Spirited News & Observations II -- NGE/Baxter

Genie of the Lamp

Well-Known Member
I see on the Orlando Informer site, they talked about how on SWW, we may hear an announcement that Indiana Jones Stunt Spectacular will be leaving as the Studios plans on using that area, and nearby parking lot space outside the park, to create an expanded area focusing on the Star Wars brand.

Also, they say on their that a IOA lagoon show may be coming and it will feature a 7th island that would rise out of the lagoon and wreck havoc. They say this will be a nighttime show/spectacle and will be very different from Cinematic Spectacular (mention Uni Creative wants to avoid using water screens in this show). This Spirited Uni news can't come soon enough.
http://www.orlandoinformer.com/2013/rumor-round-up-for-april-5-universal-orlando-walt-disney-world/

Edit: As for the DL projects, I'm interested with the Tron thrill ride TDA/WDI come up with thier in Tomorrow land. DIS stock is at $59.14 after today's closing. Seaworld ups IPO to $500 million.
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
*sigh*
Clearly, my example was for illustrative purposes only. I certainly didn't bother to do any research on the damn thing, nor di I expect anyone to subject it to such scrutiny. Thanks!

And the idea of PR not working for media has always been part of the discussion, just one that has been overshadowed.

Its impossible to explain right and wrong to people who simply don't get it and dont have those values. Dont sweat it.
 

Hakunamatata

Le Meh
Premium Member
Would it be ok for me to put on a resume that I was the President of the US when all I did was work for the Dept of Agriculture....I mean it is all part of the government.
 

MattM

Well-Known Member
Well, to be fair, you have no understanding of right and wrong.

Trying to explain to you the difference between a respectful dialogue and arguing would be pointless and a waste of time.
I thought you weren't going to "feed it." I knew you would. Like a moth to a flame.

But I like how a random guy on the internet makes sweeping character judgement because I dont have a problem with someone saying they worked for the New York Times Company when they worked for the New York Times Company. Frankly, sounds like someone may be a bit jealous that they didnt/dont work for the New York Times Company.
 

Fe Maiden

Well-Known Member
Let me poke a couple of holes in your argument:

1. Look what appears right atop the Jackson Generals' website:

wdwm.jpg
2. Let's take an example of current General's 2nd Baseman Jack Marder. Now, he is in the Mariner's minor league organization right now. Would he be wrong to say that he plays for the Mariners? I don't know, let's take a look how many media outlets reported on it per their journalists.​
As you can tell, the journalists who wrote these articles, who are held to the highest ethical standards, claim that he was in fact drafted by the MLB club the Seattle Mariners, not any of their MILB affiliates.​
What gives?​
Now, if the narrative seems to be changing from "working for the NYTCo is a lie" to "you shouldnt be a PR hack for a company and work for the NYTCo," that is something I can get behind.​


I hesitate continuing this any further but this has to be one of the flimsiest arguments I've seen.

In both those instances you referenced not once did they say he plays for or has ever played for the Mariners. Was he drafted? Sure and that's all those reporters reported on.

To answer your question, would he be wrong to say that he plays for the Mariners? Obviously. Look at his stats direct from MLB. Even if you squint I don't think you can find a mention of the Mariners included in his yearly stats.

http://mlb.mlb.com/team/player.jsp?...Type=career&statType=1&season=2013&level='ALL'
 

MattM

Well-Known Member
I hesitate continuing this any further but this has to be one of the flimsiest arguments I've seen.

In both those instances you referenced not once did they say he plays for or has ever played for the Mariners. Was he drafted? Sure and that's all those reporters reported on.

To answer your question, would he be wrong to say that he plays for the Mariners? Obviously. Look at his stats direct from MLB. Even if you squint I don't think you can find a mention of the Mariners included in his yearly stats.

http://mlb.mlb.com/team/player.jsp?...Type=career&statType=1&season=2013&level='ALL'

You're right, he doesn't play for the Mariners. He works for a subsidiary of the Mariners (or in baseball speak, minor leagues). He was drafted (hired) by the Mariners; the parent company. Just like JFB doesn't write for the New York Times, part of the New York Times Company. She writes for the New York Times Company.

To see my literal point: check out the Atlanta Braves minor league system. By your argument, they do work for the Braves, no?

http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/mlb/minorleagues/affiliates/index.jsp?c_id=atl

Thanks for helping me clear that up!

And I dont think you've been around many arguments if that's the flimsiest you've ever seen. But maybe you were just adding dramatic flare ;)
 

flynnibus

Premium Member
I'm aware of that...however, non-exempt employees are required by law to be paid for all time worked. So it MUST be rounded up, because employees must be paid for ALL time that they work. If the employer only pays in increments, then they will need to eat the additional amount of time since this is their policy.

I'm sorry - you're simply wrong here and your position makes it clear you have limited or zero experience with these hourly workers.

If your employee is scheduled to 9pm, and they clock out at 9:01.. or even 9:05.. you don't have to pay them for those minutes after 9:00pm. Their hours are rounded down to the 9:00 time. This is not illegal. All time is rounded for obvious reasons. 1) simplicity 2) to avoid abuse of the timeclock 3) to allow flexibility in the real world 4) The practical nature not everyone can use the time clock simultaneously.

That time 'disappears' - it does not add-up incrementally over the pay period. Employers are not required to round up all fractions - you round to the nearest. That means there are periods where you 'work' beyond the hour and don't get paid. That's real world and no it's not illegal. The employee also benefits the inverse when they clock out a few minutes early on the clock.

Rounding is allowed under the spirit that employees in the 'net' will still get paid for all their time worked. With the assumption that the buffer works both in + and - before the hour. Shorter increments are preferable so you have a stronger case as an employer that the employees are actually compensated for all their worked time.
Employers with hourly workers who clock in and out tend to have very strict policies in place here to ensure employees are able to clock out within the window of give for their scheduled time to avoid having labor budget leak haphazard while simultaneously trying to get employees to work their full shift and not 'clock watch'.

You're wrong. As you stated, they are telling them to "round down," which means they will not get paid for any overtime they worked that is under 15 minutes (I'm going to assume the pay OT in 30 minute increments, since that was the example the memo used). As I said above, the law requires any non-exempt employee (which if you are paid hourly, you are) to be paid for ALL time that is worked.

Wrong. The suggestion was clearly to not claim OT worked if it falls under 15 minutes . That's illegal. The law requires an employer to pay their employees for OT. Employers are not allowed to tell employees not to report time. Wal-Mart is constantly getting in trouble for that behavior.

They are not telling them to not report time - they are telling them to not extend their working time to the point of requiring overtime. That is not illegal! Telling your employee to 'go home' and stop working to avoid overtime IS NOT ILLEGAL. Reporting 9:00 instead of 9:07 means NOTHING if you are paper logging your hours and 7 minutes is under the rounding point. You're not even required to log exact times - only hours. But most employers require finer detail to ensure the backing material is there behind the hours logged to defend claims.

Being past the hour triggers the requirement of the employer to pay OT. They are free to fire employees who frequently do this, but they still have to pay for the overtime.

No - working past the hour on the clock does NOT trigger OT - working to the time increment that rounds to the fraction of the hour would require being paid for that time. Don't confuse the issue of 'authorized' time vs the subject on hand here which is rounding of time logged to a fractional hour.

On the subject of authorized time, this type of letter is actually beneficial to make it clear to employees the employer's intention for how much work they want scheduled because it's obvious in this situation the employees are lacking an in person manager to specifically release them from their shift. These appear to be independent workers assigned to complete a task.. and the employer is telling them how to balance the importance of getting the task DONE vs the time on the clock. The employer is telling them to delay work rather than push into overtime.

The issue of 'authorized' time is that the employer must pay for hours worked even if the employer did not authorize them - so such a letter is not grounds to not pay people who actually logged more hours.. but would be basis for further disciplinary action with the employee if necessary if the employee were to continue to work in excess of their scheduled time. The employee is being notified of how the employer expects them to terminate their shifts and STOP WORKING.

That may have been the intended spirit of the memo, but as far the OT statements, they're telling people explicitly not to claim it if under a certain amount of time...which IS illegal.

No - they are telling them to not work past the the time that would require an additional increment of pay. You clearly are not familiar with the standard (and legal) practice of how fractional hours are rounded UP and DOWN - and are misunderstanding that to mean they are telling them to MISREPRESENT YOUR TIME - which is not what the memo is talking about.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
I don't see what you are getting at.
You seem to be saying that 74, and perhaps PhotoDave, were in some way lying in their characterizations of Blondie's resume.
How do you get that?
Because they repeatedly stated that she claimed to have worked for The New York Times despite knowing that she only worked for the Ledger and claimed only to have worked for The New York Times Company. She is implying it, not stating it and stating it is what she is being attacked for the most. That is their lie.

She stated that she worked as a correspondent for the NYTC, in a clear attempt to mislead casual readers that she had in fact done work for The Times.

74 and Dave called her on it, saying in effect that she was claiming to work for The Times.

It would be a great stretch to characterize their statements as untrue, as they are accurately portraying her intent. Did she SAY "I write for The New York Times"? No. She implied it. Close enough.

Jumping on them and claiming "exaggeration" is just looking for an argument. We all know what they meant.
No, we do not all know what they meant because they kept using The New York Times and The New York Times Company interchangeably. You were also just shown examples IN journalism where referencing the parent organization is not uncommon or considered an ethical breach. Instead of showing the fluff and explaining how that is not only not common practice, but highly frowned upon, the implication was taken and repeated as a statement with those asking about the common practice being attacked. "The way she says this makes it sound like she wrote for The New York Times" is a very different and far more accurate statement than "She says she wrote for The New York Times." It does not matter that the latter is what she wants people to think, it is the same sort of mischaracterization. Both parties are using the similarity in name to make the point bigger than what actually occurred. "I wrote for The New York Times Company" has a bigger impact than "I wrote for The Ledger" just as "She claims to have written for The New York Times" has a bigger impact than "She claims to have written for The New York Times Company." And once again, if in the journalism profession no such distinctions are made because people reference their specific paper then it should be respectfully explained as part of the professions business culture instead of immediately suggesting a lack of moral character on the part of those not familiar with a particular profession's norms.


I see where you are going with your question. If I told you "I work for Warner Bros. as an operations manager." you would, I assume, ask me what that means. I can vaguely describe the process...factually...but imply that it is done for the studio, not a theme park. If you tell people about me and describe my job, YOU are not lying. You are unintentionally perpetuating the falsehood I created. And doing exactly what I want you to do.
But in this case I am not unintentionally perpetuating what you hope I assume. I know you only worked for Six Flags, I know you claimed to have worked for Warner Bros. and I am going around telling people that your résumé says you worked at the corporate offices.


Well, to be fair, you have no understanding of right and wrong.

Trying to explain to you the difference between a respectful dialogue and arguing would be pointless and a waste of time.
Because attacking the moral character and motives of others is respectful dialogue?


Would it be ok for me to put on a resume that I was the President of the US when all I did was work for the Dept of Agriculture....I mean it is all part of the government.
No, because that is claiming a specific job. If you only said you worked for the US government, it'd be a bit different. It'd also be wrong for somebody who knows you only worked for the State Department to go around telling people you claim to have been the President.
 

Goofyernmost

Well-Known Member
Never thought I'd get sick of hearing about blondes, but, really, who cares? If the people that should care don't then I don't either. Her moral stand on things is between her and whomever the moral gods are these days. If the companies she works for don't see a problem, then there isn't one. If they do, then she will be subject to whatever they think the solution should be. Moral stands are for each individual. You live within your own moral standards and as long as you stay within that level, then you are OK. What happens to others is not of concern unless we are directly affected by it. I never even heard of this person until last week so she has had little or no impact on my life. I'm having all I can do to stay within my own boundaries, I don't have the time to worry about the boundaries of others.
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
Because attacking the moral character and motives of others is respectful dialogue?

Like I said, arguing with you and your ilk is a waste of time. Mostly because you're wrong. My position is clear; its a black and white issue.

Also because you cant instill right and wrong in someone who doesn't have that sense of moral character to begin with. So I'm not going to try and explain basic morality to you. And if you don't like it, thats your problem.
 

Fe Maiden

Well-Known Member
You're right, he doesn't play for the Mariners. He works for a subsidiary of the Mariners (or in baseball speak, minor leagues). He was drafted (hired) by the Mariners; the parent company. Just like JFB doesn't write for the New York Times, part of the New York Times Company. She writes for the New York Times Company.

To see my literal point: check out the Atlanta Braves minor league system. By your argument, they do work for the Braves, no?

http://atlanta.braves.mlb.com/mlb/minorleagues/affiliates/index.jsp?c_id=atl

Thanks for helping me clear that up!

Just go by the back of their baseball card. If it says Atlanta they can claim they play for the Atlanta Braves, if not they can't. But you know that already.


And I dont think you've been around many arguments if that's the flimsiest you've ever seen. But maybe you were just adding dramatic flare ;)

It really is. It reminds me of that old Brady Bunch episode about living with exact words. Greg got punished by mom and dad and was told he couldn't drive their car. So not wanting to miss out on a date he used his friends car and then made the argument to his parents that they only said he couldn't drive their car not someone else's. 23 minutes later the hammer was brought down on Greg and he came crawling back to mom and dad apologizing and admitting he was being difficult and acting like a jerk.
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
It really is. It reminds me of that old Brady Bunch episode about living with exact words. Greg got punished by mom and dad and was told he couldn't drive their car. So not wanting to miss out on a date he used his friends car and then made the argument to his parents that they only said he couldn't drive their car not someone else's. 23 minutes later the hammer was brought down on Greg and he came crawling back to mom and dad apologizing and admitting he was being difficult and acting like a jerk.

You're not suggesting that people around here are difficult and act like jerks, are you?

Because you'd be right.
 

MattM

Well-Known Member
Like I said, arguing with you and your ilk is a waste of time. Mostly because you're wrong. My position is clear; its a black and white issue.

Also because you cant instill right and wrong in someone who doesn't have that sense of moral character to begin with. So I'm not going to try and explain basic morality to you. And if you don't like it, thats your problem.

Wow, @lazyboy97o got you to respond even though you've been done with this for at least 3 days, too.

You can't not respond, can you?
 

PhotoDave219

Well-Known Member
Just go by the back of their baseball card. If it says Atlanta they can claim they play for the Atlanta Braves, if not they can't. But you know that already.

A friend of mine played for several minor league teams in the Colorado organization. He never said he played for Colorado, instead he named the teams. Shame injuries cut short his career. Kid could hit.
 

MattM

Well-Known Member
Just go by the back of their baseball card. If it says Atlanta they can claim they play for the Atlanta Braves, if not they can't. But you know that already.

Who do you think signs/funds the checks for the Mississippi Braves?

Again, you're not drafted by the minor league club. You're drafted (read: hired) and thus work for the parent company.

Why is this so difficult? It seems like the non-business types argue against it (lack of experience or understanding? Maybe) and the business types are able to see it for what it is.
 

MattM

Well-Known Member
Your true character shines through. Sad.

You keep claiming the high road and saying you are done, but keep responding. So you are lying. No better than what you accuse JFB of, even though you're in the journalism industry and have better ethics than all the rest of us (laughable, in its own right). But you will rationalize why it's different when you do it. You're the good guy. Or a fake.

How about this. I will never respond to you again...and actually do it.

You can have the last word. It is insignificant anyway.

Ball's in your court, big guy.
 

lazyboy97o

Well-Known Member
Who do you think signs/funds the checks for the Mississippi Braves?

Again, you're not drafted by the minor league club. You're drafted (read: hired) and thus work for the parent company.

Why is this so difficult? It seems like the non-business types argue against it (lack of experience or understanding? Maybe) and the business types are able to see it for what it is.
I think a big part of it is different norms in different professions. This is getting combined with the tendancy if people to incorrectly over attribute behavior to personal factors (a lack of morality) and under attribute to situational factors.
 

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