Security breach at MK? You be the judge...

[brich]

Oh thats such crapola. This wasnt a newsworthy incident.... Lets blow things out of proportion, shall we? I havent seen such a wonderful idea since Dateline NBC rigged rollover tests and Primetime live got hired at Food Lion. :fork:

There are a lot bigger things to be scared of in this world. LOTS.

I agree Dave. 100%. I'm not about feeding the media anything they can twist into an another attack on WDW. My motivation is making sure I feel my family is safe at the MK. And until this incident, I have. But my experience did not make me feel safe one bit. I felt my family was extremely vulnerable in a situation that in my opinion, should have been handled more appropriately. I'm entitled to that opinion.

Oh yeah, here's a question - How much security and inconvience are you willing to put up with? How much money are you willing to pay for admission? Added security costs will be passed along to the guests..... I assure you of that.

My opinion on this is I'm willing to be inconvenienced if it improves my family's safety. Dragging a 3 and a 6 year old through the security checkpoint at MCO is no picnic. But I know it's for my safety. I don't mind the check points at the gates to the park at all. I enjoy the interaction with the generally happy security staff going through our stuff. And I don't mind paying a little extra on my ticket if it contributes to my safety in the slightest. What I do have a problem with is a theater attendant who can not respond to a security situation in which I felt was serious. This CM may have been better suited outside the theater, in my opinion, and a CM properly trained in a situation like this manning the inside of the theater. Or at the very least, when an incident is reported and I ask for security, I get more than what I got. Not asking for much here...

 

[mousermerf]

Brich - you're overreacting.

There was no need for a security team. Oh my god, someone left a Disney shopping bag in a Disney theme park. The horror! The horror!

By your statement, you jumped into action. How do you know he wasn't trying to save the seat for his family and going to retrieve them?

You don't have any idea what was going on. You assume it was something big, bad, scary and dangerous. You're crazy. Most of the world has no intention of hurting anyone - silly things like this happen because folks like yourself are brainwashed by the media. Most of your life is safe as long as you don't do something silly, like pick up a supposedly dangerous package. That's by far the biggest mistake made in the whole series of events.

Disney CM's? Let me get this straight.. you brought a Disney shopping bag to a CM? And they opened it to see what was inside after you insisted they not merely put it away to find its owner later?

It's not super dangerous since you were holding it - and i bet the CM could identify Disney packaging at a glance.

Then the person came back and got it? And a manager ignored your paranoid complaint? They didn't call in the bomb squad from the county, prompting a park evacuation and tons of news media about "Disney park bomb threat!" and stories about "Is Disney a terrorist playground?" - how could they not?

They didn't because they're not idiots. Calm down, you're making something out of nothing. If the man was still in the theater, he was a suicide bomber anyways and there's nothing anyone could do to have stopped him at that point.

And yes, containing whatever it was to one building, that theater, was far safer than exposing the rest of the park to it - Fantasyland is a far more populated area.

I suggest calling and getting counceling for paranoia and irrational behavior related to it.

 

[mikeymouse]

Yea, I guess they feel their bag check at the entrance is sufficient enough, which it isn't. Some officers barely look at bags however most officers do look thoroughly.

 

[Punkss]

So what have you done in a situation like this? Have you been in a sitaution like this? Or let me guess, your another, "If I was in this situation, I would..."

Yes I have been in this sitaution twice. Once during my tenure as a manager at a theme park in the UK. And once on the London Underground in the 90's.

The package was not moved either time, controlled explosions were carried out and the rest of the park when on as normal until they turned on the local news. Suffice to say they were not actually bomb devices, just somebodies briefcase and somebody with a hold-all full of lunch they forgot. Still better to be safe than sorry.

It has to be said though we have had this alot longer than you guys in the states and its now a fairly slick and well oiled machine that kicks into action. We all know what to do, as we have been told so many times!

I did not mean to be a know it all and i agree my response (in the cold light of next day!), was slightly sensationilist, so sorry about that.

And you are correct i was not there so i do not know the crowds but whatever you do, try to never mention the word bomb, that word is a danger in itself and panics people.

 

[Punkss]

Brich - you're overreacting.

There was no need for a security team. Oh my god, someone left a Disney shopping bag in a Disney theme park. The horror! The horror!

By your statement, you jumped into action. How do you know he wasn't trying to save the seat for his family and going to retrieve them?...................

................I suggest calling and getting counceling for paranoia and irrational behavior related to it.

Mousemerf that is far too harsh. He was right to bring to someones attention, no doubt about that. I think Brich was more suprised by the reactions he got than the actual turn of events.

 

[brich]

Brich - you're overreacting.

There was no need for a security team. Oh my god, someone left a Disney shopping bag in a Disney theme park. The horror! The horror!

I asked for directions to the security office. I wanted to report how the CM handled the incident and then go about enjoying my evening.

By your statement, you jumped into action. How do you know he wasn't trying to save the seat for his family and going to retrieve them?

When do people safe seats by placing bags "under" a seat? And when is it ok to run out the exit to get others to come in and enjoy the seats your saving for them?:hammer:

You don't have any idea what was going on. You assume it was something big, bad, scary and dangerous. You're crazy. Most of the world has no intention of hurting anyone - silly things like this happen because folks like yourself are brainwashed by the media. Most of your life is safe as long as you don't do something silly, like pick up a supposedly dangerous package. That's by far the biggest mistake made in the whole series of events.

The only assumption I made was that the situation was not right. If you read my OP, it said "I quickly moved away fearing the box could have contained something bad (make your own conclusions). " Show me where in my OP I said that I thought it was big, bad or scary. I said it "could" have been bad. No more, no less. I simply felt the circumstances where not right. Most of my life is safe. Same goes for those who have perished in senseless terrorist attacks. Folks like myself? Amazing you can draw such conclusions from a post you couldn't even grasp.:lol:

Disney CM's? Let me get this straight.. you brought a Disney shopping bag to a CM? And they opened it to see what was inside after you insisted they not merely put it away to find its owner later?

It's not super dangerous since you were holding it - and i bet the CM could identify Disney packaging at a glance.

You didn't read my post did you. I gave the bag to the nearest CM. He did not take it as serious as I. I insisted the situation was not normal and recommended he not just leave it in the theater. I never told him to open it.

Then the person came back and got it? And a manager ignored your paranoid complaint? They didn't call in the bomb squad from the county, prompting a park evacuation and tons of news media about "Disney park bomb threat!" and stories about "Is Disney a terrorist playground?" - how could they not?

Why do some of you have such a hard time grasping the issue here? Let me slow it down for you. I reported an odd situation to a CM. I felt it was a security issue. I was surprised at how the situation was handled by the CM. I decided, and this is my right as a paying guest, a share holder and a responsible adult, that I would report the situation to Security so that they could evaluate their process and proceedures of situations like this if they felt what I was telling them warranted such review. That is all. No more, no less.

They didn't because they're not idiots. Calm down, you're making something out of nothing. If the man was still in the theater, he was a suicide bomber anyways and there's nothing anyone could do to have stopped him at that point.

It appears your the one that may need some calming down. Your making way more conclussions than this thread intended. If my OP is out of your grasp, why respond? Are you looking to improve your cool factor? It's amazing how some feel they have to take the side kissing the Mouse's tail so as not to appear as anything less than the ultimate Disney fan. In turn, you make yourself look immature and pretty silly. You know Disney can be wrong on occassion.:lol:

And yes, containing whatever it was to one building, that theater, was far safer than exposing the rest of the park to it - Fantasyland is a far more populated area.

Another bomb expert. So your concluding that it could have been a bomb? Interesting. And how was Fantasyland at 9pm on Sunday, October 23? Was it crowded to you?

I suggest calling and getting counceling for paranoia and irrational behavior related to it.

If someone leaves a package in an airport unattended, they evacuate the terminal. But if I report a bag being left unattended by a man "RUNNING" out of a theater and the authority to which I reported does not take the situation serious, that makes me paranoid? And the only irrational behavior displayed by me is continuing to repsond to such posts as yours. Read and understand threads before flinging the insults merf. Grow up huh...

 

[wdwfanaustria]

Most of your life is safe as long as you don't do something silly, like pick up a supposedly dangerous package.

Please tell this to the families of the recent bombings in Madrid or London.
"Your son/daughter/mother/father was silly because they went to work."
Or about the victims in Bali and Sharm el Sheik: "They were silly because they wanted to have fun and hang out!"

I fully support all what brich said.

And with all due respect: Your post was simply disrespectful and making fun of someone's legitimate concerns.

 

[brich]

Mousemerf that is far too harsh. He was right to bring to someones attention, no doubt about that. I think Brich was more suprised by the reactions he got than the actual turn of events.

Thank you

Yes I have been in this sitaution twice. Once during my tenure as a manager at a theme park in the UK. And once on the London Underground in the 90's.

The package was not moved either time, controlled explosions were carried out and the rest of the park when on as normal until they turned on the local news. Suffice to say they were not actually bomb devices, just somebodies briefcase and somebody with a hold-all full of lunch they forgot. Still better to be safe than sorry.

And look, you took appropriate action. I commend you for that. That was all I was looking for. Appropriate action or response. Not just a yeah, what ever...

It has to be said though we have had this alot longer than you guys in the states and its now a fairly slick and well oiled machine that kicks into action. We all know what to do, as we have been told so many times!

Unfortunately, many take for granted the false sense of security we have here in the States. As you've probably notice from previous posts, many call being alert to our surrounds as paranoia and irrational behavior. So many American's don't understand the reality of it because for so many years, we did not have to deal with it on our own soil while the rest of the World lives it every day. Interesting that you reffer to you system as a well oiled machine. I know we have a ways to go over here but I do feel that Disney goes above and beyond in their safety precautions and there process is top notch, not to be confused with perfect though. And this is the single biggest reason I reported this and contemplated sending a letter to Disney.

 

[psuchad]

I think it is obvious that Brich wasn’t to overly concerned about a possible threat. Yes he was concerned enough to report it, but he did stay in the theater after all.

I admit that I was a jerk yesterday with my comments. However, just as Brich feels strongly about the fact that this could have been a very dangerous situation and that Disney’s CMs didn’t handle the situation properly, I feel strongly that Brich didn’t handle the situation correctly either.

Now we never know what we would do in the situation. Everyone says this is what I would do or I wouldn’t have done that. But until you are placed in those shoes you really have no idea.

I personally believe that the CMs should have simply made an announcement that the attraction was having technical difficulties and moved everybody out. Moving the package was the wrong move though. And attempting to take it outside is even worse. Nobody knows what was in that bag. It could have been a snow globe or a bomb or a chemical device. It is much better to keep it somewhat contained inside the building.

Reporting this to the media is an absolute overreaction. Feeding the blood thirsty media a story about a package left in a theater (one of I am sure thousands everyday) is not something that any Disney loving person would not do. They would run with this story and once again damage Disney in their own way.

 

[brich]

I think it is obvious that Brich wasn’t to overly concerned about a possible threat. Yes he was concerned enough to report it, but he did stay in the theater after all.

I admit that I was a jerk yesterday with my comments. However, just as Brich feels strongly about the fact that this could have been a very dangerous situation and that Disney’s CMs didn’t handle the situation properly, I feel strongly that Brich didn’t handle the situation correctly either.

Now we never know what we would do in the situation. Everyone says this is what I would do or I wouldn’t have done that. But until you are placed in those shoes you really have no idea.

I personally believe that the CMs should have simply made an announcement that the attraction was having technical difficulties and moved everybody out. Moving the package was the wrong move though. And attempting to take it outside is even worse. Nobody knows what was in that bag. It could have been a snow globe or a bomb or a chemical device. It is much better to keep it somewhat contained inside the building.

Reporting this to the media is an absolute overreaction. Feeding the blood thirsty media a story about a package left in a theater (one of I am sure thousands everyday) is not something that any Disney loving person would not do. They would run with this story and once again damage Disney in their own way.

Let me only say in my defense that yes, moving the bag was probably not the ideal thing to do. More than a week later and 40 posts, we can look back and make a better asessment. At the time, I saw a potential threat to my family and reacted. My reaction was to remove the threat. Sure, I could have removed my family but that was not my reaction. It truly is crazy how adrenaline kicks in. My heart was a thumping for sure. And again, no, the media is not the outlet of choice. Look at the chaos a simple post on here created over this...:lol:

Cheers Chad

 

[bgraham34]

I personally would drop it and not go any further. You did the right thing and that is that.

 

[MickeyTigg]

Brich - you're overreacting.

No...they're not.

There was no need for a security team. Oh my god, someone left a Disney shopping bag in a Disney theme park. The horror! The horror!

Why do you have to such an a$$....you're a CM? Great guest compassion guy. First of all...that's what they're there for. In today's climate...the appropriate thing to do would have been to alert Security, have them evaluate it and let them decide whether OCSD needs to get involved.

A response like, "I understand your concern. You're right, it does appear suspicious...we'll check it out," would have been fine.

By your statement, you jumped into action. How do you know he wasn't trying to save the seat for his family and going to retrieve them?

Too bad...they should have kept up with him or he should have lagged behind.

You don't have any idea what was going on. You assume it was something big, bad, scary and dangerous. You're crazy. Most of the world has no intention of hurting anyone - silly things like this happen because folks like yourself are brainwashed by the media.

Neither do you. Do me a favor merf....hang with me and when I see a suspicious package...you stand next to it, I'll run and when it goes off, we'll know who was right...

It's not super dangerous since you were holding it - and i bet the CM could identify Disney packaging at a glance.

I suppose a person leaving a bomb wouldn't be smart enough to put it in Disney packaging if they were at WDW, would they?

I suggest calling and getting counceling for paranoia and irrational behavior related to it.

Oh...that's good...I think maybe you should for anger management.

 

[shoppingnut]

First of all let me just say that the OP is not overreacting. WDW is on the top 10 list of terrorist targets and we do need to be vigilant about what is going on within our surroundings no matter where we are. The way the person left the package and ran out should and did raise a red flag. What if this was only a test run, we don't know, better to be safe than sorry.

The reality of today's world is that if someone wants to get something into a place to do some damage, they are going to find the spot where security is lacking and use it. And the security at the front gate while I have seen improvements over the past year, is still not too difficult to get something passed it.

I would definitely write a letter to disney expressing your concerns with the lack of CM and Management's training in responding to the incident. It may be that training may have to be done not just once upon a person's hire, but periodically to remind them of the importance of security and how to react. Just because it was a Disney bag, we cannot assume it is safe, gee I guess no evil doer would think to use a disney bag in disney as a disguise for unsavory contents.

Mousemerf, I suggest you might need some counseling as you seem to be making very angry posts of late. It is clear that you either didn't read the OP or comprehend it, maybe both, but there is no need to attack. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and the OP realizes their mistake, but until one is faced with such a situation there is no way to say what they will do unless they are specifically trained for such an event. It is quite clear that Disney did not handle this situation properly because if they did, the OP would have been put at ease and not felt the need to start this thread with their concern.

 

[Nemo14]

First of all let me just say that the OP is not overreacting. WDW is on the top 10 list of terrorist targets and we do need to be vigilant about what is going on within our surroundings no matter where we are. The way the person left the package and ran out should and did raise a red flag. What if this was only a test run, we don't know, better to be safe than sorry.

The reality of today's world is that if someone wants to get something into a place to do some damage, they are going to find the spot where security is lacking and use it. And the security at the front gate while I have seen improvements over the past year, is still not too difficult to get something passed it.

I would definitely write a letter to disney expressing your concerns with the lack of CM and Management's training in responding to the incident. It may be that training may have to be done not just once upon a person's hire, but periodically to remind them of the importance of security and how to react. Just because it was a Disney bag, we cannot assume it is safe, gee I guess no evil doer would think to use a disney bag in disney as a disguise for unsavory contents.

Mousemerf, I suggest you might need some counseling as you seem to be making very angry posts of late. It is clear that you either didn't read the OP or comprehend it, maybe both, but there is no need to attack. Hindsight is a wonderful thing and the OP realizes their mistake, but until one is faced with such a situation there is no way to say what they will do unless they are specifically trained for such an event. It is quite clear that Disney did not handle this situation properly because if they did, the OP would have been put at ease and not felt the need to start this thread with their concern.

I was just about to post a similar thought about this, but you worded it so much better than I could have, so I'll just say Amen to that.
Good job Brich - you did the right thing!

 

[wannabeBelle]

I was just about to post a similar thought about this, but you worded it so much better than I could have, so I'll just say Amen to that.
Good job Brich - you did the right thing!

Just as an addition to my posting....let's change the circumstances a tad
If you were standing in a subway or train car. A man comes in with a bag, puts said bag on the floor and RUNS out of the subway/train car at top speed. I would certainly proceed to the nearest train employee with a request to call the police immediately. I dont think I know anyone who would react differently at least in this area of the country. It wasnt like the man had gotten on the train with a package, got off 5 stops later and forgot to pick up his package on the way out.
In short Brich was correct. Was there a threat to anyone? Maybe not this time but I wouldnt have bet my life on it. Should the incident have been taken more seriously by the CM and the Manager? Yes I would think so. TiggerRPh's responses of you are right it looks suspicious we will check it out would have worked very well for me. I Am happy that it all ended up being a misunderstanding, but better safe than sorry. Belle

 

[Laura]

brich - though many think you made a stupid move by getting the bag out of there, I personally think it was rather heroic. Your gut told you "this bag could kill me" but you grabbed it anyway to protect your family. Yes it was pretty dumb to move the bag (LOL), but I admire your courage! It's hard to make rational decisions in the heat of the moment, and all you could think about was that you didn't want that bag near your family and you were willing to risk your own life to keep them safe. Whose to say what my reaction would have been, but I am quite sure if I thought a bomb was in the bag I would have been too wimpy to go near it.

It was a very strange thing that guy did, and I feel that though you probably didn't do the smartest thing in the heat of the moment, you were correct to "react" to it. I would send an email to Disney - and leave it at that.

 

[robynchic]

I'm sorry, but I have to interject about the whole handling packages thing.

Something I learned from my dad (he used to do computer security with the government, but doesn't anymore), and was reinforced when I was in Israel during summer 2001, never pick up a package you may think is suspicious. If it had been a bomb, it could have been gyroscopically triggered or something like that. I was always told in Israel never to pick up a package, but to alert someone with a gun on their back (the military have to carry their guns everywhere they go- even if it's an M16)

It's a great bit of advice to follow anywhere.

That being said...

Maybe the CM didn't think much of it because you picked up the package and handed it to them. It couldn't be that dangerous if the guest that was concerned picked it up, right?

 

[zkevnnashz]

If a person had a bomb in a bag and left it under a seat, I would highly doubt they would RUN out of the building. They wouldn't want to draw attention to themselves. They would either calmly walk out or actually watch the show and leave it behind.

 

[robynchic]

If a person had a bomb in a bag and left it under a seat, I would highly doubt they would RUN out of the building. They wouldn't want to draw attention to themselves. They would either calmly walk out or actually watch the show and leave it behind.

He's got a point there.

 

[brich]

I'm sorry, but I have to interject about the whole handling packages thing.

Something I learned from my dad (he used to do computer security with the government, but doesn't anymore), and was reinforced when I was in Israel during summer 2001, never pick up a package you may think is suspicious. If it had been a bomb, it could have been gyroscopically triggered or something like that. I was always told in Israel never to pick up a package, but to alert someone with a gun on their back (the military have to carry their guns everywhere they go- even if it's an M16)

It's a great bit of advice to follow anywhere.

That being said...

Maybe the CM didn't think much of it because you picked up the package and handed it to them. It couldn't be that dangerous if the guest that was concerned picked it up, right?

Great advice but I think we have established the point that my picking up the package wasn't the best move. The fact the CM handled the situation the way he did had zero to do with my actions. On the contrary, I insisted he deal with this as a security issue. And again, I propably didn't handle the situation correctly by touching the bag. Oh, let me also add that my moving the bag was probably not the best idea. Next time, I can guarantee I won't touch any packages. This of course was the a big mistake on my behalf, this moving the package....:brick: