Security breach at MK? You be the judge...

[Steve-B]

Come to think of it, I think maybe you should also CC the Orlando Sentinel with that letter. This is the kind of thing that public scrutiny and concern may make Disney more eager to deal with.

I agree with Jen Jen. Also, make sure whoever you write at Disney knows you sent a copy of the letter to the media (I know, I know - "CC" should tell them) - that will get some movement. I can't say I would have reacted any differently (or as quickly) as you did, but at least you took action. Too many people today still don't want to get involved.
BTW - That would have scared the bejesus out of me.

 

[psuchad]

Come to think of it, I think maybe you should also CC the Orlando Sentinel with that letter. This is the kind of thing that public scrutiny and concern may make Disney more eager to deal with. :xmas:

I think that is a very bad idea. This is not something that you want the media running with. It is just speculation that there was something dangerous in that bag. There are some very strange people in this world. People that like to act out events or stories in their mind. Jumping off a building because they thought they were Superman for example.

Brich no offence to you, but are you a member of the bomb squad? Are you a detective? The bag should have been left alone. To say you picked it up the same way as it came in is ridiculous. Assuming that some device was in the bag, you don’t know what steps the suspect took to ensure it went off. How did you know there wasn’t a trigger on the bottom that when it was picked up it would go off. Not to mention the fact that you could have been destroying or contaminating evidence by touching it.

I know you feel that you were being a hero, but you really could have been the indirect cause of injury if something happened. Let the authorities handle the situation. Let them evacuate the building and take care of it under their terms.

I would also like to note that people for some reason think that they are 100% aware of what is going on around them. Like it was stated above, you don’t know the circumstances as to why the man left so quickly. Maybe he had to go to the bathroom. Maybe he has a mental disorder that causes him to do things that aren’t the norm. You don’t know.

 

[SpongeScott]

..... I'd say try and relax.... Its not worth getting upset over.

IMO, the cast memeber took the approppriate balance between guest saftey and courtsey to all involved. There was no need to call out the bomb squad. There was probably a reasonable explanation for what happened.

When i was a CM, i would find unattended bags all the time. The first one i was a little apprehensive about, after that it was a "I better take this to guest relations" .....

I agree. I don't think it would have bothered me to the point the OP reacted.


*shrugs*

 

[mitchk]

I would have been suspicious too.

 

[brich]

This is where I'm on the fence. I don't want to over react and yet I think these situations should be taken seriously. I suppose I will write to Disney, see what their response is. I don't really want to run to the news with this. That's like yelling "BOMB" in the theater. I will, however, remind them that the media is an option.

Can anybody PM me the email address of who best to contact? Much appreciated...:wave:

Let me also add...
The day before we left, we were staying in Fiji at the Poly. We were out walking and noticed 3 gasoline containers stacked on a 2nd floor balconey (not a full balconey but they were jammed outside of the sliders). After the Philharmagic experience and then this. We did flag down some CM's who said they would investigate. Sure enough they were gone a short time later. No idea what that was all about but it's these little things. I guess we never truly know what we avoid by intervening. We do now what we could have avoided after the fact if we don't say anything...

 

[brich]

Brich no offence to you, but are you a member of the bomb squad? Are you a detective? The bag should have been left alone. To say you picked it up the same way as it came in is ridiculous. Assuming that some device was in the bag, you don’t know what steps the suspect took to ensure it went off. How did you know there wasn’t a trigger on the bottom that when it was picked up it would go off. Not to mention the fact that you could have been destroying or contaminating evidence by touching it.

Ok, I knew it was only a matter of time before we saw a post like this. For starters, read my post. I did not say what was in the package. Wish you were there to help me deal with the situation. You seem to have a lot of answers.:lol: By the way, I worked a number of years with local law enforcement at both the city and state level as well as the local district attorney's office in regards to crime scene services. I know a couple of things about evidence, how bout you?:animwink:

I know you feel that you were being a hero, but you really could have been the indirect cause of injury if something happened. Let the authorities handle the situation. Let them evacuate the building and take care of it under their terms.

Ya I'm a hero. I approached the nearest authority, a CM. They did worse than I did. And now you say let them evacuate?

I would also like to note that people for some reason think that they are 100% aware of what is going on around them. Like it was stated above, you don’t know the circumstances as to why the man left so quickly. Maybe he had to go to the bathroom. Maybe he has a mental disorder that causes him to do things that aren’t the norm. You don’t know.

But I do know that he placed a bag with unknown contents in a theater seat next to my wife and ran away. Insite me all you want but it simply comes down to this. Sounds like you don't have half the stones I do so you would have done nothing. Big help. Go get your homework done...

 

[col]

i was not implying that the only way to bring something into disney is through the front gate. there is many possible ways but most people would assume the front gate. people who work in/for a company can be evil and do bad stuff. theres a word for them but im not gonna type it.

it was something that may happen some times but i for one am glad that it has been brought to everyones attention.


54 days to go!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:xmas: :sohappy: :wave:

 

[psuchad]

Ok, I knew it was only a matter of time before we saw a post like this. For starters, read my post. I did not say what was in the package. Wish you were there to help me deal with the situation. You seem to have a lot of answers.:lol: By the way, I worked a number of years with local law enforcement at both the city and state level as well as the local district attorney's office in regards to crime scene services. I know a couple of things about evidence, how bout you?:animwink:

Ok let me work on your comments here. I don’t know what your profession is and that is why I asked. I am also pretty sure that the majority of law enforcement officers would absolutely frown upon grabbing a potential bomb in a bag and the carrying of said bag in a room full of people.

Ya I'm a hero. I approached the nearest authority, a CM. They did worse than I did. And now you say let them evacuate?

Yes I have reported suspicious packages and people before. But that doesn’t make me a hero. I would like to note that I never once said that I think that the CM did the right thing. But in their defense I am sure that they get this a lot. It is sad to say but I am sure they are numb to the idea of guests claming there are suspicious packages in the park. I know during my time at <st1 =""><st1 =""></st1></st1><st1 =""><st1 ="">Penn</st1> State <st1 =""></st1></st1> I myself became complacent on bomb threats. They are an almost daily occurrence on campus (so it seems) causing <st1 =""><st1 ="">Penn</st1> <st1 ="">State</st1></st1> to actually have fill in the blank posters saying “There has been a bomb threat made on _______ date for ________ building between the hours of ____ and _____. Makes you take it less serious doesn’t it.

And this brings me to your “Go get your homework done” comment. I am no longer a student and I haven’t been in several years. More years than I thought until I just now added it up. I graduated from <st1 =""><st1 =""> Penn</st1><st1 =""> State</st1></st1> and I am proud of it, hence my username. Ah the power of assumption.
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And for the record I used to work for a public library where several patrons were mentally challenged. And one man actually would do this. He would hide stuff in the bathroom all the time just for other patrons to find it and report it to me. These weren’t packages, just keys, clothes, etc. But he for whatever reason enjoyed doing this. Now I work for mental health services (not involving patents but in IT) so I can understand how this stuff happens.

 

[brich]

Makes you take it less serious doesn’t it.

See your point. But when I have my family with me, no. I am no longer complacent yet I'm not paranoid.

And for the record I used to work for a public library where several patrons were mentally challenged. And one man actually would do this. He would hide stuff in the bathroom all the time just for other patrons to find it and report it to me. These weren’t packages, just keys, clothes, etc. But he for whatever reason enjoyed doing this. Now I work for mental health services (not involving patents but in IT) so I can understand how this stuff happens.

But you were familiar with these patrons. You came to expect this behavoir and your in a public library. I'm in a theater, a strange man, lot's of people at one of the most American iconic tourist spots in the World. Again, In the heat of the moment, I'm not about to rationalized the whole situation. I reacted as best I could.

I know you feel that you were being a hero, but you really could have been the indirect cause of injury if something happened.

Let me just add that I really resent this remark. I never claimed heroism. On the contrary, I was concerned for the safety of my family and my family only so feel free to consider me selfish. My OP was to ask you if you felt I should pursue this or if it should be left as is. Also to let others know that this is how the situation was handled, which many have appreciated. But I suppose if I'm going to post, I should expect members to judge me on my actions...

 

[Ringo8n24]

I think in today's world it is never a bad thing to be too cautious, especially since WDW was one of the rumored targets of the terrorists. It is a result of the world we live in today. Some things may seem innocent, but you never know.

 

[righttrack]

Hopefully the CM will be trained to handle these situations better. Hopefully they were just "handling" you when they tried to convince you otherwise. These kinds of things, in large crowd situations, have to be handled with the utmost of care.

 

[CatLady]

I know Disney has Security at the Gate. But so didn't the Gates at Logan International Airport on Sept 11. You can't be that nieve to think the only way to get something into the park is via the front door.

Anyone who thinks that the security at the gate is going to prevent anyone from bringing things they shouldn't into the park is not being realistic. Bag checks are cursory at best, and I have personally seen an individual carry a gun into MK undetected. I seriously doubt that is the only person ever to have done so.

In this day and age, everyone has to take a certain amount of responsibility for their safety. I have told a security person at an airport about a roller bag left alone near a wall. The bag's owner was mighty cranky when she emerged from the bathroom and saw security taking it away, but I would rather make someone angry than have some bad outcome on my conscience. While I wouldn't have done what Birch did (because I would have gotten out of there rather than disturbing the bag), his instinct to do something rather than simply ignoring it was a good one.

 

[wdwfanaustria]

In my opinion the security at the gates is a joke.
Nothing would be easier than to enter the park with a belt of explosives under an oversized T-shirt or a hand grenade or two in the big pockets of cargo shorts because you aren't checked at all when you have no bag with you.
I don't want to imagine what happens if something like this is blown up in a queue, pre-show area or during a parade.

Also the security gates at the hotels have no effect. Every car can pass just when you say "I'm checking in."
Nobody has ever asked me for a room reservation confirmation or similar.

I can remember when it was reported that police has found maps of WDW in a terrorist hideout after an arrest (I belive it was in 2002 in Germany but I'm not totally sure).

Unfortunately it's a crazy world we live in right now.

 

[dumboflyer]

Let's all be alert to things around us so we can report them or respond in the best way we see fit at the moment. Doing nothing...does nothing. We all need to be alert.

That being said, if something thinks there should be more security, DISNEY should be pressure, not the media. Sometimes things like that give weirdos ideas (ie sad stories of one kid committing suicide leads a friend of his to committ suicide, or copycats, etc).

We need to remember that because many of us have insider info about Disney and that these boards/forums are PUBLIC, that somethings are better left un-said. Just pressure Disney if you think changes need to be made, but make sure the information posted here doesn't help ANYONE wanting to harm ANYONE.

Everyone needs to stay alert not just at Disney, but everywhere. But also, we've gotta live our lives.

 

[Punkss]

Let me get a few responses in before this thread goes off...

My reaction was to take that bag out of the theater. Heaven forbid it was an explosive, better to go off outside. I didn't feel the time to get the family out. The quickest response was get the bag out.

I know Disney has Security at the Gate. But so didn't the Gates at Logan International Airport on Sept 11. You can't be that nieve to think the only way to get something into the park is via the front door.

We need to remember that because many of us have insider info about Disney and that these boards/forums are PUBLIC, that somethings are better left un-said. Just pressure Disney if you think changes need to be made, but make sure the information posted here doesn't help ANYONE wanting to harm ANYONE.That being said, if something thinks there should be more security, DISNEY should be pressure, not the media. Sometimes things like that give weirdos ideas (ie sad stories of one kid committing suicide leads a friend of his to committ suicide, or copycats, etc).

In my opinion the security at the gates is a joke.
Nothing would be easier than to enter the park with a belt of explosives under an oversized T-shirt or a hand grenade or two in the big pockets of cargo shorts because you aren't checked at all when you have no bag with you.
I don't want to imagine what happens if something like this is blown up in a queue, pre-show area or during a parade.

Sorry but all those responses are quite unbeliveable!

Why would you continue to move a suspicous package towards more people and potentially a large crowd at the exit to the theatre/attraction? The package should always stay where it is, wherever it is, to start moving would not only confuse everyone including any responding emergency teams ("it was here...now its over there...but we moved it"). If its inside a buidling so what, just get the people out.

Do not confuse gate security at Disney to a mistake on security of an airport security staff and immigration controls. This is 2 entireley seperate types of incident, a number men passing unhindered through a security gate is one thing, but to accuse all security services of being lax because of it is silly. As has been said a multitude of times, Sept 11th was an entirely new type of attack which most people would not have predicted.

The second post i have quoted all I have to say is calm down, most of the stuff you guys on here could be gleaned by goign to the parks by themselves. July 7th bombings London showed that the terrorists scouted the locations a few times before the attacks. By all means be alert but don't get paranoid.

Event security is a proven deterrent, in the UK this has happened for over 30 years and almost all events have gone unhindered. And you musn't for 1 second think that just because you can't see what is happening in behind the scenes that there is nothing happening. Hotel security is more than you think too, not every bit of Disney security is just to catch terrorists.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Come to think of it, I think maybe you should also CC the Orlando Sentinel with that letter. This is the kind of thing that public scrutiny and concern may make Disney more eager to deal with. :xmas:

Oh thats such crapola. This wasnt a newsworthy incident.... Lets blow things out of proportion, shall we? I havent seen such a wonderful idea since Dateline NBC rigged rollover tests and Primetime live got hired at Food Lion. :fork:

There are a lot bigger things to be scared of in this world. LOTS.

 

[PhotoDave219]

Oh yeah, here's a question - How much security and inconvience are you willing to put up with? How much money are you willing to pay for admission? Added security costs will be passed along to the guests..... I assure you of that.

 

[wdwfanaustria]

Hotel security is more than you think too, not every bit of Disney security is just to catch terrorists.

I know that they are not there to catch terrorists (as well as the gate security).
I was just trying to say that possible terrorists would have it quite easy in WDW.

Oh yeah, here's a question - How much security and inconvience are you willing to put up with? How much money are you willing to pay for admission? Added security costs will be passed along to the guests..... I assure you of that.

I know, you're right but I hope we won't to have discuss this topic again after something happened.

 

[Punkss]

know that they are not there to catch terrorists (as well as the gate security).
I was just trying to say that possible terrorists would have it quite easy in WDW.

True some places are "softer" targets but that is why we rely on the security services to do their job and keep us safe in general. You can't guard against everything.

Plus I want to have fun at Disney not go through security checks all day.

 

[brich]

Sorry but all those responses are quite unbeliveable!

Why would you continue to move a suspicous package towards more people and potentially a large crowd at the exit to the theatre/attraction? The package should always stay where it is, wherever it is, to start moving would not only confuse everyone including any responding emergency teams ("it was here...now its over there...but we moved it"). If its inside a buidling so what, just get the people out.

Towards more people? Large crowd at the exit? Confuse everyone? Responding emergency teams? :veryconfu

For starters, it's obvious you weren't there. There were no crowds near the exit. The previous theater patrons were long gone. The Philharmagic theater was about 3/4s full. Outside of the theater would have been a far better option for an explosive device going off. Not sure about you but I would think the structural damage caused by an explosion inside could lead to far more problems then it going off in the open.

As far as confusing everyone, nobody but my wife and I saw this happen. Until I found the CM. I suppose I should just yell "BOMB" next time to get people out of the theater right? And then I'd be sitting in jail right now.
And responding emergency teams, what responding emergency teams? The CM was handling the situation. Ya, he was just going to open the package right there. The only response was by the "manager". Not security like I had requested.

But I see. I handled the situation incorrectly. Once again, another expert. Thanks for the info. Next time I'll heed your warning and leave the package. But when I speak to the nearest CM, how do I tell him I think he should get an emergency response team in there? I'm afraid just the "manager" will respond with his smile and excuses. And when I show him the package on the floor, do you think he'll leave it or pick it up himself and put it in his cabinet?

So what have you done in a situation like this? Have you been in a sitaution like this? Or let me guess, your another, "If I was in this situation, I would..."

So all of you who feel I should not have move the package, thanks. I appreciate your advice. Now back to the original question and concern....:zipit: