guest. Looked good on paper and with the confidence usually reserved for high school seniors facing the world outside, they bought it. The rest is soon to be history. A very expensive lesson that once again proves that in order to be a high paid executive you do not necessarily have to be smarter then a bucket of rocks. Which, BTW, is an insult to rocks everywhere. And there you have it, Goofyernmost's theory on the birth of NGE.


This is genius.
 

luv

Well-Known Member
I think I, personally, would prefer to have kept Jaws and Amity instead of more Potter. But I have to see how it goes.

I didn't mind Kong or BTTF, since we got to keep the DeLorean. I have never understood how anyone could prefer BTTF, good as it was, to the Simpsons.
 

Ignohippo

Well-Known Member
It is easy to see why Comcast is spending so much money in the Parks. Comcast saw what Harry Potter did for IOA at a time that WDW is under terrible management.

Yes, I called TDO terrible Management for a reason. Problems at WDW started either at Enchanted Tiki Room under new management or under the first replacement of Imagination. TDO has no problems adding restaurants and DVC's, but they don't like to Spend money on attractions without Burbank forcing them to.

Here is 6 examples of bad management by TDO:

1.) AK having no new attractions after Expedition Everest and nothing announced from Everest opening in 2006 to Avatar announced in 2011. That is a big problem for a park that was only 8 years old in 2006 with a lot of land.

2.) The handling of the Imagination Pavilion since the original Imagination was closed.

3.) TDO didn't green lit Monster Inc. Door Coaster in 2008 because it was too "expensive" for them, but has no problems spending 3 billion dollars and more on Nextgen currently. That meant TDO hurt DHS long term.

4.) The Handling of Downtown Disney. Pleasure Island was closed in 2008 and Hyperion Warf was announced. Hyperion Warf was canceled due to factors like not able to find venders. almost 5 years after Pleasure Island was closed, Disney Springs was announced. The fact it took 5 years to put stuff in an area that was closed proved that is was a sign of poor management.

5.) TDO not doing anything to fix major problems at DHS before this year. Backlot Tour has been a problem for a very long time. Fantasmic didn't get any upgrades unlike the Disneyland version due to cost. There also is TDO not addressing attractions that need to be updated like the Great Movie Ride also.

6.) The handling of Future World in Epcot. Universe of Energy is an aging attraction, Innoventions is much worse compare to 15 years ago,Imagination is a mess, but TDO has no problems of adding food places in World Showcase.

Oh, there are SO many I could add, but just off the top of my head:
• Captian EO
• Backlot Tour
• HISTK playground
• CircusLand
• No Toon Town
• Regardless of the MI Coaster never being greenlit, the idea that Soundstage One has remained closed all this time while the attraction next to it generally has an 80-minute wait time is disgusting. The lack of attractions at DHS is a joke, too.

And as for another one of your comments (but not to single you out), we've seen RUMORS of new things coming to DHS. People keep writing as though the redo of DHS is imminent. It hasn't been announced yet folks. Haven't you learned anything yet?

I think people are WAY too optimistic that these things are coming – especially after hearing that Avatar has been delayed only due to cost overruns with NextGen (which has nothing to do with park expansion and shouldn't even come out of the same budget).

Heck, even though demo has started at Disney Springs, there are rumors that even that project has been downsized.

TDO doesn't have a very good track record so, while I am optimistic and expect these things to happen, I'm VERY guarded in my optimism. Hyperion Wharf ended up just being seed & mulch after all.
 

Funmeister

Well-Known Member
If I had to guess...Star Wars Land is first to be completed around the end of 2015...Carsland second and Avatar pushed back behind those two around 2018 or 2020? Just speculation...
 

SirOinksALot

Active Member
Simply not true, some venues yes, but not all of them

Edit- agreed no reason to hash out this debate again, what's done is done.
I think the best thing about this forum is watching Tim_4 be right all the time.

And Lee, PI's actually healthier today than your glory days you keep referencing, just different and needing some plussing. You can't just throw cover on places and think you'll make more money. I'm sorry you lost your Duster haven, but life goes on.
 
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Hobnail Boot

Well-Known Member
If I had to guess...Star Wars Land is first to be completed around the end of 2015...Carsland second and Avatar pushed back behind those two around 2018 or 2020? Just speculation...
It's taken Disney going on 2 years to build the Seven Dwarves mine train...and it's still not open. As nice as it would be, there's no way they get SW Land done by 2015.
 

Pentacat

Well-Known Member
If I had to guess...Star Wars Land is first to be completed around the end of 2015...Carsland second and Avatar pushed back behind those two around 2018 or 2020? Just speculation...

Look at the FLE construction timelines and the results....It took more than two years to build one restaurant and a D ticket omnimover. No way anything of consequence opens in 2015.

Meanwhile Universal took Transformers from ground to open in Orlando in 11 months. Even for a cloned ride that's fast.
 

Atomicmickey

Well-Known Member
Look at the FLE construction timelines and the results....It took more than two years to build one restaurant and a D ticket omnimover. No way anything of consequence opens in 2015.

Meanwhile Universal took Transformers from ground to open in Orlando in 11 months. Even for a cloned ride that's fast.

I think we're just seeing capital expenses being spread thinly.
Right? NGE spending means they can't staff a construction project to complete things quickly.
They can only spend 'so much' per year. I have to believe they could build anything more
quickly. I'm sure some of the same construction workers work at Uni and Disney. They could
do it. I think it's all about budget.
 

Lee

Adventurer
I have never understood how anyone could prefer BTTF, good as it was, to the Simpsons.
Easy. Some folks, such as myself, are not fans of the Simpsons. I much prefer the BTTF version of the ride, by a mile.
And Lee, PI's actually healthier today than your glory days you keep referencing, just different and needing some plussing.
Well, yeah...if by "healthier" you mean devoid of any life, or (dare I say it...) magic.

You can't just throw cover on places and think you'll make more money.
Actually, I don't see how that can be true. Charge $20 per person to get in the door...boom. more money.

I'm sorry you lost your Duster haven, but life goes on.
Though I'm far from a "Duster" it was a bit of a haven for me. Disney hasn't matched it before or since, IMNSHO.
Life goes on, indeed. Just a little less...magical.

SW in 2015? No chance.
On that... we agree. Had to happen eventually.
 

SirOinksALot

Active Member
Actually, I don't see how that can be true. Charge $20 per person to get in the door...boom. more money.
Ha. Right. Charge $20 and you lose 90% of your traffic. You would pay $20 to get in, but your $20 doesn't make up for the nine drinks that don't get sold. Look how long Universal charged for FL Resident parking after 6. It nuked Citywalk for a few months.

But Lee, that's why you don't make the decisions. WDW would have burned up in 1992 if you were in charge.
 

bubbles1812

Well-Known Member
If I had to guess...Star Wars Land is first to be completed around the end of 2015...Carsland second and Avatar pushed back behind those two around 2018 or 2020? Just speculation...
It's already over half way thru 2013... And we know there hasn't been anything greenlit in DHD beyond that they have seemed to have decided they will eventually green light something. But we know that debate continues. I can't even see them breaking ground until next year even if they greenlit something tomorrow. And in theory an E ticket is coming in Star Wars land. Given that it is taking 2+ years to build a D ticket at best mine coaster, I don't see how they could pull off an entire land much less even that one theoretical E ticket ride by late 2015.

I mean they could get it done... If they didnt build at the speed of snail. But they do. And they seem to like it that way.

I do agree Avatar won't be seen before the end of the decade or at least near it. And who knows what Universal will have churned out by then.
 

jensenrick

Well-Known Member
Disney World is going to get plenty of "rides" in the future... trust me on this... they are building a foundation for the future of the WDW theme parks

The WDW theme park were already on a solid foundation, with plenty of room to grow- but now they are tearing up that foundation, to build on the shifting sands of smartphone apps and fastpasses made two months out.

I know plenty of "casual" WDW visitors at work too, since my hometown is just a 2 1/2 hour drive to O-town, and they think of my as the "Disney" info guy at work (although I've been saying lately that I prefer to be known as "Orlando" info guy) and 99% of the "casual" visitors I've talked to about NGE have had reactions ranging from the simple "I don't want to do that" to the strident "I hate that idea." No one I know, casual or rabid Disney geek, is eagerly anticipating NGE. I can't see how it's can be anything but a hindrance to "fun," which was is the reason you go to WDW, right?
 
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