So sad!

[Gabe1]

Lifeguards should be mandatory at every pool! This is heartbreaking and to those that say parents should be watching their kids .....this happens frequently right in front of untrained adults. There is specialty training on spotting a person/child in distress in water. It's not how movies portray it. The amount of money it cost to go on a Disney cruise is tremendous. THE LEAST they can do is have lifeguards. I have been on two and no parent should have to feel that their child is in danger on a ship that caters to small kids. This being said I hope chase makes a full recovery. The brain has a huge capacity to heal!

My DS started his Disney career as a well trained lifeguard. As I stated early on I was dumbfounded Disney opted not to have lifeguards on their ships and stick to the belief they should. Even the most inept Lifeguard would have spotted that child long before the 10-15 mark the relative mentioned. My kids have both managed a good sized water park up here, train lifeguards and were lifeguards themselves at one time as was I.

As I have read all the descriptions of crazy departing time it seems even more ludicrous to me to not staff lifeguards, good parenting or bad parenting on any voyage the pro's seem to far outweigh the con's of the lifeguard debate. Out of the drownings at WDW, knock wood, it has been in unguarded pools. Says something right there. Water parks are crazy at WDW, they have guests believing they can swim to the end of the drop pool from a slide, they guest gets disoriented and the guard goes in parent there or not, heck sometimes it is the parent that needs to be saved. Lifeguards at Disney make $8.65, $9.75 for deep water certification. It would be less on a cruise ship as Disney doesn't follow USA labor laws on cruises. No way would lifeguards add $1000 per passenger with the hours cruise ship CMs work. If Disney had to give up a few low level cabins for these CM's, my opinion, so be it.

My DS will go on his first cruise in June. I'm real curious to see what he has to say after observing first hand with his background, if no lifeguards is really best practices in his opinion. And to the family, my father in law suffered a horrid brain injury, coma, brain surgery to relieve swelling/pressure, given little hope. He came to, had movement, talked gibberish, wrote what looked like Chinese and knew nobody. Odds bleak of anything returning. A few months later he was almost back to himself and playing with his Grandchildren, though he walked a tad crooked. The brain is amazing so I will pray he beats the odds like my FIL did.

 

[3disneynuts]

My DS started his Disney career as a well trained lifeguard. As I stated early on I was dumbfounded Disney opted not to have lifeguards on their ships and stick to the belief they should. Even the most inept Lifeguard would have spotted that child long before the 10-15 mark the relative mentioned. My kids have both managed a good sized water park up here, train lifeguards and were lifeguards themselves at one time as was I.

As I have read all the descriptions of crazy departing time it seems even more ludicrous to me to not staff lifeguards, good parenting or bad parenting on any voyage the pro's seem to far outweigh the con's of the lifeguard debate. Out of the drownings at WDW, knock wood, it has been in unguarded pools. Says something right there. Water parks are crazy at WDW, they have guests believing they can swim to the end of the drop pool from a slide, they guest gets disoriented and the guard goes in parent there or not, heck sometimes it is the parent that needs to be saved. Lifeguards at Disney make $8.65, $9.75 for deep water certification. It would be less on a cruise ship as Disney doesn't follow USA labor laws on cruises. No way would lifeguards add $1000 per passenger with the hours cruise ship CMs work. If Disney had to give up a few low level cabins for these CM's, my opinion, so be it.

My DS will go on his first cruise in June. I'm real curious to see what he has to say after observing first hand with his background, if no lifeguards is really best practices in his opinion. And to the family, my father in law suffered a horrid brain injury, coma, brain surgery to relieve swelling/pressure, given little hope. He came to, had movement, talked gibberish, wrote what looked like Chinese and knew nobody. Odds bleak of anything returning. A few months later he was almost back to himself and playing with his Grandchildren, though he walked a tad crooked. The brain is amazing so I will pray he beats the odds like my FIL did.

Thanks for this!!! I am astonished also. We were on DCL twice and I was astonished that there are not life guards. EVen sprinkler parks here on Long Island are staffed by 4-6 lifeguards. I will be interested in what you son feels when he sees the DCL pools.

 

[Phonedave]

My DS started his Disney career as a well trained lifeguard. As I stated early on I was dumbfounded Disney opted not to have lifeguards on their ships and stick to the belief they should. Even the most inept Lifeguard would have spotted that child long before the 10-15 mark the relative mentioned. My kids have both managed a good sized water park up here, train lifeguards and were lifeguards themselves at one time as was I.

Not necessarly. That pool is HARD to see the bottom in. The number of people combined with how murky that water gets. It makes me think of that public pool (somwhere in the North East) were last year a dead body remained on the bottom for the entire day, even after they closed the pool for the day, only when people snuck in at night to swim did they notice the body. And they pool had multiple lifeguards.

-dave

 

[Gabe1]

Thanks for this!!! I am astonished also. We were on DCL twice and I was astonished that there are not life guards. EVen sprinkler parks here on Long Island are staffed by 4-6 lifeguards. I will be interested in what you son feels when he sees the DCL pools.

Your welcome, I'll book mark this to come back in Mid June after he takes a look. He is as curious as I am.

Not necessarly. That pool is HARD to see the bottom in. The number of people combined with how murky that water gets. It makes me think of that public pool (somwhere in the North East) were last year a dead body remained on the bottom for the entire day, even after they closed the pool for the day, only when people snuck in at night to swim did they notice the body. And they pool had multiple lifeguards.
-dave

Wow. I have to take you at your word on that, for now. With your description I even more in favor of lifeguards if the DCL are as unsafely murky as you describe. With that description a child dips under and with water that murky no parent could find their child underwater even though they are in the pool with them.

Any how, if DCL used the same lifeguarding program that they do at resorts, they are not just scanning for drowning, they are watching their particular zone, which includes guests falling or slipping into the water.
There is a very methodical scanning procedure, watch for it and you will see the pattern the lifeguards at the resorts follow, as well as at the 2 water parks.

 

[Phonedave]

Your welcome, I'll book mark this to come back in Mid June after he takes a look. He is as curious as I am.




Wow. I have to take you at your word on that, for now. With your description I even more in favor of lifeguards if the DCL are as unsafely murky as you describe. With that description a child dips under and with water that murky no parent could find their child underwater even though they are in the pool with them.

Any how, if DCL used the same lifeguarding program that they do at resorts, they are not just scanning for drowning, they are watching their particular zone, which includes guests falling or slipping into the water.
There is a very methodical scanning procedure, watch for it and you will see the pattern the lifeguards at the resorts follow, as well as at the 2 water parks.

I agree, they have a very good lifeguarding process at the parks. I can tell you that on one cruise there was a kids next to me who father was scolding him because he dropped his mask into the pool and now they could not find it. If found it for them, only because I stepped on it. I could not see my feet (or the bottom of the pool). I only found the mask by luck. There could have just as easily been a body down there.


-dave

 

[Gabe1]

I agree, they have a very good lifeguarding process at the parks. I can tell you that on one cruise there was a kids next to me who father was scolding him because he dropped his mask into the pool and now they could not find it. If found it for them, only because I stepped on it. I could not see my feet (or the bottom of the pool). I only found the mask by luck. There could have just as easily been a body down there.


-dave

Boy, that discription certainly demonstrates the differences between park safety and DCL safety. Thinking I really don't want to be in any DCL pool, ewe.

 

[Vanellope Von Schweetz]

Shame on you....shame on all of you who have passed judgment on people you don't know, and a situation you were nowhere near. I am a relative of this family and until now, I thought people like you were not worth the time and effort to give a response. This was a terrible, tragic ACCIDENT, that is all. Sorry to disappoint you and give you nothing to gossip about to others. Chase's parents are two of the most God-loving, diligent parents I know, who are deeply involved in every aspect of their children's' lives. Do you understand that if they were doing the things you accuse them of, such as drinking and not being watchful, that the authorities would have acted on this? If all of you are such avid cruisers as you claim, you would certainly know that when a ship leaves port, there are thousands of people on the upper decks, swimming, drinking, tanning, and taking in the whole experience. Chase was a sweet and active little four-year old boy who slipped away from his parents and got lost in the crowd. They didn't just "suddenly become aware" that he was missing when he had been pulled from the pool. They didn't allow him to go into a pool without them. They didn't leave the two older siblings to watch him. The truth is that they had been searching for him that ENTIRE time he was missing!!! Can you imagine the panic and fear any parent would feel during that time? Another item to point out, Chase was believed to have been underwater for 10-15 minutes and not a single person, staff or guest, noticed. NOT ONE!!! Does this not clearly point out the large number of people and commotion in that area at the time of the accident?? Chase fought for his life and survived. He now has a long battle ahead of him with a grim outlook. People like you are not helping the cause. I believe in the power of voicing opinions and the internet. You are entitled to your "opinion" but just as human beings, I beg you to be responsible about the things you say. I pray to God that they never see the horrible things posted on this thread. For those of you who supported them this last week, I thank you from the bottom of my heart.

There is this:

"Investigators concluded Chase was inadequately supervised"

As you can see in this article: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...y-chase-lykken-drown-20130507,0,7983671.story

This article may have already been posted somewhere on this forum, not sure. It also says that he was under water for up to 6 minutes, not 10 - 15 as you mentioned. It was not the responsibility of any other person, staff or guest to notice that he was missing or under water. It was the parents responsibility to prevent their child from drowning by holding his hand when he was near a pool that was over 5 ft. deep and surrounded by the ocean.

It doesn't even make sense to me the whole discussion about life guards really. Any child could go overboard into the ocean because they aren't adequately supervised on their own room veranda. A cruise is inherently full of safety risks and it's up to the parents to make sure it's right for their family and that they're able to keep their children safe.

I completely agree with the poster who said that we are parents until we die.

The family has said, from what I've read on their Caring Bridge site, that everything happens for a reason. If that were true, then I would say that the reason might be so that other parents will hold on more tightly to their children and be vigilant during vacations when many accidents happen. But, I don't personally believe that everything happens for a reason. That implies a silver lining and there is no silver lining for the child, who is the one who is actually the one suffering because of this.